Dwarf Fortress Wiki - User contributions [en]

v0.34 Talk:Water

2012-03-26T01:09:55Z

Auric: +water lace with salt

Water laced with salt can be drank by very thirsty dwarfs, and will result in a "was forced to drink slime lately" message.--[[User:Auric|Auric]] 01:09, 26 March 2012 (UTC)

v0.34 Talk:Undead

2012-03-14T19:30:39Z

Auric: /* Raised parts FYI */ new section

undead creatures are found in tombs, and first appear as skeletons or corpses lying on the ground. in human tombs there is usually a coffin in the middle of a room surrounded by corpses, if an adventurer steps onto on of the 8 tiles surrounding the coffin the corpse inside will raise its self from the dead. after a few frames of time it will put a cure on ones adventurer after screaming you dared to enter it's home. this then makes the adventurer fell horrible and even a legendary hero has little chance at winning the battle. not long after the mummy curses an adventurer, every other skeleton in the tomb with the mummy stands up and run to kill the unfortunate being stuck to fight them all. however there are a few ways to increase odds of survival; first, become legendary in the ambushing skill, when one is sneaking around the mummy won't see the one who came to close to it's coffin and will have nothing to curse, and if one is legendary he/she has enough time to kill it; second, pick up all of the corpses in the room, avoiding the 8 tiles around the coffin, and bring them outside to drop them, then there are much fewer enemies to slice and dice.

regular zombies require one to three hits before they collapse and die again, some severed limbs have been observed to still be crawling around, even heads! decapitated zombies can also walk around. also if one has companions during a skirmish inside a tomb, it is very possible that when killed their corpse will stand up and attack the adventurer (but that's cool right). (written from first hand experience by legendslayer)


--<s>So, does anyone know if dismembered zombie bits are still alive immediately after chopping?</s> They arent
[[User:Headjack|Headjack]] 23:52, 23 February 2012 (UTC)

===Special Attacks===
I spoke to someone on the forum who experienced a GCS zombification and told me that the undead GCS still shot web, but this page says the opposite. Can anybody confirm or refute? --[[User:Vasiln|Vasiln]] 22:04, 6 March 2012 (UTC)

== Raised parts FYI ==

Some experimentation in the arena has revealed that necks can be raised as undead, but noses and teeth cannot. (Fight between a Giant Sperm Whale Mummy, a werebuffalo and a Giant Desert Tortoise animated skeleton.)--[[User:Auric|Auric]] 19:30, 14 March 2012 (UTC)

v0.34 Talk:Gem

2012-03-14T18:26:43Z

Auric: Created page with "Just FYI, dwarves can now polish non-gemstone rocks into cabochons in the jewelers workshop. Even slate!--~~~~"

Just FYI, dwarves can now polish non-gemstone rocks into cabochons in the jewelers workshop. Even slate!--[[User:Auric|Auric]] 18:26, 14 March 2012 (UTC)

v0.34:Trading

2012-03-09T16:56:47Z

Auric: /* Exploits */

{{quality|Exceptional|07:56, 19 January 2011 (UTC)}}{{av}}
{{Buggy}}

'''Trading''' in Dwarf Fortress first occurs in the first [[Calendar|autumn]] after establishing your fortress, with the arrival of the [[dwarf|Dwarven]] [[Trading#Caravans|caravan]]. Trading is a good way to acquire resources that are not available or are rare in the local area. It also allows for more freedom in selecting starting gear or purchase of additional skills for the expedition party, because items can always be obtained through trade later.

'''Trader''' is the term used at your Trade Depot to refer to your fortress [[Broker]] when dealing with merchants in a visiting caravan ({{key|r}} - "''Trader requested at Depot"''). As a [[profession]], the term usually only applies to visiting merchants, or to a dwarf whose highest [[skill]] is [[Appraiser]].

== Trade Depot ==
Building a [[Trade depot]] is a requisite for trade with caravans that arrive at your fortress.

While it may be convenient to build a Trade Depot outside at first, it is usually a really good idea to move it inside or build walls, bridges and other fortifications around it to protect caravans and your goods from animals (guzzlers), [[thief|thieves]] and [[goblin]]s.

Everything that is on your map belongs to you, except:
* the items of non-fortress members (only if they are alive, when they are dead they belong to you if you claim the items),{{Verify}}
* the items that are on merchant animals{{Verify}}
* the items that are on the trade depot (they belong to the caravan until they are moved out of it)

See the [[Trade depot]] article for more information on how to interact with it.

==Trading Flowchart ==
{{:Trading/Flowchart}}
After entering the trade menu, select the items to offer from the right, and the desired items from the left. All caravans have a weight limit which cannot be exceeded, and the allowed additional weight is displayed in the lower right corner. If the acting broker has at least Novice or better [[Appraisal]] skill, the value of all items will be displayed. Once the proposal is ready, press {{K|t}} to propose the trade, but merchants will not agree unless they make adequate profit. Be sure to use '''trade''', not '''offer''' {{K|o}}, as this will make a gift of the selected items. The amount of acceptable profit is determined by the broker's [[Broker skills|skills]] and the merchant's mood, described below. Merchants may attempt to propose counteroffers if they do not accept the proposal, which can then be accepted, rejected, or further amended by the broker.

With more experienced brokers or pleased merchants, even marginally profitable trades can be successful, and counterproposals can be rejected safely, offering the same trade again. Note however that a low profit margin for the traders may not be desirable - it has been suggested that both export and profit numbers influence the size of next years caravan and, in the case of the dwarven caravan, immigration numbers.{{Verify}}

Goods brought by caravans do not have base quality higher than superior, but decorations on a good may be of any quality.{{Verify}}

== Trading cue colors ==

* '''Brown''' Items have been created (or modified) by your fortress. They can be traded away or offered as a gift.
* '''White''' Items were created by another source. They can be traded, but if one of these items has been selected, the entire selection cannot be offered as a gift.
* '''Purple''' Items are under a no-export mandate. If they are traded away it will result in disciplinary action (see [[justice]]) against the dwarf that brought the item to the depot.{{Verify}}
* '''Green''' Items have just been gifted to the caravan and they will not trade it back.
* '''Red''' Items have been seized from another caravan and cannot be traded as is; you will need to decorate them or turn them into other items for them to become "valid" trading items. However, a caravan from a different civilization ''may'' accept stolen goods without changing them first.{{verify}}

Note that containers (barrels, bins, etc) will be displayed according to the origin of the container, not the contents. So a foreign barrel holding locally-produced beer will display as foreign (white). Once you {{k|v}}iew the container, the locally-made contents are displayed as local (brown).

== Merchant mood ==
If your broker has Novice or better [[Judge of intent]] skill, there will be a line added below the merchant's dialogue describing the caravan's attitude. Their attitude rises with successful trades (especially if they get lots of profit) and falls when you propose deals they don't like.

* (trader) seems ecstatic with the trading
* (trader) seems very happy about the trading
* (trader) seems pleased with the trading
* (trader) seems willing to trade (Default, at least for humans)
* (trader) seems to be rapidly losing patience
* (trader) is not going to take much more of this
* (trader) is unwilling to trade

The happier you make a merchant, the less profit margin he will demand in a trade. If merchants reach the lowest level, no further trade will be possible, and they will immediately pack up and leave your depot. Since annoyed traders are more likely to reject deals, you should be generous in initial negotiations. Skilled negotiators seem less likely to offend traders with unsuccessful deals.

An easy way to capitalize on this mood system is to perform several partial trades. First trade for a few items, offering goods twice the value of the items you ask for (eg, offer 2000☼ for 1000☼ of his stuff). This will likely make the merchant ecstatic about trading with you. Exit the trade screen, unpause briefly, and then return to trading with a vengeance. With the merchant in such a good mood, he is more likely to counteroffer than reject a trade outright.

== Seizing items ==

Pressing {{K|s}} from the trade menu will seize the selected items of the merchant's. If you seize goods from a caravan, the merchant will respond "Take what you want. I can't stop you." and then leave immediately without the seized goods. Items cannot be seized from the dwarven caravan, and other races will not buy goods stolen from one of their caravans (then marked in red) unless they are tricked into asking for them via counteroffer, or the items are "laundered" by decoration or used to create other goods. Seizing goods will hurt diplomatic relations, but is not grounds for an automatic [[siege]].{{Verify}}

Pressing the seize button while no goods are selected will result in the merchant interpreting your seizure as a joke. This apparently does nothing to benefit or hinder your trading.{{Verify}}

As a side note, if you deconstruct your trade depot with a caravan in it, all the caravan's items will drop to the ground, to be readily hauled away by your Dwarves. This does not mark the items as stolen, and the caravan will leave. However, ''next'' year's caravan is partly based on the profits from the previous year - so if you are relying on that race's caravans for needed items, you're hurting yourself in the long run.{{Verify}}

Another way to steal without marking as stolen is to forbid the trade depot just before they leave, causing them to leave their goods at the depot.{{Verify}}

Note that the civilization attached to a particular caravan will keep track of the value of items the caravan was carrying when they set out to trade, and they will compare this value with the value of items they return home with. Regardless of what method you use to confiscate items from a caravan, even if you came to possess the goods through no fault of your own (an [[ambush]] killed the caravaners, for example) the parent civilization may decide that you stole from them and send a [[siege]] instead of a caravan the following year. It is prudent to take measures to protect caravans visiting your lands!{{Verify}}

==Offering items==

{{key|o}} You can also give away items, as gifts to the leaders of the [[civilization]] you are trading with. This presumably helps relations between yourself and the other faction, though there is not yet a clear correlation between the value of the offerings and the improvement to relations. The exact effects of offerings on trading are unknown but it is believed due to the offerings' net trade value being counted towards the traders' profit, possibly with a modifier (possibly a multiplier of more than 1 as a bonus or less than 1 to compensate for the improved relations){{Verify}}, which in turn increases the quantity and variety of trade goods brought by next year's caravan. Also the [[King]] requires offerings to be made before his arrival.(5,000 in 0.31.25) You cannot offer items that were not made at your fortress; the traders do not want your spare goblin harvest clothes.

'''''Note:''' There are currently no benefits to offering goods to your king; the game developers have stated that this is to be changed in future versions.'' ("''Req174, REASON FOR OFFERING, (Future): There's no point of offering goods to your own king right now.)"''

Unless you are looking for [[fun]], under no conditions should you offer or trade items which are wooden or used wood in their creation (glass, for example) to [[elves]], as this will insult the traders, and may cause them to leave or even damage relations enough to provoke a war between you and the elven civilization you traded with. They will be equally insulted by you trading back their wood-related items - their refusal to accept back their wooden items is probably a bug which will be removed in a later release, though this has not been verified. It is also worth noting that in-game the only way to acquire wood is by chopping down trees, so it is likely that the elves have developed a method of growing and acquiring wood without killing trees which will be included in later development (unless they are just cutting down trees that have already died naturally).

== Miscellaneous Trading Advice ==

* Several small trades, exiting the trade window each time, '''no longer''' increases the Broker's relevant skills during the early game. {{Verify}}
* Food inside the Trade Depot can go bad. Have a food stockpile nearby so you can quickly haul goods inside.
* Thieves and thieving critters tend to follow caravans. Expect assaults and intruders.
* Be careful about asking traders to bring lots of individual lightweight items (such as meat and fish) as it can result in traders taking a very long time to unload their goods. Unless the path to your depot is extremely long, though, this is unlikely to cause significant problems.{{Verify}}
* Create your trading depot inside your fort, preferably in the beginning. Place a 3-tile wide path (which must be free of obstructions such as stairways) to the entrance of the fort and line this with traps; this will help to protect the traders and keep the depot close to your supplies.
* All caravans will bring extra food (meat and edible plants) and wooden logs if the supplies of your fortress are low enough, independent of whether or not you requested them. This does not apply in the case that the weight limit is exceeded by (other) items you requested. The supply situation, as observed by traders, is based solely on the number of unforbidden items in your fortress, whether stockpiled or utilized in buildings (such as wooden axles, water wheels, windmills, or workshops); thus, it is possible to trick caravans into thinking your supplies are low by [[forbid]]ding all of your relevant stocks immediately prior to their arrival.  This also seems to apply to elven caravans bringing [[cloth]] (except that cloth that's turned into [[clothing]], [[bag]]s or [[rope]] isn't counted). So if you want elven caravans to ''stop'' bringing cloth, buy up all the cloth that the first few caravans bring and stash them somewhere.
* Define your trade depot as a burrow. When traders arrive, you can add your broker or another dwarf, perhaps one you want to train in trading, to the burrow. They will head to the depot immediately, and stay there until you remove them from the burrow.
* Elves will trade [[Tame]] exotic creatures; '''however,''' once purchased, these creatures will not show up on the Animal section of the [[Status]] screen if you do not have a [[Dungeon master]] (a noble position that is currently bugged).
* Each trade you make (regardless of value) will increase your broker's skills by 50, distributed among Comedian, Flatterer, Intimidator, Judge of Intent, Negotiator, and Persuader. Each skill seems to gain around 5-15 points, but the sum will always be 50. The skill gain occurs as soon as the "t" button is pressed - if the offer is rejected, the dwarf will still gain 50 points. If the same offer is subsequently accepted, no additional skill will be gained.

== Caravans ==
Each friendly race will send a caravan per year, linked to one season, which is autumn for dwarves, summer for humans, spring for elves. In rare cases, goblins will show up in winter.{{verify}} However, in the first year only a dwarven caravan will arrive, although it will tend to arrive later than mid-autumn, unlike previous versions {{verify}}. Caravans will only show up if that race considers the fortress site accessible (as denoted on the embark screen), with the exception of dwarves, who always arrive unless they are extinct.{{verify}} Caravans appear to enter the map from a random direction which does not coincide with the relative direction of the originating [[civilization]], and they may appear from different directions or z-levels each year. Caravans may leave without trading if it takes too long to reach the trade depot. Caravans will embark on their journey back exactly one month after their arrival, whether they have succeeded in reaching the depot or not.{{Verify}}

Note that if traders or their animals are prevented from leaving, they will eventually go [[insane]].

Also worth mention is the pathing behavior of the entire caravan. If one member of the caravan reaches a block in their chosen path (ie. a raised drawbridge that was lowered when they entered the map) the entire caravan will re-path, instead of encountering the obstacle one by one.

If a cavaran has a lot of junk to load up, it can take a while (>=2 months), but don't worry, the other caravan can unload / trade while the first one is still uploading

== Liaisons ==
[[Liaison]]s may be sent with caravans to speak to important dwarves (and they ''will'' speak to those dwarves, even if they have to wait at their bedside in the hospital for months after the caravan has left). Liaisons allow you to choose the type of items that your fortress is interested in, and will focus on bringing more of that kind of item on the next caravan (however, those items will also be more expensive). In turn, they will present a list of the items they're willing to pay more for, which will be effective upon their next arrival.

Trade agreements can be viewed at a later time through the Civilization menu ({{k|c}}). These trade agreements are cleared when a liaison of the corresponding civilization enters the screen, so they are generally not accessible after the caravan has arrived.

If a liaison is prevented from leaving, they will eventually go [[insane]]. {{Verify}}

==== [[Dwarves]] ====
:''"Our fortunes rise and fall together"''

The dwarven caravan:
* arrives in [[Calendar|autumn]].
* carries metal bars, [[leather]], weapons and armor, food and booze, and more. Dwarves alone may bring [[steel]] and steel goods. They can still bring steel (and steel goods) and [[pig iron]] bars even if they do not have access to [[iron]], but will not bring iron products.
* is well guarded.
* sends a liaison who will speak with the [[Expedition leader]], [[Mayor]], [[Baron]], [[Count]], or [[Duke]] to negotiate an import-export agreement (unless the [[Monarch]] is present).
* influences the number of immigrants received (if the caravan leaves intact).{{verify}}
* will not cause sieges when repeatedly destroyed or lost.
* is the only caravan to arrive during a fortress' first year.
* always arrives regardless of embark location, as long as the dwarven civilization is not extinct.{{verify}}
* cannot have its goods seized from the trade menu.
* may not arrive if your civilization lacks any notable figures.

==== [[elf|Elves]] ====
[[Image:Evil_elves.png|thumb|400px|A typical elven caravan.]]

The elven caravan:
* arrives in the [[Calendar|spring]].
* carries [[cloth]], [[rope]]s, various above-ground seeds, [[plant]]s and their byproducts, [[log]]s, [[wood]]en goods & [[weapon]]s, clothing and [[armor]], and may carry tame exotic [[creature]]s.
* is unguarded.
* does not accept some items in trade:

Elven traders do not like to be offered any tree byproducts. Forbidden items include:

* [[Wood]]en items (including subterranean mushrooms such as [[tower-cap]]s)
* Items derived from wood - [[ash]] and [[charcoal]], as well as [[lye]], [[potash]], and [[pearlash]]
* Items made from clear and crystal [[glass]] (due to the [[pearlash]] used) - green glass appears to be perfectly acceptable
* Items [[decoration|decorated]] with any of the above materials
* [[Obsidian]] shortswords (since they have wooden handles)
* [[Soap]] (made with [[lye]])

Offering or trading forbidden items will cause the mood of the trader to drop rapidly, causing them to refuse to trade any more that season and leave immediately. Additionally you will be called uncouth, crude, and barbaric for not understanding their customs.

However, [[stone]] and [[metal]] items, even when [[charcoal]] is used in production, are acceptable. Items made from [[silk]] are acceptable, as are all non-wooden plant-derived products such as [[cloth]] and [[thread]]. Items made of bone (totems too), horn, shell or leather are acceptable, so are meat and fish. You can also transport your goods to the [[trade depot]] in a wooden [[bin]], as long as you do not try to sell the bin. Living animals are acceptable, as long as the [[cage]] or [[trap]] is not made of [[wood]].

Be especially careful with reselling decorated items from other caravans, as non-wood/glass items may have decorations of wood or clear/crystal glass. All such items that elven caravans sell are also unacceptable to sell back to elves, as the dwarves have no means of proving that they were made in an "elf kosher" way.

==== [[Human]]s ====
The human caravan:
* arrives in [[Calendar|summer]].
* carries metal bars, sand, [[leather]], cloth, wood, food and booze, ropes, waterskins, quivers, backpacks, metal weapons and clothing and armor, cages and a few domestic animals.
* is moderately guarded.

==== [[Goblin]]s{{Verify}} ====
A goblin caravan ''may'' arrive if your civilization is at peace with the goblins.

The goblin caravan:
*will arrive every season, four times per year{{verify}}
*unguarded
*brings mostly food and cloth
*does not send a liaison or a guild representative
*does not make import/export agreements

== Destruction ==
If caravans are destroyed (intentionally or unintentionally), the items may remain for use. Traders caught in a [[cave-in]] will flee as if they were attacked, but will leave all the items dropped by the caravan behind. Pack animals carrying items are affected just like a normal tamed [[mule]] and must be killed in the cave-in for them to drop items on the ground. It is however much more likely that the pack animals will only be stunned or rendered unconscious, and flee shortly after recovering from the hit.

While caravans can defend themselves, they don't like being ambushed. An encounter with unfriendly creatures resulting in the death of any merchant or pack animal will cause them to retreat and forget about trading with you for the season. Repeated caravan destruction (intentional or unintentional) will strain diplomatic relations and may result in a [[siege]].

== Caravan Delay ==
If a caravan has arrived at your trade depot and is unable to leave for about six months after they arrived, the merchants and animals will go insane. This can result in a bunch of merchants attacking your dwarves, or just standing around moping until they starve to death. It is not known for certain if this hurts diplomatic relations, but most likely it's the same as any case where the entire caravan fails to return home.{{Verify}}

If you have locked the caravan into your fortress to hold out against a siege, it's a good idea to station a squad of soldiers near the trade depot in case the merchants [[Insanity#Types|go berserk]]. You may also want to make the depot a restricted area to encourage civilians to go around it. Alternatively, you can design the trade depot using drawbridges, so that it can be sealed off from the rest of the fortress during a siege.

If you want the merchants to leave safely, you can build four or more tunnels to each corner of the map, connected to your fortress only by drawbridges. As long as there is no other way to enter and exit your fortress, invaders and merchants will both go towards any tunnel that you activate. You can lock the merchants into the trade depot, and then open a tunnel entrance on one side of the map to make the invaders head towards that tunnel. When they get close to it, you can close it, and then open the entrance on the other side of the map, and let the traders out of the depot. If your fortress and depot are in the middle of the map, this will give the traders quite a head-start to get away.{{Verify}}

Merchants can leave the map from any map edge-- including underground map edges. If an unobstructed path through your fortress reaches an edge, then blocking an overland path will cause the merchants to travel underground. This can be useful, if you're suffering a prolonged siege; it can also be dangerous, if your underground regions are less secure than your surface.

Caravan guards cannot be starved, dehydrated, or driven to insanity if prevented from leaving, their employers and animals will however.

If an large amount of items is sold / offered to the caravan, it may take a while to load it all, specially, if you wish to keep the precious bins, and sell low value items, with low weight.

== Bugs ==

<s>*No one brings wagons, even if there is a clear path to your depot. {{bug|197}}</s> solved
*Wild animals cannot be traded; when a dwarf attempts to move the caged animal to the Depot, the creature is set free.Only aggressive animals?
*If your [[hospital]] isn't already stocked with the specified amount of thread/cloth, your dwarves will carry off as much from the caravan as they need to fill it. {{Bug|66}}
*Caravans show up very late in the season. {{Bug|1756}}

== Loyalty cascade ==
*If you order your military to kill merchants from your own civilization, your soldiers will simultaneously become members ''and'' enemies of your civilization, resulting in a civil war within your fortress. When this happens, all current members of the fortress (excluding incoming migrants) will turn on each other yet they will still be seen as normal working dwarves in the status screens. This will only last for those who were alive ''during'' the attack, they will always be hostile to everyone including incoming migrants (yet they still do their jobs/ follow military orders and work as dwarves although they will interrupt other's work. They will not be shown as enemies in the Units screen).

== Exploits ==

*If you destroy the Depot while they are unloaded you will get the leaving message but they will leave before the building is completely destroyed, so they will not reclaim any of their stuff because it is not available until the building is fully deconstructed. However any animals they had caged will only become friendly, you won't actually own them.

*If you wait some time (2-3 months{{verify}}), you can "claim" animals by linking a lever to the cage and opening it, the animals will be released in a tamed state. Check the 'u'nit screen before releasing them; if the creatures still show as Merchant creatures, they will wander off the map when released; if they show as Tame creatures, they will stay once released.

v0.34:Book

2012-03-07T00:33:00Z

Auric: /* Topics */ +poems

{{av}}

Books are a type of item. They cannot normally be created by players either in [[adventurer mode]] or [[fortress mode]], but will be written during world generation by necromancers and various demonic rulers. While it is possible to create books using custom [[reactions]] and add pages to them, the pages will always be blank.

Books are currently found sitting on [[table]]s in the tower or keep of the entity that wrote them.

One must be a [[Reader]] of at least Novice skill in order to read a book.

== Topics ==

Some books may contain "secrets of life and death", which when read by an adventurer will make him a [[necromancer]], immune to death from age and able to raise zombies.

Books may be autobiographies, or about other historical characters or locations the author has had contact with. Books may also be commentaries on other books, or contain poems.

v0.31:Wagon (embark)

2011-05-31T16:37:50Z

Auric:

{{av}}
{{Quality|Fine}}

In {{L|Fortress mode}}, you usually start with a single ''immobile'' '''wagon''' that represents the transportation vehicle for all your supplies. A wagon is not a real vehicle, and never moves or serves any other purpose - it simply sits there at the start of the game, representing where your dwarves decided to stop. Any and all supplies were selected at {{L|embark}} by you and bought with points; supplies cannot be bought later, but your dwarves can (try to) {{L|trade}} for whatever the seasonal {{L|caravan}}s bring. Embarking with a large enough quantity of goods can potentially result in receiving multiple wagons.

To empty a wagon, your dwarves need the appropriate {{L|hauling}} {{L|labor}} enabled (all are enabled by default at embark), no other jobs to distract them, an appropriate {{L|stockpile}} designated, and a valid {{L|path}} between the stockpile and the items. And, depending on how many items you brought, patience.

You can break down your wagon into three {{L|log}}s by pressing {{K|q}} or {{K|t}}, highlighting the wagon, and pressing {{K|x}}. A dwarf with the {{L|Carpentry}} labor enabled will then deconstruct the wagon into its component logs. The items will then be scattered in a slightly wider pattern in that same location. A wagon cannot be used for ''any'' other purpose - might as well break it down for the lumber, now or later.

If that dis-assembly is finished while a dwarf is returning to the wagon to {{L|haul}} an item to a stockpile, the dwarf will cancel that {{L|job}}. An {{L|announcement}} will be generated, to the effect of "Job Item lost or misplaced". Don't panic - nothing has been lost, except that dwarf's train of thought, as the item they were retrieving is no longer in the wagon but instead on the ground. They may adopt another hauling job, that same or a different one, and sooner or later that item will get hauled, but that particular job is cancelled for that moment.

In rare cases you might start on a level or spot that doesn't have a 3x3 square (e.g. mountain peak). In this case, your wagon (and its constituent logs) will be missing, but your goods will still be present, lying in a pile on the ground.

Dismantling the wagon when its very near (1-2 tiles) the edge of the map or a {{L|river}} vent can cause you to lose part of your embark equipment if it lands where your dwarves can't go. If it's within a couple tiles of such a location, it's recommended you wait until the wagon is 100% empty before dismantling it.

Unless/until you formally designate a new one, your Wagon is a default {{L|Activity zone#Meeting Area|Meeting Area}} or {{L|Meeting hall|Meeting Hall}}. A meeting zone is where any {{L|domestic animal}}s or {{L|On break|idle}} dwarves will congregate in their spare time, and also provide some measure of defense for your possessions from any {{L|rhesus macaque}}s or {{L|kobold}} {{L|thief|thieves}} before you finish securing your valuables. If you deconstruct your wagon but do not define a new meeting area, your dwarves and animals will wander aimlessly.

If you embark in a {{L|Glacier}} biome and are slow in moving your embark items underground, you will loose them and the wagon to {{L|wear}}.

{{Buildings}}

{{Category|Buildings}}
{{Category|Fortress mode}}

v0.31:Wear

2011-05-31T16:32:53Z

Auric: +wear in glacier biome

{{av}}
{{Quality|Fine}}

'''Wear''' is the general degradation of materials over time, primarily in the context of {{L|food}} and {{L|clothing}}. Wear and/or rotting will alter the quality of an item, denoted by the symbols x, X and XX. For example, over time a dwarf's "Pig tail shirt" will degrade into a "xPig tail shirtx" and eventually a "XXPig tail shirtXX" before disappearing entirely.

Animal-based products can '''rot''' given enough time, rendering the product unusable and generating {{L|miasma}} which gives your dwarves unhappy {{L|thoughts}}. Crops and harvested plants can '''wither''', making them useless but generating no miasma.

Clothing and leather items are worn down very rapidly after catching on {{L|fire}}.

If a {{L|Trade depot|trade depot}} is built outside in a {{L|Glacier}} biome, wood and cloth items will degrade until purchased. This will also happen to items in a {{L|Wagon (embark)|starting wagon}} in a similar location. Walls do not halt the effect.

== Preventing the Problem ==

The good news is that food items will eventually disappear on their own if left alone to decay - however, the best preventative measure is to use them up before they go bad.

{{L|Skin}} and {{L|fat}} can be processed into {{L|leather}} and {{L|tallow}}, respectively, neither of which can rot. {{L|Meat}} and various {{L|prepared organs|organs}} can be cooked, prolonging their shelf life. Plants can be brewed or processed into goods which do not wither.

{{L|Vermin}} will accelerate decay; as such, your food stocks should be kept in {{L|barrel}}s and guarded by {{L|cat}}s or {{L|trapper}}s.

== Dealing with Decay ==

A refuse {{L|stockpile}} will accept corpses, butchery products, bones, and rotten items. Placing one aboveground will allow corpses and meat to rot without producing miasma; if this is not an option, a sealed room can contain miasma safely without bothering the whole fort. Stockpile settings will allow you to sort your refuse as needed.

Some corpses cannot be butchered; most notably, invaders such as {{L|goblin}}s and {{L|kobold}}s.

Slain dwarves will rot unless put into a {{L|coffin}}. They are stored in a graveyard stockpile until then.

v0.31:Cave-in

2011-04-27T16:38:01Z

Auric: /* Results of a cave-in */

{{quality|Fine|21:06, 6 October 2010 (UTC)}}{{av}}

A '''cave-in''' is when walls, floors, and objects plummet downwards to lower {{L|Z-axis|Z-levels}} under the influence of {{L|gravity}}. A cave-in will occur if constructions or ground tiles are detached from all support (bridges do not support constructions). Since it is only a placeholder, the system is highly unrealistic—you can hold up a giant megafortress by a slender pillar of soap. [[Toady One]] has stated he intends to implement more realistic cave-ins in future versions.

Cave-ins can be disabled through the {{L|Technical tricks|init}} file, by changing [CAVEINS:YES] to [CAVEINS:NO].

== How cave-ins work ==

Any ''disconnected'' {{L|construction}} or section of {{L|rock}} or {{L|soil}} will cave in. The game checks for connections along the X, Y, and Z axes (that's left/right, up/down, and above/below). Any construction, even {{L|Stair}}s (natural or constructed), and {{L|support}}s (naturally) provide support/connections. '''Diagonal connections and {{L|bridge}}s do not.'''

Note that supports and fortifications, but '''not''' [[statue]]s, create an invisible floor on the level above them. No dwarf can enter the invisible floor, but it will hold an area attached to the floor tiles in four directions alongside it or the constructed/natural wall above it.

== Results of a cave-in ==

* Any {{L|creature}} caught directly underneath (on the same tile underneath) a cave-in is killed, no exception.
* Any item caught under falling natural walls is destroyed completely. Natural floors and constructed walls and floors have a chance of destroying items.{{verify}}
* Anything standing on the area that caves in falls and may get away with being stunned. The fall victim has a chance of being unable to walk away, somewhat proportional to the distance fallen but not set in stone. <s>No</s> Pun intended.
* A large amount of dust is generated. Any creature caught by the dust from the collapse is knocked {{L|unconscious}} and can be thrown a few tiles, which may cause them to fall off, say, a narrow bridge fifty z-levels above the ground. Dwarfs will receive an unhappy thought from choking on dust clouds (which won't matter if they're dead).
* All {{L|building}}s and non-wall {{L|construction}}s under the falling area are destroyed. Buildings above the cave-in will deconstruct if they are no longer supported.
* Natural terrain will remain intact during the cave-in; the only effect is they are revealed. {{verify}}
* Constructions will deconstruct when they collide with solid terrain.
* Any terrain crashes through multiple {{L|floor}}s, and stops only upon reaching solid ground or a constructed wall, where natural terrain piles up and constructions deconstruct.
* Mined stairs and {{L|ramp}}s will settle like unmined rock; Stairs down that fall onto previously empty {{L|floor}}s will reveal the level below. If there's rock or floor above them, it'll cover the stairs.
* Anything falling into a fluid sinks to the bottom. Therefore, it is not a good idea to punch a skylight into your meeting area if you forgot that e.g. your {{L|gem}} pile was directly below and you had a {{L|magma}} tube three Z levels afterward... you get the idea.
* Any water displaced by falling natural walls is not destroyed, but displaced upwards(!) to directly on top of the fallen walls.
* Soil walls tend to turn into a different soil type when they fall into a stone layer.
* {{L|Magma mist}} will be generated in all tiles of magma that were in the path of the cave-in.
* Any mined minerals or stone in the area directly under the cave-in will be forced out from under the cave-in.

== Avoiding cave-ins ==

Do not make unconnected sections of rock.

Actually, you're quite unlikely to cause cave-ins unless you are actively trying to cause them. In which case, you'd be wondering how to avoid cave-ins that ''cause damage'' to your folks. That's simple: Add a {{L|support}} under the stone mass, and link it to a distant {{L|lever}}. When you're done, hide everyone, pull the lever and watch the fireworks. If you're feeling lazier, use statues to keep dwarves off the wrong squares. Provided they move directly away from the cave-in area, the dust may not catch them - and they don't blunder off edges and die unless the dust catches them.

One of the more common accidental cave-ins results when you're taking out the floor in a checker-pattern (dwarves {{L|channel}}ing may sometimes tend to make this mistake) and the area below isn't supported, resulting in a situation like the diagram below:

Floor -1
▒▒▒▒▒▒
▒ ▒
▒ X +▒ <-- The X is a floor tile. It's not attached, so it will fall down.
▒ +>▒
▒ ▒
▒▒▒▒▒▒

Floor -2
▒▒▒▒▒▒
▒....▒
▒...▒▒ <-- Causing this area to receive a cave-in flow and knocking out any dwarves in its reach.
▒...<▒
▒....▒
▒▒▒▒▒▒

Another thing to watch out for is if you want to dig away a hill above ground, to make room for your fancy overground fort. You may dig away the hill on one level, and then have a huge platform of "floor" on the z-level above that falls on your {{L|miner}} if they get disconnected from the ground. Easy thing to miss the first time you do it.

The solution here is to dig ramps instead, since these take away both the {{L|soil}} on the level you are digging on and the floor on the level above. This is not foolproof, however, as {{L|tree}}s will prevent the floor it's on from being removed, resulting a free-hanging floor when you carve the ramp around it. In addition, ramps do not provide support for other tiles on the higher z-level; depending upon the order they are constructed, cave-ins may still occur.

== Using cave-ins ==
Intentional cave-ins serve several purposes:
* '''Defense'''
*: Use cave-ins to block off water approaches to underground cavern levels. Combined with walls higher up, a cavern can (with great effort) be rendered completely safe from all intruding vermin.1
* '''Death'''
*: Since a cave-in kills all {{L|creatures}} instantly, it can provide a {{L|Unfortunate accident|convenient}} or amusing way to off a group of creatures. This is also one of the most effective ways of dealing with {{L|titan}}s and {{L|forgotten beast}}s with dangerous {{L|syndrome}}s, especially airborne contaminants (deadly dust/vapors) and poisonous blood.
* '''Removal of floor tiles'''
*: Causing a cave-in will destroy non-reinforced (no wall or support underneath) floor tiles directly underneath the falling terrain - this is a good way to e.g. hollow out a large area. All that's left to do is a little bit of cleanup on the edges, but look at all the channeling you save yourself!
* '''Breaking through multiple aquifer levels''' {{verify}}
*: Showcase with two levels: [[User:Rhenaya/HowtoDualAquifer]]
* '''Trapping [TRAPAVOID] creatures:'''
*: Since the dust from a cave-in can knock creatures unconscious, and any unconscious creature triggers a trap (including your dwarves and other friendly creatures), combine a cave-in with nearby cage traps for the capture. Note that this is only useful for kobolds and gremlins, as all other creatures which avoid traps are also immune to being knocked unconscious.

=== Caving-in the toplevel/terrain from inside ===

You can cause terrain above you to cave in without going outside by first mining up stairs below the "borderline" you want to channel, channel the tiles above them, and removing the stairs afterwards.
The tiles above the up stairs can be mined from below while standing on the stair, so you don't have to go outside. Ramps would also work for that alone, but the ramps would allow enemies to enter, whereas the up-stairs alone do not allow passage to above as there is no corresponding down-stair above them.

1Not literal vermin, those won't be blocked.

{{Category|Physics}}

{{buildings}}

v0.31 Talk:Material definition token

2011-04-16T20:25:12Z

Auric: /* building on water? */ new section

* Found some links for people interested in tooth & bone numbers in DF... --[[User:TomiTapio|TomiTapio]] 18:59, 14 July 2010 (UTC)

::Tooth enamel Young's modulus at http://www.ruthtrumpold.id.au/designtech/pmwiki.php?n=Main.YoungSModulus 83 GPa and 12,000,000 lbf/in.

::Tooth hardness science stuff http://www.scielo.br/scielo.php?script=sci_arttext&pid=S1516-14392003000300011

::"From the load versus depth of indentation curve Young's modulus was found to be typically 8.3×10^10 Pa and the yield stress to be 3.3×10^8 Pa." http://www.springerlink.com/content/w125706571032231/

::Some bone data: www.tcd.ie/bioengineering/documents/LectureBoneProps1.ppt

::Bone and glass and copper: http://www.engineeringtoolbox.com/young-modulus-d_417.html

::http://www.soe.uoguelph.ca/webfiles/kgordon/Academic%20Courses/Bone_for_Biomaterials.htm

::human vs cow bone! http://www.engin.umich.edu/class/bme456/bonefunction/bonefunction.htm

::silk silk bone http://www.complore.com/properties-materials-tensile-strength

== Strain_at_yield ==

Well, ~_ELASTICITY is now ~_STRAIN_AT_YIELD. Should this be updated? [[Special:Contributions/174.113.156.80|174.113.156.80]] 19:13, 20 July 2010 (UTC)

== Wrong page name? ==

If we're going to be consistent with what was used in previous versions, this page should consist of the hardcoded material tokens STONE, METAL, INORGANIC, AMBER, CORAL, GLASS_GREEN, GLASS_CLEAR, GLASS_CRYSTAL, WATER, COAL, POTASH, ASH, PEARLASH, LYE, MUD, VOMIT, SALT, FILTH_B, FILTH_Y, UNKNOWN_SUBSTANCE, and GRIME (and possibly also NONE and GET_MATERIAL_FROM_REAGENT), since those are technically what the game considers to be "material tokens" and are what you use in places like ITEMCORPSE and in reactions. --[[User:Quietust|Quietust]] 16:17, 13 August 2010 (UTC)
:This has since been corrected (by me, no less). --[[User:Quietust|Quietust]] 20:06, 5 September 2010 (UTC)

== uneditable materials ==

I tried editing sand, and it seems it just plain old won't let me do it. Any changes cause a new type of soil to appear that's just called "rock" and has all of the default stone template info (it's not even a soil, it only APPEARS as soil layers, and even leaves stones behind) and leave the old sand settings untouched. The occurrence of "rock" is proportional to the number of types of sand I change, and there are even map squares with 4 layers of "rock" and no other soil layers- [[User:Elvenchakra|Elvenchakra]] 20:47, 13 September 2010 (UTC)
:In what ''exact'' way were you trying to edit the material? --[[User:Quietust|Quietust]] 21:03, 13 September 2010 (UTC)
::I was trying to remove the ability to collect sand so that a new way could be implemented, but then I tried changing the sand in other ways and I've been getting the same result- [[User:Elvenchakra|Elvenchakra]] 22:35, 13 September 2010 (UTC)
:::That's not an ''exact'' method. What tokens did you add, modify, or remove? --[[User:Quietust|Quietust]] 23:06, 13 September 2010 (UTC)
::::as I said, I tried A LOT of things, including simply moving the stuff to a different file and not changing ANY tags- [[User:elvenchakra|elvenchakra]] 15:31, 14 September 2010 (UTC)
:::::Moving stuff to other files without regenerating the world would almost certainly cause things to break horribly, as materials (and creatures) are quite sensitive to the order in which they are defined. --[[User:Quietust|Quietust]] 18:31, 14 September 2010 (UTC)
::::::I DID regenerate the world. Every single time I changed stuff I regenerated a new world. That's the only way I even knew that the stuff was considered a soil layer. Now stop telling me I'm at fault until you actually try it for yourself- [[User:Elvenchakra|Elvenchakra]] 03:26, 15 September 2010 (UTC)
::::::I even started with a clean slate each time I tried changing something. It even functions properly when I completely remove the entire soil file from the raws- [[User:Elvenchakra|Elvenchakra]] 03:28, 15 September 2010 (UTC)

== Units ==

OK, so what are the units in the Compression Yield etc tokens? How would one add a new material, such as an alloy, without knowing what the units are?

== building on water? ==

Is there any way to change the properties of water so it can be built on?--[[User:Auric|Auric]] 20:25, 16 April 2011 (UTC)

v0.31:Butcher's shop

2011-04-16T19:53:01Z

Auric: /* Notes */

{{Quality|Exceptional|09:44, 9 August 2010 (UTC)}}
{{Workshop
|name=Butcher's shop
|key=u
|job=*{{L|Butcher|Butchery}}
|construction=
1 of
*{{L|Block}}
*{{L|Stone}}
*{{L|Wood}}
|construction_job=
1 of
*{{L|Butchery}}
*{{L|Small animal dissection}}
*{{L|Trapping}}
|use=
* {{L|Tame animals}}
* Corpses of untamed non-sentient animals
|production=
* {{L|Skin}}
* {{L|Fat}}
* {{L|Meat}}
* {{L|Bone}}
* {{L|Prepared organs}}
* {{L|Skull}}
* {{L|Scale}}
* {{L|Hooves}}
* {{L|Ivory}}
* {{L|Tooth}}
* {{L|Hair}}
* {{L|Wool}}
}}{{av}}

The '''butcher's shop''' is used to butcher {{L|Tame animals|tame animals}}, corpses of certain slain animals, and to process skeletons of wild animals. Tame animals can be designated for butchering either by pressing {{key|v}}, moving the curser over the animal and pressing {{key|s}}, or by going into the animal list by pressing {{key|z}}, {{key|Enter}} and then by choosing the animal(s) for butchering by pressing {{key|b}} while they are highlighted. It can also be used to butcher already dead animals, but only if their corpses have been placed in a '''refuse''' stockpile nearby beforehand.

A butchered animal results into various items with different uses:

{| {{prettytable}}
!Item
!Uses
|-
|{{L|Meat}} and {{L|Prepared organs}}
|Eaten raw or {{L|kitchen|cooked}}
|-
|{{L|Fat}}
|{{L|kitchen|Cooked}} to {{L|tallow}}
|-
|{{L|Skull}}
|Crafting skull {{L|totem||totems}}
|-
|{{L|Bone|Bones}}
|Crafting bone {{L|bolt|bolts}}, bone {{L|craft|crafts}}, or used as a {{L|decoration}} material
|-
|{{L|Hoof|Hooves}}, {{L|Horn}}s, {{L|Shell}}s, {{L|Nail}}s,{{L|Tooth|Teeth}}
|Used for {{L|crafts}} or used as a {{L|decoration}} material
|-
|Skin, Scale, and Chitin
|Tanned into {{L|Leather}}
|-
|{{L|Hair}}
|Spun into {{L|thread}}, but not weaved into {{L|cloth}}
|-
|{{L|Cartilage}}
|Currently no uses. {{version|0.31.25}}
|-
|Nervous tissue
|Currently no uses. {{version|0.31.25}}
|-
|Feather
|Currently no uses. {{version|0.31.25}}
|-
|Wool
|Spun into {{L|Yarn}}
|}

==Menu==
'''Butcher's Shop'''

*{{k|b}}'''Butcher a dead animal'''
Renders a dead animal into its component parts of {{L|meat}}, {{L|fat}}, {{L|skin}}, {{L|bone}}s, and {{L|skull}}s. Usually used on animals that your {{L|hunter}} brings back, or tame animals you chose for slaughter.

*{{k|e}}'''Extract from a dead animal'''
Requires a caged {{L|fire snake}}, {{L|cave spider}}, or {{L|phantom spider}} and {{L|Animal dissector|animal dissection}}. Contrary to the name of the task, the vermin must be alive (though it will be dead once the task is done).
Produces {{L|Fire snake|liquid fire}} and {{L|venom}}, respectively.

*{{k|a}}'''Capture a live land animal'''
Requires an {{L|animal trap}} and {{L|trapping}}.
The trapper will take the trap and chase vermin until it catches one.

==Common Uses==
*Produce meat for food.
*Produce skin for leather.
*Produce bones for bolts.

==Helpful Strategies==

=== Hauling and stockpile considerations ===

One thing to beware of is that butchered creatures will practically explode into piles of meat, bones, fat, organs and more; this can quickly clutter up a butchers shop or risk rotting the entire pile if not enough haulers and a suitable stockpile are available. Refuse also can not be stored in containers, so every item will use up one stockpile tile. For any jobs, such as cooking meat, rendering fat, and carving bones, the entire stack will become tasked and unavailable to other workshops.

The initial corpse or body part must be in a stockpile close enough to the butcher's shop to automatically trigger the '''Butcher a dead animal''' job. Similarly, there is a maximum distance for the [[Tanner's shop]] to notice a skin and automatically trigger a '''Tan a skin''' job. It is not known precisely what "close enough" is, in either case.

=== Clutter Reduction and Rotting Prevention ===

A good way to cut down on clutter and to prevent your butchered animals from rotting is to build a Quantum Stockpile right by your butcher shops and then place a stockpile at the bottom. This way as meat is produced you can order it dumped into the stockpile so it is stored easily and will not rot.
To prevent rotten meat from producing miasma channel out a shaft above your butcher shops and build a wall around it on the surface. This way if meat rots it will not produce miasma.

==Notes==
*A butcher's shop is operated by any dwarf with the 'butchery' {{L|profession}} enabled.
*Corpses left to rot will become skeletons. Only those of wild animals (typically killed from hunting or traps) can be processed at the butcher's shop. Products will be bone, skull, hoof, horn and the like (no meat, fat, prepared organs or skin).
*Partial corpses as well as mutilated corpses do not provide the "full set"; the number of bones may be lower, organs may be missing.
*You can't butcher vermin fish, that is done at the [[Fishery]]. But you can butcher underwater creatures. For instance, you can butcher 'Carp corpse', but you can't butcher 'Oyster'.

==See Also==

:*{{L|Creature}} pages for butchering results.
:*{{L|Meat industry}}
:*{{L|Stockpile}}

{{Workshops}}

v0.31 Talk:Underworld

2011-04-12T18:28:18Z

Auric: /* Flooding Hell */ new section

== FPS ==
I have opened HFS by carving fortification and walling the thing back with raw adamantine. The fortress have been saved, but FPS decreased and that the fortress became unpleasant to play: it fell from 30+ to 13. Does anyone experience the same?

Yes, it's very common. It's most likely because the demons will continue to try and path to the surface. [[User:Naros|Naros]] 14:16, 18 January 2011 (UTC)

== LOLSPOILER ==
DF2010:Hell
(Redirected from DF2010:Hidden Fun Stuff)

{ { spoiler } }

WTF is the point of a spoiler tag concealing the contents of the clowncar '''IF YOU NAME THE DAMN ARTICLE ''"HELL"'''''
==HFS -> Hell==

Just to be clear: HFS ''is'' Hidden Fun Stuff - in the last version HFS was the [[40d:Eerie glowing pit|eerie glowing pits]], but in this version it's Hell, so that's what we're officially referring to it as (though the nickname of HFS will still stand). I imagine Demonic Fortresses will be moved to their own page eventually but for now it'd be too stubby. --[[User:Retro|Retro]] 00:35, 4 April 2010 (UTC)
:Actually, upon realizing that curious structures are demonic fortresses, I merged their info into the Demonic Fortress page. --[[User:Retro|Retro]] 01:15, 4 April 2010 (UTC)

== Article Title ==

Should the article be renamed? The game refers to the demons as denizens of the Underworld unless I'm mistaken. Using tangentially related Judeo-Christian terminology for something that already has an official name seems unnecessary. --[[User:Pilsu|Pilsu]] 8:35, 17 July 2010 (UTC)
:'''Hell''' is an English word that is not specific to any one religion, or any collection of religions. You can have Christian hells, Buddhist hells, Marriage hells, Voodoo hells, any underworld abode of the damned can be described by the word hell. -- [[User:Ancient History|Ancient History]] 15:12, 17 July 2010 (UTC)
::

== Demon populations ==

From my limited observations the demon population is infinite, but beyond the initial dozens (or hundreds?) that you get when you first breach, the rest are merely migrants just as you'd see with more mundane creatures on the surface or passing through caverns. These migrants are probably "aggressive" - seeking dwarves if they have a path - but unless you've built a path from the pillar to hell's surface, it can mean your fort is entirely safe if all your demon types are "terrestrial" and cannot fly. Safe after dealing with the initial invasion of course - the initial demon always seem to crawl up the pillar even if they cannot normally fly. [[User:Niveras|Niveras]] 16:29, 20 July 2010 (UTC)

:Are there any success stories of people actually being able to fight of the initial invasion? In my experience, striking hell means almost immediate game over.

::I managed to stop the demon hordes of hell once! Ok, technically I messed up -- I accidentally breached the magma sea a few frames after I accidentally opened hell. Long story short, flooding hell with magma does not kill the demons, but is an effective enough method of stopping them from coming up. Also an effective method of killing FPS. --[[User:Waladil|Waladil]] 13:46, 21 February 2011 (UTC)

I observe the same thing. We should probably change the article text so it's less misleading. Currently, it's worded as if the demon attacks never end. [[User:Umiman|Umiman]] 04:29, 21 July 2010 (UTC)

==Clearly not hell==
There is no way that this is hell. Hell is an unending tide of nobles that make constant demands, which can never die. --[[Special:Contributions/98.215.50.77|98.215.50.77]] 05:47, 23 August 2010 (UTC)

== Win? ==

So i found a adamantine pillar of 6 z levels tall, started digging the highest level (of course), channeled a part of it and as soon as the game paused, announcing my discovery of hell, I listed "raw adamantine" as non economic, and then using a second miner with masonry skills, I built a adamantine floor covering the hole and sealed the demons and HFS.

That's a good strategy to avoid fun.--[[Special:Contributions/200.82.91.216|200.82.91.216]] 23:19, 10 September 2010 (UTC)

== Volcano Hell? ==

Sometimes when embarking in an area with a Volcano, the volcano itself seems to reach all the way down into hell, triggering the initial demons and allowing me to see a good portion of Hell even before unpausing to start out. Unfortunately my framerate got killed before I had a chance for the demons to reach me, but should it be mentioned that Volcanoes can pierce into hell?--[[User:Twilightdusk|Twilightdusk]] 03:44, 24 November 2010 (UTC)

I can confirm this, however, I believe it is a bug. Still, it is worth a mention as I have seen it, you have seen it, and I know people on the forums have seen it. Happens with magma tubes, as well.[[User:GhostDwemer|GhostDwemer]] 22:56, 24 November 2010 (UTC)

== Hell can be a good thing in DF ==

It's extremely easy to wall or floor off. Since it just revealed a massive vein of over 100 adamantine, it's more of a good thing than a bad thing. --[[Special:Contributions/41.0.10.9|41.0.10.9]] 07:17, 12 February 2011 (UTC) (Ruan942)
:Except your FPS goes to hell when you wall it off :P [[User:Greep|Greep]] 23:21, 23 February 2011 (UTC)

== Flooding Hell ==

I wonder what would happen if you were to arrange for the ocean or a river to flood Hell? Is it even possible?--[[User:Auric|Auric]] 18:28, 12 April 2011 (UTC)