Military testing

From Dwarf Fortress Wiki
Revision as of 17:01, 23 February 2012 by Hostergaard (talk | contribs) (Added result and edit a formating error in "Dwarves against Skeletal Horses (3)")
Jump to navigation Jump to search

This page on the wiki houses trials run within the game by players, with the intention of arriving at conclusions on how certain combat situations work, or just combat in general.

If you want to know more about how to do your own testing go to the DF2010:Arena wiki article. To learn more about the military and how it works in Dwarf Fortress, go to the DF2010:Military article.

The format in which trials are presented here is by no means a strict rule. Feel free to add and change elements but make sure the information is easy to read and understand. Try to provide any information you think is relevant and useful without digressing too much.

Standard format for testing trials

Here's an example of how to present your test's information. If you're not sure how to make tables and stuff, just copy this from the edit page and fill it with your own information.

Times run: 1

Initial setup:

Side & Creature Number Skills Items
#1: Dwarf 6 Grand Master Swordsdwarf
Grand Master Elf-hater
Tower-cap stake
#2: Corinthian Magma Weasel 6 -no skills- -no items-
#3: Tea cup 6 Legendary Absurdist Mustard

Results:

Side & Creature Survived Injury level Health tags Most common cause of death
#1: Dwarves 0 Severed limbs
Bruised internal organs
Tired
Bored
Extreme Pain
Infection
#2: Corinthian Magma Weasel 3 Broken nose
Broken toes
Nauseous Severed head
#3: Tea cup 1 Cracked handle -none- Slippage

Notes: The creatures were placed in tight groups, spaced equally apart. The dwarves died fast from injuries caused by the tea cups the magma weasels were throwing. The weasels died from friendly fire.

Tester's conclusion: The test was meant to test how 3 different sides interact in combat and if any creature uses other creatures as projectiles. As far as this test goes, it seems to be true.

DF2010 (0.31.16) tests

Dwarves against Skeletal Horses (tested by: plynxis)

Times run: 2

Initial setup:

Side & Creature Number Skills Items
#1: Dwarf 6 -no skills- full iron armor (with chain leggings and mail shirt),
shield and longsword
#2: Skeletal Horse 3 -no skills- -no items-

Results:

Side & Creature Survived Injury level Health tags1 Most common cause of death
#1: Dwarves 6 4 have no injuries
2 badly wounded
Unconscious
Extreme Pain
-N/A-
#2: Skeletal Horse 0 -N/A- -N/A- Fatal injuries

1Refers only to those injured.

Notes: I did this test to see if dwarves can survive horses if they've got full iron armor and weapons. The fight was short and it looks like the skeletal horses charge hard and if they hit, they stun and can kill pretty fast if they're not stopped. I tried it 6:3 because I didn't expect the dwarves to survive a 1:1 ratio against the horses anyway. And yes the amount of trials is pathetic :P

Tester's conclusion: Even if dwarves are fully equipped, skeletal horses are very hard to deal with without casualties or at least serious injuries. Going up to a herd requires at least double the dwarves (if they're unskilled at least) to make sure you'll win and even then you're very likely to end up with dwarves that need hospitalization.

Dwarves against fire imps (tested by: plynxis)

Times run: 1

Initial setup:

Side & Creature Number Skills Items
#1: Dwarf 4 Grand Master Shield User iron shield
#2: Fire imp 6 -no skills- -no items-

Results:

Side & Creature Survived Injury level Health tags Most common cause of death
#1: Dwarves 4 -no injuries- -no tags- -N/A-
#2: Fire imp 0 -N/A- -N/A- Fatal damage from shield attacks

Notes: The purpose of this test was to see how shields block fire. In that sense, it was a failure since none of the imps even had the time to attempt fire attacks. The dwarves use their shields as weapons when they don't have an actual weapon in hand and can use it to block at the same time.

Tester's conclusion: Dwarves with shields and the skill to use them can be very deadly and hard to kill as well. That and fire imps are easy to kill :P

Dwarves against Dragon (tested by: plynxis)

Times run: 1

Initial setup:

Side & Creature Number Skills Items
#1: Dwarf 4 Grand Master Shield User iron shield
#2: Dragon 1 -no skills- -no items-

Results:

Side & Creature Survived Injury level Health tags Most common cause of death
#1: Dwarves 0 -N/A- -N/A- Severing of the body when incapable of blocking a biting attack
#2: Dragon 1 All toes broken, nose broken
Severe bruising on the rest of the body
Pain -N/A-

Notes: This is a test intended to test fire blocking with shields, in lieu of the previous test which failed at it. Dwarves can block fire breath fine with iron shields and the shields do not get worn.

Tester's conclusion: Again, dwarves capable of using shields properly are very hard to kill. These ones had very high skill and the only way the dragon was able to kill them was by knocking them over or stunning them and following through with a bite, severing them in half.

Dwarves against Dragon (2) (tested by: plynxis)

Times run: 1

Initial setup:

Side & Creature Number Skills Items
#1: Dwarf 4 Grand Master Shield User chestnut shield
#2: Dragon 1 -no skills- -no items-

Results:

Side & Creature Survived Injury level Health tags Most common cause of death
#1: Dwarves 3 -no injuries- -no tags- Severing of the body when incapable of blocking a biting attack
#2: Dragon 0 All toes broken, nose broken
Severe bruising on the rest of the body
Severe bruising of internal organs
Extreme Pain
Nauseous
Suffocation

Notes: This test was made to test the effectiveness of non-firesafe material shields against fire. Other than that, the setup is entirely identical to the previous test.

Tester's conclusion: Shield material does not matter when used by a dwarf it seems and it also never gets worn, so technically a shield of any material is just as adequate for defense. The dwarves again used their shields to attack successfully. Fights with dragons also seem to always include the dragon getting all his toes broken and often his nose. It is also apparent that chance is an important factor when attacks that land by one side (the dragon in this case) are almost always fatal and the other side (the dwarves here) is capable of completely blocking the majority of these attacks. This demonstrated by the fact that in the previous test all dwarves died while in this one the dragon died instead, with all survivors being intact.

Dwarves against Skeletal Horses (2) (tested by: plynxis)

Times run: 1

Initial setup:

Side & Creature Number Skills Items
#1: Dwarf 6 Grand Master Shield User chestnut shield
#2: Skeletal Horse 3 -no skills- -no items-

Results:

Side & Creature Survived Injury level Health tags Most common cause of death
#1: Dwarves 6 -no injuries- -no tags- -N/A-
#2: Skeletal Horses 0 -N/A- -N/A- Fatal injuries

Notes: This is a followup of the previous test to examine how effective shields are against skeletal horses.

Tester's conclusion: The dwarves are not only capable of killing the horses, but also prevent any injury to themselves. The horses still push them around a bit, but there is little they can do when dwarves gang up on them. The fight is also, quite short.

Dwarves against Horses (tested by: plynxis)

Times run: 1

Initial setup:

Side & Creature Number Skills Items
#1: Dwarf 6 Skilled Shield User chestnut shield
#2: Horse 3 -no skills- -no items-

Results:

Side & Creature Survived Injury level Health tags Most common cause of death
#1: Dwarves 0 -N/A- -N/A- Fatal injuries
#2: Horses 3 Light bruising -no tags- -N/A-

Notes: This was done by accident, but serves as a comparison between Skeletal and regular Horses. There seems to be no comparison :P. The intent was to test how capable dwarves are with just a "Skilled" level of expertise with shields rather than Grand Master.

Tester's conclusion: Contrary to Skeletal Horses, the regular ones are much harder to kill with shields. The important point here however is the immense difference of capability a dwarf has at a low skill level contrary to a high skill level. Dwarves at this level do not have a consistent ability to block attacks and use their shields enough to prevent quick death, especially by horses.

Dwarves against Horses (2) (tested by: plynxis)

Times run: 1

Initial setup:

Side & Creature Number Skills Items
#1: Dwarf 6 Grand Master Shield User chestnut shield
#2: Horse 3 -no skills- -no items-

Results:

Side & Creature Survived Injury level Health tags Most common cause of death
#1: Dwarves 3 -no injuries- -no tags- Fatal injuries
#2: Horses 0 -N/A- -N/A- Fatal injuries

Notes: This is intended to test the actual effectiveness of dwarves as grand masters against regular horses, so as to compare to skeletal horses and the previous test that had dwarves using shields at a lower skill level.

Tester's conclusion: Arguably, a higher skill level is a lot more effective, but horses still are very hard to kill without casualties. The difference between fighting a bones-only Horse and an actual muscled Horse is very apparent.

Dwarves against Hydra (tested by: plynxis)

Times run: 1

Initial setup:

Side & Creature Number Skills Items
#1: Dwarf 31 Grand Master Shield User chestnut shield
#2: Hydra 1 -no skills- -no items-

1These are the dwarves that survived the previous test. They're completely unharmed, but I thought it good to mention this.

Results:

Side & Creature Survived Injury level Health tags Most common cause of death
#1: Dwarves 1 Lost a leg Tired Fatal injuries
Severing of the body when incapable of blocking a biting attack
#2: Hydra 1 Severe bodily bruising
Internal organs bruised
Over-Exerted
Nauseous
-N/A-

Notes: This test was not completed, but the eventual outcome is fairly obvious. It was begun right after the previous one in order to compare how a stronger monster would fare against grand master shieldwarves.

Tester's conclusion: Like the dragon, the hydra has a very hard time with the dwarves. The fight is long and even though it can kill them all eventually, the damage it takes in the meantime is definitive. A slightly higher number of dwarves might have killed it and even if a whole squad dies, the threat the hydra poses is practically elimintated as it will probably eventually die on its own anyway.


Bronze vs. Iron

To simulate Fortress mode, 8 battles of 8 vs. 8. Since goblins only use iron, both teams wore iron armour, only difference between the teams being iron vs. bronze short sword.

Times run: 8

Initial setup:

Side & Creature Number Skills Items
#1: Dwarf 8 Proficient Swordsdwarf Full iron set minus breastplate and shield, iron short sword
#2: Dwarf 8 Proficient Swordsdwarf Full iron set minus breastplate and shield, bronze short sword

Results:

Side & Creature Survived Injury level Health tags Most common cause of death
#1: Iron team 4 lost rounds, 20 of 14 wounded Severed limbs
cuts
Tired
Pale
Faint
Bleeding
#2: Bronze team 4 lost rounds, 24 of 21 wounded Severed limbs
cuts
Tired
Pale
Faint
Bleeding

Tester's conclusion: Casualty/wounded(bruises and missing tooth/broken noses etc not counting)/intact rates of 67/30/3% for bronze and vs. 72/19/8% for iron would suggest that while bronze might be better in bigger and longer fights, as in all but 1 of the battles the first casualty was for the bronze team. This is probably because all attacks, both edged attacks and both blunt attacks the short sword has were seen to be used and because good part of the attacks that hit armour were deflected(and effectively became blunt attacks), and because bronze as a heavier material works slightly better in blunting, while the iron seems to have a slight edge in edged attacks. This is also supported by the comparably much higher amount of wounded dwarves(presumably having been hit early in the battle, lots of missing feet, at times lower legs, hands, lower arms, ears and noses) in the bronze team, despite them losing less as KIA.

A 52 vs 52 fight was also tested to see how much difference there would be when majority of the kills would be made when dwarves would be tired and suffering from broken bones(presumably the iron team more than bronze), and bronze team slightly more from cuts and missing body parts. The bronze team annihilated the iron team, having only 50% losses. Of its 26 survivors, however, 25(!) were wounded. Only one dwarf remained intact without cuts or body parts missing.

Adamantine Axes vs. Silver Hammers (no armor)

Times run: 10

Initial setup:

Side & Creature Number Skills Items
#1: Dwarf 10 Grandmaster All Skills Only silver war hammer
#2: Dwarf 10 Grandmaster All Skills Only adamantine battleaxe

Results:

Side & Creature Wins
#1: Hammer team Won 5 of 10 rounds
#2: Axe team Won 5 of 10 rounds

This study seems to show that (for legendary dwarfs), silver war hammers are about equal with adamantine battleaxes, even with both sides being unarmored. The previous time I ran this test, hammers actually won 6 of the 10 rounds, but this time it was evenly split.

(Is that because a grandmaster dwarf can disable or kill an unarmored dwarf with just one hit with either weapon? Might be worth examining the combat logs.) Bognor 09:08, 3 June 2011 (UTC)


Dwarves against Skeletal Horses (3) (tested by: Stormtemplar)

Times run: 1

Initial setup:

Side & Creature Number Skills Items
#1: Dwarfs 6 Proficient Fighter and swordsdwarf, skilled Dodger, Armor and Shield user
Full iron armor&Shortsword
#2: Skeletal horse 6 None none

Results:

Side & Creature Survived Injury level Health tags Most common cause of death
#1: Dwarfs 6 1 with minor wounds, one with head bruising and some broken parts 1 unconscious (Dwarf with head bruising)
#2: Skeletal horse 0

Notes: Dwarfs began in a line, horses began slightly scattered

Tester's conclusion: The test was a test of how a middling military would fare against an equal force of skeletal horses. The dwarfs did excellently with only one badly wounded and one other with a minor would.

DF2012 (0.34.02) tests

Maces VS war hammers (tested by: hostergaard)

Times run: 1

Initial setup:

Side & Creature Number Skills Items
#1: Human male 12 -no skills- Silver mace
#2: Human male 12 -no skills- Silver warhammer

Results:

Side & Creature Survived Injury level Health tags Most common cause of death
#1: Macemen 0 -N/A- -N/A- Getting their skull jammed trough their heads
#2: Warhammermen 12 Some broken hands and fingers. Some smashed open. A few bruises. Some cuts. 1 Unconscious -N/A-


Notes: I want to figure out how good the different blunt weapons are in relation to each other. For now I will test with silver only. I placed them in two groups on different z-levels with 6 from each side in each group. Each side was ordered in lines (parallel to the y axis) with no space between the individuals. The lines from each side was place right next to each other in each group. Group one had the 6 macemen on left (on the x axis) and the 6 hammermen on the right. Group two had mace on the right and hammer on left.

Tester's conclusion:

Leaves little doubt that in case of naked men fighting each other with warhammers and maces the hammers win. The hammerman who lost consciousness fought several macemen before fainting.