Dwarf Fortress Wiki - User contributions [en]

40d:Fire-safe

2008-09-24T09:36:36Z

Catpaw: This is wrong also, you can build the magna forge itself from any material as it is above the magma, only the anvil needs to safe, which it is alway eithway.

[[Fire-safe materials]] are building materials that cannot catch on [[Fire|fire]]. These include [[Stone|stone]], [[Glass|glass]], and [[Metal|metal]]. [[Wood]] is not a fire-safe material. Fire-safe materials are only required when the object is going to come into contact with extreme heat, such as near magma.

Flux materials, such as limestone blocks, which are burnt up in the purification of pig iron to produce steel, are considered fire-safe. It is perfectly fine to burn calcite as a flux making steel in a limestone furnace. [[Ice]] is also fire-safe material, but constructions made of ice may melt if exposed to sufficient heat.{{verify}}

40d Talk:Melt item

2008-09-24T09:32:44Z

Catpaw:

How material efficient is melting things down? [[User:Risim|Risim]] 23:54, 25 January 2008 (EST)
:It's not lossless, that's for sure. I could be quite wrong, but something makes me want to say it's around 3:1, based on bars required to create the items. I think overages are lost, but that's just a casual observation. It's really the only way to get certain metals in larger quantities though, assuming importing the bars or ore alone aren't good enough for your means. (Most commonly run into when trying to get certain metals from the mountainhomes before you're ready to bring in humans) --[[User:N9103|Edward]] 06:32, 26 January 2008 (EST)
:: Does smelting need coal?--[[User:Koltom|Koltom]] 23:53, 29 February 2008 (EST)
:::It needs fuel. So coal or magma. --[[User:Ikkonoishi|Ikkonoishi]] 00:25, 1 March 2008 (EST)

:Well, i got a bar of steel from melting a steel piccolo and a steel toy axe(2 items), however the piccolo was of "*" quality, not sure if the quality affects melting or not, so mentioning it just to be on the safe side.

Does designating an item to melt make it forbidden? (for equipping) {{unsigned|Sphexx}}
:Please sign your edits with <nowiki>~~~~</nowiki>. Also, no, it doesn't. --[[User:GreyMario|GreyMario]] 22:43, 11 April 2008 (EDT)

==Melting items and mandates==

I had a noble who had a mandate for two bronze goods. I melted down some bronze things and made a bronze bar from it. But that didn't seem to satisfy the mandate; he still wanted 2 bronze goods. Making bronze bars normally satisfies the mandates though. Can anyone else verify that making bars by melting things wont satisfy a mandate? --[[User:Bouchart|Bouchart]] 23:27, 23 April 2008 (EDT)
:You'll get no verify from me as I've never melted anything down. However, I will suggest making goblets when you have a metal mandate. --[[User:GreyMario|GreyMario]] 00:00, 24 April 2008 (EDT)

==Merge with [[smelting]]?===

would be senseful, or? --[[User:Catpaw|Catpaw]] 05:32, 24 September 2008 (EDT)

40d:Stupid dwarf trick

2008-09-22T14:36:31Z

Catpaw: /* Magma Pumping */

{{D for Dwarf}}

A '''stupid dwarf trick''' is any project that that requires a large amount time and effort, for little or no practical benefit. They exist only as a challenge for experienced players.

==Monumental Statue==

'''Difficulty:''' Depends on how big you want the statue to be.

'''Usefulness:''' None.

==Artificial Waterfall==
To keep the waterfall going, you need a [[pump]] stack, preferably powered by a [[windmill]] or [[water wheel]].

'''Difficulty:''' Moderate.

'''Usefulness:''' Dwarves love [[waterfall]]s. Putting a waterfall in your [[meeting hall]] will give your dwarves good [[thought]]s, although it can significantly lower framerate.

==Execution Tower==
Just a tall tower to chuck your captives to their deaths.

'''Difficulty:''' Easy.

'''Usefulness:''' Lets you dispose of prisoners, and claim expensive silk, meltable iron, and (eventually) useful bones.

==Bridge-a-pult==
A bridge that opens outwards, to fling enemies away. Ideally, they land in a very nasty place.

'''Difficulty:''' The hard part is the nasty place they get flung to.

'''Usefulness:''' There are a lot more effective ways to defend a fortress, but not as entertaining.

==Dam==
Build a wall across a riverbed to stop the flow of water. Floodgates optional.

'''Difficulty:''' On a map that freezes in the winter, this is easy. Otherwise, very difficult.

'''Usefulness:''' Dubious.

==[[Tower-cap]] Farm==
You absolutely need to break into an underground river or lake. Make some muddy floors over a big area and wait.

'''Difficulty:''' Moderate.

'''Usefulness:''' Yes, if it's big enough.

==Magma Pumping==
It's a lot like pumping water, only more dangerous, and requires the [[screw pump|pumps]] to use [[magma-proof]] pipes and screws in their construction.

'''Difficulty:''' The difficult part is making all those [[iron]] or [[steel]] pumps and [[bauxite]] [[floodgate]]s. Very high risk.

'''Usefulness:''' Magma is fun, but impractical.

==Booze Bomb==
If you set barrels of booze on fire they explode. Can possibly be used as a complex trap. About the only way to start a fire on demand is magma. Possibly caged fire imps or magma men.

'''Difficulty:''' High.

'''Usefulness:''' There many easier ways to kill goblins, but few that set them on fire.

==Greenhouse==
A [[greenhouse]] is just a farm with the the ceiling channeled out from above. This lets you grow outdoor plants without venturing above ground. For the maximum style, build a glass roof to keep your farmers safe.

'''Difficulty:''' Low.

'''Usefulness:''' Surface plants are not so much more useful than underground crops. [[Rope reed]] can be grown year round.

==Gladiator Arena==
'''Difficulty:''' Moderate, but time consuming.

'''Usefulness:''' The most difficult way to dispose of prisoners. It does give your soldiers a little bit of experience.

==Self Destruct Lever==
'''Difficulty:''' Very high. Extremely dangerous.

'''Usefulness:''' None. By definition.

==Flood the World==
'''Difficulty:''' High danger. Will kill your frame rate.

'''Usefulness:''' Will prevent any sieges, at least. Or anything else.

==[[Ballista]] Battery==
Overlap a few ballistas to completely cover a narrow corridor. There is an unavoidable risk of your operators wandering into the line of fire.

'''Difficulty:''' Low. If you insist on highly-trained operators with high-quality ballistas, it gets harder.

'''Usefulness:''' A complicated and dangerous way to defend a single corridor.

==[[Swimming]] pool==
It's a reservoir that fills to 4/7 exactly. Station soldiers inside, lock them in, and fill. This way they gain [[swimming]] skill.

'''Difficulty:''' Low. It's just a pair of reservoirs.

'''Usefulness:''' The swimming skill is only slightly useful. This is most useful if the entrance to your fort has narrow walkways/moats surrounded by water, and you station your soldiers there.

==[[Ice]] tower==
'''Difficulty:''' Low. You need to be on a freezing map to pull it off.

'''Usefulness:''' None.

==[[Obsidian]] factory==
You need one reservoir of water, and one of magma. Mix, cool and mine.

'''Difficulty:''' Medium.

'''Usefulness:''' High.

==Drowning Chamber==
'''Difficulty:''' Moderate.

'''Usefulness:''' You can kill prisoners, useless peasants, irate nobles, hammerers, untrainable animals, or anything else.

==Magma Chamber==
'''Difficulty:''' Dangerous as any magma project.

'''Usefulness:''' It's like a drowning chamber, but you can't recover most of the victim's stuff.

==Labyrinth==
'''Difficulty:''' It's a lot of mining. Having a bridge drop invaders inside is more difficult, but more useful.

'''Usefulness:''' It makes a nice element of fortress defense, and you can dump your prisoners inside it.

==[[Adventure Mode]] Fortress==
'''Difficulty:''' The sky's the limit.

'''Usefulness:''' Not applicable.

==Vomitorium==
It's like the greenhouse, only instead of a farm, it's meeting hall. Prevents [[cave adaption]].

'''Difficulty:''' Low.

'''Usefulness:''' Low.

==Pit o' Doom==
Combine with an Execution Tower for maximum z-level executions! Spike traps are a must.

'''Difficulty:''' Low. You want it nice and deep though.

'''Usefulness:''' Dispose of prisoners, execute nobles, gruesome fatal injuries, laugh maniacally.

40d Talk:Stupid dwarf trick

2008-09-22T14:06:14Z

Catpaw:

== Magma pumping ==
Thanks for the update [[user:Cizra|Cizra]], I've modified it to be more encyclopedic. :) I think more research/verification of which parts of [[screw pump|pumps]] need to be magma-proof is warranted. --[[User:Raumkraut|Raumkraut]] 17:23, 2 August 2008 (EDT)

== Obsidian Factory ==
Any ideas on how I would get started with this? I actually have a magma pipe near some natural lakes. Do I have the makings of an Obsidian Factory? -- [[User:Ehertlein|Ehertlein]] 10:59, 20 August 2008 (EDT)
:So you have an unlimited supply of magma. Is your water supply also unlimited? If not, you may want to save some for other things. But yes, that's really all you need, water and magma. It also helps to have bauxite and steel. You have two options: bring the magma to the water (via floodgates or pumps) or to bring the water to the magma (by pumps or floodgates or even buckets -which may be recommended it you have a less plentiful supply of water, as even one bucket of water will turn a square of magma into obsidian). Just be careful not to flood your fortress with anything or leave magma lying around where dwarves will foolishly walk on it and catch on fire before fleeing to their bed in the barracks to "recover". Other safety tips from my experiments with obsidian farming: Magma flows up in magma pipes up to the top of the pipe, so watch out if you're filling in, then mining out the pipe. If you are trying to drop water from a bucket onto magma, it needs to be at least two z-levels above, not just one; this is just the way it works. Good luck. Soon your giant tower made of obsidian blocks will rise majestically into the sky, I'm sure. --[[User:Zombiejustice|Zombiejustice]] 11:48, 20 August 2008 (EDT)
::You don't actually need any bauxite or adamantine to start an obsidian factory. What I did was: build a pump on top of the magmapimp to take magme out of the pipe and pump it into the wall. In this wall create a tunnel to an underground area that is at least 2z levels high. (Use channel to channel through one floor. Ideally the bottom of this area should be one z-level above your sourced water (a brook in my case). The pump only needs the screw and the pipes of iron or steel, everything else can be stone. Don't make the magma tunnel too long since magma will be very slow. Create one or more windmills (depending on wind strength) above and connect one axle to a switch far a way (preferable in your fort), turn the axle of and connect the windmill(s) with the pump. Shield the pump with walls, so the magma will only run into the tunnel and nothing else aruond. Build a pump on the water source, create a channel for the water into the underground area, connect the pump with a waterwheel (but also turned of yet by a lever). Make a water exit with a floodgate, so the water can run back into the river if you open that, connect the floodgate also to a lever in your for (you should have 3 levels in your fort). Shield the whole area from dwarven acess by walls/moats/doors so once you got it ready and every dwarf is outside you can lock it. So no dwarf runs there to drink (like mine did) and catch fire. Pull the water pump level, fill the area with water. Turn the pump of. Pull the magma pump level, let some magma drop down into that area, as the first tiles will transform to obsidian, having a 2 level space will allow the magma to travel over it to more water further away. Never have too much magma, or you could end up with a permanent magma pool on top of the obsidian, you don't want that. So turn the magma pump soon enough off (get some experience, how much magma you can take in one shot)... wait until there are only 1/7 magma tiles left, wait further until everything is cooled down. Push the 3rd level attached to the floodgate to remove access water (there is likely some resevoir on the far end from the pipe left), wait for the water to be gone. Now you can open acess to dwarves, you might wand to channel some obsidian blocks to free some locked water. Or you just can let some of it it be trapped to be reused for the next go. Mine all obsdian. Rinse and repeat. However I found once I started to mine around to create my obsidian factory, I found so much obsidian in that area, I question how useful the whole construction is after all. --[[User:Catpaw|Catpaw]] 10:06, 22 September 2008 (EDT)

40d:Stupid dwarf trick

2008-09-22T13:51:17Z

Catpaw: /* Magma Pumping */

{{D for Dwarf}}

A '''stupid dwarf trick''' is any project that that requires a large amount time and effort, for little or no practical benefit. They exist only as a challenge for experienced players.

==Monumental Statue==

'''Difficulty:''' Depends on how big you want the statue to be.

'''Usefulness:''' None.

==Artificial Waterfall==
To keep the waterfall going, you need a [[pump]] stack, preferably powered by a [[windmill]] or [[water wheel]].

'''Difficulty:''' Moderate.

'''Usefulness:''' Dwarves love [[waterfall]]s. Putting a waterfall in your [[meeting hall]] will give your dwarves good [[thought]]s, although it can significantly lower framerate.

==Execution Tower==
Just a tall tower to chuck your captives to their deaths.

'''Difficulty:''' Easy.

'''Usefulness:''' Lets you dispose of prisoners, and claim expensive silk, meltable iron, and (eventually) useful bones.

==Bridge-a-pult==
A bridge that opens outwards, to fling enemies away. Ideally, they land in a very nasty place.

'''Difficulty:''' The hard part is the nasty place they get flung to.

'''Usefulness:''' There are a lot more effective ways to defend a fortress, but not as entertaining.

==Dam==
Build a wall across a riverbed to stop the flow of water. Floodgates optional.

'''Difficulty:''' On a map that freezes in the winter, this is easy. Otherwise, very difficult.

'''Usefulness:''' Dubious.

==[[Tower-cap]] Farm==
You absolutely need to break into an underground river or lake. Make some muddy floors over a big area and wait.

'''Difficulty:''' Moderate.

'''Usefulness:''' Yes, if it's big enough.

==Magma Pumping==
It's a lot like pumping water, only more dangerous, and requires the [[screw pump|pumps]] to use [[magma-proof]] blocks in their construction. {{verify}}

'''Difficulty:''' The difficult part is making all those [[iron]] or [[steel]] pumps and [[bauxite]] [[floodgate]]s. Very high risk.

'''Usefulness:''' Magma is fun, but impractical.

==Booze Bomb==
If you set barrels of booze on fire they explode. Can possibly be used as a complex trap. About the only way to start a fire on demand is magma. Possibly caged fire imps or magma men.

'''Difficulty:''' High.

'''Usefulness:''' There many easier ways to kill goblins, but few that set them on fire.

==Greenhouse==
A [[greenhouse]] is just a farm with the the ceiling channeled out from above. This lets you grow outdoor plants without venturing above ground. For the maximum style, build a glass roof to keep your farmers safe.

'''Difficulty:''' Low.

'''Usefulness:''' Surface plants are not so much more useful than underground crops. [[Rope reed]] can be grown year round.

==Gladiator Arena==
'''Difficulty:''' Moderate, but time consuming.

'''Usefulness:''' The most difficult way to dispose of prisoners. It does give your soldiers a little bit of experience.

==Self Destruct Lever==
'''Difficulty:''' Very high. Extremely dangerous.

'''Usefulness:''' None. By definition.

==Flood the World==
'''Difficulty:''' High danger. Will kill your frame rate.

'''Usefulness:''' Will prevent any sieges, at least. Or anything else.

==[[Ballista]] Battery==
Overlap a few ballistas to completely cover a narrow corridor. There is an unavoidable risk of your operators wandering into the line of fire.

'''Difficulty:''' Low. If you insist on highly-trained operators with high-quality ballistas, it gets harder.

'''Usefulness:''' A complicated and dangerous way to defend a single corridor.

==[[Swimming]] pool==
It's a reservoir that fills to 4/7 exactly. Station soldiers inside, lock them in, and fill. This way they gain [[swimming]] skill.

'''Difficulty:''' Low. It's just a pair of reservoirs.

'''Usefulness:''' The swimming skill is only slightly useful. This is most useful if the entrance to your fort has narrow walkways/moats surrounded by water, and you station your soldiers there.

==[[Ice]] tower==
'''Difficulty:''' Low. You need to be on a freezing map to pull it off.

'''Usefulness:''' None.

==[[Obsidian]] factory==
You need one reservoir of water, and one of magma. Mix, cool and mine.

'''Difficulty:''' Medium.

'''Usefulness:''' High.

==Drowning Chamber==
'''Difficulty:''' Moderate.

'''Usefulness:''' You can kill prisoners, useless peasants, irate nobles, hammerers, untrainable animals, or anything else.

==Magma Chamber==
'''Difficulty:''' Dangerous as any magma project.

'''Usefulness:''' It's like a drowning chamber, but you can't recover most of the victim's stuff.

==Labyrinth==
'''Difficulty:''' It's a lot of mining. Having a bridge drop invaders inside is more difficult, but more useful.

'''Usefulness:''' It makes a nice element of fortress defense, and you can dump your prisoners inside it.

==[[Adventure Mode]] Fortress==
'''Difficulty:''' The sky's the limit.

'''Usefulness:''' Not applicable.

==Vomitorium==
It's like the greenhouse, only instead of a farm, it's meeting hall. Prevents [[cave adaption]].

'''Difficulty:''' Low.

'''Usefulness:''' Low.

==Pit o' Doom==
Combine with an Execution Tower for maximum z-level executions! Spike traps are a must.

'''Difficulty:''' Low. You want it nice and deep though.

'''Usefulness:''' Dispose of prisoners, execute nobles, gruesome fatal injuries, laugh maniacally.

40d:Stupid dwarf trick

2008-09-22T13:49:02Z

Catpaw: /* Magma Pumping */

{{D for Dwarf}}

A '''stupid dwarf trick''' is any project that that requires a large amount time and effort, for little or no practical benefit. They exist only as a challenge for experienced players.

==Monumental Statue==

'''Difficulty:''' Depends on how big you want the statue to be.

'''Usefulness:''' None.

==Artificial Waterfall==
To keep the waterfall going, you need a [[pump]] stack, preferably powered by a [[windmill]] or [[water wheel]].

'''Difficulty:''' Moderate.

'''Usefulness:''' Dwarves love [[waterfall]]s. Putting a waterfall in your [[meeting hall]] will give your dwarves good [[thought]]s, although it can significantly lower framerate.

==Execution Tower==
Just a tall tower to chuck your captives to their deaths.

'''Difficulty:''' Easy.

'''Usefulness:''' Lets you dispose of prisoners, and claim expensive silk, meltable iron, and (eventually) useful bones.

==Bridge-a-pult==
A bridge that opens outwards, to fling enemies away. Ideally, they land in a very nasty place.

'''Difficulty:''' The hard part is the nasty place they get flung to.

'''Usefulness:''' There are a lot more effective ways to defend a fortress, but not as entertaining.

==Dam==
Build a wall across a riverbed to stop the flow of water. Floodgates optional.

'''Difficulty:''' On a map that freezes in the winter, this is easy. Otherwise, very difficult.

'''Usefulness:''' Dubious.

==[[Tower-cap]] Farm==
You absolutely need to break into an underground river or lake. Make some muddy floors over a big area and wait.

'''Difficulty:''' Moderate.

'''Usefulness:''' Yes, if it's big enough.

==Magma Pumping==
It's a lot like pumping water, only more dangerous, and requires the [[screw pump|pumps]] to use magma-proof blocks in their construction. {{verify}}

'''Difficulty:''' The difficult part is making all those [[iron]] or [[steel]] pumps and bauxite floodgates. Very high risk.

'''Usefulness:''' Magma is fun, but impractical.

==Booze Bomb==
If you set barrels of booze on fire they explode. Can possibly be used as a complex trap. About the only way to start a fire on demand is magma. Possibly caged fire imps or magma men.

'''Difficulty:''' High.

'''Usefulness:''' There many easier ways to kill goblins, but few that set them on fire.

==Greenhouse==
A [[greenhouse]] is just a farm with the the ceiling channeled out from above. This lets you grow outdoor plants without venturing above ground. For the maximum style, build a glass roof to keep your farmers safe.

'''Difficulty:''' Low.

'''Usefulness:''' Surface plants are not so much more useful than underground crops. [[Rope reed]] can be grown year round.

==Gladiator Arena==
'''Difficulty:''' Moderate, but time consuming.

'''Usefulness:''' The most difficult way to dispose of prisoners. It does give your soldiers a little bit of experience.

==Self Destruct Lever==
'''Difficulty:''' Very high. Extremely dangerous.

'''Usefulness:''' None. By definition.

==Flood the World==
'''Difficulty:''' High danger. Will kill your frame rate.

'''Usefulness:''' Will prevent any sieges, at least. Or anything else.

==[[Ballista]] Battery==
Overlap a few ballistas to completely cover a narrow corridor. There is an unavoidable risk of your operators wandering into the line of fire.

'''Difficulty:''' Low. If you insist on highly-trained operators with high-quality ballistas, it gets harder.

'''Usefulness:''' A complicated and dangerous way to defend a single corridor.

==[[Swimming]] pool==
It's a reservoir that fills to 4/7 exactly. Station soldiers inside, lock them in, and fill. This way they gain [[swimming]] skill.

'''Difficulty:''' Low. It's just a pair of reservoirs.

'''Usefulness:''' The swimming skill is only slightly useful. This is most useful if the entrance to your fort has narrow walkways/moats surrounded by water, and you station your soldiers there.

==[[Ice]] tower==
'''Difficulty:''' Low. You need to be on a freezing map to pull it off.

'''Usefulness:''' None.

==[[Obsidian]] factory==
You need one reservoir of water, and one of magma. Mix, cool and mine.

'''Difficulty:''' Medium.

'''Usefulness:''' High.

==Drowning Chamber==
'''Difficulty:''' Moderate.

'''Usefulness:''' You can kill prisoners, useless peasants, irate nobles, hammerers, untrainable animals, or anything else.

==Magma Chamber==
'''Difficulty:''' Dangerous as any magma project.

'''Usefulness:''' It's like a drowning chamber, but you can't recover most of the victim's stuff.

==Labyrinth==
'''Difficulty:''' It's a lot of mining. Having a bridge drop invaders inside is more difficult, but more useful.

'''Usefulness:''' It makes a nice element of fortress defense, and you can dump your prisoners inside it.

==[[Adventure Mode]] Fortress==
'''Difficulty:''' The sky's the limit.

'''Usefulness:''' Not applicable.

==Vomitorium==
It's like the greenhouse, only instead of a farm, it's meeting hall. Prevents [[cave adaption]].

'''Difficulty:''' Low.

'''Usefulness:''' Low.

==Pit o' Doom==
Combine with an Execution Tower for maximum z-level executions! Spike traps are a must.

'''Difficulty:''' Low. You want it nice and deep though.

'''Usefulness:''' Dispose of prisoners, execute nobles, gruesome fatal injuries, laugh maniacally.

40d Talk:Your first fortress

2008-09-22T12:56:54Z

Catpaw: /* Switching out Weaponsmith/Armorsmith */

=Other=
===== Content from [[Getting started]] =====
The goal of this page is to explain in detail, and for newbies, how to:
#Generate a world (possibly from a seed)(probably will link to article(s) on the topic)
#Pick a fortress location
#Name your fortress and starting group
#Buy skills and items, for the biome type picked in #2 (probably will give the newbie build from the [[starting builds]] page)
#Play the first month or two of the game, for the biome type picked in #2
I don't know how to write an article that does this, but I do know that this is what this article should be. 
--[[User:Savok|Savok]] 11:19, 2 November 2007 (EDT)

I'd like to avoid having an overabundance of tutorial articles again. It sounds to me like all of the above would fit into [[Your first fortress]] just as easily. --[[User:Peristarkawan|Peristarkawan]] 12:00, 2 November 2007 (EDT)

:Should we go ahead and just #redirect it?--[[User:Draco18s|Draco18s]] 12:07, 2 November 2007 (EDT)

::Done. --[[User:Peristarkawan|Peristarkawan]] 12:14, 2 November 2007 (EDT)

===== Recording a Movie =====
I was thinking that someone could record a movie following the steps given here, as a visual aid. As DF is very structure-based it would help to visualize how the fortress is supposed to look. [[User:Memo|Memo]] 15:13, 4 November 2007 (EST)

=Choosing a location=
==Your surrondings==

===== flux, iron, etc. =====

Is it really necessary to recommend a sedimentary layer? You don't really need to start with iron at all, you can just let the goblins import it for you and melt their armor for an essentially infinite supply. Unless this changes at the end of Army Arc I'm not sure starting iron is needed.

===== Have to be in contact with dwarves? =====

"You will want to be in contact with dwarves to get immigrants and a dwarven trading caravan."

Is it even possible to settle somewhere without dwarves? --[[User:Juckto|Juckto]] 18:18, 24 May 2008 (EDT)

:Nope. Even on a volcanic island on the opposite side of the map from any dwarven mountainhome, caravans visited. It's worth noting that the local map was all land, but still they took ships over to get to the island itself, I suppose.--[[User:Dadamh|Dadamh]] 14:49, 30 May 2008 (EDT)

::Ships don't exist. <tt>"Boats are the enemy of tiles. And tiles are the enemy of boats." --Toady One</tt>
::They don't need to, either - the caravans just bring along seven units of lava, one block of green glass, and a legendary glassmaker. Once they get to the beach, they turn a tiny patch of sand into an ocean-spanning bridge.
::That, or they tunnel under the ocean with an unskilled miner - he'll become legendary soon enough. --[[User:Savok|Savok]] 23:01, 30 May 2008 (EDT)

:::Well, I sort of meant it as a joke. Off-screen boats. My entire tile was flat land, but they still got there somehow, so I was supposing boats over the water.--[[User:Dadamh|Dadamh]] 07:32, 31 May 2008 (EDT)

=Buying Skills and Items=
==Skills==
===== Skill choices =====
I know skill choices are largely a matter of preference, but the inclusion of a Bookkeeper, Manager, Expedition Leader, and Broker in the landing party definitely merit a mention, as well as whether or not a beginning player should throw a few skill points at improving his Broker's and Leader's key skills. Being able to talk that first dwarven caravan into throwing some extra sides of meat in could mean the difference in survival for a newer player.--[[User:Xazak|Xazak]] 19:29, 3 November 2007 (EDT)
:I agree with this. When I make a new Caravan, I often make a Leader-type with ONLY leader/trade related skills. Even just having the ability to SEE the values of the items (even if you have them memorized) helps aid in making a good first-year trade session. And the first-year Dwarven caravan doesn't expect a large profit. I've done large deals with them that only netted them a 10-coin profit. --[[User:Nekojin|Nekojin]] 12:45, 14 November 2007 (EST)

I think good bridging points are the seasons and end of the years; To aid readability and to separate into chunks, I think a listing of 'things to accomplish by winter', 'things to accomplish by spring (your first immingants!)', that sort of thing -- To avoid having a gigantic page, it might be better to split them off into "your first year", "your second year", especially because the gameplay changes signifiantly when you start getting nobles and your construction focus starts to shift from mere survival into making your dwarves happy, trading, and onward to economy and such. If people are interested in taking this approach, I'd certainly help with the writing. [[User:Bhodi|Bhodi]] 13:10, 4 November 2007 (EST)

Current skill list could be improved. Gem setter? Just wait for immigrant... Starting points can be spent in better ways. Mechanic/architect won't have time for architecture if he has well-planned day. Woodcutting goes up really quick. 4 points in axedwarf will give you enough active defense for everything that isn't strong enough to force you to lock all dwarves underground. Weaponsmith isn't really needed at start. Your unskilled dwarves aren't good fighters, and this 20-40% damage won't change much. Proficient in herbalism is too much. It's either only to bootstrap aboveground farming or to replace it entirely (for starting fortresses) in which case you don't need grower skill. --[[User:Someone-else|Someone-else]] 16:35, 24 April 2008 (EDT)
:Speaking of gem setters, they're completely worthless because it takes more time to stud 300 exceptional mugs with gems than it takes to make 300 masterwork mugs. --[[User:GreyMario|GreyMario]] 16:50, 24 April 2008 (EDT)
::Hey now, the point of gem setting (after you've gotten a legendary one of course) isn't to stud your mugs, its to decorate those statues/thrones/tables/doors for the king or just general enjoyment of the fortress. Its not like you need gems or gem-studded objects for trade, buying out caravans is so trivially easy without that. And if you're going to stud a tradegood with gems, stud something with more intrinsic value than a mug - even a masterwork one isn't worth all that much.
::More generally on skills, i've been finding that once you get comfortable with the game you want to load up on skills that are harder to level up. I haven't even been starting with miners my last couple games, leveling miners is pretty easy. I often grab dwarves who can do one to two of the following: Carpentry, Building Design, Masonry, Mechanics, Weaponsmith, Armorsmith, Metalsmith. After that, choose one of Clothier or Glassworker (and possibly grab some related profession skills). Make sure one dwarf has leader skills (I prefer 1 in each of Negotiator/Appraiser/Judge Intent/Persuader/Consoler). Combine these as you see fit (though I generally combo Architect/Mason and make my Mechanic my broker/trader/bookkeeper/hopefully leader). And make sure to get a Brewer/Grower to handle your food needs (starting with a trained cook I find to be less important than a trained brewer). Anything left I put into other possibly useful and hard to train skills - gem cutter or setter being most typical. The real trick is suitably micromanaging the 'easy-train' necessary jobs to avoid polluting your desired mood skill before the first wave of immigrants arrive. I've also been starting with an anvil most of the time too, and crafting my axe (and sometimes my picks, although you don't save much doing that).
::Which isn't to say beginners shouldn't start with some experienced miners and so forth. But the herbalist is wholely unnecessary (I've only above ground farmed once, and that was for dye plants and 4 years in). It would be more worthwhile to recommend they start in an area with a soil layer to make underground farming easier (and soil layers seem to be pretty common). But the starting advice recommends so much food that the only difficulty is figuring out how to irrigate, not having the time to do so before they run out of food. Finally, defensive skills are overrated. You want defense? That's what the mechanic is for. Stonefall traps are far more reliable than a military dwarf, and won't take ages getting into position, be sleeping/eating/drinking when you need them, or take an unlucky hit and die instead of finishing the critter. Far too much of a gamble, especially for a new player. (Kobold thieves are easily dealt with by drafting everyone within a small radius, or just letting it run away if only one dwarf is nearby - they won't try to engage your dwarves once spotted - or by dogs for that matter).
::--[[User:Squirrelloid|Squirrelloid]] 01:31, 30 April 2008 (EDT)

I have a concern that fisherdwarf is a suggested skill. If you are along a river or ocean, chances are any fisherdwarves will be horribly mauled by deadly carp and longnose gar. Fish are deadly enough to any dwarves getting a drink from a river without tempting fate by actually fishing. One dwarf dying along a river creates a deadly cycle of dwarves attempting to loot the body and then being killed by fish.--[[User:Quartic|quartic]] 14:19, 30 May 2008 (EDT)

===== Dwarf with appropriate skills not necessarily the leader =====
I used a skill assignment similar to those recommended here and my presumptive leader with mining/judge of intent/consoler/appraiser/record-keeper/organizer was passed over for the weaponsmith/armorsmith. He was assigned outpost leader, manager, trader, and bookkeeper despite not having a single appropriate skill. And to really rub it it in, one of his traits is "never speaks out or attempts to direct activities." At least I was able to switch the jobs other than leader back to the right dwarf for the job (and I'm forcing the smith to smooth stone all day for his presumption.) One other factor that may have been involved is that the smith is friends with 5 others and the intended boss-dwarf has but one friend and one grudge. --[[User:Danny Rathjens|Danny Rathjens]] 02:12, 7 April 2008 (EDT)

===== Switching out Weaponsmith/Armorsmith =====
I was thinking, instead of switching out the weapon/armor smith for a fisher, you could switch them out for a craftsdwarf and remove 1 point from building design for fisherdwarf. --[[User:0todd0|0todd0]] 19:57, 1 September 2008 (EDT)

:The weapon/armor smith is certainly the weakest in this setup, I don't take him with me also. It mostly takes quite a while until you are ready to smelter stuff, usually having quite some migrants already at the time. And even if you have an untrained dwarf. Working with metal is seldom something you need to go really fast. So I for one always take 1 military trained dwarf (marksdwarf) with me instead of the smith, to take care of the early monsters, which can otherwise be quite a pain. --[[User:Catpaw|Catpaw]] 08:56, 22 September 2008 (EDT)

==Items==
=====Huh?=====
Is this still up to date? In the newest version of DF, you don't seem to spend money on skills, but rather use points from a collective pool. There doesn't seem to be enough points to even come close to creating the suggested group. I've never actually played a game (hence my consultation of the "first fortress" page), so I'm not sure if I'm just missing something, though. Any advice? --[[User:DuckAndCower|DuckAndCower]] 23:47, 29 April 2008 (EDT)

Nevermind... I just realized I needed to remove items from the pool first. Maybe a note that you have to hit Tab to get to the items page would help? --[[User:DuckAndCower|DuckAndCower]] 23:52, 29 April 2008 (EDT)

=Beginning the Fortress=
==Intro==
===== Wall of text =====
I think the "Beginning the Fortress" section isn't very pleasant to read. The bullet points help a bit, but I think numbered ones (matching the "TOC" above it) would be a bit more helpful. I'd however prefer to split the steps using numbered headlines, then it'd clearly define each step and automatically be indexed at the top. Thoughts? --[[User:TwoD|TwoD]] 13:03, 2 November 2007 (EDT)
:That's beyond me, but anyone who can should feel free to clean it up and make it as readable as possible. --[[User:BahamutZERO|BahamutZERO]] 01:37, 3 November 2007 (EDT)

I believe the following sentence to be much to hard to understand for its continued existence:
"Stairs can go as deep as you want in a stack if you keep making up/down stairways on top of each other. You can continue stairs from both the top and the bottom of up/down stairways, but only from the bottom of downward stairways, and only from the top of upward stairways so only use the upward stairway or downward stairway when you're not planning to ever go further that direction."
[[User:Iluziat|Iluziat]] 02:23, 15 September 2008 (EDT)

== Trading ==
=====Anvil=====
The caravan is by no means guaranteed to bring an anvil the first year. (Out of ten games started and played through first year, I think I've gotten an anvil twice.) You can request one from the liason, though. I'd edit the entry myself, but I'm not certain how to word it without totally changing that whole paragraph.--[[User:Xazak|Xazak]] 15:41, 11 November 2007 (EST)

:I think that Humans always bring an anvil or two, but I may be wrong. [[User:Memo|Memo]] 17:02, 11 November 2007 (EST)
:: You are not correct, Memo. I've had fortresses that have gone anvil-less for 2 years before a Dwarven Caravan finally brought one (brought three, actually). Edit: The first year's caravans (Fall Dwarven, Spring Elven, and Summer Human) are largely randomized. I've seen vastly different products being brought in on all three of those, with roughly similar settlements and trade requests. --[[User:Nekojin|Nekojin]] 12:18, 14 November 2007 (EST)

===== Trading vs Growing=====
Is it just me, or is it much easier to teach people how to trade for food than it is to farm/grow/brew? I find one dedicated stonecrafter is more than enough to purchase all the food that can be possibly thrown at you, and will likely even be legendary by the time the second trade caravan comes along. For a "newb strategy" this might be the way to go instead of trying to explain floodgates and channels right off the bat. [[User:Weasello|Weasello]] 10:50, 21 March 2008 (EDT)

:Yeah, but you're forgetting something. If a trade caravan gets ambushed or if they don't sell anything to you, then you're in trouble. And of course, trading with an Elf is like trying to get blood out of a stone.
My recommendation is to get food three ways;
1) Grow Plump Helmet
2) Fish
3) Kill animals for meat.[[User:AlexFili|AlexFili]] 07:43, 30 April 2008 (EDT)

::Eeeeeexcept you don't know how to properly trade with the elves. As a general rule of thumb, if it once lived, don't sell it to them. Silk is fine, buy shit from the elves using the *cave spider silk sock*s you made from the dwarves' cave spider silk cloth that you bought with your *cat meat roast [40]*. --[[User:GreyMario|GreyMario]] 15:16, 30 April 2008 (EDT)

:::Alternately, trade them craploads of stonecrafts. I mean, there are two ways to clear a fortress of excess stone (stone blocks and stonecrafts), and one of them provides tradegoods, so stonecraft like mad. You'll get nice clean hallways too. Mechanisms would almost work, except they can't be binned. They're also a great early trade good, but elves will complain about the weight - you can unload a couple on the elves generally though if you clear them out (supplemented by lighter things, like... stonecrafts). Mechanisms are far better for doing things like buying metal bars and an anvil off the dwarf caravan, because they're more value/mass than those are.
:::You can also unload all those Narrow Giant Spider Silk loincloths you'll start collecting on elves, just make sure to check for blood spatters - elves don't like those too much.
:::--[[User:Squirrelloid|Squirrelloid]] 17:20, 30 April 2008 (EDT)

===== Office not required to meet with liaison =====
I met him in my barracks with no office built. :) --[[User:Danny Rathjens|Danny Rathjens]] 02:00, 7 April 2008 (EDT)
:I confirm. When I forgot to assign office to my Exp leader, he conducted meeting with liaison at meeting hall (designated from well)--[[User:Dorten|Dorten]] 03:46, 7 April 2008 (EDT)

::I also confirm, my leader's thoughts included 'was embarassed to hold a meeting in a dining room'.--[[User:Dwarven Gemologist|Gemmy]] 13:35, 23 April 2008 (EDT)

:::Despite having built an office for him, he refused to use it while he was still an expedition leader - and received no bad thought because of it. From a different game, after becoming mayor he does receive an embarassed thought if no office is assigned. --[[User:Squirrelloid|Squirrelloid]] 13:48, 23 April 2008 (EDT)

:I fixed this in the article a week ago. [[User:Anydwarf|Anydwarf]] 15:24, 23 April 2008 (EDT)

==Stockpiles==
===== Moving refuse stockpile inside =====
Section about stockpiles recommends moving all stockpiles inside as soon as possible. It's wrong thing as it creates miasma if not handled properly. Best thing that can be done is either making custom stockpiles - one for bones/shells/skulls (inside, near craftdwarf shop) and one for rest (outside, near tanner), designing special anti-miasma room for refuse or order dwarves to dump rotting things into water/magma/chasm etc.

You dont understand the point - if your miasma creating stuff is usually put outside, the shit hits the fan one or another way when u have the first siege or even only ambush. Made this clearer in the article.--[[User:Koltom|Koltom]] 21:36, 23 April 2008 (EDT)

Just for an example, I store my refuge and graveyard in a nearby cave/mountain/basement. I usually make the corridors a bit more winding then usual, and I put a few doors in for an air-lock effect. a 5x5 refuge pit should be enough for the first year, and 1-3 coffins in the graveyard just in case. [[User:AlexFili|AlexFili]] 07:41, 30 April 2008 (EDT)

40d:Insanity

2008-09-16T17:29:44Z

Catpaw:

Certain events/conditions can drive a dwarf insane.
* Entering a [[strange mood]] but failing to complete a [[legendary artifact]].
* A diplomat who is trapped inside the fortress for a long time. A caged diplomat will go insane immediatly (e.g. if he is unconcious while stangind on [[cage trap]])
* Being very [[thought|unhappy]] for a long time.

There are three types of insanity:

; Stark, raving mad (crawling around babbling!)
:The afflicted dwarf will drop all their items and stand around babbling until they die of hunger or thirst.
; Melancholy
:The afflicted dwarf refuses to eat or drink, and will eventually starve to death.
:If possible, the dwarf will commit suicide by jumping off a cliff or into water/magma.
; Berserk
:The afflicted dwarf attacks randomly, this can be dangerous if it happens to an experienced dwarf; [[war dog]]s will quickly pull down an unskilled dwarf though.

Insanity always ends in the death of the afflicted dwarf, which will upset their friends and family. This can lead to a vicious circle of depression and [[tantrum]]s. Make sure to build [[coffin]]s to avoid compounded unhappiness from their friends decaying on open air.

In Adventure Mode, it is possible to have your adventurer become stark raving mad, this can be caused by extreme drowsiness. When this happens, your adventurer will be able to fall off cliffs without using the ALT-key, and possibly won't be able to swim during this state. Other than that, nothing really else happens, and the effect goes away when you travel on the world map.

40d Talk:Maximizing framerate

2008-09-16T12:29:37Z

Catpaw:

== Effect on # of dwarves, framerate calculations ==

I'm not sure how important the number of dwarves is on the framerate. I was getting about 12 to 15 with 22 dwarves, and this has fallen to 9 with 97 dwarves. I think it is more bad pathing, like animals being caught behind doors that causes more problems than the number of units themselves. The addition of 80 goblins had an impact of 1 fps as well... although again, they probably weren't having any trouble path finding to no where. --Gotthard 13:53, 3 December 2007 (EST)

:I typically see a substantial drop in framerate when new immigrants come, and afterward the game's never as fast or responsive. However, I also demand a higher framerate (not less than 40, to avoid annoying interface lagging/jerkiness) than many people seem prepared to tolerate, so our findings aren't inconsistent. You just have more load already and so don't notice a given amount of additional usage as much. [[User:Fedor|Fedor]] 05:39, 7 December 2007 (EST)

::If this is the case, then I doubt there is a linear relationship associated with the FPS values. The G_FPS might also impact this. Typically, 10-12 more dwarves lowered my FPS by 1 at max, and I have 6 masons making blocks for my castle, and 18 dwarves running around permanently putting them up. I would guess that the FPS drops off fast to begin with, so it takes a lot to go down from 10-9 fps compared to 40-39 fps. --Gotthard 08:35, 7 December 2007 (EST)

:::Yes, this is expected. Framerate changes aren't linear and here's why: Let us imagine that a given computer can process 10,000 game things per second. A framerate of 100 means that the game requires only 100 calculations per update, and therefore can update 100 times/second. A framerate of 1 means the game has to perform 10,000 calculations per update. To drop from 40 to 39 FPS, the game must require ~6 more calculations per update. To drop from 10 to 9 FPS, the game must require ~111 more calculations per update. [[User:Fedor|Fedor]] 08:51, 13 December 2007 (EST)

::Wow, I can't stand things if FPS falls under ~80! Though, running a 2.1Ghz Dual Core and 512M 8600GeForce probably has some bearing on it. Personally, I run my G_FPS at only 10, and FPS_CAP at 200. I haven't gotten to economy sized populations yet with these settings (mostly on purpose cause I also keep my POP_CAP to only 10 until I've gotten the majority of the fortress dug out and a good stock of food and bedrooms, etc. The extra dwarves end up just getting in the way any other time I've tried my play-style. With this setup, I usually average around 150 FPS. Also, I've noticed a difference in FPS if I have the map section open, either single or double pane, moreso when there are a large number of creatures on the map. Simply closing (tabbing) the map got me an increase from ~125 to ~140. Should be worth 2-3 frames at the low FPS levels you guys are talking about. I'm also curious if the FPS counter itself has a significant effect on frames... --[[User:n9103|n9103]] 11:40, 17 Dec 2007 (PST)

== Weather and Trees ==

Is it just me, or with weather turned trees will not grow back. Most saplings have withered and died. The landscape is littered with them. I'm in a Mirthful area, so it's not alignment. I haven't been able to get any trees since I deforested the entire area, and yes, it has been over three years. I'm playing 33d. [[User:Klada|Klada]] 19:50, 5 December 2007 (EST)

:Well I've been playing map for 6 years now, and I've had weather on the entire time, tons of trees have grown back. I've not deforested the ENTIRE area, but from what I understand trees grow back at a proportional rate to the amount of area there was to grow, so it should be better. I think saplings randomly die, perhaps moreso with traffic on them but... I don't have an explanation. --Gotthard 19:23, 6 December 2007 (EST)

::"Is it just me, or with weather turned trees will not grow back." Turned on or turned off? Logically, if weather were turned off, trees shouldn't grow to maturity. --[[User:n9103|n9103]] 11:29, 17 Dec 2007 (PST)

:::Trees grow back just fine with weather turned off. I don't know why sometimes most or all the saplings die, but it's not turning weather off that causes it. --[[User:BurnedToast|BurnedToast]] 00:00, 4 January 2008 (EST)

::::N9103, logic has no place here. Begone! --[[User:Savok|Savok]] 15:12, 21 March 2008 (EDT)

:::::HA! Tell that to Flingify() ^.^ Most things in DF do get a logical implementation... notable exceptions exist of course, but generally speaking, things follow commonsense. ... So Nya! --[[User:N9103|Edward]] 05:55, 22 March 2008 (EDT)

:Is any part of the area you embarked at evil? If so, are they the areas that the trees could grow in? (i.e. a mirthful mountain next to haunted woods) If you're beyond doubt sure that that's not the case, then going on what else has been investigated, I see one of two things: Complete deforestation *stops* tree growth, including saplings; Or, you've got some kind of bug that hasn't been documented yet. --[[User:N9103|Edward]] 19:05, 2 April 2008 (EDT)

== Economy ==

Can we confirm/disprove the effect of the economy on framerate? --[[User:DDouble|DDouble]] 02:42, 13 December 2007 (EST)

:Not sure what you mean exactly. The economy makes several changes, any of which might potentially impact speed. Can you give more detail on what specifically might potentially be causing a slowdown (or speed boost)? Is there a discussion on the forum that you have in mind? [[User:Fedor|Fedor]] 08:51, 13 December 2007 (EST)

::I'm pretty sure he's talking about the init setting and turning it off. The 'potentially' part you mentioned is what he wanted clarification on. Does turning the setting off before the economy activates improve pre-economy performance? There might indeed be people out there that are willing to lose one of the cooler features for a much improved framerate. A good question is does turning that setting off prevent you from ever gaining an economy (when you decide to turn the option back on) should you pass the point where it should have activated? --[[User:n9103|n9103]] 11:27, 17 Dec 2007 (PST)

== One Way Stairs ==

"Use ...multiple one-way stairways to connect any two spots where lots of dwarves will want to be"

How do you make a one way stair? I tried searching here, and on the forum, but didn't find it. [[User:Calculus|Calculus]]

:I mean to use paired up and down staircases instead of up/down ones. This suggestion is now removed because I'm not sure it actually makes a difference (it's safer for your dwarves, but I don't see a difference in game speed) [[User:Fedor|Fedor]] 14:50, 2 January 2008 (EST)

::How is a single-floor staircase (down+up) any safer than using a multiple-floor staircase (down+down/up+up)?

::Or for that matter, how is it different than making all your staircases down/up (minus bottom level of course)? --[[User:N9103|Edward]] 22:40, 3 January 2008 (EST)

:::If a dwarf falls down a multi-level up/down staircase, he may die or be badly injured.[[User:Fedor|Fedor]] 22:52, 3 January 2008 (EST)

::::What would cause a dwarf to fall down stairs aside from combat?--[[User:Maximus|Maximus]] 01:59, 4 January 2008 (EST)

:::::Haven't a clue. I just know that several people have reported their dwarves getting killed or maimed that way.[[User:Fedor|Fedor]] 15:17, 5 January 2008 (EST)

::::I used to use the up/down staircases for a central mineshaft until I had multiple dwarves become maimed/die when fighting on the stairs. I now use a spiral staircase design instead. I don't think anything BUT combat makes them fall, but if they charge a goblin snatcher and miss, there's no promise they won't end up 15 levels down missing all their limbs. --Gotthard 11:08, 7 January 2008 (EST)

:::::How about using floor hatches every level? -- Digger

== Weather and windmills ==

To BurnedToast: You seem to be right that turning weather off doesn't stop windmills from working. I wasn't sure where I got that impression, but after looking it up, it was from several instances on IRC where people came in, said "The windmill isn't making power :(", were told to "turn weather on", went "Ah ha!", and never said that it didn't make them start working. (After I while I started suggesting it too since nobody had reported it not working, until recently.) So, hmm. I just switched a fort that had weather to not having it, and yeah, the windmills all still work. So I built a new one - also works. Then I generated a new world with weather off, started a new fort in it, built a windmill, and it produced 20 power. Oh well. --[[User:SL|SL]] 13:24, 9 January 2008 (EST)

== Multiple CPUs/Cores ==

As far as I have tested, DF uses 3 threads. It seems to put all its efforts in a single one, but even so, the other two still take cpu time, so having a dual-core machine still helps even if the threads are synchronized (and it isn't such a huge difference). I assume one of the threads link the display to the game core while the other runs the input buffer. I'd have to do more testing. [[User:Soulwynd|Soulwynd]] 23:37, 17 March 2008 (EDT)

== Bulging Histories ==

Any chance history plays a role in framerates? I have a fairly beefy machine and was regularly getting 100FPS in my first few forts, but after about 15 forts and 30 adventure modes (I'm quite suicidal), I can't get my FPS above 35 even on initial embark and a 3x3 fortress plot. [[User:Weasello|Weasello]] 12:43, 21 March 2008 (EDT)

:Well... from that data, that's likely. Personally, I play all my forts on separate worlds. --[[User:Savok|Savok]] 15:12, 21 March 2008 (EDT)

:I think I have to second the idea of (small histories == higher framerates) I've been playing a lot of small and smaller worlds, and even when I pick larger than normal sites, my frames seem to stay up better than on standard worlds. I'll test at some point just how well a Full Local map holds up in a Pocket world. --[[User:N9103|Edward]] 19:04, 2 April 2008 (EDT)

== Disconnection ==

I've found it '''VERY''' important, in terms of framerates, not to block all paths between your fortress and the outside world, either with raised bridges, or with forbidden doors. I'm not certain about walls, as I haven't desired "permanent" blocking, but temporary, to prevent thives and the like. Infact, pathfinding errors from those I desire to keep out are exactly what crashes the framerate. 
 
I'm talking about '''50% loss''', and that's just to start. If you continue to block the pathfinding, It's possible to have it completely crawl to a stop, as in 0-1 FPS! 
It's a shame that such a primitive defense results in such a catastrophic failure of the pathing system. :( 
 
As I didn't see it mentioned anywhere, I'm adding it here, and will eventually add it to the main article if no one else feels like pretty-ing it up for display. 
--[[User:N9103|Edward]] 17:42, 29 March 2008 (EDT)

:That's happening for you? I've been setting up an elaborate set of bridges and floodgates that serves as the only entrance to my fortress, and have closed my dwarves off inside on numerable occasions and it caused little more than make them cancel tasks that required them to leave the fortress.--[[User:Eurytus|Eurytus]] 15:57, 2 April 2008 (EST)

::Have you turned off invasions as well? I used to do that when I played with invasions off to develop my management abilities. I did it now in three different worlds (smaller) and have had it happen every time. The framerate loss began as soon as a goblin/kobold tried to do mischief and pull a lever, as determined in the error log. I would assume that thieves/snatchers would likely cause similar frame-crashes, but that much isn't verified on my part. --[[User:N9103|Edward]] 04:04, 4 April 2008 (EDT)

:::I have invasions on, although any attackers have died rather quickly.--[[User:Eurytus|Eurytus]] 21:48, 2 April 2008 (EST)

::::Hey look! invaders! I closed the gates and lowered the bridge, but my framerate didn't drop. In fact, just as the invaders got there my framerate went back up from a puzzlingly low 40 back up to a regular 90.--[[User:Eurytus|Eurytus]] 22:19, 2 April 2008 (EST)

::::I've tested it again with a couple more waves of goblins, and I've come to the conclusion that the preceding immense slowdown is while the goblins are on the map but not in view. This makes me think that either hidden units contribute to lag more, or the difficult terrain in my area causes their pathfinding to temporarily "freak out."--[[User:Eurytus|Eurytus]] 1:03, 3 April 2008 (EST)

:::::Well, it would seem obvious that invaders have glitches that have direct effects on framerates... just not well defined effects :-/ The "not in view" part seems true enough since the 'mischief-makers' are always invisible until discovered, and my forts generally have been rather far from invasion points. Looks like this is gonna be on hold for the page until someone does some '''extensive''' testing. --[[User:N9103|Edward]] 04:04, 4 April 2008 (EDT)

::::::I'll be happy to start testing it as soon as I start establishing some more long-term fortresses.--[[User:Eurytus|Eurytus]] 11:23, 4 April 2008 (EST)

:[[User_talk:Squirrelloid#Animals_try_to_path_through_tightly_closed_doors|Squirrelloid]]'s done some tests that end up proving the same point, but with animals instead of thieves/snatchers. Both of those groups use flawed pathfinding that doesn't properly account for created obstacles that are passable under certain conditions that aren't true at the time of the pathfind. (Doors being forbidden, or bridges raised for the thieves, and doors being designated as pet forbidden for the animals.) I still say that failed pathfinds cause 90% of framerate loss. --[[User:N9103|Edward]] 06:24, 1 May 2008 (EDT)

:I've uploaded a zip of my errorlog.txt that encompasses a decent, but not overly long amount of time. The unzipped file is 22MB! Thankfully, text compresses very well, and the zip is only 387K. <99% of the file is failed mischief from either goblins or kobolds. [http://dffd.wimbli.com/file.php?id=167] --[[User:N9103|Edward]] 02:29, 11 May 2008 (EDT)

== Dual Screens ==

I just put a second monitor on my computer, partly so I could fullscreen DF with the wiki in another screen. However, running DF in fullscreen make sit take up one screen like normal, and the other goes black. Ckciking the black monitor causes DF to stretch across the monitors. Since there is info here about running DF in one monitor to save CPU cycles, I was wondering is anyone could help. – [[template:unsigned|unsigned]] comment by [[User:Ilmmad|Ilmmad]]

:I don't understand what you're saying. Dwarf Fortress does not do that on my computer. Operating system, perhaps? By the way, sign your comments using <nowiki>--~~~~</nowiki>. --[[User:GreyMario|GreyMario]] 17:24, 22 April 2008 (EDT)

:When you enter fullscreen mode with most graphics apis (such as OpenGL) you will take full control, which is why the other screen goes black. Your best bet is to run in windowed mode with the window size set to your resolution. --[[User:Shades|Shades]] 18:01, 22 April 2008 (EDT)

== temperature ==

From the article "" You're well-advised to stick with "warm" or "hot" fortress sites if you turn temperature off and your source of water is a stream."" --- I cannot understand that. --[[User:Catpaw|Catpaw]] 08:29, 16 September 2008 (EDT)

40d:Magma-safe

2008-09-08T15:38:48Z

Catpaw:

Magma-safe materials are known to include [[iron]], [[steel]], [[bauxite]], and [[adamantine]], but currently it is difficult to control [[magma]] flow with floodgates since mechanisms must be made out of [[Rock|rocks]], most of which are not magma-safe (Bauxite being a notable exception). [http://www.bay12games.com/cgi-local/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic&f=6&t=001614]

[[Mechanisms]] made from raw adamantine are magma-safe, and will properly operate a magma-safe floodgate in a magma channel. The mechanism on the trigger need not be magma-safe, only the one on the floodgate. In order to construct mechanisms from raw adamantine, you must first allow its use for non-economic purposes in the stock screen ({{key|z}} and select 'stone'). You might wish to remove other stone-using jobs while adamantine is available for use. If you do not have any bauxite or adamantine available, you can also workaround floodgate based flow control by building instead screwpumps to pump the magma over [[wall]]-barriers.

== Calculations ==

According to the raw data files, magma's temperature is somewhere between 1300°C and 1400°C, which translates to 2300°F–2500°F .

Materials that resist magma are:

Earth:ground that has not been dug or built will not melt
obsidian fortifications will allow the passage of magma, but also of magma men

Metal:
* [[Nickel]] — 2600°F (1427°C)
* [[Nickel silver]] — 2600°F (1427°C)
* [[Iron]] — 2680°F (1471°C)
* [[Steel]] — 2710°F (1488°C)
* [[Platinum]] — 3000°F (1649°C)
* [[Adamantine]] — 15000°F (8315°C)

Stone:
* [[Bauxite]] — 3600°F (1982°C)
* [[Raw adamantine]] — 15000°F (8315°C)

{{Magma FAQ}}

40d:Magma

2008-09-08T15:37:53Z

Catpaw: /* Using magma */

Magma is red-hot molten rock present in [[volcano]]es, as well as magma pools and magma pipes. It serves as an energy source, powering [[magma forge]]s, [[magma glass furnace]]s and [[magma smelter]]s. It is extremely dangerous.

==Magma sources==

While in previous versions of Dwarf Fortress, every map was guaranteed to have magma, since v0.27.169.32a magma is now a feature of terrain and may or may not be present.

Magma occurs in three different features; Magma pools, Magma Pipes, and [[Volcano|Volcanoes]].

* A '''Magma Pool''' is a reservoir of magma that occupies only a few Z-Levels in the mountain, without reaching the surface. Magma Pools can be very small, and may have few suitable locations for buildings that rely on magma. Magma in these pools is limited, and pools will not refill with magma once emptied.

* A '''Magma Pipe''' starts at the lowest z-level of the map from an magma (or lava) flow and extend in a pipe shape upwards, sometimes reaching the surface but often not. Magma Pipes gradually refill with magma.

* A [[Volcano]] is similar to a magma pipe, but it has the advantage of being a geographical feature that is visible on the [[location]] screen. This means that it is a lot easier to find. However, it IS actually possible for a volcano that shows up on the "local" and region screen in the starting location chooser to be entirely underground - Although you could see it in the starting location chooser, it would not be visible from the surface once your dwarves have arrived at the fort's site.

== Finding magma ==

Volcanoes are visible on the "local" screen in the starting location chooser. It is represented as a red ≈ mark (a double tilde) - essentially it looks like red water. Note that red ≈ marks in the "region" screen mean something different entirely (e.g. red sand).
If you are using a certain [[utility]], you can also see magma pools and magma pipes on the local screen in the embark menu.
After you have embarked for a place that has a volcano, and once your dwarves have arrived at their target destination, you should see a large red pool of lava on your map. If you don't, you should expect your volcano to be somewhere underground. You then have to use [[exploratory mining]] to find it.

While picking a starting location, the easiest place to look for magma is on or near a [[volcano]] (a red ^ mark in the "region" screen). There are often volcanic islands (easy to find, since they are the sole land in the middle of oceans), but since sea travel is not yet implemented, trade with other races may not be possible on such islands. Instead, find a volcano on land, and (optionally) start looking for a vent in nearby squares. "Nearby squares" can mean anything from literally on top of the volcano, to adjacent, to quite a long distance away indeed. The placement of magma seems to be related to the distance from volcanoes, but is still essentially random.

Magma vents occur exclusively in world map tiles that are primarily igneous extrusive. That is to say, if you select an entire tile on the embarkation screen and press F1 to highlight the most common terrain, the tile will only have magma if the top stone is dark gray, signifying igneous extrusive rock. Magma does not necessarily form in this geological zone/biome, rather anywhere in the tile. Even if magma is not evident on the surface, it's almost certain to be underground somewhere, though the chances of finding it without reveal.exe are still slim.

Much harder than simply finding a magma vent is finding a magma vent that is also near suitable terrain for building. Depending on your requirements - you may be looking for a source of running water, or a mountain for minerals, or a healthy tree population, a layer of [[flux]] for steel production or even all four - suitable building sites can be extremely scarce.

Since volcanoes show up on the region finder, and magma vents do not, you may find it easier to simply check all volcanoes on a map for suitability, and generate a new world if none are suitable, rather than scouring tile after tile for magma vents.

If you're willing to search exhaustively, you might want to consider finding magma vents that are not near volcanoes at all. Very occasionally, magma will be visible in the middle of forests, plains, or other terrain nowhere near a volcano or even mountains. There is no way to spot these on the region map, so you have to review the local maps. This can be done from DF, but since it involves a lot of scrolling and is very tedious, you can try exporting the local map of the world which can be much more quickly searched for the distinctive red ≈ symbol.

You can also occasionally find magma that does not extend all the way to the surface, and therefore is not visible on the local map. These are in fact much more numerous than surface-visible magma vents; however, they are almost impossible to find without cheating via one of the [[utilities]] like "reveal.exe", since unlike proper magma vents these smaller deposits must be almost literally mined into to see (you will get a warning about "warm stone" before you actually breach the deposit). These smaller magma deposits appear in the same places as normal magma vents - near volcanoes, or, failing that, near other known magma.

The newly-added "Site Finder" feature neatly sidesteps all of this legwork, allowing you to search for a site with a magma pool or pipe without having to manually check each tile on the world map. Note that unless you edit the .init file so that magma features are shown on the local map, you won't know exactly ''where'' the lava is prior to embarking- just that it exists. Depending on whether or not you like a little mystery, this can be turned on or off at will.

== Using magma ==

On a map with a magma vent, the magma will be clearly visible from every level ground and below, unless the map is in a Freezing area. In Freezing areas, the top few levels of the vent will have cooled to form an obsidian "cap". This should still be readily recognizable however, as it will comprise a circular area. The minerals directly adjacent to the magma vent will also be immediately visible, even at the lowest level of the map, which can give some hints about where to prospect for ores.

The vent has a similar, circular shape on each level. However, it is not identical from one level to the next; some levels will have a larger or somewhat misshapen circle of magma.

The primary use for magma is to power [[magma smelter]]s, [[magma glass furnace]]s and [[magma forge]]s. (There are other uses, including defense, [[obsidian]] production, and possibly even garbage disposal.) To build forges, etc. on magma, at least one of the external eight squares must be above a square of magma.

This can be done most easily by simply building on ground level. The magma is visible from ground level but is actually contained one level below ground level, just like any ground-level water source.

To build underground, you will need to dig at least one tile of a [[channel]] above the location you wish to build the smelter or forge. Underneath this channel there must be magma, either directly from the vent or channeled from the vent. You can simply build a tunnel straight into the magma, or use channels to tap into the magma on the level below safely - this latter is easier if there is more magma on the lower level than the level on which you wish to build. Tapping into magma directly is usually safe (see Pressure note below,) provided that you are prepared for it. Magma is much slower than water, and can be stopped by a simple floodgate. Take care however if you are using a [[screwpump]] to pump magma into a tunnel/funnel with a cistern below. The pump will make the magma overflow like it would with water.

Volcanoes and magma tubes slowly replenish their supply of magma.

==Magma compared to water==

Magma is a chunky liquid. As such, it acts like water in certain circumstances, but acts differently in others.

===Similarities===

*Magma fills a tile and has seven possible depths.

*Magma flows outward and downward to expand into clear space.

*Screw pumps work in magma.

*Floodgates and pressure plates work in magma.

*Constructed walls of all kinds safely contain magma.

*Objects thrown into magma sink to the bottom.

*Magma that is only 1 deep "evaporates" over time.

===Differences===

*Magma is extremely hot, and capable of melting objects and constructions made of most materials (see [[Magma#Magma vs. Built Objects|Magma vs. Built Objects]]) and thus destroying them.

*Magma is never pressurized, it seeps out of holes slower than water and slow enough for any dwarves to outrun, unless they are the ones digging into it.

*Magma flows up from a direct vertical line from the bottom of a [[Magma#Magma sources|Volcano or Magma Pipe]] only. Otherwise, its level may rise only by dripping more magma from above, and new magma may only distribute itself by moving down or to the sides, but never up.

*Magma reacts violently with water, releasing steam and, depending on the amount of magma, leaving behind tiles of solid obsidian which can be mined, smoothed or engraved like any natural tile.

*Magma is not a water source. Dwarves can't drink it or supply it to their wounded.

== Magma vs. Built Objects ==

Some objects that come in contact with magma will function fine, no matter what their material. Others will melt or cease to work properly unless they're made of [[magma-safe materials]].

* Workshops that are powered by magma need not be built of magma-safe materials to function.

* Constructed [[wall]]s of any material, even those that are not "Magma-safe", will hold magma in without issues.

* Like walls, [[door]]s can also be built out of any material and still hold back lava as long as it's in the "closed" position. It may be wise to make sure hallways/rooms close to an engineering project involving magma have plenty of doors, just in case you have a little too much [[fun]] when you forget to build that last [[floodgate]].

* Bridges that are built over magma may be constructed of any material. However, bridges that are submerged in magma must be constructed of a magma-safe material.

* Most machines must be made of [[magma-safe materials]] to function for more than a few minutes in magma. This includes [[floodgate]]s. Unsafe materials will function for a while, but then burn away. Screw pumps will not melt, but will burn. Stone blocks and copper pipes/corkscrews will not melt.

* Stone mechanisms attached to a construction will melt in magma unless made of bauxite or raw adamantine, even if the construction itself is made of steel. In addition, if the mechanisms melt off of a floodgate, the floodgate will cease to be "constructed" and become an unplaced item again.{{version|0.27.176.38c}} At this point, the magma will flow over it freely.

== Temperature settings ==

Magma is almost harmless if temperature is disabled in the Dwarf Fortress init file. It can still trap and suffocate or simply starve your dwarves in some situations. It will not melt bridges, etc. constructed of non-[[magma-proof]] materials.

== Magma reactions ==

*Water: If magma happens to contact water it produces some steam and [[obsidian]]. This means there is no longer any chance of using a prolonged contact between the two to create a steam trap, though steam is also likely now not harmful. For those of you who aren't veteran dwarves, in the old 2D version, steam was deadly.
*[[Brook]]s: If magma comes in contact with a brook, it will not produce steam, but will turn the water tile below the brook to obsidian, and give the brook tile the appearance of a dried-up brook.
*Rocks: [[stone|Rock]]s left over from mining will melt if magma covers them.
*Speed: Magma moves relatively slowly. While it is nearly impossible to try to seal off water let loose, magma is slow enough for your dwarves to build a floodgate or door, or even wall off the flooding area, if you happen to let magma loose by mistake.
*Pressure: Magma does not transmit [[water pressure|pressure]].
: If magma level is lower than its initial level in the volcano when season changes and the uppermost layer of magma is all 7s the new layer of magma will be created above. Magma will be only created above tiles without floor. It will be created in 7s, and will probably spread around in few seconds. This may be deadly to unlucky dwarves standing around. Therefore, to be sure to avoid casualties, do not build workshops except at the highest level of magma.

[[Category:Physics]]
{{Magma FAQ}}

40d:Magma-safe

2008-09-08T15:33:48Z

Catpaw:

Magma-safe materials are known to include [[iron]], [[steel]], [[bauxite]], and [[adamantine]], but currently it is difficult to control [[magma]] flow with floodgates since mechanisms must be made out of [[Rock|rocks]], most of which are not magma-safe (Bauxite being a notable exception). [http://www.bay12games.com/cgi-local/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic&f=6&t=001614]

[[Mechanisms]] made from raw adamantine are magma-safe, and will properly operate a magma-safe floodgate in a magma channel. The mechanism on the trigger need not be magma-safe, only the one on the floodgate. In order to construct mechanisms from raw adamantine, you must first allow its use for non-economic purposes in the stock screen ({{key|z}} and select 'stone'). You might wish to remove other stone-using jobs while adamantine is available for use. If you do not have any bauxite or adamantine available, you can also workaround floodgate based flow control by building instead screwpumps to pump the magma over barriers.

== Calculations ==

According to the raw data files, magma's temperature is somewhere between 1300°C and 1400°C, which translates to 2300°F–2500°F .

Materials that resist magma are:

Earth:ground that has not been dug or built will not melt
obsidian fortifications will allow the passage of magma, but also of magma men

Metal:
* [[Nickel]] — 2600°F (1427°C)
* [[Nickel silver]] — 2600°F (1427°C)
* [[Iron]] — 2680°F (1471°C)
* [[Steel]] — 2710°F (1488°C)
* [[Platinum]] — 3000°F (1649°C)
* [[Adamantine]] — 15000°F (8315°C)

Stone:
* [[Bauxite]] — 3600°F (1982°C)
* [[Raw adamantine]] — 15000°F (8315°C)

{{Magma FAQ}}

40d:Magma-safe

2008-09-08T15:32:01Z

Catpaw:

Magma-safe materials are known to include [[iron]], [[steel]], [[bauxite]], and [[adamantine]], but currently it is difficult to control [[magma]] flow with floodgates since mechanisms must be made out of [[Rock|rocks]], most of which are not magma-safe (Bauxite being a notable exception). [http://www.bay12games.com/cgi-local/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic&f=6&t=001614]

[[Mechanisms]] made from raw adamantine are magma-safe, and will properly operate a magma-safe floodgate in a magma channel. The mechanism on the trigger need not be magma-safe, only the one on the floodgate. In order to construct mechanisms from raw adamantine, you must first allow its use for non-economic purposes in the stock screen ({{key|z}} and select 'stone'). You might wish to remove other stone-using jobs while adamantine is available for use. If you do not have any bauxite or adamantine available, you can also workaround floodgate based flow control by building instead screwpumps to pump the magma over a wall barrier.

== Calculations ==

According to the raw data files, magma's temperature is somewhere between 1300°C and 1400°C, which translates to 2300°F–2500°F .

Materials that resist magma are:

Earth:ground that has not been dug or built will not melt
obsidian fortifications will allow the passage of magma, but also of magma men

Metal:
* [[Nickel]] — 2600°F (1427°C)
* [[Nickel silver]] — 2600°F (1427°C)
* [[Iron]] — 2680°F (1471°C)
* [[Steel]] — 2710°F (1488°C)
* [[Platinum]] — 3000°F (1649°C)
* [[Adamantine]] — 15000°F (8315°C)

Stone:
* [[Bauxite]] — 3600°F (1982°C)
* [[Raw adamantine]] — 15000°F (8315°C)

{{Magma FAQ}}

40d:Magma-safe

2008-09-08T15:31:10Z

Catpaw:

Magma-safe materials are known to include [[iron]], [[steel]], [[bauxite]], and [[adamantine]], but currently it is difficult to control magma flow with floodgates since mechanisms must be made out of [[Rock|rocks]], most of which are not magma-safe (Bauxite being a notable exception). [http://www.bay12games.com/cgi-local/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic&f=6&t=001614]

Mechanisms made from raw adamantine are magma-safe, and will properly operate a magma-safe floodgate in a magma channel. The mechanism on the trigger need not be magma-safe, only the one on the floodgate. In order to construct mechanisms from raw adamantine, you must first allow its use for non-economic purposes in the stock screen ({{key|z}} and select 'stone'). You might wish to remove other stone-using jobs while adamantine is available for use. If you do not have any bauxite or adamantine available, you can also workaround floodgate based flow control by building instead screwpumps to pump the magma over a wall barrier.

== Calculations ==

According to the raw data files, magma's temperature is somewhere between 1300°C and 1400°C, which translates to 2300°F–2500°F .

Materials that resist magma are:

Earth:ground that has not been dug or built will not melt
obsidian fortifications will allow the passage of magma, but also of magma men

Metal:
* [[Nickel]] — 2600°F (1427°C)
* [[Nickel silver]] — 2600°F (1427°C)
* [[Iron]] — 2680°F (1471°C)
* [[Steel]] — 2710°F (1488°C)
* [[Platinum]] — 3000°F (1649°C)
* [[Adamantine]] — 15000°F (8315°C)

Stone:
* [[Bauxite]] — 3600°F (1982°C)
* [[Raw adamantine]] — 15000°F (8315°C)

{{Magma FAQ}}

40d:Losing

2008-09-04T09:09:09Z

Catpaw: /* General Unhappiness */

Losing is fun!

Either way, it keeps you busy.

Most new players will lose their first few forts; <s>if</s> when you lose a fortress, don't feel like you don't understand the game. Dwarf Fortress has a steep learning curve, and part of the appeal is discovering things for yourself. However, this Wiki serves as an excellent place to speed up the learning process.

If you lose, you can always [[reclaim fortress mode|reclaim fortress]] or go visit it in [[adventurer mode]].

If you're looking for more ways to <s>die horribly</s> test yourself, try either the [[Difficult Seeds]], [[Mega Constructions]], [[Challenge Builds]] or the [[Goals]] pages.

== Autopsy ==

Various things can cause you to lose a fortress.

=== Losing your miners ===

If your [[miner]]s are killed in a [[cave-in|collapse]] and their equipment destroyed, chances are good that you will no longer be able to continue your efforts. Consider abandoning your fortress. Alternatively, you can try to keep your fortress running long enough to request additional [[pick]]s from your Outpost [[Liaison]], who will arrive with the next dwarven trade [[caravan]]. It will take another year before they will return. 
Also consider the tedious but fun option of making buildings outside! If your [[woodcutter]]s with [[axe]]s are still available, then you can build structures of [[wood]]. This is not recommended for very new players though, as it is intensely resource-demanding and takes a lot of managing to get right. (Also not recommended if you don't understand the z-axis system yet.)

=== Starvation ===

A serious danger, generally in the more inhospitable climates, is the loss of your dwarves due to starvation; if you are in the heart of a mountain with no [[soil]] to build on, it is possible you will not be able to establish [[farm]]s. As dwarves begin to starve, they will become Hungry, then Starving. This will cause them to become very angry. When they die, their friends will become upset and will become even angrier, potentially causing the remainder of your fortress to break out in a terminal brawl.

Don't forget your alternative sources of [[food]]. Try [[butchering]] your [[animals]], [[plant gathering|gathering plants]], or resorting to [[hunting]] of local wildlife.

===Dehydration===

One of the biggest problems with a fortress that has no [[brook]], [[stream]], [[river]], or other source of fresh [[water]]. Water must be rapidly gathered from stagnant pools and stored into an indoor basin or water tower, with sufficient depth before it [[evaporate]]s. If this fails, all of the water on the map will evaporate and your dwarves will be left without any water.

Healthy Dwarves will not die of thirst as long as they have alcohol, which in the current version can be [[Brewing|brewed]] without the use of water. However, injured dwarves must be given water, not alcohol, or they will die of dehydration.

===Flooding accidents===

The opposite side of the dehydration spectrum is having too ''much'' water. Remember that water can [[flow]] in 10 directions (the 8 horizontal ones as well as up and down). It is also worth remembering that, unlike water, [[magma]] does not flow upwards.

If your fortress is beginning to flood from [[Water#Sourced Water|sourced water]], abandon all of the levels the water can reach immediately—drafting dwarves into the [[military]] and stationing them onto the surface if need be. You will never be able to recover those areas unless you can manage to [[pump]] out the water faster than it floods in, which can take over a year or two of game time to establish a functioning automated pump system. Generally, a flooding accident spells doom for your fortress.

===Invasion===

The [[goblin]]s first come with about a dozen soldiers to [[siege]] your fort. Then they come again with about two dozen. Then three. Soon enough your [[trap]]s are all sprung, your [[door]]s beaten down, and your dwarves are dead. Without some simple [[Fortress defense|defense]]s, such as a [[moat]], a horde of goblins on your doorstep can be deadly.

===Wildlife===

Goblins aren't the only creatures that want you dead. Be it [[unicorn|unicorns]], [[hippo|hippos]], [[undead]] [[elephant|elephants]] or a [[giant cave spider]], a sudden wildlife attack can quickly cripple or destroy an unprepared fortress.

===Volcanic Death===

Toady has stated that in the future volcanoes will be much less stable and much more deadly.

===General Unhappiness===

Think it's no big deal to leave your dwarves with a medicore dining room, living room, and a generally inadequate fortress?

If there is little in a fortress to give your dwarves happy [[thoughts]] and enough to give them unhappy [[thoughts]], then your dwarves will start to throw tantrums, go melancholy, and destroy your civilization. Unhappiness is more likely to occur if your fortress is suffering other kinds of downfall.

===Siege===

Should hosts of goblins besiege your gates, drive your peasantry inside and force you to seal off from the outside world, you may have already lost the game. Although a dwarven fortress can be made to appear self-contained, with sources of [[metal]], [[fuel]], underground [[list of crops|crops]] and even livestock kept within inaccessible tunnels, very rarely if ever can a fortress sustain such a state indefinitely. For example, [[trade]] with the outside world has now been shut off, leaving you only what minerals are on your map for the production of mandate goods. This results in a breakdown of social order if your [[Hammerer]] kills and maims dwarves. [[Shell]], [[bone]], [[leather]] and other products commonly acquired by [[hunting]] and [[fishing]] can no longer be found by your workers, which can drive moody [[craftsdwarf|craftsdwarves]] to commit suicide. Rotten vermin [[corpse]]s begin to heap in your food supply, forcing you to dump these into garbage pits and refuse piles generating [[miasma]]. One fell miscalculation of your fuel reserves may leave you without [[coke]] to refine further coal, and without a supply of timber for your wood burning [[furnace]] this can drive your [[weaponsmith]]s to melancholy or berserk rage, and worse, end your vital [[weapon]]s production for a future counterattack. Your watersupply and aqueducts can be assaulted unless sealed off, and caverivers almost always send sporadic, bloodthirsty monsters to cause further casualties. But should you be waterless, your wounded will die of dehydration and your entire colony will hinge on [[alcohol|booze]] production; a delicate balancing act.

With all these critical industries unproductive, dwarves dying, and friends mourning over the rotting heaps of slain loved ones, its important to remember your dwarves have nothing to do but throw funeral receptions, grief counseling sessions, and the occasional keg stand. This means they've all become one big happy family of friends, manically depressed from the loss of any dwarf.

In short, the attacking army can simply wait until your dwarves emo themselves to death.

[[ru:Поражение]]

40d Talk:Water wheel

2008-08-29T13:51:05Z

Catpaw:

==Perpetual motion machine==
I've not used waterwheels yet, so I'm unsure if this is the case, but couldn't you, theoretically, set up a perpetual motion machine using a waterwheel and a screw pump?

The article contradicts itself, it says on the first line "in" a flow, but the next line refers to a flow underneath, which is correct? [[User:Matryx|Matryx]] 17:34, 31 October 2007 (EDT)

A perpetual motion device is easy enough to setup once you have an understanding of screwpumps and power. I currently have a water wheel placed between two underground resevoirs that runs a mill and pumps water from the lower tank to the higher one. Its very energy efficient aswell. Three axles, a gear, the mill and the pump only draw 40 power leaving me 60 for other devices.

I'll try get up screenshots of it or maybe a tidier one later --[[User:Lucid|Lucid]] 19:58, 31 October 2007 (EDT)
==edit comments==

Someone removed my edit, but the water wheel actually only requires one square of water underneath it, not three. - Sludge Man

We could really use better pictures. The tileset in these screenshots is terrible, (lets use the default one) and they are very unclear. I do not understand how to build a working waterwheel after looking at this page.
==Perpetual motion again==
I removed the unclear example of a perpetual motion machine with a forum link to much clearer designs. We still need clear pictures and elaboration of the method of construction. I'll get around to it once I understand it myself, if no one beats me to it. --[[User:Turgid Bolk|Turgid Bolk]] 15:48, 5 November 2007 (EST)

: Sorry about the tilesets but I didn't think anyone would mind my custom one considering the only noticibly difference is the pump which looks like 2 barrels.
Although my screenshots were specifically for a perpetual motion machine which is why they lacked indepth wheel and pump construction.
I was hoping to create a video or some sort of tutorial to add in the construction section which dealt with creating waterwheels for someone who has absolutely no idea of any of the mechanics.

Also how reliable are the new designs?
I checked out that link and I previously toyed with designs similar to those and found them to be excellent power generators but not true perpetual motion machines, they all lost power intermittedly for varying lengths of time. --[[User:Lucid|Lucid]] 18:30, 5 November 2007 (EST)

== Perpendicular to water flow ==

Strange as it may sound, water wheels do 'not' need to be parallel to the water flow direction to work. [[User:VengefulDonut|VengefulDonut]] 16:31, 23 November 2007 (EST)
:This is as in real life - you can build a less efficient water wheel by putting the "buckets" at an angle - and indeed might put the "buckets" on a 360 degree pivot for some purposes.[[User:GarrieIrons|GarrieIrons]] 07:21, 8 January 2008 (EST)
===Water Flow Needed?===
::Actually there is no need for water flow at all. A water wheel seems to generate power even if it is built to a water body with no current (no "entry" or "exit" points). So basically the water wheel just needs to touch water and that's it. This is what I've noticed when confining a canal with floodgates at both ends. --[[User:Flaa|Flaa]] 07:47, 22 April 2008 (EDT)
:::This seems to have changed in a recent version. In previous versions you just had to connect a canal to a brook and the whole canal would count as 'flowing' even when nothing was moving. In my latest game this hasn't worked. So it's either changed, or the fact that I tried a 4-tile wide canal has stopped it working. --[[User:Juckto|Juckto]] 18:22, 10 May 2008 (EDT)

== Powering a Water Wheel ==

It seems that you can connect a Water Wheel to a Windmill, or other power source and cause it to spin - is there a purpose to doing this? can you move water along channels this way? What are the benefits? --[[User:SeiferTim|SeiferTim]] 12:47, 12 March 2008 (EDT)

::I think that it's because water wheels use power to run. Hence, they produce 100 power by themselves, but end up using 10 to spin, making the net power output only 90. Therefore, most likely the windmills provide that 10 power to the waterwheel. I don't think it does anything, but it does look cool.
--[[User:Umiman|Umiman]] 05:34, 27 May 2008 (EDT)

==Verify Carpenter==
Does the water wheel require carpentry to build?--[[User:Richards|Richards]] 04:11, 21 April 2008 (EDT)
:Yep--[[User:Dorten|Dorten]] 04:15, 21 April 2008 (EDT)
::Thanks Dorten.--[[User:Richards|Richards]] 04:26, 21 April 2008 (EDT)

==Minimum water level==
What is the minimum water level and flow required to power a waterwheel? --[[User:Sphexx|Sphexx]] 16:48, 27 May 2008 (EDT)

:1/7 water Hight. [[User:Hoborobo|Hoborobo]] 04:59, 8 June 2008 (EDT)-
::That doesn't sound correct to me... [[User:Juckto|Juckto]] 20:33, 14 June 2008 (EDT)

== Definition of "flow"? ==

The article states that waterwheels need flow under them, but how exactly does the game calculate this?

I was thinking that it means any water changing depth below it, but that would rule out building on a river/ocean full of 7/7 tiles. Will a waterwheel work on top of water full to the brim but supposedly "flowing" (i.e. ocean, full river)? [[User:G-Flex|G-Flex]] 8 June 2008 (EDT)

:I believe that right now a waterwheel will provide power as long as there is at least 4/7 water depth below it, or at least that is what has been the case in my experience, as I don't think a dead end channel would really provide any water flow yet a waterwheel will still provide power if place over one. --[[User:Elvang|Elvang]] 04:15, 8 June 2008 (EDT)

::Are you sure, though? Juckto (above) seems to believe the state of affairs is a bit more complicated. I guess I can just test it out for myself at some point. [[User:G-Flex|G-Flex]] 04:28, 8 June 2008 (EDT)

:::I'm sure about the minimum being 4/7, never had a waterwheel that would work below that level. Maybe it counts the water as flowing if the water depth changes during x ticks? If thats the case then a closed system would work unless you manage to get all the tiles at the same depth. I doubt the game uses a system much more complicated than that, as it would cause incredible lag checking each tile for depth, direction of flow, speed of flow, and path of least resistance. Not to mention factoring in water pressure and evaporation. Additionally, waterwheels seem to work no matter what their orientation is to the water. --[[User:Elvang|Elvang]] 04:37, 8 June 2008 (EDT)

::::Hrm, yeah, it seems like you need change of depth for it to count as "flow". Putting in the ocean just don't work.[[User:G-Flex|G-Flex]] 04:23, 16 June 2008 (EDT)

:::::Change of depth not needed. Putting it in a full river works. --[[User:Savok|Savok]] 22:47, 20 July 2008 (EDT)

== Construction Key? ==

The construction area needs a key. I can't figure out what the O is supposed to be, and I only use the ASCII version of DF.--[[User:RustyMcloon|Rusty Mcloon]] 11:19, 18 July 2008 (EDT)

:It is a vertical axle. You should know, since you play the pseudo-ASCII version. --[[User:Savok|Savok]] 22:47, 20 July 2008 (EDT)

== Two Quick Questions... ==

would water wheels be powered by water falling down a Z axis onto a waterwheel?

can a waterwheel be used in magma or would it burn?

--[[User:Althalus|Althalus]] 10:05, 9 August 2008 (EDT)

::Water wheels need to be placed in a channel with water to be powered. AFAIK the channel doesn't have to be any longer than the water wheel, doesn't need water coming in nor going out. The game isn't clever enough yet... (shhh!)
::I think the water has to be depth:3.
::Water wheels have to be made of wood. Any machine that has magma flow through it, if it isn't made of magma-safe material, will burn/melt. You might get a bit of power for a short time but the water wheel would burn (assuming temperature is turned on which it is by default).
::To sign your name properly use the signature button on the toolbar or type "~" four times: <nowiki>~~~~</nowiki> [[User:GarrieIrons|GarrieIrons]] 21:26, 8 August 2008 (EDT)

:::Waterwheels may not be magma-safe, but the actual structure of the wheel is built one z-level above the magma, rather than in it. Thus it is entirely plausible that a waterwheel could survive being used with magma. Whether it does actually survive such circumstances, and if so whether it starts turning, could do with being tested. --[[User:Raumkraut|Raumkraut]] 23:09, 8 August 2008 (EDT)

:Well i guess i will have to do my own experiments on magma wheels, i will report my findings. --[[User:Althalus|Althalus]] 10:05, 9 August 2008 (EDT)

== Waterwheel on rivers ==
Yesterday I build a waterwheel above a river, it did not work. I build a second wheel in a moat channeled from the river it did work. Either I made some stupid error, or there is a bug at the current ver. that makes wheel not working on rivers themselves... --[[User:Catpaw|Catpaw]] 06:37, 29 August 2008 (EDT)
:A brook or a river? [[User:HeWhoIsPale|HeWhoIsPale]] 09:24, 29 August 2008 (EDT)
:: Oh it was a brook, since my dwarfes always waded through it. okay I understand it now... Is kinda quirky in the simulation... you turn a brook into a river by digging its surface... uh. common logic anyone? :-) --[[User:Catpaw|Catpaw]] 09:50, 29 August 2008 (EDT)

40d Talk:Water wheel

2008-08-29T13:50:31Z

Catpaw:

==Perpetual motion machine==
I've not used waterwheels yet, so I'm unsure if this is the case, but couldn't you, theoretically, set up a perpetual motion machine using a waterwheel and a screw pump?

The article contradicts itself, it says on the first line "in" a flow, but the next line refers to a flow underneath, which is correct? [[User:Matryx|Matryx]] 17:34, 31 October 2007 (EDT)

A perpetual motion device is easy enough to setup once you have an understanding of screwpumps and power. I currently have a water wheel placed between two underground resevoirs that runs a mill and pumps water from the lower tank to the higher one. Its very energy efficient aswell. Three axles, a gear, the mill and the pump only draw 40 power leaving me 60 for other devices.

I'll try get up screenshots of it or maybe a tidier one later --[[User:Lucid|Lucid]] 19:58, 31 October 2007 (EDT)
==edit comments==

Someone removed my edit, but the water wheel actually only requires one square of water underneath it, not three. - Sludge Man

We could really use better pictures. The tileset in these screenshots is terrible, (lets use the default one) and they are very unclear. I do not understand how to build a working waterwheel after looking at this page.
==Perpetual motion again==
I removed the unclear example of a perpetual motion machine with a forum link to much clearer designs. We still need clear pictures and elaboration of the method of construction. I'll get around to it once I understand it myself, if no one beats me to it. --[[User:Turgid Bolk|Turgid Bolk]] 15:48, 5 November 2007 (EST)

: Sorry about the tilesets but I didn't think anyone would mind my custom one considering the only noticibly difference is the pump which looks like 2 barrels.
Although my screenshots were specifically for a perpetual motion machine which is why they lacked indepth wheel and pump construction.
I was hoping to create a video or some sort of tutorial to add in the construction section which dealt with creating waterwheels for someone who has absolutely no idea of any of the mechanics.

Also how reliable are the new designs?
I checked out that link and I previously toyed with designs similar to those and found them to be excellent power generators but not true perpetual motion machines, they all lost power intermittedly for varying lengths of time. --[[User:Lucid|Lucid]] 18:30, 5 November 2007 (EST)

== Perpendicular to water flow ==

Strange as it may sound, water wheels do 'not' need to be parallel to the water flow direction to work. [[User:VengefulDonut|VengefulDonut]] 16:31, 23 November 2007 (EST)
:This is as in real life - you can build a less efficient water wheel by putting the "buckets" at an angle - and indeed might put the "buckets" on a 360 degree pivot for some purposes.[[User:GarrieIrons|GarrieIrons]] 07:21, 8 January 2008 (EST)
===Water Flow Needed?===
::Actually there is no need for water flow at all. A water wheel seems to generate power even if it is built to a water body with no current (no "entry" or "exit" points). So basically the water wheel just needs to touch water and that's it. This is what I've noticed when confining a canal with floodgates at both ends. --[[User:Flaa|Flaa]] 07:47, 22 April 2008 (EDT)
:::This seems to have changed in a recent version. In previous versions you just had to connect a canal to a brook and the whole canal would count as 'flowing' even when nothing was moving. In my latest game this hasn't worked. So it's either changed, or the fact that I tried a 4-tile wide canal has stopped it working. --[[User:Juckto|Juckto]] 18:22, 10 May 2008 (EDT)

== Powering a Water Wheel ==

It seems that you can connect a Water Wheel to a Windmill, or other power source and cause it to spin - is there a purpose to doing this? can you move water along channels this way? What are the benefits? --[[User:SeiferTim|SeiferTim]] 12:47, 12 March 2008 (EDT)

::I think that it's because water wheels use power to run. Hence, they produce 100 power by themselves, but end up using 10 to spin, making the net power output only 90. Therefore, most likely the windmills provide that 10 power to the waterwheel. I don't think it does anything, but it does look cool.
--[[User:Umiman|Umiman]] 05:34, 27 May 2008 (EDT)

==Verify Carpenter==
Does the water wheel require carpentry to build?--[[User:Richards|Richards]] 04:11, 21 April 2008 (EDT)
:Yep--[[User:Dorten|Dorten]] 04:15, 21 April 2008 (EDT)
::Thanks Dorten.--[[User:Richards|Richards]] 04:26, 21 April 2008 (EDT)

==Minimum water level==
What is the minimum water level and flow required to power a waterwheel? --[[User:Sphexx|Sphexx]] 16:48, 27 May 2008 (EDT)

:1/7 water Hight. [[User:Hoborobo|Hoborobo]] 04:59, 8 June 2008 (EDT)-
::That doesn't sound correct to me... [[User:Juckto|Juckto]] 20:33, 14 June 2008 (EDT)

== Definition of "flow"? ==

The article states that waterwheels need flow under them, but how exactly does the game calculate this?

I was thinking that it means any water changing depth below it, but that would rule out building on a river/ocean full of 7/7 tiles. Will a waterwheel work on top of water full to the brim but supposedly "flowing" (i.e. ocean, full river)? [[User:G-Flex|G-Flex]] 8 June 2008 (EDT)

:I believe that right now a waterwheel will provide power as long as there is at least 4/7 water depth below it, or at least that is what has been the case in my experience, as I don't think a dead end channel would really provide any water flow yet a waterwheel will still provide power if place over one. --[[User:Elvang|Elvang]] 04:15, 8 June 2008 (EDT)

::Are you sure, though? Juckto (above) seems to believe the state of affairs is a bit more complicated. I guess I can just test it out for myself at some point. [[User:G-Flex|G-Flex]] 04:28, 8 June 2008 (EDT)

:::I'm sure about the minimum being 4/7, never had a waterwheel that would work below that level. Maybe it counts the water as flowing if the water depth changes during x ticks? If thats the case then a closed system would work unless you manage to get all the tiles at the same depth. I doubt the game uses a system much more complicated than that, as it would cause incredible lag checking each tile for depth, direction of flow, speed of flow, and path of least resistance. Not to mention factoring in water pressure and evaporation. Additionally, waterwheels seem to work no matter what their orientation is to the water. --[[User:Elvang|Elvang]] 04:37, 8 June 2008 (EDT)

::::Hrm, yeah, it seems like you need change of depth for it to count as "flow". Putting in the ocean just don't work.[[User:G-Flex|G-Flex]] 04:23, 16 June 2008 (EDT)

:::::Change of depth not needed. Putting it in a full river works. --[[User:Savok|Savok]] 22:47, 20 July 2008 (EDT)

== Construction Key? ==

The construction area needs a key. I can't figure out what the O is supposed to be, and I only use the ASCII version of DF.--[[User:RustyMcloon|Rusty Mcloon]] 11:19, 18 July 2008 (EDT)

:It is a vertical axle. You should know, since you play the pseudo-ASCII version. --[[User:Savok|Savok]] 22:47, 20 July 2008 (EDT)

== Two Quick Questions... ==

would water wheels be powered by water falling down a Z axis onto a waterwheel?

can a waterwheel be used in magma or would it burn?

--[[User:Althalus|Althalus]] 10:05, 9 August 2008 (EDT)

::Water wheels need to be placed in a channel with water to be powered. AFAIK the channel doesn't have to be any longer than the water wheel, doesn't need water coming in nor going out. The game isn't clever enough yet... (shhh!)
::I think the water has to be depth:3.
::Water wheels have to be made of wood. Any machine that has magma flow through it, if it isn't made of magma-safe material, will burn/melt. You might get a bit of power for a short time but the water wheel would burn (assuming temperature is turned on which it is by default).
::To sign your name properly use the signature button on the toolbar or type "~" four times: <nowiki>~~~~</nowiki> [[User:GarrieIrons|GarrieIrons]] 21:26, 8 August 2008 (EDT)

:::Waterwheels may not be magma-safe, but the actual structure of the wheel is built one z-level above the magma, rather than in it. Thus it is entirely plausible that a waterwheel could survive being used with magma. Whether it does actually survive such circumstances, and if so whether it starts turning, could do with being tested. --[[User:Raumkraut|Raumkraut]] 23:09, 8 August 2008 (EDT)

:Well i guess i will have to do my own experiments on magma wheels, i will report my findings.

== Waterwheel on rivers ==
Yesterday I build a waterwheel above a river, it did not work. I build a second wheel in a moat channeled from the river it did work. Either I made some stupid error, or there is a bug at the current ver. that makes wheel not working on rivers themselves... --[[User:Catpaw|Catpaw]] 06:37, 29 August 2008 (EDT)
:A brook or a river? [[User:HeWhoIsPale|HeWhoIsPale]] 09:24, 29 August 2008 (EDT)
--[[User:Althalus|Althalus]] 10:05, 9 August 2008 (EDT)
:: Oh it was a brook, since my dwarfes always waded through it. okay I understand it now... Is kinda quirky in the simulation... you turn a brook into a river by digging its surface... uh. common logic anyone? :-) --[[User:Catpaw|Catpaw]] 09:50, 29 August 2008 (EDT)

40d Talk:Water wheel

2008-08-29T10:37:05Z

Catpaw:

==Perpetual motion machine==
I've not used waterwheels yet, so I'm unsure if this is the case, but couldn't you, theoretically, set up a perpetual motion machine using a waterwheel and a screw pump?

The article contradicts itself, it says on the first line "in" a flow, but the next line refers to a flow underneath, which is correct? [[User:Matryx|Matryx]] 17:34, 31 October 2007 (EDT)

A perpetual motion device is easy enough to setup once you have an understanding of screwpumps and power. I currently have a water wheel placed between two underground resevoirs that runs a mill and pumps water from the lower tank to the higher one. Its very energy efficient aswell. Three axles, a gear, the mill and the pump only draw 40 power leaving me 60 for other devices.

I'll try get up screenshots of it or maybe a tidier one later --[[User:Lucid|Lucid]] 19:58, 31 October 2007 (EDT)
==edit comments==

Someone removed my edit, but the water wheel actually only requires one square of water underneath it, not three. - Sludge Man

We could really use better pictures. The tileset in these screenshots is terrible, (lets use the default one) and they are very unclear. I do not understand how to build a working waterwheel after looking at this page.
==Perpetual motion again==
I removed the unclear example of a perpetual motion machine with a forum link to much clearer designs. We still need clear pictures and elaboration of the method of construction. I'll get around to it once I understand it myself, if no one beats me to it. --[[User:Turgid Bolk|Turgid Bolk]] 15:48, 5 November 2007 (EST)

: Sorry about the tilesets but I didn't think anyone would mind my custom one considering the only noticibly difference is the pump which looks like 2 barrels.
Although my screenshots were specifically for a perpetual motion machine which is why they lacked indepth wheel and pump construction.
I was hoping to create a video or some sort of tutorial to add in the construction section which dealt with creating waterwheels for someone who has absolutely no idea of any of the mechanics.

Also how reliable are the new designs?
I checked out that link and I previously toyed with designs similar to those and found them to be excellent power generators but not true perpetual motion machines, they all lost power intermittedly for varying lengths of time. --[[User:Lucid|Lucid]] 18:30, 5 November 2007 (EST)

== Perpendicular to water flow ==

Strange as it may sound, water wheels do 'not' need to be parallel to the water flow direction to work. [[User:VengefulDonut|VengefulDonut]] 16:31, 23 November 2007 (EST)
:This is as in real life - you can build a less efficient water wheel by putting the "buckets" at an angle - and indeed might put the "buckets" on a 360 degree pivot for some purposes.[[User:GarrieIrons|GarrieIrons]] 07:21, 8 January 2008 (EST)
===Water Flow Needed?===
::Actually there is no need for water flow at all. A water wheel seems to generate power even if it is built to a water body with no current (no "entry" or "exit" points). So basically the water wheel just needs to touch water and that's it. This is what I've noticed when confining a canal with floodgates at both ends. --[[User:Flaa|Flaa]] 07:47, 22 April 2008 (EDT)
:::This seems to have changed in a recent version. In previous versions you just had to connect a canal to a brook and the whole canal would count as 'flowing' even when nothing was moving. In my latest game this hasn't worked. So it's either changed, or the fact that I tried a 4-tile wide canal has stopped it working. --[[User:Juckto|Juckto]] 18:22, 10 May 2008 (EDT)

== Powering a Water Wheel ==

It seems that you can connect a Water Wheel to a Windmill, or other power source and cause it to spin - is there a purpose to doing this? can you move water along channels this way? What are the benefits? --[[User:SeiferTim|SeiferTim]] 12:47, 12 March 2008 (EDT)

::I think that it's because water wheels use power to run. Hence, they produce 100 power by themselves, but end up using 10 to spin, making the net power output only 90. Therefore, most likely the windmills provide that 10 power to the waterwheel. I don't think it does anything, but it does look cool.
--[[User:Umiman|Umiman]] 05:34, 27 May 2008 (EDT)

==Verify Carpenter==
Does the water wheel require carpentry to build?--[[User:Richards|Richards]] 04:11, 21 April 2008 (EDT)
:Yep--[[User:Dorten|Dorten]] 04:15, 21 April 2008 (EDT)
::Thanks Dorten.--[[User:Richards|Richards]] 04:26, 21 April 2008 (EDT)

==Minimum water level==
What is the minimum water level and flow required to power a waterwheel? --[[User:Sphexx|Sphexx]] 16:48, 27 May 2008 (EDT)

:1/7 water Hight. [[User:Hoborobo|Hoborobo]] 04:59, 8 June 2008 (EDT)-
::That doesn't sound correct to me... [[User:Juckto|Juckto]] 20:33, 14 June 2008 (EDT)

== Definition of "flow"? ==

The article states that waterwheels need flow under them, but how exactly does the game calculate this?

I was thinking that it means any water changing depth below it, but that would rule out building on a river/ocean full of 7/7 tiles. Will a waterwheel work on top of water full to the brim but supposedly "flowing" (i.e. ocean, full river)? [[User:G-Flex|G-Flex]] 8 June 2008 (EDT)

:I believe that right now a waterwheel will provide power as long as there is at least 4/7 water depth below it, or at least that is what has been the case in my experience, as I don't think a dead end channel would really provide any water flow yet a waterwheel will still provide power if place over one. --[[User:Elvang|Elvang]] 04:15, 8 June 2008 (EDT)

::Are you sure, though? Juckto (above) seems to believe the state of affairs is a bit more complicated. I guess I can just test it out for myself at some point. [[User:G-Flex|G-Flex]] 04:28, 8 June 2008 (EDT)

:::I'm sure about the minimum being 4/7, never had a waterwheel that would work below that level. Maybe it counts the water as flowing if the water depth changes during x ticks? If thats the case then a closed system would work unless you manage to get all the tiles at the same depth. I doubt the game uses a system much more complicated than that, as it would cause incredible lag checking each tile for depth, direction of flow, speed of flow, and path of least resistance. Not to mention factoring in water pressure and evaporation. Additionally, waterwheels seem to work no matter what their orientation is to the water. --[[User:Elvang|Elvang]] 04:37, 8 June 2008 (EDT)

::::Hrm, yeah, it seems like you need change of depth for it to count as "flow". Putting in the ocean just don't work.[[User:G-Flex|G-Flex]] 04:23, 16 June 2008 (EDT)

:::::Change of depth not needed. Putting it in a full river works. --[[User:Savok|Savok]] 22:47, 20 July 2008 (EDT)

== Construction Key? ==

The construction area needs a key. I can't figure out what the O is supposed to be, and I only use the ASCII version of DF.--[[User:RustyMcloon|Rusty Mcloon]] 11:19, 18 July 2008 (EDT)

:It is a vertical axle. You should know, since you play the pseudo-ASCII version. --[[User:Savok|Savok]] 22:47, 20 July 2008 (EDT)

== Two Quick Questions... ==

would water wheels be powered by water falling down a Z axis onto a waterwheel?

can a waterwheel be used in magma or would it burn?

--[[User:Althalus|Althalus]] 10:05, 9 August 2008 (EDT)

::Water wheels need to be placed in a channel with water to be powered. AFAIK the channel doesn't have to be any longer than the water wheel, doesn't need water coming in nor going out. The game isn't clever enough yet... (shhh!)
::I think the water has to be depth:3.
::Water wheels have to be made of wood. Any machine that has magma flow through it, if it isn't made of magma-safe material, will burn/melt. You might get a bit of power for a short time but the water wheel would burn (assuming temperature is turned on which it is by default).
::To sign your name properly use the signature button on the toolbar or type "~" four times: <nowiki>~~~~</nowiki> [[User:GarrieIrons|GarrieIrons]] 21:26, 8 August 2008 (EDT)

:::Waterwheels may not be magma-safe, but the actual structure of the wheel is built one z-level above the magma, rather than in it. Thus it is entirely plausible that a waterwheel could survive being used with magma. Whether it does actually survive such circumstances, and if so whether it starts turning, could do with being tested. --[[User:Raumkraut|Raumkraut]] 23:09, 8 August 2008 (EDT)

:Well i guess i will have to do my own experiments on magma wheels, i will report my findings.
--[[User:Althalus|Althalus]] 10:05, 9 August 2008 (EDT)

== Waterwheel on rivers ==
Yesterday I build a waterwheel above a river, it did not work. I build a second wheel in a moat channeled from the river it did work. Either I made some stupid error, or there is a bug at the current ver. that makes wheel not working on rivers themselves... --[[User:Catpaw|Catpaw]] 06:37, 29 August 2008 (EDT)