Dwarf Fortress Wiki - User contributions [en]

40d Talk:Sand

2009-07-05T02:45:33Z

Cerol The Elf Hunter: /* D for Dwarf */ new section

Sand seems to spread when I cut down trees. Any confirmation on this?
'''[[User:Finn A|Finn A]] 19:39, 30 March 2009 (UTC)'''

:Cutting down trees tends to cause heavy traffic as the woodcutters do their thing and haulers come to take the logs to a stockpile. Heavy traffic, in turn, kills the grass and reveals the underlying soil layer. If said soil layer is sand, then the traffic will reveal the sand. So it can ''look'' like cutting trees spreads the sand around. --[[User:LegacyCWAL|LegacyCWAL]] 21:46, 30 March 2009 (UTC)
::Aha, thanks. [[User:Finn A|Finn A]] 14:08, 31 March 2009 (UTC)

This seems a bit confusing. Is it possible to collect sand without bags? Without a glass furnace? What do you set to get your dwarves to do it?--[[User:Xazak|Xazak]] 17:56, 3 November 2007 (EDT)

:You can't collect sand without empty bags or a glass furnace. The command to gather sand is issued from the furnace itself.
:At least, that's how it was back in the last version-I doubt they changed it, though.
:[[User:Kefkakrazy|Kefkakrazy]] 18:37, 3 November 2007 (EDT)

::It hasn't changed. --[[User:Draco18s|Draco18s]] 19:41, 3 November 2007 (EDT)

== Absence of sand and moods ==

Are you screwed if a dwarf enters a mood, requires raw green glass, and there is no sand on the map? Presumably in such a situation you'd want to specify glass blocks from the traders ASAP. I just had a dwarf go berserk for want of green glass ... although he was a lowly hauler, so whatevs! [[User:Julius|Julius]] 14:37, 13 November 2007 (EST)

:So far, in all my fortresses, my dwarves never asked for something they could not find on the map for their moods. In my current fortress, I have a ''lot'' of items made of rock, wood, bone and leather... --[[User:Eagle of Fire|Eagle of Fire]] 20:16, 4 December 2007 (EST)

I have had a fort where there was no single sand at all...but after some years small squares of sand has appeard at places where my dwarf travels alot. Is it possblie that sand can be made? ([[User:Keilden|Keilden]] 06:20, 21 January 2008 (EST))

:I believe this is caused by the dwarves killing off the vegitation covering the sand. I don't think you can create sand in areas where there is something else underneath, such as silty loam.--[[User:Kingzilla|Kingzilla]] 19:03, 21 January 2008 (EST)

::It's easy to tell if a square has collectible sand or not. Simply designate a zone over a single square, and look to see if sand collection isn't a 0. --[[User:N9103|Edward]] 01:33, 22 January 2008 (EST)

Well those single squares have more then 0 in sand but they can't be collected.([[User:Keilden|Keilden]] 02:48, 22 January 2008 (EST))

:Then there's something else wrong, not a lack of sand. The raws determine the sand or not. I've gone and added sand to a map that originally didn't have any by adding the proper tag. If the zone says it's sand, then it's sand, and something else in the collection is the problem. --[[User:N9103|Edward]] 20:35, 22 January 2008 (EST)

== Types of sand for glassmaking ==

Are red, black, white and yellow the only types of sand available for glass production? [[User:Schm0|Schm0]] 20:13, 4 December 2007 (EST)

:Yes, as they are the only types of sand. (Loamy sand or whatever isn't really sand) --[[User:Karlito|Karlito]] 23:55, 4 December 2007 (EST)

::"(Loamy sand or whatever isn't really sand) --Karlito" Thank you for clearing that up! If you get time, would you add that to the Sand page? -- [[User:Holyfool|Holyfool]] 9:55, 21 March 2008 (EST)

Could we, perhaps, include a newbies guide to sand? Or rather, explain that just because a soil tile is "Sandy Clay" or what-not, that it's not enough, but you need "[Color] Sandy [Tile]?" [[User:Inoko|Inoko]] 22:16, 2 March 2009 (EST)
:If you want to write a guide to sand, go ahead. It is a wiki, after all ;). I think it would be easier to rewrite the second paragraph though, making it clearer that stuff like sandy clay isn't actually sand. --[[User:LegacyCWAL|LegacyCWAL]] 17:20, 3 March 2009 (EST)
::I updated it some, the second paragraph that is. I don't feel that "How to make bags" should really be there, but since the bag page doesn't have it yet, I left it. I think that this still needs work, but is much clearer. I would like to verify exactly which tiles you can draw sand from and which you can't, as well as how many dwarves can draw sand per furnace. Amusingly I've never had sand on a map I've played, which is why I asked in the first place. [[User:Inoko|Inoko]] 06:14, 4 March 2009 (EST)
:::I went ahead and fixed/verified the stuff you mention, and tried to clear it up a bit more. Geez this article is a mess, huh? ;) --[[User:LegacyCWAL|LegacyCWAL]] 12:54, 4 March 2009 (EST)
::::Not a mess... just a work in progress. ;) --[[User:Inoko|Inoko]] 16:25, 4 March 2009 (EST)

== digging for sand ==

In some forum there was mentioned that one may dig for sand near a river, in the sense that this might create some previously hidden areas of sand for bag-collecting. can this really be done? and how? --[[User:Koltom|Koltom]] 19:41, 3 March 2008 (EST)

:Just check to see if there's a sand deposit under the soil near the river. Sometimes you get lucky. You can check without digging there as well, just {{k|k}} over the banks under it. – [[template:unsigned|unsigned]] comment by [[User:Chrispy|Chrispy]]

::I don't think this is true, personally. Then again, I hardly ever embark on a river. Heh. --[[User:GreyMario|GreyMario]] 17:18, 22 April 2008 (EDT)

::: I'm not sure 'digging' is the right word - you may need to pump water for sand. I just found an underground pool with a sandy bottom on a map otherwise lacking in sand. Multi-level water pumping? Gee i'm glad i practiced building under the ocean not too long ago... --[[User:Squirrelloid|Squirrelloid]] 19:02, 22 April 2008 (EDT)

::: Yes it's true, I was shocked to discover a piece of black sand next to my undeground river and I know for a fact that there was otherwise no sand on this map because when I embarked I would've brought a glassmaker with me initially. --[[User:Gamli|Gamli]] 01:11, 21 November 2008 (PST)
::::THAT would be because towercaps change rock to soil when they grow. And sometimes it's sand --[[User:Dorten|Dorten]] 04:25, 21 November 2008 (EST)

== Is Sand Ever Available in Caravans? ==

Just wondering if I will never have it in this current fortress. --[[User:Ehertlein|Ehertlein]] 07:46, 22 August 2008 (EDT)

:Sadly, no. Caravans don't carry sand and it isn't available as something you can request. I expect Toady will eventually take care of it in an update, but for now you're out of luck. You shouldn't actually need it though since moods no longer require glass if you have none and have no way to make it on your map (no sand). --[[User:Janus|Janus]] 08:48, 22 August 2008 (EDT)

::Good to know. I was basically just interested in making some glass windows for an office. --[[User:Ehertlein|Ehertlein]] 09:45, 22 August 2008 (EDT)

:::If you don't mind cheating, you could either make your soil sand by raw editing. That's what I do, since finding a small site with sand + underground river + magma pipe + flux + chasm - aquifer - underground pool - cave - salt water is a bit difficult. --[[User:Savok|Savok]] 12:10, 22 August 2008 (EDT)

::::I'll work with what I have been given. I have a magma pipe and supposedly an underground river (if the site finder didn't lie to me) so I will work on building some sort of obsidian monstrosity if I get bored. I am too new to DF to worry too much about glass anyways! I can't even keep incoming caravans happy! :) --[[User:Ehertlein|Ehertlein]] 12:43, 22 August 2008 (EDT)

:::::You can always use gems to make windows. Those can potentially be quite a bit more valuable than glass ones anyway. --[[User:Janus|Janus]] 04:27, 23 August 2008 (EDT)

:: "You shouldn't actually need it though since moods no longer require glass if you have none and have no way to make it on your map": This may be true, but I know through bitter experience that nobles will request glass items on sandless maps. The Hammerer has not listened to my protests. :p --[[User:Ookpik|Ookpik]] 04:50, 12 October 2008 (EDT)

== Sand suddenly appeared ==

I'm on a map that had no sand (and I lost two glassmakers to strange moods because of it); suddenly after several years a large region of yellow sand is turning up near/in my farms, in areas that had formerly just been muddy gabbro/obsidian floor. It's almost exactly <s>5</s> 4 years since I first created these farms (and made the ground muddy), and the area has experienced a lot of traffic. Is this repeatable? Can any fort get sand if they wait long enough?--[[User:Maximus|Maximus]] 01:03, 12 October 2008 (EDT)

If a lot of dwarves travel over a square, it will eventually reveal its base layer, so only if your tiles are all based off sand. [[User:Destor|Destor]] 15:12, 12 October 2008 (EDT)

:It was carved-out gabbro, underground. Not sand at all... at first.--[[User:Maximus|Maximus]] 17:55, 12 October 2008 (EDT)
:Never been on a map that had sand underneath gabbro. When it's deep enough to be gabbro, I've always found rock all the way down from there. [[User:Corona688|Corona688]] 18:29, 12 October 2008 (EDT)

::[[Image:Aut 301 - gabbro.png|thumb|right|Muddy Gabbro Cavern Floor]]
[[Image:Aut 305 - sand.png|thumb|right|Four years later, same tile: Muddy Yellow sand Cavern Floor]]
::Okay, then, pics:
::I've got about 80 yellow sand tiles in this area now. You can see two of them directly (the yellow ≈s); most of them are Muddy Yellow sand Cavern Floors and appear as brown periods (just like the muddy gabbro floors). The water in the channel in the upper left is sourced from a brook with sandy clay loam walls, if that makes a difference... although sandy clay loam does not count as "sand" in the game.

::These tiles all started as regular gabbro or obsidian cavern floors, but have been muddy and heavily-trafficked for about four years. I also have a couple of "Muddy Silty clay cavern floors" in the area, which may be a transitional state before they turn to sand.

::I've never seen sand anywhere else on this map, not even on heavily-trafficked outdoor squares, including those by the brook. The site chooser mentioned a sandy clay loam layer but no sand.--[[User:Maximus|Maximus]] 03:59, 13 October 2008 (EDT)

Follow-up: the same thing happened in my "second" farm in this fortress (I moved everything to a different, more internal location.) I didn't actually bother to do any farming, however, since I had such a surplus from the first few years of farming. Tiles that have been muddy for about four years are starting to turn into yellow sand now. Since I've done no farming on these farms, it's clearly not something caused by heavy traffic.

I can't believe no one else has ever reported this though -- muddy stone floors turning into muddy sand after a space of four years is pretty dramatic. This farm was muddied by the cave river, not the "sandy clay loam"-lined brook, so the source of water doesn't seem to be a factor either.

Anyhow, sand, whoo. And this patch of it is adjacent to my magma kiln, even better. Been making terrariums and screw pumps with it.--[[User:Maximus|Maximus]] 01:23, 2 November 2008 (EDT)

:::Hmm, you can't have "glassmaker mood" if you don't have sand on your map. So the sand must be here from the beginning, but where ? I can't tell you. [[User:Timst|Timst]] 05:53, 2 November 2008 (EST)

::::In those cases, though, sand is already there, but hidden under grass or whatever. In this case, sand "showed up" in areas where nothing but underground stone had been. Again, I must express my astonishment that no one else has ever reported this. I never saw it in any of my prior fortresses, but I haven't played since 0.27.169.33e, so I figured Toady added it at some point between then and now. But plenty of people have been playing 40d. I gotta post on the forums to see what's going on. It can't be a bug. It happens in such a logical, deliberate way: after four years, tile by tile, muddied floors are turning into muddied sand tiles.--[[User:Maximus|Maximus]] 13:05, 2 November 2008 (EST)

::::A search of the forums turned up a handful of similar stories. So it's not a total fluke, but if it happened on every map, it would be well-known. I wonder what the underlying factors are? Muddy tiles + time seem to be an absolute minimum. Maybe a discovered cave river is needed too (due to the shrub/tree growth it triggers)?--[[User:Maximus|Maximus]] 14:50, 2 November 2008 (EST)

:::::And here I would tell the same: Underground river? ==> Tower caps grow. They chaange tile material to some (maybe random) soil. Sometimes sand. Happens all the time. In this example saplings appear, get stomped - reveal sand.--[[User:Dorten|Dorten]] 04:29, 21 November 2008 (EST)

::::::And yet, in a different location where I had mud, sand appeared where there was virtually no traffic for years. So I'm not sure stomping is a necessary part of the formula. Needs more testing.--[[User:Maximus|Maximus]] 12:50, 21 November 2008 (EST)

:::::::Plants will die on their own, too. I'm pretty sure a soil tile is exposed after a dead plant rots away, with the game choosing the type of soil based on biome. If it is near a cave river, this biome seems to be sand. I have a fort right now with tree farms both near the cave river and not. The ones near the river have sand, the one not near the river has silt. There's no mixing and both were made on stone floors; the type of stone doesn't seem to matter either. --[[User:Nillions|nil]]

== Modding ==

All mod content, it has been stated, should not appear in the regular articles.--[[User:Zchris13|Zchris13]] 20:09, 7 March 2009 (EST)

:AFAIK, it's been said once by a single person in the last few days. Feel free to correct me if I'm wrong.
:If you want to make such a claim, take it to the [[DwarfFortressWiki talk:Community Portal|community portal]]. I shall for you. --[[User:Savok|Savok]] 11:10, 8 March 2009 (EDT)

== Muddy granite turning into sandy loan ==
So I cant confirm sand yet, but i have granite turning into sandy loam (which is a layer that is present on my map anyway, as opposed to sand. --[[User:Birthright|Birthright]] 19:08, 26 June 2009 (UTC)
: As far as I know, sandy loam or any loam can't be use for glassmaking. It's a type of soil, but you can't use it even if there's the "sand"y in the name.--[[User:Karl|Karl]] 20:53, 26 June 2009 (UTC)

::Yes. My point is to check if sand 'proper' will indeed appear on a map where it was not present at all, if there is a progression from soil to sand and/or if there will appear only one type of soil per map - in 40d. --[[User:Birthright|Birthright]] 00:40, 27 June 2009 (UTC)

== D for Dwarf ==

I don't get why there is a D for Dwarf tag at the top of the page. I don't see any humor in the article at all .Unless there is some sort of hidden joke in it I don't think it should be there.--[[User:Cerol The Elf Hunter|Cerol The Elf Hunter]] 02:45, 5 July 2009 (UTC)

40d Talk:Challenges

2009-06-28T16:08:57Z

Cerol The Elf Hunter:

==Prison Complex==
The idea is to build a large detention centre for the Mountainhomes.
Your starting 7 are the only dwarves allowed as wardens (except immigrants already in the military) and should have military skills and some basic construction skills.
All immigrants are treated as prisoners, and should be met as soon as possible once they enter the map and shepherded into the prison.
The cells should be arranged on three or four z-levels and all cell doors on a row linked to a lever in a seperate guard-only area.
'New fish' entered into general population during the out-of-cell hours, then all prisoners locked up for the night.
Some prisoners are on food duties - farming and such - but all food for prisoners to be dished out in a canteen.
Prisoners may also work on crafting items for the guards to trade.
Ideally many of your inmates are going to lose the plot and start attacking other inmates, leading to riots and all sorts. Send in the dogs!

I'm sure there are other interesting additions to this concept, but my experience with large and especially themed fortresses is limited.
I'd love it if anyone could expand this, and maybe figure out how to control the prisoners, get them all to bed etc.
Also, this is my first post on these pages, so hope I'm doing it right. :)

==Colorful==
This is an idea I got by reading trough all the challenges, what if you make it a goal to have the fortress in the colour of the rainbow. (Example, 80x80 tile fortress, first 10 tiles are red, second 10 tiles are brown-orange, the third 10 are yellow and go on) --[[User:G1real|G1real]] 08:43, 27 June 2008 (EDT)

==Sparta==
"You shouldn't create chainmail or plate armour."
 why? --Savok
:because spartans don't wear chest armor. you should definately watch 300, it's like Dwarf Fortress on crack! --AlexFili
::from what I've read, 300 isn't an accurate depiction of Spartan life. However, this challenge build is based on 300 --Savok
:::Alright, fair point, 300 was based from a graphic novel, but many similarities between Spartans in 300 and in real history are present. --[[User:AlexFili|AlexFili]] 10:39, 9 June 2008 (EDT)
::::"However, this challenge build is based on 300" No it isn't. At least, it wasn't intended to be. I guess I shouldn't have referred to pop culture when I added it. --juckto
:::::The hell with it. Split off spartans from 300. [[User:Juckto|Juckto]] 16:55, 14 June 2008 (EDT)
::::::Not only did Spartans use chest armour (although in the form of bronze muscel cuirasses), but it was illegal and finable to fight without your armour. Theres one story of a Prince praying in Temple when some enemies attacked, he ran out naked and killed them, the Oligarchs awarded and praised him with one hand and then fined him with the other. Further specific Spartan attributes, the largely did not wear sandals except during war (don't want your feet to be soft and flabby, gotta make them rock-proof), Sparta itself didn't rely on walls (although they did use them [notably at the battle of the Hot Gates to keep the Persians from landing south of the gates] and the city did eventually make some). Theres also the complicated issue of their government, not sure how to replicate that, dual monarchy with the Kings having no real governmental powers and an oligarchy ruling at home. Maybe having a Legendary warrior lead each of two squads and having every position (Book Keeper, Mayor, Captain of the Guard even maybe) filled by a useless fat rich guy in a nice shiny house. I should also point out alot of their generals and kings were known for a love of gold and that 50% of the population being in the military is not very accurate, actual Spartan soldiers were vastly outnumbered by the Helots. --[[User:Lowlandlord|Lowlandlord]] 01:37, 31 July 2008 (EDT)
==No mining==
Now that you construct walls and fortifications out of wood, I wonder if anyone is going to take on a 'no mining' challenge? You're going to need a ''lot'' of wood! --[[User:Mechturk|Mechturk]] 17:00, 6 November 2007 (EST)

:Some people already are :p --[[User:Turgid Bolk|Turgid Bolk]] 17:44, 6 November 2007 (EST)

::I'm running a game with Elves as the playable civilization, a challenge on its own--The Forest Retreat of Inalamina is well into its ninth year, with a population of 220, and this is without mining ''or'' cutting down any trees. It's defended entirely by spearmen, swordsmen, and wrestlers, and the nobles/admins and wounded elves live happily in tree forts and lean-tos! Worth adding, maybe? I'd even consider writing an article for it... --[[User:Navian|Navian]] 10:23, 6 November 2008 (EST)

::: I am completely enthralled. I'd love to see it written up. Screenshots, the whole thing. --[[User:RomeoFalling|RomeoFalling]] 10:37, 6 November 2008 (EST)

::Oh, you mean for the game I'm running itself? I'd love to, but I can't seem to find what the rules for that are and I don't want to step on any toes by randomly creating a page. --[[User:Navian|Navian]] 10:48, 6 November 2008 (EST)

::: Either for the game itself, or a general essay sorta thing on the challenges and solutions for that kind of gameplay. As for the [[rules]], I don't know what you're talking about exactly. A wiki is a kind of anarchistic democracy. If you think it's worth putting up, you are free to put it up. If someone wants to take it down, they're free to do that too. – [[template:unsigned|unsigned]] comment by [[User:RomeoFalling|RomeoFalling]]

:::Put the writeup on your userpage, and if it can be broadened into something else, we'll move it into the mainspace.--[[User:Maximus|Maximus]] 23:09, 6 November 2008 (EST)

==Assassination==
I tried "Assassination" the other day and found that it was incredibly easy with a group of axedwarves. Not only did I kill the hardest-to-get-at goblin, I killed every last other goblin too. In the end, there were only 2 dogs and 2 dwarves dead (the last one fell, sadly, to the last goblin left, who was hiding in the tunnels.--[[User:Smoking Gnu|Smoking Gnu]] 22:51, 15 December 2007 (EST)

:Now do it with 7 untrained dwarves with no armor. --[[User:TheUbie|TheUbie]] 19:30, 29 December 2007 (EST)

::Mwa ha ha ha!--[[User:Jackrabbit|Jackrabbit]] 18:38, 11 December 2008 (EST)

::: How did you get it to work? I've tried starting with goblins and they are always "friendly" on the unit screen and so I can not attack them. Is there some trick to getting them hostile so you can do this sort of thing? 40d, by the way. --[[User:Kwieland|Kwieland]] 11:33, 18 February 2009 (EST)
::::Unless you're actually at war with the goblins, they'll always be 'friendly' when there's a tower nearby. Bug, I think. --22:57, 17 May 2009 (UTC)

== Humanlike? ==
It should be noted that the 'human-like fortress' as described is historically inaccurate. In particular, its either misrepresenting or confusing various details. One major point is that a _castle_ never incorporated a town. There are walled towns and there are castles, but these are entirely different things. A couple of historical periods/styles would lead to the following different suggestions:

(A) Larger (stone) medieval castles sometimes had industry in the bailey. This was often pressed up against the outer wall to save on space and wall building. It was usually militarily useful industry (ie, metalsmithing of various types). Cooking and possibly brewing might also happen, and cooking at least would have been handled in the keep itself. Industries including jewelry, carpentry (on a permanent basis), and other non-military production would have been outside the castle, quite possibly in a town nearby.

(B) More isolated smaller castles would have done necessary production in the bailey on a temporary basis (ie, erecting a carpentry work area when needed and disassembling it afterwards), with a few permanent industries (notably blacksmithing).

(C) 'Dark Ages' castles would be made of wood, and weren't large enough to accomodate much industry. Instead they would have imported everything. The early castle was a defensible home for the lord and his family, and would only house them and a few military retainers.

It should be noted that the lack of focus on industry in a castle meant diverse tasks might share the same workspace and in fact be handled by the same person. The purpose of a castle is military, not production, and castle's only produced goods for internal demand that either could not be imported, would be inconvenient to import, or were critical to the military purpose (and couldn't afford access to those goods being lost during a siege).

(D) A walled town would have no keep. Nobles would not live there. Basically, towns would build a wall around their perimeter for defense. More important towns often grew to encompass nearby castles, and often outgrew their walls - which might either lead to substantial portions beyond the walls or accruing walls occasionally to encompass new growth. Despite a castle potentially being encompassed by a town, the castle and town were administratively separate - towns receiving independent charters from the crown - and the town was never subject to the lord of the castle (who may well control the surrounding countryside).

Given the nature of Dwarf Fortress, treating it as a town rather than a castle is probably preferable unless you really want to emphasize military skills, which could be interesting. You could, of course, create a castle and a town, keeping them as virtually separate entities, with military dwarves and nobles living in the castle and other dwarves living in the town.

--[[User:Squirrelloid|Squirrelloid]] 18:11, 30 April 2008 (EDT)

:When did we start trying to make DF fit real-world history?
:His idea seems perfectly fine when compared to in-game human towns/cities, as they have a keep and whatnot as part of the city. Only difference is adding a wall around it all. --[[User:N9103|Edward]] 18:25, 30 April 2008 (EDT)

== Insane Renegade (just a thought) ==

Well I was thinking something along these lines,

They all think that your crazy, so you and some others ran. You shouldn't trust them... They want you dead. Except for the (random profession/job) they think like you. KILL THEM KILL ALL THAT OPPOSE YOU!!,

Description:
Xenophobia, Do not trade with others, Kill all immigrants except ones of a certain job/profession. If you want to go as a truly insane person, ban all statues and engravings of Dwarven faces (the statues, THE ROCKS! THEY ALL WANT ME DEAD!!!!) Be prepared for a long life of hatred and sieges.

P.S. if anyone edits this and puts it on the main thing please give me partial credit... Thank you and goodnight! – [[template:unsigned|unsigned]] comment by [[User:LrZeph|LrZeph]]

:How is this different from [[Challenges#Outcast|Outcast]], aside from the RP? --[[User:Savok|Savok]] 16:41, 22 June 2008 (EDT)

::Oh dear, i missed that one. never mind – [[template:unsigned|unsigned]] comment by [[User:LrZeph|LrZeph]]

== Dystopian society ==

Anyone thought of making a fortress based off one of those dystopian futures found in scifi novels like 1984, We, Brave New World, and Fahrenheit 451? The way I imagine it, it would be similar to the Equaland challenge, with variations based on the dystopian principle of your choice. For example, if you want to encourage uniformity across your population, enable all labor for every dwarf and persecute anyone who skills up too quickly at a given skill. A strict caste system might also be implementable, a la Brave New World. Another idea would be to kill off or at least "re-educate" any dwarf that falls below ecstatic for an extended period of time. Tons of ideas at {{wiki|Dystopia}}. Thoughts? --[[User:Mikaka|Mikaka]] 04:56, 24 June 2008 (EDT)

:That sounds like a good challenge. --[[User:Savok|Savok]] 08:24, 24 June 2008 (EDT)

== Underwater Building ==

I've decided to take on the underwater building challenge, and have started Migrurmestthos, The Ocean-Citadel. But ah... I can't for the live of me figure out how I'm going to get glass blocks to the bottom of the ocean. Any ideas? --[[User:Anfini|Anfini]] 20:36, 19 July 2008 (EDT) 
''P.S.: I've altered the creature tokens and set my Dwarves to Aquatic.''

:I recommend either
:#Don't build it in the ocean.
:#Use pumping to pump a large area of the top level of the ocean out. Do the same with a slightly smaller area one level down. Repeat as desired.
:#Pump the ocean out, build, then let it flow back in. This is like the above, but with the whole visible ocean. --[[User:Savok|Savok]] 22:45, 20 July 2008 (EDT)

:::Oookay, okay. I have single-handedly diverted the courses of raging rapids to give my children something to drink, harnessed the power of lava, and built towers of glass. However, I cannot help but approach the idea of pumping out '''the entire ocean''' with a bit of skepticism. Is this ''really'' possible? --[[User:Anfini|Anfini]] 22:53, 21 July 2008 (EDT)

::::Aye, it is. Aside from waves, the "entire" ocean is really, due to map limitations, just a large, fast-refilling lake. If you build a ring of pumps properly, you should be able to clear the water from a section, which can be as large as your fortress map. --[[User:Savok|Savok]] 02:34, 23 July 2008 (EDT)

::::: I've personally been using 'canals' in my fortress for quite a while, and what I do is simply allocate nobles' rooms along the side of the canal, and before flooding the waterway, I dig into it and build glass windows and blocks so the nobles can watch the fish swim by. I doubt it actually raises the room value by any more than the glass windows' base value, but I like the effect. This isn't really an "underwater city" per se, but it's born of the same concept. --[[User:Eddie|Eddie]] 07:45, 26 July 2008 (EDT)

:Check out [[User:Squirrelloid/Under the Sea]], then note that I haven't quite tested any of the possible methods yet. I'm about ready to turn on the magma tap and see if I can create an obsidian stalagmite with successive bursts of magma followed by channelling - that may provide a way to build stairs down through and assemble a mass pump appartus - yes, this is going to be a lot of work. Its took 6 years of game time to get to the point where I was ready and able to do a trial run - admittedly, it wasn't the only thing I was focused on. --[[User:Squirrelloid|Squirrelloid]] 12:28, 19 November 2008 (EST)

== Dwarf Factory ==

--[[User:Bilkinson|Bilkinson]] 18:12, 28 August 2008 (EDT)
Looking to develop this callenge concept:

Your fortress is a highly specialized industrial complex. Select one item, or very narrow category of items. (ie Flour, Scepters, Shoes, Silk Bags, Crossbow Bolts) This is your factory's product. You must produce as much of it as possible, and it may only be used for export to any any and all caravans which visit your factory. Set up shift schedules, assign massive teams of dwarves (or even all of them!) to your core product, and generally devote your fort to maximizing output.

Variants: 
Assembly line - Each Dwarf is assigned a single stage of the production cycle, this is their only labour. Workshops should be grouped togeather by type, ordered based on the production cycle and grouped with relevant stockpiles. 
Communal - Every Dwarf has every relevant labour enabled, in addition to whatever else they do for the fort. 
High Management - For each Task in your production, appoint a department head. As the number of workers in each department grows, start appointing shift managers. As your factory expands in size, appoint reigonal coordinators and quality control bureaus. Cap this off with a board of directors and a CEO. None of these dwarves do anything but fill noble slots and build social skills. 
Prison/Work Camp - Noble dwarves do not contribute to labour. Max the fortress/royal Guard at all times and draft 20% of the population into the army. The remaining dwarves are prisoners who must produce output. Build walls, rig traps, and make an example of anyone who fails to meet their quota. 
People's Glorious Five-Year Plan - As above, but arrive with no skilled workers, rig all facilities with self destructs and kill switches, and only arm one in ten of your soldiers. 

Bonus: Only produce things vital to the survival of your workers, or directly involved in making your product. Anything else must be imported. 
Further Bonus: Produce only your final product, all raw materials must be imported. spend the surplus on anything else you may need.

How's it sound?

== Luxurious Tomb ==

Build an extravagant mausoleum for your entire dwarf community. Make it multi-leveled, make it a pyramid, make it out of glass if you want - but it must serve no other purpose than to be a dying place, and must not be accessed for any purpose other than to build it. Add a few decorations here and there, statues, tables, and a whole lot of coffins to house everyone.

Once it's complete, turn your fortress into a ghost town. Remove the designation of all your stockpiles. Forbid all the workshops and forbid access to the different areas of the fort as they get deserted to limit dwarf movement. Lure everyone into the tomb, seal the entrance from the inside and watch everyone die inside their new mausoleum. The tomb should be designed such that the initial entry point cannot easily be guessed (i.e.: The entrance should be sealed using a wall or some other solid structure - not via a door you just mark forbidden.

BONUS: make access to the tomb difficult or impossible, either by causing a cave-in in the tunnel that leads towards it, or by flooding the surrounding area in water or magma.

BONUS #2: Build the tomb over a chasm. Find a way to drop the whole tomb-building into it once everyone's inside.

:Suggestion: DON'T build it over a chasm; build it over a very large pit (deep enough to be called a 'chasm' by some) and make a set of ramps that lead down to the bottom. 1x2 setup; that is:
^^
^^
^^
^^
^^
^^
..
That is, up ramps, turn on normal flooring, then continue back up in the opposite direction. So a dwarf would travel in this path:
VV
VV
VV
VV
VV
VV
>^
:They'd come down the left ramp, turn left twice, and go down via the right ramp. Then they'd take two more lefts, and go down the left ramp, etc..
:Just a neat little suggestion that's way too complicated, but'd look nice...also, {{k|V}} is a ramp; {{k|^}} is not.
:I can't wait to try this out, then watch the temple I build go down, down, down, and '''SMASH'''--then use the ramps alongside it to view (and plunder, of course--it IS a tomb in adventure mode) it.
:Oh, and just a Z-level view:
| /
| /
| /
|/
|\
| \
| \
| \
:Or:
| /
| /
| /
|/___
| /
| /
| /
|/___
:Etc.. ~ [[User:Midna|Midna]] 23:45, 25 October 2008 (EDT)

== Agoraphobia ==

Your dwarves are absolutely terrified of the great outdoors, ([[carp|and]] [[Elephant|with]] [[Giant eagle|good]] [[undead|reason]] and want nothing more than to be nestled tightly in the "[[Giant Cave Spider|relative]] [[Pit|saftey]]" of the underground. Upon arrival, immediately burrow into the ground and haul all your supplies out of the sun's glare, and then never set foot on the surface again. Also, to help reduce anxiety, have no single chamber larger than 5x5, and let no hall stretch farther than 5 tiles between doors.--[[User:Bilkinson|Bilkinson]] 11:42, 15 September 2008 (EDT)

== <insert material> Fort....wait, what? ==

Ok, now I can understand a glass fort...and I can understand making it all outside, but how does one build it under water? Can someone please tell me how to do this so I can try to create my own Dwarven SeaLab? [[User:Alkyon|Alkyon]] 05:58, 17 October 2008 (EDT)
:I believe its either done via pump rings (enough screw pumps can hollow out sections of the ocean long enough to build something to hold the water back), or in a cold enough seasonal environment, only doing construction during the winter. [[User:HeWhoIsPale|HeWhoIsPale]] 08:44, 17 October 2008 (EDT)
:: The third option would be building the fort, and then making a lake around it. --[[User:Bilkinson|Bilkinson]] 08:51, 17 October 2008 (EDT)
::The real trick with building enough screw pumps is in water deeper than 1 z-level you need to find a way to build down - you cannot hang down staircases off sides like you can up staircases. I'm attempting to pump magma to form an obsidian sheen - tunnel down through it and channel a hole, pump more magma, and so on. I'll let people know how it works... --[[User:Squirrelloid|Squirrelloid]] 12:41, 19 November 2008 (EST)
:::So I've heard. Have you tried just carving a staircase along the underwater cliff on your game? I hope to see, or at least hear, the results of your work. As for me, I'm trying this challenge the other way around: Turn a hilly desert map into a massive glass aquarium, with my dwarves living the good life inside. --[[User:Alkyon|Alkyon]] 13:41, 19 November 2008 (EST)
:::::Well, my goal was to build a free-standing structure in 15 z-levels of water, so yes, if there is a convenient cliff it works, but that limits you to cliffs which start 1 z-level below water. As all my really deep water areas aren't even close to being accessible in that way, its not even an option. --[[User:Squirrelloid|Squirrelloid]] 19:34, 19 November 2008 (EST)

::::To me, the solution that comes to mind is to place a weapon rack on a narrow causeway and get recruits to wrestle until one punts another into the abyss. The lucky winner gets to build the up staircase. Getting materials below is easy, you can just build something and deconstruct it, among other more elaborate means. --[[User:Navian|Navian]] 17:41, 19 November 2008 (EST)

:::::That only works if its only 2 z-levels down, because otherwise the dwarf falls into deeper water and drowns... and as 2 z-levels is boring... --[[User:Squirrelloid|Squirrelloid]] 19:34, 19 November 2008 (EST)

==Genesis==
Kill all but two of your starting dwarves off (one male and one female). Seal them in your fortress (no trading). Repopulate the earth. Measure of success is based on number of children before the fortress dies. Thoughts?
--[[User:Squirrelloid|Squirrelloid]] 05:12, 22 November 2008 (EST)

:How reliably can you get them to mate?--[[User:Maximus|Maximus]] 16:57, 22 November 2008 (EST)

:: Tried this out - 3 years in and not even lovers yet. Ick. So, here's the problem: you really want two dwarves who won't start as friends with many other people (although each other is ok), and who can handle stress and aren't quick to anger. Because of course your first hurdle is going to be surviving the unhappiness generated by killing off everyone else. (You may just want to build some coffins early just in case). Unfortunately, the embark screen view mode won't let you see who they're friends with before embarking, so if you want to assign just two of them skills you're making guesses based solely on their personality traits as two which dwarves will be compatible and likely to survive the initial culling. After that you then need to reduce your job queue to almost nothing and basically lock them in the same room together so they spend their time talking - because you've already chosen otherwise self-reliant and anti-social dwarves.

::Some evidence on the Relationships talk page suggests giving some social skills to your dwarves may increase the rate at which they progress to friends/lovers.

::My first attempt was a Carpenter 5/Cook 5 and a Mason 5/Grower 5... I might have to revise that to Mason 5/Grower 3/Something social 2 and Carpenter 4/Cook 4/something social 2 - but carpenter and mason are going to be important for generating happy thoughts.

::Apparently setting the .init file to a max of 2 dwarves doesn't stop immigrants from coming - which is annoying because I really don't want to keep killing them off, and they keep stealing my moods. (Yes, i put a stone stockpile outside so the immigrants can build their own deathtrap over the lava vent). I do recommend playing on an island so you only have to deal with not going outside for the dwarf caravan each year. And the liaison will happily join your migrants on the death trap if you make it a meeting area.

::--[[User:Squirrelloid|Squirrelloid]] 10:18, 23 November 2008 (EST)

:::It's all a matter of compatibility. Dwarves actually don't start out friends, they just make them almost instantly at the start (and can make grudges here, too. I had one who had a very low sense of adventure while everyone else had high, and five of the seven had grudges with her.) To become lovers and get married requires a very, very high compatibility--whatever that means. It seems that some dwarves never upgrade from lovers to married, either, perhaps due to being not compatible enough, but being faced with a lack of programming to handle breakups. (I'll leave that one to the playwrights.) Getting this challenge to work is probably more than half the challenge! --[[User:Navian|Navian]] 11:29, 23 November 2008 (EST)

:::Do social skills make dwarves more likely to make friends, or does being friendly make dwarves more likely to gain social skills? Instead of focusing on social skills, you might need to pick dwarves with a lot of friendly traits (or even compatible traits, like Navian suggests). You can check their personalities before setting out -- if you don't see compatible traits, scrap it and start building another party.

:::For happiness, build several native gold (i.e., masonry) statues and put them in their bedrooms -- that will dwarf (ahem) the bonus you will get from the bed itself being high-quality. You can potentially skip carpentry altogether.

:::For them to actually form a relationship, you might need to give them idle time, during which they will socialize.

:::To keep other dwarves away, you could try putting a moat around the entire perimeter of the map (better still, a magma moat). This worked with the 2D version, but with finite quantities of fluid in the 3D version, it might not work anymore. But if you do want to try, put a wall as close to the edge of the map as it allows you, and flood everything outside it. Have the sacrificial five (and all immigrants) work on that.

:::Supposedly you won't get moods at all in a fortress with less than 20 dwarves. You also won't get moods if you haven't produced enough goods or revealed enough tiles through mining (see [[strange mood]]).--[[User:Maximus|Maximus]] 12:30, 23 November 2008 (EST)

:Is there a way to disable other dwarf civilizations from existing? I've been looking around world generation and stuff but I can't seem to find a way to do so. Closest I found is making minimum savagery 66 but it rejects the worlds without Dwarfs it seems. --[[User:Doodle|Doodle]] 14:14, 17 May 2009 (UTC)

==Noblesse requis==

Build your fortress to please the sick, twisted, evil nobles needs. Build a execution chamber for your rowdy dwarves and build a torture chamber for your dungeon master, using your imagination! Use this to punish pathetic dwarves who dare rebel. Build palaces for your nobles and pamper them in every way. Pour most of your resources into a beautiful place for nobles to live whilst letting your dwarves sleep in tiny, pathetic rooms. The only exception is your mayor, who rises from the rank of the disgusting peons. He must live in squalor as well, preferably next to noble rooms to so the nobles can taunt him. score yourself according to how happy your nobles are, and your worth. Evil. And fun! can I add this to the main page? --[[User:Jackrabbit|Jackrabbit]] 03:04, 11 December 2008 (EST)

:Sure – it's a wiki, after all. You can edit the pages yourself!
:Also, is that really what [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Noblesse_oblige Noblesse/noblis oblige] means? --[[User:Savok|Savok]] 10:55, 11 December 2008 (EST)
::Nope, just sounds good. I was hoping nobody would look it up. Maybe I'll change the name. Also, I'm new to wikis in general so I don't really know how everything works, desipte making this profile about a year ago. Thanks!--[[User:Jackrabbit|Jackrabbit]] 18:26, 11 December 2008 (EST)
:::Okay, changed it to Noble demand. Thanks!--[[User:Jackrabbit|Jackrabbit]] 18:30, 11 December 2008 (EST)

== Magma/Lava Waterfall ==

Would creating a sustainable magmafall, or one that can be triggered as part of a defense system, be considered a challenge? Or is it more of a Stupid Dwarf Trick? I'm just curious because one has to take into account building the thing, making sure it won't set your dwarves on fire, and where to put the excess magma/lava since you can't really just pump it back into the magma pipe without some sort of massive and elaborate pump system. (Oh wow, I feel stupid. I created a new subject and forgot to sign it for at least two days.) --[[User:Alkyon|Alkyon]] 20:26, 10 January 2009 (EST)

:I'm inclined to declare it a SDT, due to the overly dangerous side effects. But then... I'd also call half the challenges SDTs too. I think that if the side effects are more dangerous than the intended effect, it's no longer a challenge, but something some random (insane) dwarf felt needed to be done. To put it in perspective, there's few cases where a 20-dwarf squad can't handle an entire siege, with or without fortifications and traps. Give them those, and they can handle all the siegers rushing and arriving at the same time. Even if you never have any mistakes during the construction of the magma-defenses (and that's a rare thing) then you could easily lose more than 20 in the first siege alone from dwarves trying to gather dropped goods. It's also almost useless against any other defenses (thieves & ambushes) since you'll have little, if any forewarning that you need to clear the area and throw the switch.
:On the other side of the fence, if you're particularly interested in making this, you should do the little things, like making a near-exact count of how much lava you'll need to let flow, to both keep all tiles where it will settle to less than 2/7 (since then it would never evaporate, the best cleaning method) and how to direct the flow so that it covers the path, but doesn't flow to other areas you didn't intend. --[[User:N9103|Edward]] 15:38, 11 January 2009 (EST)

::Well, it doesn't have to be part of a defense system, one could just have massive magma waterfalls lining their entrance. Though I have to say from experience that the hardest part is drainage. Creating a massive magma cistern is one thing, it just takes some pumps and construction, but getting the stuff to not backup on the way to the disposal chasm and therefore not flood your fortress is a bit more complex than it first seems.--[[User:Alkyon|Alkyon]] 11:13, 12 January 2009 (EST)

:::Which is why it's great building your fort into the the ledge a few levels over a Magma Pipe ;) --[[User:N9103|Edward]] 21:01, 12 January 2009 (EST)

::::Hmm, that would be one way to do it, too bad I can't search for maps with that specific of a terrain set. Anyways, there has to be a way to spill off at least some of the magma as the magma pipes fill slowly but constantly from the bottom. Also, I learned from my failed experiment that Coke roads + magma spillover = road of fire. Unusable except for turning your fortress into Mordor, which is awesome in it's own way. --[[User:Alkyon|Alkyon]] 21:29, 12 January 2009 (EST)

:::::LOL, yes, I saw that and was thinking something along the lines of Mordor myself ;) As for spill over, the magma tends to flow off to the side off the top of the magma pipe where I'm at, resulting in a net loss to evaporation, so I just turn it off for a season once or twice a year. As for finding a magma pipe that's exposed *and* sunken, to provide atleast one level of inaccessible floor around the pipe, I'd look in the mountains, where you've got many many levels of elevation. Or atleast, that's what my map looks like (50+ levels) with the majority of the map being mountain tiles, and one corner (of a 2x4 map) being desert. It had two * listed in the height map, '''''but no chasm''''', so that could help to find one. --[[User:N9103|Edward]] 23:35, 14 January 2009 (EST)

:Or, how about a dual water/magma waterfall, meeting on the road leading in? Encase your enemies in carbonite, err, obsidian. [[User:Random|Random]] 20:31, 15 January 2009 (EST)

== "Real time" challenge talk ==

1) As mentioned in the challenge, opening any menu pauses the game

2) "You have struck Alunite!" Anyone else get this message and a pause every 5 minutes?

If you were to keep the game running while you slept -- and trust me, I have -- all it takes is one minor inconvenience of the legion the game contains to pause it. I set the game to keep running before I went to bed one night, and between doing that and going to brush my teeth, it paused. I resumed, lay down in bed, and not a minute later, I opened my eyes to see the game had paused ''again.'' Too much stuff causes the game to pause to really execute this without constant babying.

Overall, I don't see this challenge as being feasible. Not bad in theory, but impossible in practice. --[[User:Eddie|Eddie]] 06:15, 16 January 2009 (EST)

:Yes, thats true. That challenge would require either a new version where pausing-for-announcements can be disabled or a helper program to automatically acknowledge them and unpause the game. [[User:Random|Random]] 20:54, 16 January 2009 (EST)

== Hermit Challenge ==

Does anyone have any tips for not having any damn migrants? The carps can't eat everyone.
: Well, you can just kill them all. Atom smasher, lava, water, goblin siege, choose your way to kill them. Even random ballista bolt could do the trick! Bonus point for the creative part !? :D [[User:Karl|Karl]] 19:45, 21 January 2009 (EST)
::Well, if the problem gets too extreme, you can adjust your maximum population to 1 in the ini files, and see if that works...--[[User:Quil|Quil]] 20:43, 21 January 2009 (EST)
::: It doesn't work. The POPULATION_CAP seems bugged something awful. [[User:AbuDhabi|AbuDhabi]] 02:36, 23 January 2009 (EST)

== The Great Wall of [Kingdom] ==

Here's an interesting challenge:

Your kingdom needs a great impenetrable defense to protect against your goblin enemies. You have been assigned to build a giant wall!

The wall must stretch from one side to the opposite, have a height of 5 z-axis, be four tiles wide complete with gate(s), towers, fortifications, ballistas and catapults. You must also position a crossbowdwarf at every ten tiles.

* BONUS: Build it right next to a goblin lair.
* BONUS: Build it all using only wood.
* BONUS++: Build it all using only soap!

[[User:Myroc|Myroc]] 15:16, 22 January 2009 (EST)

:This wouldn't work due to the fact that you can't build walls (among other things) too close to the edge. At best, it would have to start six tiles in on both sides. However, you could implement an existing hill/mountain to "assist" with the completion of the wall.
:[[User:Nocash|Nocash]] 18:30, 24 January 2009 (EST)

::Ah, good point. I kinda forgot about that. [[User:Myroc|Myroc]] 05:50, 25 January 2009 (EST)

:::You could use raised bridges at the ends, they can be built right up to the edges. --[[User:Torasin|Torasin]] 13:25, 25 January 2009 (EST)

== Pave the World? ==

If one where to flood the world with magma, then flood it with water, you would be left with a solid block of obsidian, am I right? (along with ALOT of steam.) Bonus for paving the elves. --[[User:Zchris13|Zchris13]] 18:13, 7 April 2009 (UTC)

Unfortunately, Unless you time it right, you will get one flat layer of obsidian with all the water under it; the obsidian doesn't jump straight to the bottom. [[User:Sensei|Sensei: Last seen somewhere in the Basic Jungle of Terror]] 17:26, 16 May 2009 (UTC)

:So if the water reaches the edge, and it drains, you're left with a layer of obsidian sitting on air? I can't really think of a use for something like that, but it sounds incredibly awesome anyway. --[[User:Smartmo|Smartmo]] 19:03, 16 May 2009 (UTC)

== Rewrite ==
Alright, this article is getting way too messy. 60 top-level items is more than most talk pages, many of them overlap each other, the ones involving goblin forts are out of date (as local goblins are automatically friendly as of 40d) and some of them just plain aren't challenges.

For now I've split them up into three broad categories, and I plan to weed out redundant/wrong bits and streamline the whole thing while still hopefully preserving some of the "flavor text". [[User:Walliard|Walliard]] 04:06, 14 April 2009 (UTC)

== College ==
A center for enlighted craftsmanship studying and teaching. There should be auditoriums for each workshop type lined with chairs and a few lecture rooms with ascending rows of chairs where nobles rant to the peasants how lesser they are and to teach them manners. A canteen and dorms will also be needed.

Minor bonus: auditoriums are designated as meeting halls and have balconies and floor hatches on the ceiling to allow best studying with illuminated stages. 
Minor bonus: Hold keger parties each night. 
Bonus: Do not make co-ed dorms; married couples can rent a small apartment from nearby study houses. 
Bonus +: Engligthen other races. 
Ultimate bonus: Englighten orcs, goblins and other less friendly creatures. -[[User:Karpatius|Karp]] 08:00, 6 May 2009 (UTC)
: How does one "enlighten" other races? [[User:Lymojo|Lymojo]] 21:38, 13 May 2009 (UTC)Lymojo

== Water Park challange ==

Try to make a bunch of pools and somehow keep the water level always at 4/7 so they wont drown. Then set the pools as meeting areas so all of your dwarves will go there and eventually everyone will be legendary swimmers

bonus: somehow make waterslides

bonus: make it outside so your dwarves will be tan

bonus: pave it with gold

bonus: make a sauna using steam from lava and water colliding

how does this sound as a challenge. If you can get it to work all of your peasants will get stats from the swimming skill making them easier to train in something useful.--[[User:Cerol The Elf Hunter|Cerol The Elf Hunter]] 16:08, 28 June 2009 (UTC)

40d Talk:Challenges

2009-06-28T16:08:02Z

Cerol The Elf Hunter: /* Water Park challange */ new section

==Prison Complex==
The idea is to build a large detention centre for the Mountainhomes.
Your starting 7 are the only dwarves allowed as wardens (except immigrants already in the military) and should have military skills and some basic construction skills.
All immigrants are treated as prisoners, and should be met as soon as possible once they enter the map and shepherded into the prison.
The cells should be arranged on three or four z-levels and all cell doors on a row linked to a lever in a seperate guard-only area.
'New fish' entered into general population during the out-of-cell hours, then all prisoners locked up for the night.
Some prisoners are on food duties - farming and such - but all food for prisoners to be dished out in a canteen.
Prisoners may also work on crafting items for the guards to trade.
Ideally many of your inmates are going to lose the plot and start attacking other inmates, leading to riots and all sorts. Send in the dogs!

I'm sure there are other interesting additions to this concept, but my experience with large and especially themed fortresses is limited.
I'd love it if anyone could expand this, and maybe figure out how to control the prisoners, get them all to bed etc.
Also, this is my first post on these pages, so hope I'm doing it right. :)

==Colorful==
This is an idea I got by reading trough all the challenges, what if you make it a goal to have the fortress in the colour of the rainbow. (Example, 80x80 tile fortress, first 10 tiles are red, second 10 tiles are brown-orange, the third 10 are yellow and go on) --[[User:G1real|G1real]] 08:43, 27 June 2008 (EDT)

==Sparta==
"You shouldn't create chainmail or plate armour."
 why? --Savok
:because spartans don't wear chest armor. you should definately watch 300, it's like Dwarf Fortress on crack! --AlexFili
::from what I've read, 300 isn't an accurate depiction of Spartan life. However, this challenge build is based on 300 --Savok
:::Alright, fair point, 300 was based from a graphic novel, but many similarities between Spartans in 300 and in real history are present. --[[User:AlexFili|AlexFili]] 10:39, 9 June 2008 (EDT)
::::"However, this challenge build is based on 300" No it isn't. At least, it wasn't intended to be. I guess I shouldn't have referred to pop culture when I added it. --juckto
:::::The hell with it. Split off spartans from 300. [[User:Juckto|Juckto]] 16:55, 14 June 2008 (EDT)
::::::Not only did Spartans use chest armour (although in the form of bronze muscel cuirasses), but it was illegal and finable to fight without your armour. Theres one story of a Prince praying in Temple when some enemies attacked, he ran out naked and killed them, the Oligarchs awarded and praised him with one hand and then fined him with the other. Further specific Spartan attributes, the largely did not wear sandals except during war (don't want your feet to be soft and flabby, gotta make them rock-proof), Sparta itself didn't rely on walls (although they did use them [notably at the battle of the Hot Gates to keep the Persians from landing south of the gates] and the city did eventually make some). Theres also the complicated issue of their government, not sure how to replicate that, dual monarchy with the Kings having no real governmental powers and an oligarchy ruling at home. Maybe having a Legendary warrior lead each of two squads and having every position (Book Keeper, Mayor, Captain of the Guard even maybe) filled by a useless fat rich guy in a nice shiny house. I should also point out alot of their generals and kings were known for a love of gold and that 50% of the population being in the military is not very accurate, actual Spartan soldiers were vastly outnumbered by the Helots. --[[User:Lowlandlord|Lowlandlord]] 01:37, 31 July 2008 (EDT)
==No mining==
Now that you construct walls and fortifications out of wood, I wonder if anyone is going to take on a 'no mining' challenge? You're going to need a ''lot'' of wood! --[[User:Mechturk|Mechturk]] 17:00, 6 November 2007 (EST)

:Some people already are :p --[[User:Turgid Bolk|Turgid Bolk]] 17:44, 6 November 2007 (EST)

::I'm running a game with Elves as the playable civilization, a challenge on its own--The Forest Retreat of Inalamina is well into its ninth year, with a population of 220, and this is without mining ''or'' cutting down any trees. It's defended entirely by spearmen, swordsmen, and wrestlers, and the nobles/admins and wounded elves live happily in tree forts and lean-tos! Worth adding, maybe? I'd even consider writing an article for it... --[[User:Navian|Navian]] 10:23, 6 November 2008 (EST)

::: I am completely enthralled. I'd love to see it written up. Screenshots, the whole thing. --[[User:RomeoFalling|RomeoFalling]] 10:37, 6 November 2008 (EST)

::Oh, you mean for the game I'm running itself? I'd love to, but I can't seem to find what the rules for that are and I don't want to step on any toes by randomly creating a page. --[[User:Navian|Navian]] 10:48, 6 November 2008 (EST)

::: Either for the game itself, or a general essay sorta thing on the challenges and solutions for that kind of gameplay. As for the [[rules]], I don't know what you're talking about exactly. A wiki is a kind of anarchistic democracy. If you think it's worth putting up, you are free to put it up. If someone wants to take it down, they're free to do that too. – [[template:unsigned|unsigned]] comment by [[User:RomeoFalling|RomeoFalling]]

:::Put the writeup on your userpage, and if it can be broadened into something else, we'll move it into the mainspace.--[[User:Maximus|Maximus]] 23:09, 6 November 2008 (EST)

==Assassination==
I tried "Assassination" the other day and found that it was incredibly easy with a group of axedwarves. Not only did I kill the hardest-to-get-at goblin, I killed every last other goblin too. In the end, there were only 2 dogs and 2 dwarves dead (the last one fell, sadly, to the last goblin left, who was hiding in the tunnels.--[[User:Smoking Gnu|Smoking Gnu]] 22:51, 15 December 2007 (EST)

:Now do it with 7 untrained dwarves with no armor. --[[User:TheUbie|TheUbie]] 19:30, 29 December 2007 (EST)

::Mwa ha ha ha!--[[User:Jackrabbit|Jackrabbit]] 18:38, 11 December 2008 (EST)

::: How did you get it to work? I've tried starting with goblins and they are always "friendly" on the unit screen and so I can not attack them. Is there some trick to getting them hostile so you can do this sort of thing? 40d, by the way. --[[User:Kwieland|Kwieland]] 11:33, 18 February 2009 (EST)
::::Unless you're actually at war with the goblins, they'll always be 'friendly' when there's a tower nearby. Bug, I think. --22:57, 17 May 2009 (UTC)

== Humanlike? ==
It should be noted that the 'human-like fortress' as described is historically inaccurate. In particular, its either misrepresenting or confusing various details. One major point is that a _castle_ never incorporated a town. There are walled towns and there are castles, but these are entirely different things. A couple of historical periods/styles would lead to the following different suggestions:

(A) Larger (stone) medieval castles sometimes had industry in the bailey. This was often pressed up against the outer wall to save on space and wall building. It was usually militarily useful industry (ie, metalsmithing of various types). Cooking and possibly brewing might also happen, and cooking at least would have been handled in the keep itself. Industries including jewelry, carpentry (on a permanent basis), and other non-military production would have been outside the castle, quite possibly in a town nearby.

(B) More isolated smaller castles would have done necessary production in the bailey on a temporary basis (ie, erecting a carpentry work area when needed and disassembling it afterwards), with a few permanent industries (notably blacksmithing).

(C) 'Dark Ages' castles would be made of wood, and weren't large enough to accomodate much industry. Instead they would have imported everything. The early castle was a defensible home for the lord and his family, and would only house them and a few military retainers.

It should be noted that the lack of focus on industry in a castle meant diverse tasks might share the same workspace and in fact be handled by the same person. The purpose of a castle is military, not production, and castle's only produced goods for internal demand that either could not be imported, would be inconvenient to import, or were critical to the military purpose (and couldn't afford access to those goods being lost during a siege).

(D) A walled town would have no keep. Nobles would not live there. Basically, towns would build a wall around their perimeter for defense. More important towns often grew to encompass nearby castles, and often outgrew their walls - which might either lead to substantial portions beyond the walls or accruing walls occasionally to encompass new growth. Despite a castle potentially being encompassed by a town, the castle and town were administratively separate - towns receiving independent charters from the crown - and the town was never subject to the lord of the castle (who may well control the surrounding countryside).

Given the nature of Dwarf Fortress, treating it as a town rather than a castle is probably preferable unless you really want to emphasize military skills, which could be interesting. You could, of course, create a castle and a town, keeping them as virtually separate entities, with military dwarves and nobles living in the castle and other dwarves living in the town.

--[[User:Squirrelloid|Squirrelloid]] 18:11, 30 April 2008 (EDT)

:When did we start trying to make DF fit real-world history?
:His idea seems perfectly fine when compared to in-game human towns/cities, as they have a keep and whatnot as part of the city. Only difference is adding a wall around it all. --[[User:N9103|Edward]] 18:25, 30 April 2008 (EDT)

== Insane Renegade (just a thought) ==

Well I was thinking something along these lines,

They all think that your crazy, so you and some others ran. You shouldn't trust them... They want you dead. Except for the (random profession/job) they think like you. KILL THEM KILL ALL THAT OPPOSE YOU!!,

Description:
Xenophobia, Do not trade with others, Kill all immigrants except ones of a certain job/profession. If you want to go as a truly insane person, ban all statues and engravings of Dwarven faces (the statues, THE ROCKS! THEY ALL WANT ME DEAD!!!!) Be prepared for a long life of hatred and sieges.

P.S. if anyone edits this and puts it on the main thing please give me partial credit... Thank you and goodnight! – [[template:unsigned|unsigned]] comment by [[User:LrZeph|LrZeph]]

:How is this different from [[Challenges#Outcast|Outcast]], aside from the RP? --[[User:Savok|Savok]] 16:41, 22 June 2008 (EDT)

::Oh dear, i missed that one. never mind – [[template:unsigned|unsigned]] comment by [[User:LrZeph|LrZeph]]

== Dystopian society ==

Anyone thought of making a fortress based off one of those dystopian futures found in scifi novels like 1984, We, Brave New World, and Fahrenheit 451? The way I imagine it, it would be similar to the Equaland challenge, with variations based on the dystopian principle of your choice. For example, if you want to encourage uniformity across your population, enable all labor for every dwarf and persecute anyone who skills up too quickly at a given skill. A strict caste system might also be implementable, a la Brave New World. Another idea would be to kill off or at least "re-educate" any dwarf that falls below ecstatic for an extended period of time. Tons of ideas at {{wiki|Dystopia}}. Thoughts? --[[User:Mikaka|Mikaka]] 04:56, 24 June 2008 (EDT)

:That sounds like a good challenge. --[[User:Savok|Savok]] 08:24, 24 June 2008 (EDT)

== Underwater Building ==

I've decided to take on the underwater building challenge, and have started Migrurmestthos, The Ocean-Citadel. But ah... I can't for the live of me figure out how I'm going to get glass blocks to the bottom of the ocean. Any ideas? --[[User:Anfini|Anfini]] 20:36, 19 July 2008 (EDT) 
''P.S.: I've altered the creature tokens and set my Dwarves to Aquatic.''

:I recommend either
:#Don't build it in the ocean.
:#Use pumping to pump a large area of the top level of the ocean out. Do the same with a slightly smaller area one level down. Repeat as desired.
:#Pump the ocean out, build, then let it flow back in. This is like the above, but with the whole visible ocean. --[[User:Savok|Savok]] 22:45, 20 July 2008 (EDT)

:::Oookay, okay. I have single-handedly diverted the courses of raging rapids to give my children something to drink, harnessed the power of lava, and built towers of glass. However, I cannot help but approach the idea of pumping out '''the entire ocean''' with a bit of skepticism. Is this ''really'' possible? --[[User:Anfini|Anfini]] 22:53, 21 July 2008 (EDT)

::::Aye, it is. Aside from waves, the "entire" ocean is really, due to map limitations, just a large, fast-refilling lake. If you build a ring of pumps properly, you should be able to clear the water from a section, which can be as large as your fortress map. --[[User:Savok|Savok]] 02:34, 23 July 2008 (EDT)

::::: I've personally been using 'canals' in my fortress for quite a while, and what I do is simply allocate nobles' rooms along the side of the canal, and before flooding the waterway, I dig into it and build glass windows and blocks so the nobles can watch the fish swim by. I doubt it actually raises the room value by any more than the glass windows' base value, but I like the effect. This isn't really an "underwater city" per se, but it's born of the same concept. --[[User:Eddie|Eddie]] 07:45, 26 July 2008 (EDT)

:Check out [[User:Squirrelloid/Under the Sea]], then note that I haven't quite tested any of the possible methods yet. I'm about ready to turn on the magma tap and see if I can create an obsidian stalagmite with successive bursts of magma followed by channelling - that may provide a way to build stairs down through and assemble a mass pump appartus - yes, this is going to be a lot of work. Its took 6 years of game time to get to the point where I was ready and able to do a trial run - admittedly, it wasn't the only thing I was focused on. --[[User:Squirrelloid|Squirrelloid]] 12:28, 19 November 2008 (EST)

== Dwarf Factory ==

--[[User:Bilkinson|Bilkinson]] 18:12, 28 August 2008 (EDT)
Looking to develop this callenge concept:

Your fortress is a highly specialized industrial complex. Select one item, or very narrow category of items. (ie Flour, Scepters, Shoes, Silk Bags, Crossbow Bolts) This is your factory's product. You must produce as much of it as possible, and it may only be used for export to any any and all caravans which visit your factory. Set up shift schedules, assign massive teams of dwarves (or even all of them!) to your core product, and generally devote your fort to maximizing output.

Variants: 
Assembly line - Each Dwarf is assigned a single stage of the production cycle, this is their only labour. Workshops should be grouped togeather by type, ordered based on the production cycle and grouped with relevant stockpiles. 
Communal - Every Dwarf has every relevant labour enabled, in addition to whatever else they do for the fort. 
High Management - For each Task in your production, appoint a department head. As the number of workers in each department grows, start appointing shift managers. As your factory expands in size, appoint reigonal coordinators and quality control bureaus. Cap this off with a board of directors and a CEO. None of these dwarves do anything but fill noble slots and build social skills. 
Prison/Work Camp - Noble dwarves do not contribute to labour. Max the fortress/royal Guard at all times and draft 20% of the population into the army. The remaining dwarves are prisoners who must produce output. Build walls, rig traps, and make an example of anyone who fails to meet their quota. 
People's Glorious Five-Year Plan - As above, but arrive with no skilled workers, rig all facilities with self destructs and kill switches, and only arm one in ten of your soldiers. 

Bonus: Only produce things vital to the survival of your workers, or directly involved in making your product. Anything else must be imported. 
Further Bonus: Produce only your final product, all raw materials must be imported. spend the surplus on anything else you may need.

How's it sound?

== Luxurious Tomb ==

Build an extravagant mausoleum for your entire dwarf community. Make it multi-leveled, make it a pyramid, make it out of glass if you want - but it must serve no other purpose than to be a dying place, and must not be accessed for any purpose other than to build it. Add a few decorations here and there, statues, tables, and a whole lot of coffins to house everyone.

Once it's complete, turn your fortress into a ghost town. Remove the designation of all your stockpiles. Forbid all the workshops and forbid access to the different areas of the fort as they get deserted to limit dwarf movement. Lure everyone into the tomb, seal the entrance from the inside and watch everyone die inside their new mausoleum. The tomb should be designed such that the initial entry point cannot easily be guessed (i.e.: The entrance should be sealed using a wall or some other solid structure - not via a door you just mark forbidden.

BONUS: make access to the tomb difficult or impossible, either by causing a cave-in in the tunnel that leads towards it, or by flooding the surrounding area in water or magma.

BONUS #2: Build the tomb over a chasm. Find a way to drop the whole tomb-building into it once everyone's inside.

:Suggestion: DON'T build it over a chasm; build it over a very large pit (deep enough to be called a 'chasm' by some) and make a set of ramps that lead down to the bottom. 1x2 setup; that is:
^^
^^
^^
^^
^^
^^
..
That is, up ramps, turn on normal flooring, then continue back up in the opposite direction. So a dwarf would travel in this path:
VV
VV
VV
VV
VV
VV
>^
:They'd come down the left ramp, turn left twice, and go down via the right ramp. Then they'd take two more lefts, and go down the left ramp, etc..
:Just a neat little suggestion that's way too complicated, but'd look nice...also, {{k|V}} is a ramp; {{k|^}} is not.
:I can't wait to try this out, then watch the temple I build go down, down, down, and '''SMASH'''--then use the ramps alongside it to view (and plunder, of course--it IS a tomb in adventure mode) it.
:Oh, and just a Z-level view:
| /
| /
| /
|/
|\
| \
| \
| \
:Or:
| /
| /
| /
|/___
| /
| /
| /
|/___
:Etc.. ~ [[User:Midna|Midna]] 23:45, 25 October 2008 (EDT)

== Agoraphobia ==

Your dwarves are absolutely terrified of the great outdoors, ([[carp|and]] [[Elephant|with]] [[Giant eagle|good]] [[undead|reason]] and want nothing more than to be nestled tightly in the "[[Giant Cave Spider|relative]] [[Pit|saftey]]" of the underground. Upon arrival, immediately burrow into the ground and haul all your supplies out of the sun's glare, and then never set foot on the surface again. Also, to help reduce anxiety, have no single chamber larger than 5x5, and let no hall stretch farther than 5 tiles between doors.--[[User:Bilkinson|Bilkinson]] 11:42, 15 September 2008 (EDT)

== <insert material> Fort....wait, what? ==

Ok, now I can understand a glass fort...and I can understand making it all outside, but how does one build it under water? Can someone please tell me how to do this so I can try to create my own Dwarven SeaLab? [[User:Alkyon|Alkyon]] 05:58, 17 October 2008 (EDT)
:I believe its either done via pump rings (enough screw pumps can hollow out sections of the ocean long enough to build something to hold the water back), or in a cold enough seasonal environment, only doing construction during the winter. [[User:HeWhoIsPale|HeWhoIsPale]] 08:44, 17 October 2008 (EDT)
:: The third option would be building the fort, and then making a lake around it. --[[User:Bilkinson|Bilkinson]] 08:51, 17 October 2008 (EDT)
::The real trick with building enough screw pumps is in water deeper than 1 z-level you need to find a way to build down - you cannot hang down staircases off sides like you can up staircases. I'm attempting to pump magma to form an obsidian sheen - tunnel down through it and channel a hole, pump more magma, and so on. I'll let people know how it works... --[[User:Squirrelloid|Squirrelloid]] 12:41, 19 November 2008 (EST)
:::So I've heard. Have you tried just carving a staircase along the underwater cliff on your game? I hope to see, or at least hear, the results of your work. As for me, I'm trying this challenge the other way around: Turn a hilly desert map into a massive glass aquarium, with my dwarves living the good life inside. --[[User:Alkyon|Alkyon]] 13:41, 19 November 2008 (EST)
:::::Well, my goal was to build a free-standing structure in 15 z-levels of water, so yes, if there is a convenient cliff it works, but that limits you to cliffs which start 1 z-level below water. As all my really deep water areas aren't even close to being accessible in that way, its not even an option. --[[User:Squirrelloid|Squirrelloid]] 19:34, 19 November 2008 (EST)

::::To me, the solution that comes to mind is to place a weapon rack on a narrow causeway and get recruits to wrestle until one punts another into the abyss. The lucky winner gets to build the up staircase. Getting materials below is easy, you can just build something and deconstruct it, among other more elaborate means. --[[User:Navian|Navian]] 17:41, 19 November 2008 (EST)

:::::That only works if its only 2 z-levels down, because otherwise the dwarf falls into deeper water and drowns... and as 2 z-levels is boring... --[[User:Squirrelloid|Squirrelloid]] 19:34, 19 November 2008 (EST)

==Genesis==
Kill all but two of your starting dwarves off (one male and one female). Seal them in your fortress (no trading). Repopulate the earth. Measure of success is based on number of children before the fortress dies. Thoughts?
--[[User:Squirrelloid|Squirrelloid]] 05:12, 22 November 2008 (EST)

:How reliably can you get them to mate?--[[User:Maximus|Maximus]] 16:57, 22 November 2008 (EST)

:: Tried this out - 3 years in and not even lovers yet. Ick. So, here's the problem: you really want two dwarves who won't start as friends with many other people (although each other is ok), and who can handle stress and aren't quick to anger. Because of course your first hurdle is going to be surviving the unhappiness generated by killing off everyone else. (You may just want to build some coffins early just in case). Unfortunately, the embark screen view mode won't let you see who they're friends with before embarking, so if you want to assign just two of them skills you're making guesses based solely on their personality traits as two which dwarves will be compatible and likely to survive the initial culling. After that you then need to reduce your job queue to almost nothing and basically lock them in the same room together so they spend their time talking - because you've already chosen otherwise self-reliant and anti-social dwarves.

::Some evidence on the Relationships talk page suggests giving some social skills to your dwarves may increase the rate at which they progress to friends/lovers.

::My first attempt was a Carpenter 5/Cook 5 and a Mason 5/Grower 5... I might have to revise that to Mason 5/Grower 3/Something social 2 and Carpenter 4/Cook 4/something social 2 - but carpenter and mason are going to be important for generating happy thoughts.

::Apparently setting the .init file to a max of 2 dwarves doesn't stop immigrants from coming - which is annoying because I really don't want to keep killing them off, and they keep stealing my moods. (Yes, i put a stone stockpile outside so the immigrants can build their own deathtrap over the lava vent). I do recommend playing on an island so you only have to deal with not going outside for the dwarf caravan each year. And the liaison will happily join your migrants on the death trap if you make it a meeting area.

::--[[User:Squirrelloid|Squirrelloid]] 10:18, 23 November 2008 (EST)

:::It's all a matter of compatibility. Dwarves actually don't start out friends, they just make them almost instantly at the start (and can make grudges here, too. I had one who had a very low sense of adventure while everyone else had high, and five of the seven had grudges with her.) To become lovers and get married requires a very, very high compatibility--whatever that means. It seems that some dwarves never upgrade from lovers to married, either, perhaps due to being not compatible enough, but being faced with a lack of programming to handle breakups. (I'll leave that one to the playwrights.) Getting this challenge to work is probably more than half the challenge! --[[User:Navian|Navian]] 11:29, 23 November 2008 (EST)

:::Do social skills make dwarves more likely to make friends, or does being friendly make dwarves more likely to gain social skills? Instead of focusing on social skills, you might need to pick dwarves with a lot of friendly traits (or even compatible traits, like Navian suggests). You can check their personalities before setting out -- if you don't see compatible traits, scrap it and start building another party.

:::For happiness, build several native gold (i.e., masonry) statues and put them in their bedrooms -- that will dwarf (ahem) the bonus you will get from the bed itself being high-quality. You can potentially skip carpentry altogether.

:::For them to actually form a relationship, you might need to give them idle time, during which they will socialize.

:::To keep other dwarves away, you could try putting a moat around the entire perimeter of the map (better still, a magma moat). This worked with the 2D version, but with finite quantities of fluid in the 3D version, it might not work anymore. But if you do want to try, put a wall as close to the edge of the map as it allows you, and flood everything outside it. Have the sacrificial five (and all immigrants) work on that.

:::Supposedly you won't get moods at all in a fortress with less than 20 dwarves. You also won't get moods if you haven't produced enough goods or revealed enough tiles through mining (see [[strange mood]]).--[[User:Maximus|Maximus]] 12:30, 23 November 2008 (EST)

:Is there a way to disable other dwarf civilizations from existing? I've been looking around world generation and stuff but I can't seem to find a way to do so. Closest I found is making minimum savagery 66 but it rejects the worlds without Dwarfs it seems. --[[User:Doodle|Doodle]] 14:14, 17 May 2009 (UTC)

==Noblesse requis==

Build your fortress to please the sick, twisted, evil nobles needs. Build a execution chamber for your rowdy dwarves and build a torture chamber for your dungeon master, using your imagination! Use this to punish pathetic dwarves who dare rebel. Build palaces for your nobles and pamper them in every way. Pour most of your resources into a beautiful place for nobles to live whilst letting your dwarves sleep in tiny, pathetic rooms. The only exception is your mayor, who rises from the rank of the disgusting peons. He must live in squalor as well, preferably next to noble rooms to so the nobles can taunt him. score yourself according to how happy your nobles are, and your worth. Evil. And fun! can I add this to the main page? --[[User:Jackrabbit|Jackrabbit]] 03:04, 11 December 2008 (EST)

:Sure – it's a wiki, after all. You can edit the pages yourself!
:Also, is that really what [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Noblesse_oblige Noblesse/noblis oblige] means? --[[User:Savok|Savok]] 10:55, 11 December 2008 (EST)
::Nope, just sounds good. I was hoping nobody would look it up. Maybe I'll change the name. Also, I'm new to wikis in general so I don't really know how everything works, desipte making this profile about a year ago. Thanks!--[[User:Jackrabbit|Jackrabbit]] 18:26, 11 December 2008 (EST)
:::Okay, changed it to Noble demand. Thanks!--[[User:Jackrabbit|Jackrabbit]] 18:30, 11 December 2008 (EST)

== Magma/Lava Waterfall ==

Would creating a sustainable magmafall, or one that can be triggered as part of a defense system, be considered a challenge? Or is it more of a Stupid Dwarf Trick? I'm just curious because one has to take into account building the thing, making sure it won't set your dwarves on fire, and where to put the excess magma/lava since you can't really just pump it back into the magma pipe without some sort of massive and elaborate pump system. (Oh wow, I feel stupid. I created a new subject and forgot to sign it for at least two days.) --[[User:Alkyon|Alkyon]] 20:26, 10 January 2009 (EST)

:I'm inclined to declare it a SDT, due to the overly dangerous side effects. But then... I'd also call half the challenges SDTs too. I think that if the side effects are more dangerous than the intended effect, it's no longer a challenge, but something some random (insane) dwarf felt needed to be done. To put it in perspective, there's few cases where a 20-dwarf squad can't handle an entire siege, with or without fortifications and traps. Give them those, and they can handle all the siegers rushing and arriving at the same time. Even if you never have any mistakes during the construction of the magma-defenses (and that's a rare thing) then you could easily lose more than 20 in the first siege alone from dwarves trying to gather dropped goods. It's also almost useless against any other defenses (thieves & ambushes) since you'll have little, if any forewarning that you need to clear the area and throw the switch.
:On the other side of the fence, if you're particularly interested in making this, you should do the little things, like making a near-exact count of how much lava you'll need to let flow, to both keep all tiles where it will settle to less than 2/7 (since then it would never evaporate, the best cleaning method) and how to direct the flow so that it covers the path, but doesn't flow to other areas you didn't intend. --[[User:N9103|Edward]] 15:38, 11 January 2009 (EST)

::Well, it doesn't have to be part of a defense system, one could just have massive magma waterfalls lining their entrance. Though I have to say from experience that the hardest part is drainage. Creating a massive magma cistern is one thing, it just takes some pumps and construction, but getting the stuff to not backup on the way to the disposal chasm and therefore not flood your fortress is a bit more complex than it first seems.--[[User:Alkyon|Alkyon]] 11:13, 12 January 2009 (EST)

:::Which is why it's great building your fort into the the ledge a few levels over a Magma Pipe ;) --[[User:N9103|Edward]] 21:01, 12 January 2009 (EST)

::::Hmm, that would be one way to do it, too bad I can't search for maps with that specific of a terrain set. Anyways, there has to be a way to spill off at least some of the magma as the magma pipes fill slowly but constantly from the bottom. Also, I learned from my failed experiment that Coke roads + magma spillover = road of fire. Unusable except for turning your fortress into Mordor, which is awesome in it's own way. --[[User:Alkyon|Alkyon]] 21:29, 12 January 2009 (EST)

:::::LOL, yes, I saw that and was thinking something along the lines of Mordor myself ;) As for spill over, the magma tends to flow off to the side off the top of the magma pipe where I'm at, resulting in a net loss to evaporation, so I just turn it off for a season once or twice a year. As for finding a magma pipe that's exposed *and* sunken, to provide atleast one level of inaccessible floor around the pipe, I'd look in the mountains, where you've got many many levels of elevation. Or atleast, that's what my map looks like (50+ levels) with the majority of the map being mountain tiles, and one corner (of a 2x4 map) being desert. It had two * listed in the height map, '''''but no chasm''''', so that could help to find one. --[[User:N9103|Edward]] 23:35, 14 January 2009 (EST)

:Or, how about a dual water/magma waterfall, meeting on the road leading in? Encase your enemies in carbonite, err, obsidian. [[User:Random|Random]] 20:31, 15 January 2009 (EST)

== "Real time" challenge talk ==

1) As mentioned in the challenge, opening any menu pauses the game

2) "You have struck Alunite!" Anyone else get this message and a pause every 5 minutes?

If you were to keep the game running while you slept -- and trust me, I have -- all it takes is one minor inconvenience of the legion the game contains to pause it. I set the game to keep running before I went to bed one night, and between doing that and going to brush my teeth, it paused. I resumed, lay down in bed, and not a minute later, I opened my eyes to see the game had paused ''again.'' Too much stuff causes the game to pause to really execute this without constant babying.

Overall, I don't see this challenge as being feasible. Not bad in theory, but impossible in practice. --[[User:Eddie|Eddie]] 06:15, 16 January 2009 (EST)

:Yes, thats true. That challenge would require either a new version where pausing-for-announcements can be disabled or a helper program to automatically acknowledge them and unpause the game. [[User:Random|Random]] 20:54, 16 January 2009 (EST)

== Hermit Challenge ==

Does anyone have any tips for not having any damn migrants? The carps can't eat everyone.
: Well, you can just kill them all. Atom smasher, lava, water, goblin siege, choose your way to kill them. Even random ballista bolt could do the trick! Bonus point for the creative part !? :D [[User:Karl|Karl]] 19:45, 21 January 2009 (EST)
::Well, if the problem gets too extreme, you can adjust your maximum population to 1 in the ini files, and see if that works...--[[User:Quil|Quil]] 20:43, 21 January 2009 (EST)
::: It doesn't work. The POPULATION_CAP seems bugged something awful. [[User:AbuDhabi|AbuDhabi]] 02:36, 23 January 2009 (EST)

== The Great Wall of [Kingdom] ==

Here's an interesting challenge:

Your kingdom needs a great impenetrable defense to protect against your goblin enemies. You have been assigned to build a giant wall!

The wall must stretch from one side to the opposite, have a height of 5 z-axis, be four tiles wide complete with gate(s), towers, fortifications, ballistas and catapults. You must also position a crossbowdwarf at every ten tiles.

* BONUS: Build it right next to a goblin lair.
* BONUS: Build it all using only wood.
* BONUS++: Build it all using only soap!

[[User:Myroc|Myroc]] 15:16, 22 January 2009 (EST)

:This wouldn't work due to the fact that you can't build walls (among other things) too close to the edge. At best, it would have to start six tiles in on both sides. However, you could implement an existing hill/mountain to "assist" with the completion of the wall.
:[[User:Nocash|Nocash]] 18:30, 24 January 2009 (EST)

::Ah, good point. I kinda forgot about that. [[User:Myroc|Myroc]] 05:50, 25 January 2009 (EST)

:::You could use raised bridges at the ends, they can be built right up to the edges. --[[User:Torasin|Torasin]] 13:25, 25 January 2009 (EST)

== Pave the World? ==

If one where to flood the world with magma, then flood it with water, you would be left with a solid block of obsidian, am I right? (along with ALOT of steam.) Bonus for paving the elves. --[[User:Zchris13|Zchris13]] 18:13, 7 April 2009 (UTC)

Unfortunately, Unless you time it right, you will get one flat layer of obsidian with all the water under it; the obsidian doesn't jump straight to the bottom. [[User:Sensei|Sensei: Last seen somewhere in the Basic Jungle of Terror]] 17:26, 16 May 2009 (UTC)

:So if the water reaches the edge, and it drains, you're left with a layer of obsidian sitting on air? I can't really think of a use for something like that, but it sounds incredibly awesome anyway. --[[User:Smartmo|Smartmo]] 19:03, 16 May 2009 (UTC)

== Rewrite ==
Alright, this article is getting way too messy. 60 top-level items is more than most talk pages, many of them overlap each other, the ones involving goblin forts are out of date (as local goblins are automatically friendly as of 40d) and some of them just plain aren't challenges.

For now I've split them up into three broad categories, and I plan to weed out redundant/wrong bits and streamline the whole thing while still hopefully preserving some of the "flavor text". [[User:Walliard|Walliard]] 04:06, 14 April 2009 (UTC)

== College ==
A center for enlighted craftsmanship studying and teaching. There should be auditoriums for each workshop type lined with chairs and a few lecture rooms with ascending rows of chairs where nobles rant to the peasants how lesser they are and to teach them manners. A canteen and dorms will also be needed.

Minor bonus: auditoriums are designated as meeting halls and have balconies and floor hatches on the ceiling to allow best studying with illuminated stages. 
Minor bonus: Hold keger parties each night. 
Bonus: Do not make co-ed dorms; married couples can rent a small apartment from nearby study houses. 
Bonus +: Engligthen other races. 
Ultimate bonus: Englighten orcs, goblins and other less friendly creatures. -[[User:Karpatius|Karp]] 08:00, 6 May 2009 (UTC)
: How does one "enlighten" other races? [[User:Lymojo|Lymojo]] 21:38, 13 May 2009 (UTC)Lymojo

== Water Park challange ==

Try to make a bunch of pools and somehow keep the water level always at 4/7 so they wont drown. Then set the pools as meeting areas so all of your dwarves will go there and eventually everyone will be legendary swimmers

bonus: somehow make waterslides
bonus: make it outside so your dwarves will be tan
bonus: pave it with gold
bonus: make a sauna using steam from lava and water colliding

how does this sound as a challenge. If you can get it to work all of your peasants will get stats from the swimming skill making them easier to train in something useful.--[[User:Cerol The Elf Hunter|Cerol The Elf Hunter]] 16:08, 28 June 2009 (UTC)

User:Cerol The Elf Hunter

2009-06-26T13:46:16Z

Cerol The Elf Hunter:

Hello I am Cerol the elf hunter. I love playing this game and as you can tell I hate elves.You may be wondering where I got my name well Ill tell you. As you probably know Cerol is a dwarf name. It was also the name of my favorite dwarf ever. He was my original miner in my first fortress he was killed by a goblin ambush while trying to reload a stone trap. Now why I hate elves. Well one day an elven caravan came to my fortress and It was ambushed by goblins then slaughtered. So the elves decide to blame me for it and they attack me. Well I fight them off but I lose two dwarves. Well It just so happens that They were friends with almost every dwarf in the fortress. So my fortress tantrums into a boiling pit of despair

I just started a fortress called sazirimsal. In my area I have a volcano a brook and an abundance of magnetite. looks like a keeper.

Well I just found out sazirimsal has a large goblin population so I guess It will be a military fortress.

Lately I have built a water death trap. I was having a bunch of ambushes so I decided to find a way to despose of all my goblitaking ns. So I built a long hallway and put down two pressure plates. One of them was attached to the bridges at each end and the other plate was attached to the floodgates. Then I pulled a lever that opened the floodgates to my brook and drowned all of the goblins. 15 in all died from the trap and the 16th gobbo ran ahead of everybody else and got in a skirmish with 2 marksdwarves and an elite marksdwarf. long story short I lost 1 marksdwarf and the goblin finally died because my expert swordsdwarf charged him getting his left hand shot off in the process and his lung pierced.

lately I had a dwarf make a horse bone floodgate made with aluminum and pine bands it had an image of a dwarf surounded by the dwarves. It was worth 104 thousand

Lately I had a gigantic siege of 30 goblin bowmen and 8 trolls. Also a goblin Mace lord and an Axe lord. I had hundreds of traps and I caught about 15 bowmen 4 trolls and the Mace lord and the Axe lord. I was very surprised to see my legendary miner cleave straight through 3 trolls killing them while only taking a broken arm out of the fight then he carried himself to his bed to rest.

Due to an accident involving an Elvin caravan, a faulty lever ,and a goblin Axe Lord I just had 3 talented hammerdwarves massacred and my champion sworddwarf's right arm lopped off. So I decided that I shall totally militarize Sazirimsal. Ive decided that at I should at least have 50% of my dwarves in the military.

Well sazirimsal is going down. in the last 2 dorf months I've lost 6 champions in random sparring/magma/goblin accidents. Everybody is going mad and my last remaining champion has killed about 8 berserk dwarves and is now the happiest dwarf in town because she took joy in slaughter

I have now decided to visit some of my old fortresses in adventure mode. I just came to Controltraded one of my favorite lost forts. I lost Controltraded when in a siege I slaughtered every goblin and only lost 4 dwarves. Well those dwarves knew every dorf in the fort as a friend and faster than you could say "CRAP" I was down to 50 dwarves. then a bc comes and destroyed my entire crippled military in one fell swoop. After that he came waltzing into my fortress and started chasing my children through the hallways and ripping off there legs. Overall Controltraded was very "Fun"

I decided to reclaim Controltraded and this is what happened. OK I get there with my 56 dorfes and find the fort crawling with chasm creatures. Im about to attack when an ambush with one bc in it. long story short it killed 27 dwarves before it died.

User:Cerol The Elf Hunter

2009-06-26T13:37:43Z

Cerol The Elf Hunter:

Hello I am Cerol the elf hunter. I love playing this game and as you can tell I hate elves.You may be wondering where I got my name well Ill tell you. As you probably know Cerol is a dwarf name. It was also the name of my favorite dwarf ever. He was my original miner in my first fortress he was killed by a goblin ambush while trying to reload a stone trap. Now why I hate elves. Well one day an elven caravan came to my fortress and It was ambushed by goblins then slaughtered. So the elves decide to blame me for it and they attack me. Well I fight them off but I lose two dwarves. Well It just so happens that They were friends with almost every dwarf in the fortress. So my fortress tantrums into a boiling pit of despair

I just started a fortress called sazirimsal. In my area I have a volcano a brook and an abundance of magnetite. looks like a keeper.

Well I just found out sazirimsal has a large goblin population so I guess It will be a military fortress.

Lately I have built a water death trap. I was having a bunch of ambushes so I decided to find a way to despose of all my goblitaking ns. So I built a long hallway and put down two pressure plates. One of them was attached to the bridges at each end and the other plate was attached to the floodgates. Then I pulled a lever that opened the floodgates to my brook and drowned all of the goblins. 15 in all died from the trap and the 16th gobbo ran ahead of everybody else and got in a skirmish with 2 marksdwarves and an elite marksdwarf. long story short I lost 1 marksdwarf and the goblin finally died because my expert swordsdwarf charged him getting his left hand shot off in the process and his lung pierced.

lately I had a dwarf make a horse bone floodgate made with aluminum and pine bands it had an image of a dwarf surounded by the dwarves. It was worth 104 thousand

Lately I had a gigantic siege of 30 goblin bowmen and 8 trolls. Also a goblin Mace lord and an Axe lord. I had hundreds of traps and I caught about 15 bowmen 4 trolls and the Mace lord and the Axe lord. I was very surprised to see my legendary miner cleave straight through 3 trolls killing them while only taking a broken arm out of the fight then he carried himself to his bed to rest.

Due to an accident involving an Elvin caravan, a faulty lever ,and a goblin Axe Lord I just had 3 talented hammerdwarves massacred and my champion sworddwarf's right arm lopped off. So I decided that I shall totally militarize Sazirimsal. Ive decided that at I should at least have 50% of my dwarves in the military.

Well sazirimsal is going down. in the last 2 dorf months I've lost 6 champions in random sparring/magma/goblin accidents. Everybody is going mad and my last remaining champion has killed about 8 berserk dwarves and is now the happiest dwarf in town because she took joy in slaughter

I have now decided to visit some of my old fortresses in adventure mode. I just came to Controltraded one of my favorite lost forts. I lost Controltraded when in a siege I slaughtered every goblin and only lost 4 dwarves. Well those dwarves knew every dorf in the fort as a friend and faster than you could say "CRAP" I was down to 50 dwarves. then a bronze comes and destroyed my entire crippled military in one fell swoop. After that he came waltzing into my fortress and started chasing my children through the hallways and ripping of there legs. Overall Controltraded was very "Fun"

40d Talk:Plant token

2009-06-13T20:01:23Z

Cerol The Elf Hunter: /* under or above ground tokens */ new section

==GENPOWER==

In my for I experiencing this: every time I harvest plants from my underground forest I end up with 200-300 plump helmets and dimple cups and less than 50 of other underground plants. The only difference I can see, that might affect this is GENPOWER (2 on PH and DC and 1 on other).--[[User:Dorten|Dorten]] 23:55, 2 December 2008 (EST)
:I believe I read in the wiki somewhere that GENPOWER was related to a scrapped magic system. Doesn't mean it's not being used for this, though. --[[User:Aristoi|Aristoi]] 16:25, 19 January 2009 (EST)

==GOOD/EVIL==
The sliver barb has the [EVIL] tag, might be worth adding that in here to the list. --[[User:Aristoi|Aristoi]] 19:54, 13 January 2009 (EST)
:Yeah, and I heard Wild Sunberry is found only in good biomes... What I'd like to know is if, when you import these plants into a non-evil or non-good biome respectively, will they grow? My guess is no...--[[User:Jpwrunyan|Jpwrunyan]] 04:37, 27 March 2009 (UTC)

==FREQUENCY==
Does FREQUENCY act as a percent chance of a successful harvest? So 100 means an herbalist is always successful? If so, what determines the chance of a particular plant appearing at all? --[[User:Aristoi|Aristoi]] 16:25, 19 January 2009 (EST)

== under or above ground tokens ==

what are the tokens for if you want your plant to grow exclusively under ground. --[[User:Cerol The Elf Hunter|Cerol The Elf Hunter]] 20:01, 13 June 2009 (UTC)

40d Talk:Chasm

2009-06-05T17:50:24Z

Cerol The Elf Hunter:

I removed the "this is for use on the lowest level of the Chasm" part of the article, because it doesn't seem to be the case. You can set a dump zone over the side of a tower 20 z-levels high and still have the crap land in the chasm, and I don't see why the collapse trick wouldn't work at all levels as well. --[[User:Tallyho|Tallyho]] 07:24, 5 May 2008 (EDT)

I've had a chasm in a mountainous area near a volcano which was in fact cylindrical, not shaped like a river at all. It was basically a bore of empty space all the way to the bottom-most level, which consisted of the # chasm squares. In that respect, it looked much like a volcano bore but generally a bit smaller. There were variations in width on different levels of it as well. This led to open cave floor around it on some levels where troglodytes, iron men, giant cave swallows, and caveswallowmen frolicked about. --[[User:Janus|Janus]] 08:25, 1 November 2007 (EDT)

:Huh, how about that. They're certainly more interesting than they used to be.--[[User:Draco18s|Draco18s]] 14:54, 1 November 2007 (EDT)

:Interesting. Sounds like a magma vent minus the magma. I have a game going in a grassland a few region squares away from a volcano. When I first started the game, I got a message that part of the cavern had collapsed and it zoomed to the magma vent. The vent itself was as you describe--a roughly cylindrical sinkhole of varying widths that went all the way to the bottom. Only in my case, it was full of magma up to the surface, and at lower depths, fire imps, magma men and fire snakes could be seen (Apparently, magma is transparent.) Maybe the game treats magma vents as localized chasms full of magma? --[[User:RedKing|RedKing]] 16:43, 3 November 2007 (EDT)

:: That's probably how it was formed, using the same algorithm as a magma vent, but it does appear to be intentional. Perhaps it is indeed meant to be a dead magma vent. That same map has the main volcano magma vent a short distance away. The magma vent was of course shown on the local map when choosing the map location, but the circular chasm was not.
::As for the collapse message when starting on a map with a magma vent, that appears to be due to a bug where a body of water is generated in the middle of it. This water instantly creates a solid block of obsidian with no support, which then collapses. Magma is semi-liquid, and fireproof monsters like those you mention will swim freely through it. --[[User:Janus|Janus]] 17:06, 3 November 2007 (EDT)

Actually there are two variants of the chasm, a chasm vent/pit and a chasm/river star like chasm (encountered this one twice, and it really fucked up the level). Perhaps we should works this into the article. Perhaps we should ad screenshots. I sadly have no save with the star river like chasm anymore (abandoned those). --[[User:Soyweiser|Soyweiser]] 18:45, 7 November 2007 (EST)

I'm playing a fortress right now with the same type of "pit" chasm. I'll see if I can get a shot of it to add to the page. --[[User:Sk128234|Sk128234]] 19:08, 7 November 2007 (EST)

Are the surface chasms visible from the map when selecting the site? It would be great to get a screenshot of that for the page to look similarly to the volcano page. --[[User:JPolito|JPolito]] 02:26, 18 November 2007 (EST)

:They're not visible until you actually embark. Same thing for kobold caves. However, if they reach the surface at all, you can see every single tile they contain right away.--[[User:Maximus|Maximus]] 15:05, 19 November 2007 (EST)

I don't think that chasms are the only things that can produce 20+ cliffs. I have a fortress now that is right on the edge of a massive cliff.--[[User:Zonhin|Zonhin]] 19:39, 18 December 2007 (EST)

: They aren't. Those cliffs appear rather often around true volcanoes and mountain peaks. Chasms just happen to be VERY common in mountain region tiles at embark, as much so as small brooks/rivers in certain other regions.

I have a pretty oddly shaped chasm, or at least i think i do. It starts from the corner of the map in a river like shape, then it splits off into 5 smaller 'fingers.' I've mined alot of the rock around it; it has a wide assortment of metals, gems, and stone i havent seen anywhere else on the map.--[[User:Hiho216|Hiho216]] 00:58, 23 January 2008 (EST)

:Apparently, you have a chasm that got the same code as a river source/delta, as that creates the same sort of 'fingers.'--[[User:Alfador|Alfador]] 11:34, 23 January 2008 (EST)

The article says that cave spiders "Often cave spiders are present near chasms". Shouldn't it be "Cave spiders spawn periodically near chasms"? I haven't seen chasm without those awesome little silk spawners. --[[User:Someone-else|Someone-else]] 08:09, 22 April 2008 (EDT)

I have a pic of the end of a chasm here: http://img168.imageshack.us/img168/8286/chasmendfl7.png
Not sure if it's notable... [[User:QMarx|QMarx]] 23:59, 26 April 2008 (EDT)

== Baddies ==

Do chasms spawn hostile creatures like ratmen, or do they just start there? [[User:Gairabad|Gairabad]] 00:00, 15 December 2008 (EST)

:Sadly, UG/chasm/magma no longer spawns anything. Kill it, and it is gone for good. --[[User:Savok|Savok]] 10:05, 15 December 2008 (EST)

::Any chance of re-introducing spawning? A init option enabling it would be sweet! --[[User:Kwieland|Kwieland]] 14:04, 3 March 2009 (EST)

== Chasm of Death ==

There's no mention of this in the article so I feel compelled to inquire as to what people's experiences of chasms in adventure mode have been.

When 'venturing about one of my fallen fortresses I was attacked by a hoard of troglodytes, approximately 15 brutally violated me within the corridors of my fortress as my noble warrior collapsed due to over-exertion after blocking countless attacks and was promptly strangled to death. Thinking this a mere quirk of the wonderful world of DF I returned to the fortress with a different character, much stronger this time, expecting to be able to have a proper look around. I was sadly mistaken. I was first attacked by a giant eagle, after a few fortunate strikes I had claimed the upper hand and was preparing to deal the killing blow when a wave of those cursed troglodytes clambered up the mountainside. Well taught by the experience of that unfortunate past warrior, abandoning my prey, I fled. Well, I did for a few moments before turning to see the troglodyte hoard attacking the giant eagle, I must say, I felt a deep sense of pity for the poor beast as the monsters went about their brutal practice of trying to break every bone in its body.

With a cry I charged at the mass of assailants and began to cleave them apart, blood spat forth endlessly from the mound of creatures before me as I hacked and slashed, coating the mountainside in crimson. Unfortunately the eagle was torn apart before I could give it a slightly more honourable death (slightly being the key word here) and I found myself surrounded by limbs, corpses and blood. The slaughter of the troglodytes was not to be the first however as each time I return to that cursed place more and more crawl forth from the chasm. They attack all in their path, be they goat or giant eagle and as such the slope of the mountain is stained with the blood of perhaps hundreds and the bones of the countless fallen litter the earth. It seems the troglodytes are without number.

Perhaps this was a curious enigma in the world, a strange chasm of frenzied and blood thirsty troglodytes, so I thought until I came upon an inhabited fortress deep in the mountains nearby. Upon arriving I heard the cries of a child set upon by vicious bat-men, by the time I found the infant I was too late, only a bruised and battered corpse remained. Upon this visit there was little more of importance which came to pass, I was in fact not even aware that there was a chasm in the vicinity until my second visit. As soon as I neared the fortress the stench of death was thick in the air, rat-men, troglodytes and bat-men were mobbing and slaughtering soldiers, fish-cleaners and dyers indiscriminately. I ran to the aid of the assailed but for many I was too late, after what seemed like an age of combat all was quiet and the ground was littered with limbs and corpses and, of course, stained with blood. As I looked upon the all-to-familiar scene of destruction a terrible thought suddenly struck me, perhaps there was a chasm here. From my experience I presumed that it would probably be upon the side of a mountain and so to the East I ran, clambering up the slopes, and as I did so I heard a cry. A swordsman, perhaps with the same idea as I had come upon the chasm and was being attacked by numerous assailants, including a gremlin and several rat-men. Tragically, as I neared his location he bled to death (I don't quite know what cut him, perhaps a large rat entered the battle at some point), I found his corpse high atop a pile of the bodies of those he had slain in his battle-frenzy.

And then, I saw it, the chasm, a damned pit of suffering and torment. No sooner had I sighted it than I was attacked by a number of bat-men. As I fought more and more emerged from the chasm but they all met the same bloody end, my time spent fighting hoards of vicious troglodytes had sharpened my skill in combat and once the stream of foes ended I emerged tired, but unwounded.

To conclude, chasms may be useful waste-disposal areas in fortress, but in adventure they are terrible places of endless slaughter where blood flows unceasingly. Have others had similar experiences? If so I'll add a section (with a little less story-telling) to warn people of the dangers of these cursed pits. --[[User:Deja Mort|Deja Mort]] 17:25, 8 February 2009 (EST)
----
Uncommon? They're all over the place in mountain biomes, in my experience. [[User:InsanityPrelude|InsanityPrelude]] 13:32, 6 April 2009 (UTC)

----

Y'mean the chasms? Perhaps I've been spending too much time frolicking with wolves in the woods.
Admittedly they are pretty prevalent in fortress mode but tend to be tucked away, at least in my fortresses. Maybe I just haven't been looking hard enough on my adventures or the majority of the citizens of chasms are friendlier folk who don't pick fights quite as often. --[[User:Deja Mort|Deja Mort]] 21:32, 11 April 2009 (UTC)

== To find a chasm ==

Once I looked at my stocks screen to find a bunch of naked mole dog/olmman corpses on the list. I didn't recall anything dying recently, so I zoomed to it and found it pointing deep underground. I never actually got the chance to dig it up and see, but it didn't take me long to figure out what was going on. Anyway, that's just something to look out for, if you're in the market for a chasm, or just don't want any nasty surprises. --[[User:Smartmo|Smartmo]] 01:12, 15 May 2009 (UTC)

== Cave spiders= Chasm ==

I was digging a corridor right under my cave river when I noticed that there was a bunch of silk laying around and my cats had killed about 10 cave spiders. So after a while more and more cave spiders spawned and made more silk.I was wondering if this meant that i was near a chasm.--[[User:Cerol The Elf Hunter|Cerol The Elf Hunter]] 17:50, 5 June 2009 (UTC)

40d Talk:Chasm

2009-06-05T17:50:02Z

Cerol The Elf Hunter: /* Cave spiders= Chasm */ new section

40d Talk:Trap

2009-06-03T00:32:07Z

Cerol The Elf Hunter: /* Cage trap bug */ new section

== Cage traps clarification ==

I think I know the answer, but are ANY sort of cages suitable for trapping any kind of invading monster (except those that evade traps altogether, such as kobalds). The page mentions a glass trap catching a colossus, but will that also apply to a rickety wooden trap? I haven't produced any glass. --[[User:RustyMcloon|Rusty Mcloon]] 06:18, 29 May 2008 (EDT)
:Yes. I've had a bronze colossus trapped in an Ashen Cage before. I don't think creatures care what you trap them in.--[[User:Dadamh|Dadamh]] 14:59, 29 May 2008 (EDT)

== cage traps for food ==
Couldn't one generate a mild supplementary food source by putting cage traps out on the map at random? Or create rows of them to catch aggressive creatures that are chasing down a fleeing dwarf. The ability to place them on the surface has some interesting possibilities. [[User:Kefkakrazy|Kefkakrazy]] 04:45, 4 November 2007 (EST)

: You can really do this with any kind of trap now - I built a 1 tile wide stair/corridor up an exposed cliff face, and as I was concerned about goblins and the like I stonefall-trapped it. Ever since then some of the local wildlife has used it to get up and down the 5 z-level cliff, with predictable and hilarious results. The goats just die, but the marmots are hurled off the cliff face to splatter on the ground below. It's a nice easy meat/leather/fat source, as well as being entertaining "Dwarfy McDwarf cancels reload stone trap - interrupted by (flying) hoary marmot" [[User:Acama|Acama]] 19:48, 20 December 2007 (EST)

==berserk dwarves==
Will berserk dwarves set off pressure plates? Toady mentioned he was going to stop that from happening [[User:VengefulDonut|VengefulDonut]] 19:39, 4 November 2007 (EST)

On a possibly related note, pets CAN set off traps. Although in my experience the pet has to be falling unconscious to do so. [[User:Anonymousphrase|Anonymousphrase]] 22:43, 27 May 2008 (EDT)

[[image:Pet_setting_off_trap.png]]

It may also be the case that you can also get pets killed by a trap if they're in the square when a hostile sets off the trap. —[[User:Chaos|Chaos]] 12:42, 28 May 2008 (EDT)

==flooding a spiked pit==
Will flooding a spiked pit break or cancel the spike trap? I'd test this, but I don't have the channel dug in yet. --[[User:Xazak|Xazak]] 18:30, 5 November 2007 (EST)
:confirmed that flooding doesn't affect spear/spike traps. [[User:YayTheDwarves|YayTheDwarves]] 17:52, 6 January 2008 (EST)

I'm pretty sure the "corpse stuck in trap" chance is 50%, according to Toady either on IRC or some forgotten forum post a few months back. I really can't remember for sure. -[[User:EarthquakeDamage|EarthquakeDamage]] 02:31, 10 November 2007 (EST)
:Do spike traps stop functioning if a corpse gets stuck in them, or can you just retract and continue using as usual? [[User:Gairabad|Gairabad]] 13:11, 9 December 2008 (EST)

==cage traps/ fire imps==
I've secured the entries oy my magma furnaces with cage traps, but it seems that the fire imps just walk through.
Just as the Giant moles did. How so? --[[User:Doub|Doub]]
:supposedly there is a bug that causes any creatures on the map when it is generated to count as residents, and thus know where your traps are and not trigger them. I've never run into the problem myself, but I've never specifically tested for it so I can't really say for sure if it still exists (or ever did). --[[User:BurnedToast|BurnedToast]] 07:41, 6 January 2008 (EST)
:I had read about this and tried it out with a trapped coridoor next to my magma vent - an imp I tempted out walked right through 4 cage traps and 4 stonefall traps without triggering them. Seems like indigenous life is currently trap-immune. Most magma creatures can be dealt with by a few marksdwarves though, so you're only in serious trouble if you have a herd of skeletal hippos on your map on embark.--[[User:TangoThree|TangoThree]] 15:42, 19 January 2008 (EST)
::There's always the menacing spike + lever combo. And pits. [[User:Benitosimies|Benitosimies]] 16:08, 10 March 2008 (EDT)
::I've killed fire imps and magmamen with stone fall traps --[[User:Strangething|Strangething]] 01:20, 19 July 2008 (EDT)
:I've caught native fire imps in cage traps loaded with green glass terrariums. [[User:Rkyeun|Rkyeun]] 21:42, 4 August 2008 (EDT)

==Trolls and Cages==
I'm planning on making the only passage to my fortress filled with cage traps, but I'm not sure if dwarves going out and migrants and traders coming in will be affected by them. Does anyone know? Also, do trolls smash goblin cages? [[User:Patarak|Patarak]] 21:41, 23 January 2008 (EST)
:Only hostile units will trigger traps. Trolls only smash buildings and after a goblin is captured the cage is not built. So the answer to your second question is no. --[[User:Karlito|Karlito]] 21:45, 23 January 2008 (EST)
::Make sure to forbid the traps when the siege starts. Otherwise your dwarves will rush out to reload them and store all the cages. --[[User:Ikkonoishi|Ikkonoishi]] 22:53, 23 January 2008 (EST)

==Thieves and trap avoidance==
Is it possible that Kobold thieves/Goblin master thieves can also trigger traps? I think I killed one and caged another master thief in the past. Maybe the quality of the mechanism is important here? --[[User:Qwertyu|Qwertyu]] 13:24, 17 March 2008 (UTC+1)

:goblin thieves, both regular and master, have always triggered traps -[[User:Chariot|Chariot]] 14:18, 17 March 2008 (EDT)

::So why does the article then say "Sneaking enemies do not trigger traps"? Goblin master thieves seem very sneaky to me. --[[User:Qwertyu|Qwertyu]] 20:33 17 March 2008 (UTC+1)

:::once goblin thieves are revealed they are captured fine. even revealed kobolds dont trigger. -[[User:Chariot|Chariot]] 15:45, 17 March 2008 (EDT)
:::: At least "normal" goblin thieves are scewered fine without being detected, says my weapon trap --[[User:Koltom|Koltom]] 16:58, 17 March 2008 (EDT)
:::: I have to agree with Koltom, I got an "Ambush" event when a goblin (master) thief went into a cage trap, and had another one cut to pieces by a serrated disc, which I only noticed when suddenly all my dwarves rushed off to remove his clothes. --[[User Quertyu|Qwertyu]] 13:31 (UTC+1)
:::: Weapon traps apparently have a chance of friendly fire. At least, that's what the ghost of my Kitten(tame) told me... [[User:QMarx|QMarx]] 18:48, 13 April 2008 (EDT)
::::: I think traps have a chance to trigger against theives, not an absolute yes or no. Also, remember that a citizen going unconscious on a trap will trigger it. The reason animals do so is because they ignore traffic designations, of which I presume traps create an invisible 'no sleep' tile. I've tested locking a dwarf in a room where the entire floor space was covered with traps, they starved to death before sleeping on the traps. However, if a dwarf is knocked unconscious by fighting or a bridge, then they will still trigger traps. [[User:Sensei|Sensei: Last seen somewhere in the Basic Jungle of Terror]] 23:43, 13 May 2009 (UTC)

== Crossbow Trap? ==

How does a crossbow trap work? Does it have line of sight, like a Dwarf? – [[template:unsigned|unsigned]] comment by [[User:Lordmick134|Lordmick134]]

Ranged weapons in weapon traps work much the same as melee weapons do, attacking the creature which triggered the trap. The only real difference in functionality seems to be that they require and use up appropriate ammunition, and (according to the article) do not get occasionally stuck and need cleaning like melee weapons in a weapon trap do. --[[User:Janus|Janus]] 21:31, 28 March 2008 (EDT)

How much ammo gets loaded into a crossbow trap? I have 10 individual bolts in one and a stack of 39 in another. [[User:HeWhoIsPale|HeWhoIsPale]] 09:48, 24 November 2008 (EST)

:I assume they load it with whatever stack is close at hand. They'd probably load it with a 1-er if you don't forbid used ammo.--[[User:Maximus|Maximus]] 12:07, 24 November 2008 (EST)

== Trapping cave dwellers ==

Has anyone sucessfully caged a cave dwelling megabeast? I have tried on two seperate maps to capture a minotaur and an ettin, both times the monster just run right through the cage traps. Perhaps creatures that are spawned on embark are bugged immune to traps?

as said above, some creatures that spawn on the map dont seem to be caught in traps. however, i successfully caught and with the dugeon master, tamed, a giant cave spider that was living in my chasm. I designated it as available for a pet. a legendary engraver adopted it, so i drafted him and am training him up now. hopefully the giant cave spider that now follows him everywhere will be happy to defend its owner against goblins. megabeasts that spawn and attack you can be caged, in fact, its the easiest way by far to deal with them. some, like dragons can then be tamed. im assuming your etin and minotaur fall under the aforementioned bug... try a later game version. --[[User:FruityBix|FruityBix]] 13:04, 20 September 2008 (EDT)

==Weapon Trap Jamming==
The page says crossbow weapon traps don't jam, but what about a trap with a crossbow and a melee weapon? Does the crossbow still fire if the trap jams? Or does a trap have to be pure crossbows to avoid jamming? --[[User:Strangething|Strangething]] 01:21, 19 July 2008 (EDT)

:Well, it jams in my experience as of 40d, I tried mixed trap, when something jams, the whole trap stops [[User:TettyNullus|TettyNullus]] 18:26, 30 November 2008 (EST)

== Trap betrayals? ==

Has anyone else been betrayed by their own traps? I had a dog and a crossbowman killed by weapons traps. Serrated iron disks ripped through their bodies like the bloody tusks of enraged elephants.

Correction. A dog, a crossbowman, and a miner. Will the slaughter never end?--[[User:Amenos42|Amenos42]] 12:08, 30 July 2008 (EDT)

I've noticed that traps tend to fire on people/animals with injuries. They've killed lots of 3 legged dogs for me, and a soldier that was dragging himself off the field.

: Traps will (also) trip for any and all unconscious individuals. That may be or be one of the reasons. [[User:Drawf irons|Drawf irons]] 20:53, 4 August 2008 (EDT)

::Does that include dead individuals? And is it possible to get my dead dog out of his cage? --[[User:Groveller|Groveller]] 01:32, 14 August 2008 (EDT)

:::Mark it for dumping? That's usually the solution as to how to get anything out of anywhere! --[[User:Raumkraut|Raumkraut]] 09:34, 16 August 2008 (EDT)

== Cage Trap Question ==

I recently received the message that there was a goblin snatcher in my fortress. It zoomed the page to one of the 3 cage traps. I took the game off pause and it gave me the same message again. Now I have two cave traps sprung, and when I press "k" and go over them, one says : "goblin cage (Larch)" and the other says "Goblin cage(nickel)". Does this mean I have successfully caught the scoundrels? Or are they still at large?

:If there is a flashing 'g' then yes, if no than It could be possibly a bug.[[User:Hoborobo|Hoborobo]] 08:25, 10 August 2008 (EDT)

== Stone Fall Update: Watch Out!! ==

This is as of release '''0.28.181.39f''': in the past hour I saw two of my own dwarves - both normal healthy members of society - get killed in two different stone fall traps I'd had set up. Clearly, the old rule that dwarves are immune to their own traps is no longer entirely accurate...unless there's a bug going on here? Has anyone else fallen prey to this occurrence? [[User:Grand marquis|Grand marquis]] 06:31, 16 August 2008 (EDT)

:See two sections up. :P Anything unconscious will trigger traps currently - did those dwarves fall asleep on the trap square maybe? I've changed the section on triggering traps, so it gives at least a little hint that backfiring is now possible! --[[User:Raumkraut|Raumkraut]] 09:33, 16 August 2008 (EDT)

== Room of Spiky Death ==
Alright, after a long, long time, I finally got myself a gross(144) of menacing green glass spikes. I'm planning to put them in airlock area of my castle, so that I can trap the goblins who have been annoying me and spike them to death. Each trap will use ten spikes, and there are 14 of them. There's an animal planted as bait, and once I raise both draw bridges, there's no way out. Can anyone tell me if there is something I should know before embarking on this death spree? -[[User:Cypress|Cypress]] 14:47, 20 August 2008 (EDT)

Yes. Be prepared for blood. lots and lots of blood. also, it will be awesome.--[[User:Jackrabbit|Jackrabbit]] 00:56, 15 September 2008 (EDT)

== Stop dwarves from automaticaly cleaning traps and getting killed. ==

its in the title. first big siege comes in, hits the first line of traps in my entry hall of death, and then half the fortress runs out en mass to clean them, getting killed by the goblins in front and the ballista bolts from behind. they also block my military from getting past. this is agonizing! children, peasants, legendary craftsdwarves and nobles all are susceptible. aaaaarrrrrrggh! --[[User:FruityBix|FruityBix]] 17:35 30 September 2008 UTC
:Lock the doors. --[[User:GreyMario|GreyMaria]] 22:49, 20 September 2008 (EDT)
:Forbid the traps, at least until the siege is over. --[[User:Smartmo|Smartmo]] 17:20, 6 May 2009 (UTC)
:Build the traps well outside (removing the roof and rebuilding with blocks still counts as "outside"), and forbid your dwarves to go out. [[User:Qwertyu|Qwertyu]] 12:17, 7 May 2009 (UTC)

I'm having a similar problem with this, they dont want to clean the traps anymore, oh no, they want to clean the damned splatters of blood off the walls after! luckily my fortress entrance is so convoluted that it takes a full day to traverse it, but It could become a problem in the future. [[User:Heliman|Heliman]] 11:16, 16 May 2009 (EST)

== Caged Creatures and Loot ==

''In this case remove the poor fellow using the goblin's inventory screen.''

I just caught my first goblin in my outer line of defenses! It wasn't even complete yet. *dances* Only, I can't seem to access the bugger's inventory screen. How get his goods off him without killing him? --[[User:RomeoFalling|RomeoFalling]] 04:12, 7 November 2008 (EST)
:Mark the bag (or whatever) he's holding for dumping via the stocks screen. [[User:HeWhoIsPale|HeWhoIsPale]] 09:29, 7 November 2008 (EST)

== weapon trap ==

anyone got a good combo for a weapon trap setup? I have magma so my last line of defense is a 3x3 grid of serrated green glass disk weapon traps- with ten each. It is generally a one-hit-kill, if they make it past my cage trap field. Anyway, share some good weapon combos here. Good meaning easily producible yet deadly, or really effective.--[[User:Destor|Destor]] 00:47, 5 December 2008 (EST)

: Bone crossbows trap, nuff said, all you need are some stones, and breeding pairs, and off ya go. Might be a bit high-maintance, but it never jams, and as long as you still have animals and stone around, you can make more of 'em, and fill 'em with just animals. -- [[User:TettyNullus|TettyNullus]] 01:46, 8 December 2008 (EST)

:I tend to do 2-3 of whatever weapon I've got on hand per trap. This is usually either glass weapons that I've been making to train a glassmaker or silver or copper weapons that I've been training a weaponsmith on. Weapon traps reset quickly between attacks, so a line of 2- or 3-weapon traps 3-4 deep is usually plenty. And why go through the trouble of reloading traps just to avoid an occasional jam? Save your bone bolts for training marksdwarves. IMO.--[[User:Maximus|Maximus]] 23:07, 8 December 2008 (EST)

::Metal tend to be in short supply in early fortresses, and those with lack of wood to burn through. Beside the jamlessness is just a bonus, nicely balanced by the difficulity of keeping it supplied. Breeding pairs of animals are cheap and counts as renewable resource, they provides food, leather and bone, as long as there're enough breeding pairs to keep going. Animal husbandery can be slightly complicated with a -lot- of animals but the benefit is you have armour, weapon and food resource no matter where you go ( And as long as there're enough of 'em to breed ). It's really more player preference and avaliable resources so YMMV! (Plus last I recall, the only weapons that can be made with bones are crossbows, at least in vanilla DF using dwarves, correct me if I'm wrong, since some maps don't have woods. And some don't have stones but at least you can arm your guys with bone and leather equipments) -- [[User:TettyNullus|TettyNullus]] 01:30, 10 December 2008 (EST) ed: forget to say that I've had sieges big enough to run through 5 deep of fully loaded glass disc traps, that'd be stopped almost completelly by fully loaded crossbow traps with even bone bolts, but maybe I've just been lucky.

== Dwarven Flame Belcher ==

I'm modding DF to support a flamethrower trap component, and I was wondering whether 'charcoal' is an acceptable ammunition. More specifically, I'm curious what the proper name for refined coal is.

[ITEM_TRAPCOMP:ITEM_TRAPCOMP_FLAMEBELCHER]
[NAME:flame belcher:flame belchers]
[ADJECTIVE:dwarven]
[DAMAGE:100:HEAT]
[WEIGHT:200]
[HITS:1]
[CRITBOOST:1]
[MATERIAL_SIZE:4]
[RANGED:CROSSBOW:CHARCOAL]
[METAL]

It's designated as a crossbow because I don' know if RANGED will work without a skill. And so crossbow users in adventure mode can have fun. --[[User:RaguCat|RaguCat]] 14:13, 11 December 2008 (EST)

:If you wanted to be really awesome, you'd have Naptha produceable at an alchemists, and use Naptha as fuel. I suppose you could have Naptha be made from coke and soap, although really you'd need some oil too... but adding oil to the game sounds complicated. --[[User:Squirrelloid|Squirrelloid]] 15:06, 11 December 2008 (EST)

::Do you mean napalm?--[[User:Mrdudeguy|Mrdudeguy]] 20:24, 14 May 2009 (UTC)

: Refined coal is [[coke]] in the game. Whiskey is a nice burny liquid your dwarves know how to make, but it's wasted on goblins. --[[User:Jellyfishgreen|Jellyfishgreen]] 19:29, 30 May 2009 (UTC)

== Spike Trap hit falling goblin ==

I had a spike trap surrounded by walls that I would drop gobbos on from 6 z-levels above; the idea was to stun them and then have a dwarf grind them to death. However, the first goblin I dropped died on impact (previous goblins did not) and got stuck in the spike trap. The trap wasn't being operated at the time. Has spike impact been added? --[[User:LucienSadi|LucienSadi]] 18:22, 22 December 2008 (EST)

== Friendlies ''completely'' immune to traps? ==

Unless I'm mistaken, except in a few cases, friendlies are immune to traps; if a friendly unit is on the same tile as a trap and an enemy triggers the trap only the enemy will get hurt. Right? --[[User:Xonara|Xonara]] 01:24, 4 January 2009 (EST)

Well it depends, if the trap in question is a spike trap, it will not discriminate between friend or foe, otherwise a trap shouldn't harm any conscious ally--[[User:Heliman|Heliman]] 2:12, May 17 2009 (EST)

== Traps + Caravans = very bad ==

Today, I had an elven caravan run into my weapon traps... they all died... this may be because they were wounded from goblin ambush but it is still kind of weird, is this a bug? or is it supposed to happen?

Correction: happened twice, first the elven, then a human caravan was ambushed and the same thing happened when they tried to flee to my fortress

:Friendly units can be caught in traps if they lose consciousness, which would usually be due to wounds. Although it could also happen if a dwarf with no bed happened to go to sleep on a trapped tile. --[[User:FunkyWaltDogg|FunkyWaltDogg]] 05:30, 31 March 2009 (UTC)

== Caged Dwarfs not immortal ==

So the bit about trapping berserk ones instead of killing them needs to be updated out of existence. I fiddeled with a rewrite where in I tried to say it myself, but I'm not very good, so I didn't post it.

== Stonefall traps not being reloaded?==
I don't know what is going on, but in my game, some of the stonefall traps don't seem to get reloaded since they show a whole bunch of stone on top of it which blinks as it should when icons are on top of each other, however, I'm not sure if this is normal or not.--[[User:Smjjames|Smjjames]] 21:56, 13 May 2009 (UTC)
:Sure they reload them, just not with the same stone. Because dwarves are stupid like that. I just dump the excess stones once they get annoying enough. --[[User:Corona688|Corona688]] 23:47, 13 May 2009 (UTC)
:: Apparently so. Anyways, it was looking like the stones were actually blocking the traps from working right, so I cleared them anyway. Those goblin seiges are pretty skittish, once they take a few casualties from my traps, they run like chickens.--[[User:Smjjames|Smjjames]] 01:28, 14 May 2009 (UTC)
:: It seems that when dwarves are assigned a job to load a trap, they will pick up stone closest to their current location, not closest to trap. --[[User:Denspb|Denspb]] 18:16, 14 May 2009 (UTC)

== Cage trap bug ==

recently I caught about 15 goblins in a siege so I decided to drop them in my volcano to prove a point to the rest. Well I dropped them in and then I noticed that one of my cage traps was smoking and that there was everything that a goblin bowmen would where in it. So after a couple of minutes I had gotten a screw pump ready to try and get rid of the smoke when my game crashed then I tried it again and the exact same thing happened. Im pretty sure that this is a bug but I cant be sure.--[[User:Cerol The Elf Hunter|Cerol The Elf Hunter]] 00:32, 3 June 2009 (UTC)

40d Talk:Island

2009-05-31T22:52:02Z

Cerol The Elf Hunter:

Um, I'm a complete newbie, and I want to make my first fortress on an island. What about the fact that you are immune to goblin attacks if you are on an island? What about some tips on how to make a fortress on an island? Help! -- Cayzle

This should be added to the <nowiki>{{world}}</nowiki> categories.

--[[User:JPolito|JPolito]] 17:55, 13 November 2007 (EST)

Oh wait. I figured out how to do it.

--[[User:JPolito|JPolito]] 18:02, 13 November 2007 (EST)

I'm pretty sure an island isn't a biome type. Also, I've yet to see the game mention islands at all. Like a valley, this is a feature that is created and then recieves no reference. [[User:VengefulDonut|VengefulDonut]] 09:27, 14 November 2007 (EST)

== Complete nonsense ==

As far as I can tell there is nothing useful about this article. The facts listed are all either completely untrue, utterly misleading, or don't related specifically to islands.

As mentioned, islands are not a feature in the game, there is nothing special about islands at all. If there is anything truly unique about them, then it is the comment about volcanoes:

# Often has a volcano

But I'm not even really convinced that is very accurate.[[User:Qalnor|Qalnor]] 14:27, 11 December 2007 (EST)

I agree. Delete this page. [[User:Bouchart|Bouchart]] 20:07, 11 December 2007 (EST)

== Rewrote the page. ==

I made the article a little less cluttered, but other than that not much. Islands really aren't all that different from other coastline, even if I like the aesthetics :P I suppose islands could be useful for escaping the hippy menace though. Can anyone verify what sea level is?

"Your first fortress" says that goblins will settle nearby you at a certain point if there weren't any to begin with. --[[User:Xonara|Xonara]] 00:22, 20 November 2008 (EST)

:Is that true? I'm not aware of a mechanism by which this happens. They don't siege until you have 80 dwarves -- maybe that's what the author of that line had in mind?--[[User:Maximus|Maximus]] 02:29, 20 November 2008 (EST)

::I've built in a remote corner of the map with my fortress population approaching 400 and no hostiles have ever showed up, haha. It's been eight years, so if there's a trigger, it has to be pretty obscure. --[[User:Navian|Navian]] 09:46, 20 November 2008 (EST)

== Deletion ==

This page appears to have been deleted once already with the reason that it was useless and unimportant. I still don't see why it should be kept. Anyone? --[[User:Savok|Savok]] 17:41, 11 December 2008 (EST)

:Doesn't seem that bad to me in its current form.--[[User:Maximus|Maximus]] 19:23, 11 December 2008 (EST)

:It's got info about the volcanoes and about how civs have a hard time trading over the seas. It's well-written enough, notes the general salinity of the aquifer and provides a place to gather info for new players who want to build on an island. I don't see a reason -to- delete it. --[[User:LucienSadi|LucienSadi]] 19:31, 11 December 2008 (EST)

:Voting to keep. --[[User:Jellyfishgreen|Jellyfishgreen]] 06:39, 17 December 2008 (EST)

:I'm of the opinion that some of this info is worthy of mention, but it's not really enough to fill an entire article. Perhaps it could be included in, say, [[Location]] or similar?--[[User:Quil|Quil]] 06:51, 17 December 2008 (EST)

I really should've clarified. Since an island differs from a beach in only two ways, one insignificant, I don't think that we need to have a separate page for island. 
The two ways are:
# If you choose a large embark area, you can have ocean on both sides of your fort. Insignificant.
# Most civs cannot reach you.
I think that this page should be made a small subsection in [[beach|Life next to an ocean]] in [[ocean]]. --[[User:Savok|Savok]] 14:39, 17 December 2008 (EST)

:I believe I concur. Just a sentence or two there and possibly in [[lake]], too? --[[User:Quil|Quil]] 15:50, 17 December 2008 (EST)

:I'm fine with that.--[[User:Maximus|Maximus]] 17:06, 17 December 2008 (EST)

:Actually I don't see how civs don't reach you on an island. I made a fort on an island, and even the elves came to trade in the spring of the second year. The fort wasn't all that rich as I only made cheap bone crafts. There were no engravings or anything. For that matter I couldn't even get to stone cause of aquifers. And in previous forts the elves came only after 2-3 years!!

So the only differences between an island and a beach are the fact that its possible to get ocean on both sides and the higher likelihood of there being a volcano on an island. Maybe we can combine this page and beach?--[[User:Stinhad Limarezum|Stinhad Limarezum]] 05:16, 19 March 2009 (UTC)

== Salty to fresh ==

The article says "should you start a fortress on an island you better know how to turn salt water into fresh water" Is this actually possible or was it just a joke.--[[User:Cerol The Elf Hunter|Cerol The Elf Hunter]] 22:48, 31 May 2009 (UTC)

Never mind looked it up you can if you make the water go through screw pump. --[[User:Cerol The Elf Hunter|Cerol The Elf Hunter]] 22:52, 31 May 2009 (UTC)

40d Talk:Island

2009-05-31T22:48:01Z

Cerol The Elf Hunter: /* Salty to fresh */ new section

40d Talk:Troll

2009-05-31T20:26:24Z

Cerol The Elf Hunter:

I wasn't sure where else to put this... 
 
Will a building destroying creature damage constructed walls/stairs/ramps/etc? 
Or will a simple one width wall stop any damage to your fort? 
--[[User:Lordmick134|Lordmick134]] 11:35, 21 April 2008 (EDT)

:I did some testing with a [[bronze colossus]] -- it looks like building-destroyers ignore walls and fortifications. They are also blocked by a one-tile channel. [[User:Anydwarf|Anydwarf]] 12:06, 21 April 2008 (EDT)

== No bones? ==

Article says N/A for bones and other things. Does this mean that trolls leave no corpse or that it cannot be used after it rots?– [[template:unsigned|unsigned]] comment by [[User:Someone-else|Someone-else]]
:It means that you can't butcher the corpse to get shit from it. It's size 9, though, so I assume it leaves nine bones. --[[User:GreyMario|GreyMario]] 20:26, 21 April 2008 (EDT)
:Hypothetically, you ''could'' butcher them if you slaughtered them as livestock, but they're not pets or pet_exotics so you can't tame them in order to do so. --[[User:JT|JT]] 20:39, 21 April 2008 (EDT)

So, why can't we add a parameter to the template to make it say "rotting leaves", so we can actually give information to the people reading the articles? [[User:Anydwarf|Anydwarf]] 21:47, 21 April 2008 (EDT)

:Yes, this would be a good thing. While the article doesn't state "Their bones are valuable, but you can't get them" usage of the word "although" suggests that. --[[User:Someone-else|Someone-else]] 07:34, 22 April 2008 (EDT)

::OK, I edited the template. I still don't know about the bones, somebody who does will need to add that. [[User:Anydwarf|Anydwarf]] 14:49, 22 April 2008 (EDT)

:::Rhesus macaques are size 3 and leave three bones. Therefore, trolls are size 9 and thus leave nine bones. --[[User:GreyMario|GreyMario]] 17:13, 22 April 2008 (EDT)

==Only in evil?==

Do Trolls only show up in evil biomes? I have had multiple seiges of 50+ goblins but nary a troll/beak dog/etc. Just simple goblins. It is [[fun]] to watch the traps get sprung!--[[User:Kwieland|Kwieland]] 16:19, 31 March 2009 (UTC)

No they do not. I had a siege of 30 goblins and 8 trolls in an untamed wilderness biome.--[[User:Cerol The Elf Hunter|Cerol The Elf Hunter]] 20:26, 31 May 2009 (UTC)

Category talk:Humanoids

2009-05-31T20:17:07Z

Cerol The Elf Hunter:

Is it possible for demons be placed in this category? They seem to not fit in the animal category.--[[User:Richards|Richards]] 23:59, 26 April 2008 (EDT)

== Unlisted ==

I have seen a bunch of man infused species that are not listed here like Tigermen and slugmen maybe we should add those.--[[User:Cerol The Elf Hunter|Cerol The Elf Hunter]] 20:17, 31 May 2009 (UTC)

Category talk:Humanoids

2009-05-31T20:16:48Z

Cerol The Elf Hunter: /* Unlisted */ new section

40d Talk:Olmman

2009-05-31T20:10:28Z

Cerol The Elf Hunter: Created page with 'What the crap is an olm.--~~~~'

What the crap is an olm.--[[User:Cerol The Elf Hunter|Cerol The Elf Hunter]] 20:10, 31 May 2009 (UTC)

40d Talk:Hydra

2009-05-30T14:05:31Z

Cerol The Elf Hunter:

Even though hydras have seven heads I have only gotten one skull from butchering them, not seven. Someone please confirm this. [[User:Bouchart|Bouchart]] 18:48, 23 November 2007 (EST)

Confirm. The game code for skull dropping doesn't support multiple heads. --[[User:Karlito|Karlito]] 01:28, 26 November 2007 (EST)
:Uou can, however, accidentally cut several heads of it's body. Then each head will give you a skull, after it rot.--[[User:Dorten|Dorten]] 23:23, 22 January 2008 (EST)

just captured a hydra after it continually rammed it's heads on my 3rd front door which had many stone fall traps after chasing a cat and killing a legendary armorsmith. should i keep it or save my armor smith by resetting the game? --[[User:Seaneat|Seaneat]] 16:44, 30 June 2008 (EDT)

:Now that the hydra's tasted dwarf blood it's untameable (see [[Talk:Tame]]), so in practical terms you're probably better off with the legendary armorsmith. Though for roleplaying reasons you might still want to install the hydra's cage in an execution pit to use for sport, or other such things. [[User:Bryan Derksen|Bryan Derksen]] 19:41, 30 June 2008 (EDT)

captured it with no casualties.
just needed a few tries, changed a load of people's allowed labor and disabled all stockpiles.
i think i spent the whole day trying to capture the monster...it changed locations and species after reset. even if they go after dwarves but not hurting them, can they still be tamed?

For a "Megabeast" I expected an epic battle, instead it chased a bunch of random haulers around for a bit (without catching any of them) and was killed by a single weapon trap with 5 green glass discs. Apparently the first triggering knocked the Hydra out without really wounding it and it continued to fire until I had a lovely Hydra tartare. Is this typically anti-climatic? [[User:HeWhoIsPale|HeWhoIsPale]] 08:51, 29 August 2008 (EDT)
:Megabeast attacks tend to either be complete disaster or a footnote, depending on how well you're prepared. It's rarely something in between. Bronze Collossi tend to be the 'disaster' route, though. You can, at your discretion, mod Hydras and Dragons to be a lot tougher by putting scales on them in the raws, so your dwarves have to mangle up an entire layer of scales before they can harm the megabeast at all. Cage traps make basically every megabeast attack a footnote, so if you want epic struggles, don't use them. --[[User:ThunderClaw|ThunderClaw]] 12:02, 3 November 2008 (EST)

During a siege I had a hydra attack and 4 hammer goblins killed it within the first second of meetiing it without any causualties then they turned around and massacred my army. It was very anti-climatic and fortress ending.--[[User:Cerol The Elf Hunter|Cerol The Elf Hunter]] 14:05, 30 May 2009 (UTC)

::Or give 'em [[Creature_tokens#T|[TRAPAVOID]]].--[[User:Maximus|Maximus]] 13:19, 3 November 2008 (EST)

40d Talk:Hydra

2009-05-30T14:04:36Z

Cerol The Elf Hunter:

Even though hydras have seven heads I have only gotten one skull from butchering them, not seven. Someone please confirm this. [[User:Bouchart|Bouchart]] 18:48, 23 November 2007 (EST)

Confirm. The game code for skull dropping doesn't support multiple heads. --[[User:Karlito|Karlito]] 01:28, 26 November 2007 (EST)
:Uou can, however, accidentally cut several heads of it's body. Then each head will give you a skull, after it rot.--[[User:Dorten|Dorten]] 23:23, 22 January 2008 (EST)

just captured a hydra after it continually rammed it's heads on my 3rd front door which had many stone fall traps after chasing a cat and killing a legendary armorsmith. should i keep it or save my armor smith by resetting the game? --[[User:Seaneat|Seaneat]] 16:44, 30 June 2008 (EDT)

:Now that the hydra's tasted dwarf blood it's untameable (see [[Talk:Tame]]), so in practical terms you're probably better off with the legendary armorsmith. Though for roleplaying reasons you might still want to install the hydra's cage in an execution pit to use for sport, or other such things. [[User:Bryan Derksen|Bryan Derksen]] 19:41, 30 June 2008 (EDT)

captured it with no casualties.
just needed a few tries, changed a load of people's allowed labor and disabled all stockpiles.
i think i spent the whole day trying to capture the monster...it changed locations and species after reset. even if they go after dwarves but not hurting them, can they still be tamed?

For a "Megabeast" I expected an epic battle, instead it chased a bunch of random haulers around for a bit (without catching any of them) and was killed by a single weapon trap with 5 green glass discs. Apparently the first triggering knocked the Hydra out without really wounding it and it continued to fire until I had a lovely Hydra tartare. Is this typically anti-climatic? [[User:HeWhoIsPale|HeWhoIsPale]] 08:51, 29 August 2008 (EDT)
:Megabeast attacks tend to either be complete disaster or a footnote, depending on how well you're prepared. It's rarely something in between. Bronze Collossi tend to be the 'disaster' route, though. You can, at your discretion, mod Hydras and Dragons to be a lot tougher by putting scales on them in the raws, so your dwarves have to mangle up an entire layer of scales before they can harm the megabeast at all. Cage traps make basically every megabeast attack a footnote, so if you want epic struggles, don't use them. --[[User:ThunderClaw|ThunderClaw]] 12:02, 3 November 2008 (EST)

During a siege I had a hydra attack and 4 hammer goblins killed it within the first second of meetiing it without any causualties then they turned around and massacred my army. It was very anti-climatic and fortress ending.

::Or give 'em [[Creature_tokens#T|[TRAPAVOID]]].--[[User:Maximus|Maximus]] 13:19, 3 November 2008 (EST)

Category talk:Megabeasts

2009-05-29T22:58:19Z

Cerol The Elf Hunter: /* Megabeast battles */ new section

I think this article needs some more info on what exactly a megabeast is (like what makes a megabeast a megabeast) and some more helpful info like if fortress wealth can effect if they appear or not and good ways to defend against them. I would add all of this, but let's just say, I am no expert in this subject. --[[User:Demaster72|Demaster72]] 01:07, 29 November 2008 (EST)

Just realized that this is just a category page, maybe it needs to be made into an article? --[[User:Demaster72|Demaster72]] 01:08, 29 November 2008 (EST)

Agreed, A megabeast article would be useful, unfortunately I dont have the facts on megabeasts to make one.--[[User:Cultiststeve|cultiststeve]] 15:14, 13 January 2009 (EST)

----

what wealth attracts any megabeast? im at 926000 created wealth, and yet the worst that has happend is that 5 goblins have died attacking!

I find it really cute that these monsters spend a lot of time chasing things like cats.
While I prepare traps.--[[User:Seaneat|Seaneat]] 16:22, 30 June 2008 (EDT)

== Megabeast battles ==

I was going to build a huge labryinth with megabeast's running about and hunting down my prisoners Ive dropped in, but then I realized that the megabeast's might just slaughter each other. So If anybody knows if megabeast's attack each other it would be appreciated if would tell me.--[[User:Cerol The Elf Hunter|Cerol The Elf Hunter]] 22:58, 29 May 2009 (UTC)

User:Cerol The Elf Hunter

2009-05-29T22:48:45Z

Cerol The Elf Hunter:

Hello I am Cerol the elf hunter. I love playing this game and as you can tell I hate elves.You may be wondering where I got my name well Ill tell you. As you probably know Cerol is a dwarf name. It was also the name of my favorite dwarf ever. He was my original miner in my first fortress he was killed by a goblin ambush while trying to reload a stone trap. Now why I hate elves. Well one day an elven caravan came to my fortress and It was ambushed by goblins then slaughtered. So the elves decide to blame me for it and they attack me. Well I fight them off but I lose two dwarves. Well It just so happens that They were friends with almost every dwarf in the fortress. So my fortress tantrums into a boiling pit of despair

Just in case anyone wonders I play on 38d version.

I just started a fortress called sazirimsal. In my area I have a volcano a brook and an abundance of magnetite. looks like a keeper.

Well I just found out sazirimsal has a large goblin population so I guess It will be a military fortress.

Lately I have built a water death trap. I was having a bunch of ambushes so I decided to find a way to despose of all my goblitaking ns. So I built a long hallway and put down two pressure plates. One of them was attached to the bridges at each end and the other plate was attached to the floodgates. Then I pulled a lever that opened the floodgates to my brook and drowned all of the goblins. 15 in all died from the trap and the 16th gobbo ran ahead of everybody else and got in a skirmish with 2 marksdwarves and an elite marksdwarf. long story short I lost 1 marksdwarf and the goblin finally died because my expert swordsdwarf charged him getting his left hand shot off in the process and his lung pierced.

lately I had a dwarf make a horse bone floodgate made with aluminum and pine bands it had an image of a dwarf surounded by the dwarves. It was worth 104 thousand

Lately I had a gigantic siege of 30 goblin bowmen and 8 trolls. Also a goblin Mace lord and an Axe lord. I had hundreds of traps and I caught about 15 bowmen 4 trolls and the Mace lord and the Axe lord. I was very surprised to see my legendary miner cleave straight through 3 trolls killing them while only taking a broken arm out of the fight then he carried himself to his bed to rest.

Due to an accident involving an Elvin caravan, a faulty lever ,and a goblin Axe Lord I just had 3 talented hammerdwarves massacred and my champion sworddwarf's right arm lopped off. So I decided that I shall totally militarize Sazirimsal. Ive decided that at I should at least have 50% of my dwarves in the military.

User:Cerol The Elf Hunter

2009-05-29T02:31:23Z

Cerol The Elf Hunter:

User:Cerol The Elf Hunter

2009-05-28T02:36:17Z

Cerol The Elf Hunter:

40d Talk:Vermin

2009-05-28T02:24:57Z

Cerol The Elf Hunter:

Can someone put a list of all the vermin, and their uses if caught? And a picture? --[[User:DDouble|DDouble]] 21:55, 11 November 2007 (EST)
:What would be the use of the picture? --[[User:Eagle of Fire|Eagle of Fire]] 00:24, 12 November 2007 (EST)
::Just to clarify in case the first poster didn't know, vermin all use the same image. --[[User:Shades|Shades]] 09:13, 12 November 2007 (EST)

:::Not quite. Lungfish vermin, for instance, use a fish-like symbol, worms use a tilde, etc. However, most do use the simple "large dot" graphic. --[[User:JT|JT]] 16:30, 18 November 2007 (EST)

:I just listed them all, with most pertinent information. Hope you like. Now someone should go list all the extracts. --[[User:Turgid Bolk|Turgid Bolk]] 02:08, 26 November 2007 (EST)

== un tameable vermin ==

Fire snakes when caught in an animal trap had a value of 1. I was unable to tame them and the announcement "needs tameable small creature item" appeared. --[[User:Kingzilla|Kingzilla]] 14:18, 23 January 2008 (EST)

In addition to that, they keep disappearing from cages and small animal traps on me. --[[User:Squirrelloid|Squirrelloid]] 16:28, 12 December 2008 (EST)
: You need the [[Dungeon Master]] to tame as they are PET_EXOTIC. I also have the suspicion they are burning their way out of wooden traps every so often, but can't prove it. I think they burned a barrel once, leaving the contents behind. --[[User:Jellyfishgreen|Jellyfishgreen]] 08:01, 14 January 2009 (EST)

::Had Dungeon Master. I trapped one in an animal trap, then moved it into a cage with a lot of other animals. Saw that it was there. Did some other things and when I looked again it was no longer in the cage, but the cage was most definitely still there. (Cage was also metal, but its continued existence on its own sort of ruled out the possibility that it burned). They were making a mess of my metal bar bins by turning them to ash, which was why I was trapping them in the first place. --[[User:Squirrelloid|Squirrelloid]] 10:31, 14 January 2009 (EST)

:::If I had to guess, it's possible that a dwarf decided to eat it. I've caught my dwarves eating vermin out of my cages, sometimes, even if they aren't starving. Some dwarves just like to eat weird things, I suppose. It seems odd that a dwarf would eat something that can set things on fire, but I've never seen anything to indicate that they can't. --[[User:Xennith|Xennith]] 7:34, 27 February 2009 (PST)

== Creating vermin habitat ==

I know you can make vermin show up to your base (try a tundra biome with an aquifer - if the stuff belowground stays liquid you can have toads hopping around in the snow :S. Also, I dug out some open cliffside dwellings in a random jungle map, and 5 min later about 50 or so bats turn up singing Meatloaf, and causing miasma hell for my dwarves after they were (mostly) dispatched by my two cats :(. Can anyone else replicate these (or other) situations to confirm my hypothesis? --[[User:Frostedfire|Frostedfire]] 04:21, 19 February 2008 (EST)

:Apparently vermin (and everything else?) spawn by biome. So, if you dig into a cave biome, you'll get bats. I dug next to a chasm and suddenly cave spiders spawn in my tunnel. [[User:Anydwarf|Anydwarf]] 22:37, 6 May 2008 (EDT)

:I started a fortress in the freezing tundra, no life there except my dwarves, wild musk-oxen, wild elk and the inhabitants of the magma-pipe. But as soon as I pumped some water into a cave one level beneath the surface, turtles started to spawn near the self-made underground pool. So apparently even a self-made pool of water is sufficient for pool-vermin ([[toad|toads]] and [[turtle|turtles]]) to make them spawn. --[[User:Doub|Doub]] 16:02, 9 September 2008 (EDT)

== Tameable? ==

There should be a list of -- or mark on -- tameable vermin.

At the very least, there should be a mention that only some can be tamed.

Currently, I know rats can be tamed, while fire snakes and two-legged rhino lizards cannot.

I have a tame fire snake. I'm pretty sure all non-fish vermin creatures are tameable. [[User:Bouchart|Bouchart]] 19:36, 5 March 2008 (EST)

:fire snakes and rhino lizards can be tamed, they are just [PET_EXOTIC]. not all non-fish vermin can be tamed(flies cant for example), and some fish vermin can be(turtles). -[[User:Chariot|Chariot]] 20:22, 5 March 2008 (EST)

Is there a way to get my dwarves to stop eating the fluffy wamblers before I can tame them? Apparently they taste like meat and saltwater taffy had a baby. Or something. (Maybe I just have to be pretty quick on handing my DM the task) [[User:Anydwarf|Anydwarf]] 22:37, 6 May 2008 (EDT)

:Not without a lot of micro-management. Even being quick to assign the task isn't enough, the dwarves will just snatch it right out of his hand. However, if you follow your trapper around as he's searching, and immediately forbid the vermin when he catches it (note: the vermin, not the trap), that'll prevent your dwarves from eating it. This works because eating requires the vermin itself to be unforbidden, but taming only requires that the animal trap is available. --[[User:Morlark|Morlark]] 19:31, 21 June 2008 (EDT)

== Corpse patrol ==

alright I guess this is just a winge...

is there any order to set (or anything else I can do) to get my dwarves to clean up vermin corpses without me manually marking them for dumping?

I guess I'm looking for an order: Autodump vermin corpses or something.
I know if I {{k|k}}{{k|d}} each corpse then it gets dumped pretty quick, but especially once my population goes up I'd like to not worry so much about miasma in the dining room.[[User:GarrieIrons|GarrieIrons]] 08:23, 21 June 2008 (EDT)

: AFAIK dead vermin will be automatically placed in a refuse stockpile, so long as 'Dwarves gather refuse' is selected in the refuse options menu ({{k|o}}{{k|r}}) --[[User:Raumkraut|Raumkraut]] 19:15, 21 June 2008 (EDT)
:: This seems to be what is happening now that I actually have some peasants wandering around on cleaning/food hauling/refuse hauling only... so it sounds like vermin corpses are a lesser priority for picking up for refuse haulers then items marked for dumping are.[[User:GarrieIrons|GarrieIrons]] 07:27, 22 June 2008 (EDT)

== repopulation ==

The [[turtle]] article states:
:Like most fish, they can be harvested too aggressively, and become depleted until the next '''repopulating of vermin'''
I added the bold bit... when does repopulating of vermin occur? Randomly? At spring (on a date) or during thaw (if there is one?) or differently by biome?[[User:GarrieIrons|GarrieIrons]] 01:06, 9 July 2008 (EDT)

Vermin respawn on season changes, along with refuse erasure and limb-mending, if I remember correctly. May be wrong, though. [[User:Iituem|Iituem]] 21:37, 5 Aug 2008 (GMT)

== Flies... ==

Is there anyway to kill flies?

I second this question! :) Is there anyway to kill these things? [[User:Ehertlein|Ehertlein]] 16:34, 5 August 2008 (EDT)
:Cats can kill them. [[User:HeWhoIsPale|HeWhoIsPale]] 16:13, 9 September 2008 (EDT)

== Rats ==

According to my animal and vermin list when I access cages, I have a "Live Rat" somewhere in my fortress that I don't recall ever catching. I've tried to install it into a placed "vermin cage" but it never shows up. I've asked my Trainer to tame it, but the task cancels itself and the rat never surfaces. Has some dwarf been carrying around a rat in his pockets for the last three years and refuses to give it up? --[[User:FJH|FJH]] 15:49, 17 April 2009 (UTC)
:Maybe you walled it in? ;) --[[User:Höhlenschreck|Höhlenschreck]] 23:46, 27 May 2009 (UTC)
:Or, more likely, its already tame? Try assigning it to a built cage? --[[User:Höhlenschreck|Höhlenschreck]] 23:47, 27 May 2009 (UTC)

== Already tamed ==

I was checking my animal screen and I noticed I had a tamed lizard. I have not trained any animals or even built a kennel nor have I built any small animal traps. Does anybody know how that may have happened.--[[User:Cerol The Elf Hunter|Cerol The Elf Hunter]] 21:47, 25 May 2009 (UTC)
:The elves. It was the Elves.--[[User:Zchris13|Zchris13]] 00:06, 26 May 2009 (UTC)
::isn't it always the elves? ;) --[[User:Höhlenschreck|Höhlenschreck]] 00:05, 28 May 2009 (UTC) 
:Specifically, you probably bought a cage from the [[Elf|Elves]], which looked empty, but had a vermin creature in it. During trading, if you {{key|v}}iew the cage, it will list the contents, including any vermin in it. —[[User:0x517A5D|0x517A5D]] 03:50, 26 May 2009 (UTC)
Your probably right I have seized and destroyed many elvin caravans lately --[[User:Cerol The Elf Hunter|Cerol The Elf Hunter]] 02:24, 28 May 2009 (UTC)

User:Cerol The Elf Hunter

2009-05-25T23:31:57Z

Cerol The Elf Hunter:

User:Cerol The Elf Hunter

2009-05-25T23:14:56Z

Cerol The Elf Hunter:

User:Cerol The Elf Hunter

2009-05-25T23:13:21Z

Cerol The Elf Hunter:

40d Talk:Vermin

2009-05-25T21:47:13Z

Cerol The Elf Hunter: /* Already tamed */ new section

Can someone put a list of all the vermin, and their uses if caught? And a picture? --[[User:DDouble|DDouble]] 21:55, 11 November 2007 (EST)
:What would be the use of the picture? --[[User:Eagle of Fire|Eagle of Fire]] 00:24, 12 November 2007 (EST)
::Just to clarify in case the first poster didn't know, vermin all use the same image. --[[User:Shades|Shades]] 09:13, 12 November 2007 (EST)

:::Not quite. Lungfish vermin, for instance, use a fish-like symbol, worms use a tilde, etc. However, most do use the simple "large dot" graphic. --[[User:JT|JT]] 16:30, 18 November 2007 (EST)

:I just listed them all, with most pertinent information. Hope you like. Now someone should go list all the extracts. --[[User:Turgid Bolk|Turgid Bolk]] 02:08, 26 November 2007 (EST)

== un tameable vermin ==

Fire snakes when caught in an animal trap had a value of 1. I was unable to tame them and the announcement "needs tameable small creature item" appeared. --[[User:Kingzilla|Kingzilla]] 14:18, 23 January 2008 (EST)

In addition to that, they keep disappearing from cages and small animal traps on me. --[[User:Squirrelloid|Squirrelloid]] 16:28, 12 December 2008 (EST)
: You need the [[Dungeon Master]] to tame as they are PET_EXOTIC. I also have the suspicion they are burning their way out of wooden traps every so often, but can't prove it. I think they burned a barrel once, leaving the contents behind. --[[User:Jellyfishgreen|Jellyfishgreen]] 08:01, 14 January 2009 (EST)

::Had Dungeon Master. I trapped one in an animal trap, then moved it into a cage with a lot of other animals. Saw that it was there. Did some other things and when I looked again it was no longer in the cage, but the cage was most definitely still there. (Cage was also metal, but its continued existence on its own sort of ruled out the possibility that it burned). They were making a mess of my metal bar bins by turning them to ash, which was why I was trapping them in the first place. --[[User:Squirrelloid|Squirrelloid]] 10:31, 14 January 2009 (EST)

:::If I had to guess, it's possible that a dwarf decided to eat it. I've caught my dwarves eating vermin out of my cages, sometimes, even if they aren't starving. Some dwarves just like to eat weird things, I suppose. It seems odd that a dwarf would eat something that can set things on fire, but I've never seen anything to indicate that they can't. --[[User:Xennith|Xennith]] 7:34, 27 February 2009 (PST)

== Creating vermin habitat ==

I know you can make vermin show up to your base (try a tundra biome with an aquifer - if the stuff belowground stays liquid you can have toads hopping around in the snow :S. Also, I dug out some open cliffside dwellings in a random jungle map, and 5 min later about 50 or so bats turn up singing Meatloaf, and causing miasma hell for my dwarves after they were (mostly) dispatched by my two cats :(. Can anyone else replicate these (or other) situations to confirm my hypothesis? --[[User:Frostedfire|Frostedfire]] 04:21, 19 February 2008 (EST)

:Apparently vermin (and everything else?) spawn by biome. So, if you dig into a cave biome, you'll get bats. I dug next to a chasm and suddenly cave spiders spawn in my tunnel. [[User:Anydwarf|Anydwarf]] 22:37, 6 May 2008 (EDT)

:I started a fortress in the freezing tundra, no life there except my dwarves, wild musk-oxen, wild elk and the inhabitants of the magma-pipe. But as soon as I pumped some water into a cave one level beneath the surface, turtles started to spawn near the self-made underground pool. So apparently even a self-made pool of water is sufficient for pool-vermin ([[toad|toads]] and [[turtle|turtles]]) to make them spawn. --[[User:Doub|Doub]] 16:02, 9 September 2008 (EDT)

== Tameable? ==

There should be a list of -- or mark on -- tameable vermin.

At the very least, there should be a mention that only some can be tamed.

Currently, I know rats can be tamed, while fire snakes and two-legged rhino lizards cannot.

I have a tame fire snake. I'm pretty sure all non-fish vermin creatures are tameable. [[User:Bouchart|Bouchart]] 19:36, 5 March 2008 (EST)

:fire snakes and rhino lizards can be tamed, they are just [PET_EXOTIC]. not all non-fish vermin can be tamed(flies cant for example), and some fish vermin can be(turtles). -[[User:Chariot|Chariot]] 20:22, 5 March 2008 (EST)

Is there a way to get my dwarves to stop eating the fluffy wamblers before I can tame them? Apparently they taste like meat and saltwater taffy had a baby. Or something. (Maybe I just have to be pretty quick on handing my DM the task) [[User:Anydwarf|Anydwarf]] 22:37, 6 May 2008 (EDT)

:Not without a lot of micro-management. Even being quick to assign the task isn't enough, the dwarves will just snatch it right out of his hand. However, if you follow your trapper around as he's searching, and immediately forbid the vermin when he catches it (note: the vermin, not the trap), that'll prevent your dwarves from eating it. This works because eating requires the vermin itself to be unforbidden, but taming only requires that the animal trap is available. --[[User:Morlark|Morlark]] 19:31, 21 June 2008 (EDT)

== Corpse patrol ==

alright I guess this is just a winge...

is there any order to set (or anything else I can do) to get my dwarves to clean up vermin corpses without me manually marking them for dumping?

I guess I'm looking for an order: Autodump vermin corpses or something.
I know if I {{k|k}}{{k|d}} each corpse then it gets dumped pretty quick, but especially once my population goes up I'd like to not worry so much about miasma in the dining room.[[User:GarrieIrons|GarrieIrons]] 08:23, 21 June 2008 (EDT)

: AFAIK dead vermin will be automatically placed in a refuse stockpile, so long as 'Dwarves gather refuse' is selected in the refuse options menu ({{k|o}}{{k|r}}) --[[User:Raumkraut|Raumkraut]] 19:15, 21 June 2008 (EDT)
:: This seems to be what is happening now that I actually have some peasants wandering around on cleaning/food hauling/refuse hauling only... so it sounds like vermin corpses are a lesser priority for picking up for refuse haulers then items marked for dumping are.[[User:GarrieIrons|GarrieIrons]] 07:27, 22 June 2008 (EDT)

== repopulation ==

The [[turtle]] article states:
:Like most fish, they can be harvested too aggressively, and become depleted until the next '''repopulating of vermin'''
I added the bold bit... when does repopulating of vermin occur? Randomly? At spring (on a date) or during thaw (if there is one?) or differently by biome?[[User:GarrieIrons|GarrieIrons]] 01:06, 9 July 2008 (EDT)

Vermin respawn on season changes, along with refuse erasure and limb-mending, if I remember correctly. May be wrong, though. [[User:Iituem|Iituem]] 21:37, 5 Aug 2008 (GMT)

== Flies... ==

Is there anyway to kill flies?

I second this question! :) Is there anyway to kill these things? [[User:Ehertlein|Ehertlein]] 16:34, 5 August 2008 (EDT)
:Cats can kill them. [[User:HeWhoIsPale|HeWhoIsPale]] 16:13, 9 September 2008 (EDT)

== Rats ==

According to my animal and vermin list when I access cages, I have a "Live Rat" somewhere in my fortress that I don't recall ever catching. I've tried to install it into a placed "vermin cage" but it never shows up. I've asked my Trainer to tame it, but the task cancels itself and the rat never surfaces. Has some dwarf been carrying around a rat in his pockets for the last three years and refuses to give it up? --[[User:FJH|FJH]] 15:49, 17 April 2009 (UTC)

== Already tamed ==

I was checking my animal screen and I noticed I had a tamed lizard. I have not trained any animals or even built a kennel nor have I built any small animal traps. Does anybody know how that may have happened.--[[User:Cerol The Elf Hunter|Cerol The Elf Hunter]] 21:47, 25 May 2009 (UTC)

User:Cerol The Elf Hunter

2009-05-25T21:13:19Z

Cerol The Elf Hunter: Created page with 'Hello I am Cerol the elf hunter. I love playing this game and as you can tell I hate elves'

Hello I am Cerol the elf hunter. I love playing this game and as you can tell I hate elves