Dwarf Fortress Wiki - User contributions [en]

v0.31:Health care

2010-11-20T19:13:02Z

Doub: typo

{{quality|Exceptional|20:36, 13 August 2010 (UTC)}}{{av}}
{{buggy|bugsection=Bugs}}

'''Hospitals''' are a {{l|Activity zone#Hospital|zone}} designated via the {{l|Activity zone|zone menu}}. Hospitals use any beds, tables, traction benches, and boxes/bags that are within these zones. You may also alter how much {{l|thread}}, {{l|cloth}}, {{l|splint}}s, {{l|crutch}}es, {{l|plaster powder}} for casts, {{l|bucket}}s, and {{l|soap}} hospitals use.

'''Doctors''' are dwarves assigned to any of the five medical labors; dressing wounds, diagnosis, surgery, setting bones, and suturing. All doctors in the fortress operate under the instruction of the {{l|Chief Medical Dwarf}}, an appointed {{l|noble}}. Doctors perform medicine on a dwarf only after treatment has been prescribed by a diagnostician. Doctors do not perform any healthcare on animals, despite injured animals "requesting" diagnosis in the {{l|Health screen|z-health screen}}.

All beds within a hospital zone are automatically Hospital beds, where injured dwarves will go to recuperate. Tired healthy dwarves will occasionally camp there too if the hospital is close, even if they have their own bed.

== Medical Skills ==
There are five doctor skills - how critical they are is unclear at the moment, but from [[Toady]]'s pre-release comments we can assume they are moderately important to the healing process.

Skill (& Profession)

* {{l|Diagnosis}} (Diagnostician) This skill is used at the start of the treatment of every wounded; used a lot and also needed by your chief medical dwarf
* {{l|Wound Dressing}} (Wound Dresser) This is also used pretty often; any wound seems to need it
* {{l|Suturing}} (Suturer) Fairly common; most open wounds (from cutting) seem to need it?
* {{l|Surgery}} (Surgeon) Somewhat less common; amongst others, wounds to organs seem to require it
* {{l|Setting Bones}} (Bone Doctor) This is obviously needed for broken bones, but perhaps not for all?

===Non-doctor labors===

"Non"-doctors have 2 {{L|labor}}s that contribute to healthcare:

* Feed Patients/Prisoners
* Recover Wounded

Note that these are not {{L|skill}}s - they do not cause experience gain, but merely are activities that can be turned on/off for each dwarf. By default, all dwarfs start with these labors designated.

==Setting up a Hospital==
* You must have assigned a Chief Medical Dwarf to diagnose patients. Without a diagnosis, patients cannot be treated. If they cannot be treated, they will occupy the hospital area until they die, performing no function. (Any dwarf with the Diagnosis labor enabled can diagnose dwarves, but the Chief Medical Dwarf may impact the diagnosis job creation.)
* Ensure your doctors have their respective healthcare labors enabled through {{k|v}}-{{k|p}}-{{k|l}} in order to handle treatments.
* Hit {{k|i}} and set up a hospital [[zone]] for the area you plan on having your hospital in. Be sure "Hospital" is highlighted.
* Place enough beds in that zone to ensure you can keep all wounded dwarves in the hospital, plus a few spare that will be occupied by lazy couch-surfers.
* Build at least four containers ({{k|b}}-{{k|h}}) to store hospital supplies.
* Build tables ({{k|b}}-{{k|t}}) for surgeons to perform surgery on. You may perform surgery without tables; it will be more messy.
** Place the tables right next to the beds, or you will get "cancels surgery, patient not resting" spam, as moving the sleeping patient more than one square from the bed to the table wakes up the patient [http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=60231.0]
* Build one (or more) traction benches to handle compound fractures when the dwarf requires "immobilization."

== Broken bones ==

Broken bones require additional medical peripherals/devices to be properly treated.

=== Traction Benches ===

A '''traction bench''' is used by a {{l|doctor}} in a {{l|Hospital|hospital zone}} to immobilize a dwarf that has sustained complex or overlapping fractures.

It is constructed in the {{l|Mechanic's workshop}}, and requires a {{l|table}}, a {{l|mechanism}}, and a {{l|rope}} to construct.

=== Casts ===

Casts are made out of {{l|plaster powder}} and are used to keep broken bones in their proper place until healed. To store it in a hospital, create a stockpile with furniture/siege ammo enabled, metals allowed (is this needed?), core and total quality all allowed, material plant cloth, and boxes and bags individually selected. Gypsum plaster under "other stones" should also be selected. Applying a cast also requires a bucket and cloth, and a water source.

Plaster powder is produced at a {{L|kiln}} or {{L|magma kiln}} from {{L|gypsum}}, {{L|alabaster}}, {{L|selenite}}, or {{L|satinspar}} and an empty {{L|bag}} by a dwarf with the furnace operator skill enabled. They can also be bought at embark for 3 points per unit, with each unit coming with a free {{L|bag}}.

=== Crutches ===

{|
|Crutches are represented with the symbol
|{{RT0|┬|#770}}
|.
|}

A dwarf that needs to use a crutch/crutches will gain experience in the '''Crutch Walking''' skill, which Toady has stated will reduce the speed penalty for having to use crutches. Presumably, at legendary, they will move just as fast as without crutches. Testing remains to be seen whether using crutches causes any other penalties that this skill might reduce.

'''See Also:'''
*{{l|Health screen|z-health screen}}

==Infection==
Every open wound can become infected. Infections may heal over time, however, many dwarves will die due to infection, often months after the actual wounding

Causes of infection include:
* No cleaning of the wounds
* Cleaning with water from a stagnant water source
* Cleaning without soap
* Medical operation from unskilled doctors {{verify}}
* Bad luck

==Tips for an Effective Hospital==
* Regularly use ({{k|i}}-{{k|H}}) to examine your hospital stockpile. Ensure your hospital is well-stocked. If you run out of materials regularly, increase the limits.
* It is possible to do without soap in the hospital stockpile. Choosing to do so, however, increases the risk of infection, which most likely will kill your dwarf. Consult the {{l|soap}} page to understand that industry. Bring a 2 lye on embark for easy soap.
* Put a well inside the hospital for maximum efficiency. Doctors need to wash regularly, and clean water reduces infection.
* Do not place chairs next your surgery tables. A chair is an invitation for rat-roast eating freeloaders to block the medical process.
* Consider making use of burrows to ensure your healthcare workers stay in the area.
* You may wish to consider individual rooms for each bed if you find your doctors are choosing to treat Urist McScratched over Urist McBloodFountainTheGushing. A locked door minimizes the mess and thereby infection and allows you to prioritize.
* The Chief Medical Dwarf should be kept unbusy and near the hospital, as no treatment will begin until he has diagnosed them.
** Yes, expecting him to also treat dwarves is a distraction. When you have multiple dwarves needing a diagnosis, the other medical dwarves cannot start work until he has finished.
* Create "nurses" by setting dwarves to only use the Recover Wounded, Bring Food and Water labors.
** It is important not to distract doctors from treating patients.
** "Give food" and "Give water" are low priority jobs, so it is entirely possible for a patient to starve to death if no one ever gets "unbusy" enough to bring them food.
** Similarly, it is important not to put your doctors at risk by recovering wounded in the middle of a battle—if they become injured, they cannot treat themselves.
* You can select nurses who enjoy helping people to give them good thoughts. This helps prevent dwarves that hate bringing others food from receiving unhappy thoughts for being "forced" to.
* Consult the talk page where past bugs are detailed. Healthcare started out with many bugs. Some of those bugs may no longer be valid.

Dwarves will prefer to store and use the most expensive thread and cloth. Yes, that includes '''adamantine strands'''. ''Fortunately,'' adamantine is not nearly as useful in DF2010 as it used to be; this would have been crippling in 40d.

==Bugs==
Items linking to a bug on the bug tracker are accurate as of {{version|0.31.08}}. Older bugs should be removed or tagged with the version they were fixed in.

* If a dwarf gets stuck in surgery or is never properly treated, you can re-injure them to get the attention of Dwarven Healthcare, e.g. by causing a {{l|Cave-in}}. This will cause a new diagnosis to be made and may free the invalid. If he is stuck in a bed, you can sometimes remove the bed the dwarf is resting in to get him to leave the hospital. {{verify}}
* Gypsum powder is not stored at the hospital. {{bug|194}}
* Bone doctors cannot fill buckets to apply plaster casts, instead standing next to the water source holding a bucket indefinitely. If an already-full bucket of water is available somewhere in the fortress, forbidding all empty buckets will allow the cast to be made. {{bug|2627}}
* Dwarves with healthcare jobs will use the closest supplies to do their work, even if they are not stored in the hospital. {{bug|287}}
* The hospital allocates as many of a material as possible (enough to fill all chests in the hospital) whenever the material is understocked by any amount. {{bug|191}}
* The quality and value of a finished traction bench doesn't account for all of the inputs used to make it. {{verify}}
* Dwarves will steal items from the caravan and store them in hospital.
* For whatever reason, Dwarves will '''never, EVER''' be assigned crutches. No matter what. It doesn't matter what labors are or aren't assigned, where your crutches are or aren't kept, whether they're stored in {{L|container}}s {{k|b}}uilt in the hospital or in stock{{k|p}}iles placed within the hospital, whether the crutches are masterworks or just tack, or what other injuries the dwarves do or do not have. What this means, in practical gameplay terms, is that a dwarf with a broken leg will recover once the leg is set with gypsum plaster - but a dwarf with motor nerve damage, or a missing limb, will '''remain a bed-ridden invalid for the rest of their miserable life'''. No known workaround, save for {{L|Unfortunate accident|intensive manual therapy}}. {{verify}}

[[Category:Current]]

v0.31:Barracks

2010-11-20T14:56:51Z

Doub: typo

{{av}}{{Quality|Fine|22:02, 4 July 2010 (UTC)}}

'''Barracks''' may be defined from a {{l|bed}}, {{l|cabinet}}, {{l|chest}}, {{l|weapon rack}}, or {{l|armor stand}}. They provide a space for {{l|soldier|soldiers}} to {{l|sleep}}, {{l|Sparring|train}} and store equipment (Bugged as of 31.10). Multiple barracks can overlap to serve the needs of several different {{L|squads}}.

As of the newer version, civilians will no longer sleep in open beds within a defined barracks. To circumvent this issue, simply use one of the beds in the barracks to designate a {{l|dormitory}}. To create a dormitory, press {{k|q}}, highlight a bed, press {{k|r}}, then {{k|-}}/{{k|+}} until you have the size you want, then press {{k|d}}.

{{buildings}}

v0.31 Talk:Baron

2010-07-18T16:23:40Z

Doub: No {{k|n}}-{{k|c}} option available.

I definitely got a Baron at 55 population, 60 may be a bit high? --[[User:Nobu|Nobu]] 21:09, 10 April 2010 (UTC)

:I have 113 population and nearly a million of created wealth, but no Baron. I don't have any imported wealth though (I made a living for my fortress robbing caravans), so maybe it's required also required.

::In the old version, you had to export a certain amount of wealth, and have at least 25 jobs a year in four different categories. I don't know how much of that is still in, but I'm guessing the export requirement at least. Caravans are for loading down with useless trinkets; they don't have anything you REALLY want. Except steel. And booze. --[[User:Zombiejustice|Zombiejustice]] 22:38, 10 April 2010 (UTC)

:::Being that nobles are now defined in the raws, we can use what we know from there, which is 20 pop, 100000 created wealth, and 10000 exported wealth. Other information needs to be tested for. -Commondragon

::::I can't confirm it solidly, but it looks like the job thing is still in effect. I had well in excess of the other requirements for years. -Anon

Is the appointment of the Baron perhaps linked to the "Becoming the Capital" requirements listed in n -> c? Mine is listing 10000 architecture, 5000 road value, and 7500 offerings as "desired" amounts. I don't see anything about this screen in the wiki, but I am now pushing forward with road construction to see what happens when the targets are met.

:Following up, as soon as my fortress met these requirements (after 20+ years of meeting the old critera), the liason asked me to nomimate a Dwarf to become Baron. Looks like the n -> c requirements are what triggers the upgrade to Barony.

::What is this n -> c screen? I dont see any c option on the nobles screen...

:::I didn't see it at first, but it (the screen) eventually showed up, I think there is some basic criteria to having that screen available at all.--[[User:OmathErius|OmathErius]] 14:39, 14 May 2010 (UTC)

::::I think the c option requires a broker with minimum skill requiremnets - it is a fortress valuation measure after all.

::::Well, visible or not, as soon as I built a road, I got a baron. Thanks for the tip! --[[User:Zombiejustice|Zombiejustice]] 02:31, 15 May 2010 (UTC)

:::::Did the road have to be connected to the edge of the map? I have done all requirements and no baron [[User:Jimi12|Jimi12]] 23:42, 13 July 2010 (UTC)

::::My broker is a high master appraiser, and there's no {{k|n}}-{{k|c}} option available.--[[User:Doub|Doub]] 16:23, 18 July 2010 (UTC)

v0.34 Talk:Goblinite

2010-07-16T11:38:11Z

Doub:

== How do I get rid of Goblinite? ==

I killed some invading goblins and they dropped socks and tunics. I've tried dumping them, moving them by building stuff on them, and everything I can think of, and in every game of DF I've ever played, these items always just stay on the ground and cannot be dumped. I have a refuse stockpile which is not full and Gather Refuse From Outside is enabled. How do I dump these items.--[[Special:Contributions/208.81.12.34|208.81.12.34]] 19:48, 14 July 2010 (UTC)

:Please excuse Quietust being little rough, but you have to understand that the (or a) '''wiki''' is for '''finding answers''' and the '''forum''' ([http://www.bay12games.com/forum/index.php here]) is perfect place to '''ask questions''' . And messing a page up with your question isn't the right way, if every one would do this.. hmm maybe you can imagine. Back to topic: could it be that the stuff is forbidden? Try reclaiming it. Of course you could also try smashing it with a [[DF2010:Dwarven atom smasher|DAS]]. Greetings --[[User:Used|Used]] 21:16, 15 July 2010 (UTC)

::Hauling is, generally speaking, a low-priority task. After you {{L|reclaim}} the goblinite, the job might still get buried way down in the stack so that the socks sit out there season after season. You can try using specialized haulers, reforbidding/unforbidding the item again, and placing stockpiles nearby. When a caravan comes, you should be able to designate non-refuse items for trade and they'll have a higher haul priority (of course, they won't be listed in their normal categories, so you'll have to do it from the general designate-for-trade screen). -- [[User:Ancient History|Ancient History]] 21:29, 15 July 2010 (UTC)

==How do I get rid of cloth goblinite?==
I killed some invading goblins and they dropped socks and tunics. I've tried dumping them, moving them by building stuff on them, and everything I can think of, and in every game of DF I've ever played, these items always just stay on the ground and cannot be dumped. I have a refuse stockpile which is not full and Gather Refuse From Outside is enabled. How do I dump these items.--[[Special:Contributions/208.81.12.34|208.81.12.34]] 19:48, 14 July 2010 (UTC)
:Enable collection of refuse from outdoors. Also, items marked for Dumping end up in garbage dump activity zones (ideally ones placed underneath a raised drawbridge), not refuse stockpiles. --[[User:Quietust|Quietust]] 23:24, 15 July 2010 (UTC)
:Sometimes dwarves claim cloth goblinite for themselves. If they don't own a cabinet, the clothes won't be hauled into any stockpile or dumped. You can check if this is the case by loo{{k|k}}ing at the items: If they are owned by a dwarf, you could just build him a cabinet.--[[User:Doub|Doub]] 11:38, 16 July 2010 (UTC)

v0.31:Animal trap

2010-07-10T10:07:04Z

Doub: Removed wrong info: Blacksmithing skill NOT used for creating metal animal traps.

{{quality|Fine|08:00, 22 May 2010 (UTC)}}{{av}}

'''Animal traps''' are items used by a {{l|trapper}} to catch {{l|vermin}}.
They are created at a {{l|carpenter's workshop}} or a {{l|metalsmith's forge}} by a dwarf with the trapping labor enabled.

Animal traps can be used by ordering one of your trappers to capture a live land animal in the {{l|kennel}} with {{k|q}} then {{k|a}}, or placing an order with to capture live land animals, and can also be build by going into the {{k|b}}uild menu, and choosing {{k|m}} to place an animal trap anywhere. In order to bait small animals, the trap must be baited once set. Bait can be {{l|fish}}, {{l|meat}}, or a large {{l|gem}} (though gems are currently useless), however, there is a chance that depends on it's quality that it will not spring fast enough to catch it, causing the bait to be lost, and the trap will need to be reset and rebaited, which a trapper dwarf will automatically do on his own. According to [[Toady One|Toady]], the formula for the chance that a trap quality gives you successfully trapping a creature (as opposed to being robbed) is '''50/65/75/85/95/100'''; this means that masterwork traps will never be robbed.

{{buildings}}

User talk:Niggy

2010-07-06T16:51:41Z

Doub:

Please give feedback on anything I do. Just do it!
:Did you notice that [[User:Njero|Njero]] works on a similar project as you do? --[[User:Doub|Doub]] 16:51, 6 July 2010 (UTC)

User talk:Njero

2010-07-06T16:51:38Z

Doub:

== Material Colour Guide ==

I'm not sure if I have the colours right for my first stone entry (the 7:0:1s). Mostly because I've never built a statue from white stone before, and that just looks really bright! I'm just assuming for now that the construction colour carries over from the stone/block colour. If that's the case, then it should be right. --[[User:Njero|Njero]] 04:14, 16 September 2009 (UTC)
:Did you notice that [[User:Niggy|Niggy]] works on a similar project as you do? --[[User:Doub|Doub]] 16:51, 6 July 2010 (UTC)

== RE: Draining Method ==

<pre>I now have six soggy dwarf corpses in the canyon, and a melancholy dwarf trading baleful glares with a couple local harpies.</pre>
Oh, that last part gave me a good long laugh. On the bright side, now he doesn't have to share any of the booze! --[[User:Bronzebeard|Bronzebeard]] 08:41, 28 April 2010 (UTC)

v0.31:Creepy crawler

2010-06-29T16:11:51Z

Doub: Changed "chasm" to "caverns"

{{VerminInfo|name=Creepy crawler|symbol=*|color=6:0:0|biome=* Subterranean chasm (3)
|spring=1|summer=1|autumn=1|winter=1}}
{{av}}{{Quality|Exceptional|00:29, 10 June 2010 (UTC)}}
:''A tiny underground creature made of a mass of appendages resembling human fingers. It creeps across the ground like a starfish and eats with a mouth on the bottom of its body.''

'''Creepy crawlers''' are a type of {{L|underground}} {{l|vermin}}. They are found in deep {{L|caverns|caverns}}, and may {{L|rot}} {{L|food}} {{L|stockpile|stockpiles}} if they are nearby.

{{gamedata}}
{{vermin}}

v0.31 Talk:Tigerman

2010-06-14T18:33:42Z

Doub: lazy tigerman

==Tigermen for sale==
The elves sold me a caged and tame (!) tigerman. At first, it died of thirst in his cage. After I reloaded the game and set him free, I saw that he has a name and even a skill: He's an adequate pacifier! He's also butcherable, though. --[[User:Doub|Doub]] 18:09, 14 June 2010 (UTC)
:Did you modded anything? Tigerman don't have a [PET_.... WTF?? Why do they have a [PET] tag? And anyway, shouldn't only your dwarves have thirst? And also, can it do jobs for you? It also has a skill because he has the [CAN_LEARN] tag so it can learn to do something, you can see this by the many underground animalmen, if they start wrestling, they will become wrestlers.--[[User:Niggy|Niggy]] 18:16, 14 June 2010 (UTC)
:: No, I never modded anything. But tigermen DO have a petvalue in the raws. And I don't know, if he should not have thirst, but he was dehydrated, as I found in the wounds screen, and he went of to the drinking zone right away. So at least, he doesn't drink any booze, as it seems. He doesn't do any tasks. In the unit-screen, he's still listed under the wild animals, and if I {{k|v}}iew him and his {{k|p}}references, it's stated that "This animal can't work". --[[User:Doub|Doub]] 18:33, 14 June 2010 (UTC)

v0.31 Talk:Tigerman

2010-06-14T18:09:41Z

Doub: Bought a tame tigerman from the elves. He's got a name and a skill!

v0.31 Talk:Immigration

2010-06-14T13:10:48Z

Doub: Legendary immigrant arrived!

==skills==
First migrant wave, 3 migrants, 1st summer. One migrant, a "stoneworker", had:
:* Competent (3) Armor User
:* Novice (1) Siege Operator
:* Competent (3) Fighter
:* Competent (3) Wrestler
:* Competent (3) Dodger
:* Expert (8) Engraver
:* Expert (8) Mason
:* Novice (1) Animal Dissector
:* Adequate* (2) Tanner ''(* the new term for the old "no label" level 2 experience slot)''
We ain't in Kansas any more!--[[User:Albedo|Albedo]] 07:49, 5 April 2010 (UTC) 
Another (rerun via seasonal save, same season as above):
:* one w/ High Master (13) Furnace Operator and Talented (6) Appraiser.
:* one with Talented (6) Cheese Maker, Adequate (2) Gem Cutter and Novice Archer, Dodger, Armor User and (yes) Blowgunner.
:* and a very familiar level 2 (Adequate) Dyer.

I had one with *two* Grand Master (14) medical skills show up. (anon)
GM is 1 short of Legendary. It seems at least two things are true: 1) experience can be quite high, and 2) skills are no longer grouped by "profession", nor have to make any "sense" re matching up.--[[User:Albedo|Albedo]] 19:43, 5 April 2010 (UTC)

==size of waves==
:For what it's worth, I've noticed on two separate forts that giving the first Dwarf caravan a good deal (100% profit or thereabouts) tends to produce a massive migrant wave the following spring. One fortress had 19 show, the other had ~20 (can't quite remember). These were varying in skill from the virtually-nothing to a jeweller with Grand Master Gem Cutter and Grand Master Gem Setter...

:For relatively new players like me, it might be worth noting here that you can get a migrant wave in the first spring after embark that literally doubles the size of your fortress and can prove a serious headache to manage if not anticipated. --[[User:Nimblewright|Nimblewright]] 09:11, 6 April 2010 (UTC)

::And that's why there are talk pages. In 40d, it's not the trade % that matters, it's the increase in your Created Wealth - and if you had the wealth to trade, that's 100% consistent with the old paradigm. Not that things might not have changed in this version, but there are many, MANY variables in DF - which makes it that much harder to parse out. A LOT of our hard info comes from the RAW files, and from folk who can analyze the game code, but the rest comes from a combo of observation, confirmation and consensus. For now, keep an eye on Trade %, but watch Created Wealth as well. --[[User:Albedo|Albedo]] 17:55, 6 April 2010 (UTC)

Just had a new migrant wave turn up. 25 dwarfs - including several with Grand Master skill levels, and some with jack all - plus 8 animals. Have updated main page to reflect this. Has anyone else experienced such a large migration? (this is the third spring of the fort) --[[Special:Contributions/131.111.254.209|131.111.254.209]] 12:45, 6 April 2010 (UTC)
:::25 used to be the max(iirc?) migration wave (plus children). I've had over 20, but haven't seen that many total to get any sense of what's "typical". Has anyone had OVER 25 (not including children)?--[[User:Albedo|Albedo]] 17:55, 6 April 2010 (UTC)

It seem that now immigration is a lot less random and more wealth dependant. E.g. in the old version, your first year wave was entirely random and unless you never made a single item you would get exactly 8-10 sometime before spring (or not at all). Unless you never got a first immigration in which case you'd get the first mandatory one at your first new spring, which was up to 25.

Now I ALWAYS get a first summer immigration, with sizes so far from 2-8, the one with two in a fort without any craftsmen. It's pretty clear you can reliably get immigrants as long as you have enough wealth. I'm willing to wager that a fort with X wealth by summer is guaranteed an immigration, but I'd need to test further. [[User:Greep|Greep]] 01:55, 17 April 2010 (UTC)

I just got 26 (70 dwarves from 44, including at least 1 new child) on my 3rd Spring, after 2 (maybe 3?) seasons with 0 migrant. -- Cheshire
:Perhaps he only evened out the first year? I guess the question to ask is, has anyone missed a summer immigration with 20k wealth? [[User:Greep|Greep]] 09:44, 18 April 2010 (UTC)

Contrary to what is said in this wiki page, limiting the max population in the init.txt does NOT guarantee you will never get more than that number. In fact I would say 75 percent of the time it goes way over that number and in several waves after that number is reached. I believe the population cap doesn't kick in until the next year after the population cap is reached. For people trying to keep a low population I would recommend maintaining a low wealth and limit trade until after you start getting the "no migrants this season" message. Otherwise that 30 population you were shooting for can turn into 50 real quick. -- Lemunde
:In previous versions, the population cap would only be respected once the Dwarven caravan arrived and departed. Even then, childbirth will completely ignore it, which is quite annoying. --[[User:Quietust|Quietust]] 02:58, 14 June 2010 (UTC)

== labor turned on ==
Just a hunch, but does the game actually check if a dwarf (before that wave?) is present with higher skill and only ''if not'' turns on the labor? I can't check any more, but I think it fits and it's the only reasonable explanantion I can come up with for now. That would be nifty. --[[User:Confused|Confused]] 12:56, 11 April 2010 (UTC)
:I think dwarves are just assigned a history of jobs (like NPCs), and their "latest" one is the active one, even if they're far better suited at another job. I've seen lower-skill miners and woodcutters arrive with their jobs on, although I cannot confirm if jobs like those are merely exceptions from your hypothesized rule or not. [[User:Trorbes|Trorbes]] 18:44, 11 April 2010 (UTC)
::I had the same thought as Trorbes here. I think this bug/feature would easily make sense in light of how dwarves will change their professions over time in Legends mode. But the immigrant dwarves are not pulled from existing creatures right? Are they still created on the spot to be immigrants? Either way, I would argue that arriving with multiple skills but only the most recent ones enabled is a fair simulation of world gen dwarves. [[User:Coaldiamond|-Coaldiamond]] 13:26, 28 April 2010 (UTC)

== pattern with military skills? ==

It seems like immigrants arrive either completely without military skills, or they have quite a few. In particular, if they have X weapon they almost always have some fighting, armor user, etc to go with it. In addition, it seems like those non-weapon military skills are always smaller or equal to the highest weapon skill. Can anyone confirm this? [[User:Greep|Greep]] 20:36, 16 April 2010 (UTC)
:I was noticing a different pattern - posted as such, with {verify} tag.--[[User:Albedo|Albedo]] 18:42, 20 April 2010 (UTC)

== HA! ==

Oh this is funny... so I get this blacksmith immigrant, with no blacksmithing skills o.O. His only skill? Competent Liar XD [[User:Greep|Greep]] 01:42, 17 April 2010 (UTC)
:nvm, prolly had labor skills turned off. Bum :/ [[User:Greep|Greep]] 03:57, 17 April 2010 (UTC)

== Crash bug ==

Encountering repeated crash bug when recieving 3rd immigrant in second spring. Tired of reloading. No idea about the cause.

== Never Legendary? ==

So far I have seen quite a few high masters but not a single legendary. Has anyone seen a legendary immigrant yet? [[User:Greep|Greep]] 00:45, 14 May 2010 (UTC)
:Huh! There just arrived a legendary glassmaker! (He's also a competent record keeper.) I'm playing version .06 --[[User:Doub|Doub]] 13:10, 14 June 2010 (UTC)

== Odd thingy ==

I think it may be worth mentioning that I just got an immigrant with some medical skills, and Adequate skill level in both Archer AND Bowman. A second one had some skill in Marksdwarf -- it seems that there are a few too many bow-skills around. --[[Special:Contributions/97.121.181.207|97.121.181.207]] 05:38, 12 June 2010 (UTC)

v0.31 Talk:Mechanism

2010-05-29T09:44:48Z

Doub: In a forge, mechanisms are treated as trap components, not furniture (as they are in stockpiles)

==quality mech's and trap accuracy==
I have no intention of assuming that high-quality mechanisms do not help weapons traps - and perhaps others as well - until we have more evidence in. That's how it worked in the prev version, so I'll act on that until we know diff. However, I'm equally sure that citing a quote from July 2007 is not necessarily relevant to the version just released April 2010. (When was 40d released?)--[[User:Albedo|Albedo]] 22:54, 8 April 2010 (UTC)

==Metal==
Maybe it's just me, but I kind of wish that 'They can also be created at a forge' should get put in HUGE CAPS. Being able to make lava-proof mechanisms out of steel now? HUGE CHANGE! Plus, I almost edited the article to point it out again because I missed that the first time. Perhaps we should just change that . to a , in the first sentence. [[User:Savanik|Savanik]] 02:22, 14 April 2010 (UTC)
:Considering a great deal of other stones have become magma-safe, the ability to create metal mechanisms is less significant now. Too bad they're limited to weapons-grade metals, otherwise it'd become possible to have levers made of rose gold and lay pewter (which would permit colors otherwise not possible using stone). --[[User:Quietust|Quietust]] 05:09, 14 April 2010 (UTC)
:Perhaps it should be stated in the article that in a forge mechanisms are treated as trap components, not as furniture, as they are in stockpiles? --[[User:Doub|Doub]] 09:44, 29 May 2010 (UTC)

v0.31 Talk:Web

2010-05-21T15:45:44Z

Doub:

This article states that webs can be found next to chasm tiles, chasms no longer existing in DF2010 so it seems like this article might contain copy and pasted info from 40D. Could someone with more knowledge look over this article for incorrect info and correct it?--[[User:Railick|Railick]] 23:38, 19 May 2010 (UTC)Railick
: Updated some info to v0.31.04. I couldn't veryfiy the sentence about web in the rain, though. --[[User:Doub|Doub]] 15:45, 21 May 2010 (UTC)

v0.31:Web

2010-05-21T15:43:50Z

Doub: Updated some info to v0.31.04.

{{av}}{{Quality|Exceptional}}
'''Webs''' are the source of {{L|silk}}, and appear in {{l|cavern|caverns}}. The web itself looks like a light-grey {{L|gem}}, and is most often labeled as being from {{L|cave spider}}s, but the presence of the actual {{L|vermin}} is not necessary for the web to be formed on a given spot (though cave spiders will appear in the general {{L|biome}} where the webs are found). Similar webs can be found in a biome inhabited by {{L|giant cave spider}}s; an actual {{L|giant cave spider}} will be present if these are found.

Webs will be collected ''automatically'' by dwarves with the {{L|weaving}} labor enabled, but not until the fortress has a {{L|loom}}. A ''collect web'' task will be triggered at the loom as long as webs are on the map and in reach. This can be comfortably deactivated with {{k|o}}-{{k|W}}-{{k|w}}. An important option since webs often occur in dangerous places you might want to secure first. The {{L|weaver}} will then drop the collected thread in the loom and, depending on the loom setting and availability of a stockpile, either leave it there, immediately weave it to cloth, or put it on a stockpile. Other ways to prevent collecting are preventing any dwarf from using the loom ({{k|q}}-{{k|P}} - requires {{L|manager}}), deactivating the weaving {{L|labor}} on all dwarves or removing all looms. (Lack of stockpiles alone will ''not'' prevent this!) An easier alternative is just to suspend the collect webs task in each loom. ({{k|q}}-{{k|s}}). It may be a good idea to only allow non-skilled weavers to collect webs and only skilled ones to actually weave cloth. Set high minimal skill on the actual weaving loom ({{k|q}}-{{k|P}}) and just as high maximal skill on the collecting loom. Suspend weaving on collecting loom and collecting on weaving loom. This allows higher efficiency, since collecting is not in any way affected by weaving skill (it happens instantly), but trains it and the skill affects quality of cloths.

Webs become {{L|thread|silk thread}} the moment they are picked up. (They are, however, shown in the {{k|z}}-stocks menu under -> thread.) Cave spider silk webs and thread are worth 6{{L|currency|☼}}; giant cave spider silk webs and thread are worth 24{{L|currency|☼}}.

{{L|Giant cave spider}}s leave similar, individual webs behind, but also shoot long strings of dangerous entangling webs at targets prior to attacking - this behaviour can be used to create {{l|giant cave spider|giant cave spider silk farms}}. It is not advised to allow weavers to randomly gather webs on maps where giant cave spiders might be lurking nearby.

Webs are delicate, and can be destroyed by contact with any creature (except a dwarf that is gathering that web), or by any other rough treatment such as {{L|Irrigation|irrigating}}, etc.
It also appears that if open to the outside, {{L|rain}} will destroy the webs remarkably fast

{{L|Vermin}} that come into contact with a web will immediately turn into {{l|corpse|remains}}. For sanity reasons, cave spiders themselves are immune to this effect.

[[Category:Items]]

v0.31 Talk:Olm man

2010-05-18T16:05:08Z

Doub: Olm-men don't have the [TRAPAVOID] tag, so their avoiding of traps seems to be a bug. (?)

==Olm-People Do Not Trigger Traps==
My current game has an underground cavern with a tribe of olm people. I created a 1 tile wide hallway filled with stone traps and the olm people walked right through it without triggering a single one. Anyone know if this is intentional behaviour or a bug? --[[User:Frewfrux|Frewfrux]] 02:25, 18 May 2010 (UTC)
:They don't have the [TRAPAVOID] tag, so I'd guess it's a bug. --[[User:Doub|Doub]] 16:05, 18 May 2010 (UTC)

==Olm-People Treasure==
From the raw files you can see that these creatures are found in groups of 5-10. What you can't see is that they appear to populate the underground caverns with piles of "treasure" which they gaurd. In my current game, there are several pieces of leather which they seem to be very fond of. Anyone else seen this? Is it always leather, or are there sometimes other items? --[[User:Frewfrux|Frewfrux]] 15:28, 18 May 2010 (UTC)

v0.31 Talk:Thief

2010-05-14T18:41:10Z

Doub: Confusing Announcement: OVERWROTE JOB: Kidnap BY Clean Self

Goblin master thieves are missing - IIRC they are armed differently. Other noteable diffs? In 40d there were Kobold master thieves too, right? --[[User:Birthright|Birthright]] 22:23, 19 April 2010 (UTC)

==Kidnapping bug==
Had DF crash right after receiving alert of a successful kidnapping. Is this a known bug? Has anyone else had this happen? --[[User:Zombiejustice|Zombiejustice]] 01:59, 26 April 2010 (UTC)

==Caged Kobold==
I was looking at my stockpiles, and I noticed a cage with a kobold thief in it. How did it trigger a cage trap?

==Overwrote Job: Kidnap By Clean Self (?)==
I just got this confusing announcement: 
"OVERWROTE JOB: Kidnap BY Clean Self" 
The only reason for cleaning right now seems to be the slaying of the goblin ambushers by my military, but they wouldn't want to kidnap anyone, would they? --[[User:Doub|Doub]] 18:41, 14 May 2010 (UTC)

v0.31:Bridge

2010-05-12T13:36:56Z

Doub: Minor orthographical edit.

{{av}}{{Quality|Fine}}

'''Bridges''' are extremely useful buildings for crossing dangerous terrain and also for fortress defence. Using them to control [[flow|fluids]] can save one a ton of mechanisms and time, especially when the fluid in question is free-flowing and not pressurized (by pump, river or hydrostatic anything) and needs a wide tunnel.

==Building Bridges==

Bridges can be built ({{k|b}} -> {{k|g}}) of metal, stone or wood. They are first designed by an architect, then require a specialist worker for the material used (e.g. a mason for a stone bridge). The size of the bridge can be altered with {{k|u}}{{k|m}}{{k|k}}{{k|h}} while placing it. The bridge must be anchored to a solid surface on at least one edge. Before placing the bridge ensure that the bridge raises in the direction you want it to using {{k|w}}{{k|a}}{{k|d}}{{k|x}} or retracts using {{k|s}}.

==Raising/Retracting Bridges==

All bridges in DF can be raised or retracted by linking it to a {{L|lever}}. This requires a mechanics workshop and a dwarf with a the mechanic labour activated.

If a bridge is set to retract when the lever is pulled, the bridge essentially disappears dropping anything (friend, foe, or object) on the bridge onto whatever is underneath. Clearly this can be used to drop your enemies to rocky/watery/fiery deaths (or anything more imaginative you can think up!).

If a bridge is set to raise when the lever is pulled, the bridge becomes a wall along the edge selected with the {{k|w}}{{k|a}}{{k|d}}{{k|x}} keys when placing the bridge. The resulting wall is always one z-level tall, regardless of the width of the bridge. The bridge also "moves" to this position very fast, firing anything on the bridge into the air. The key advantage to raising bridges is the creation of a wall when the bridge is raised. This can be used to block fortress entrances/corridors. Using 2 bridges at opposite ends of a corridor creates a very large and simple trap by walling in enemies.

The lowering of a drawbridge can also be used as a waste disposal for unwanted stones, refuse, goblins (dead or alive) and nobles, to name a few. Even fluids get destroyed (this is especially useful considering lack of chasms in the new version).

==Bugs==

Retractable bridges (possibly raising bridges, but this is untested) will not retract when a mounted unit (a unit riding another) is on the bridge. Attempting to do so will create odd results if multiple bridges are connected to the same lever[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mS5f_Snz-Y8].

It is impossible to channel out stone that is directly under a raiseable bridge when its in the raised position.

Non-[[magma-safe]] bridge will heat up and eventually melt if a tile, which would be normally part of a lowered bridge gets covered in magma. State of the bridge (raised/lowered) doesn't matter, if it's within the bridge's rectangle, it endangers the whole bridge.

{{buildings}}

v0.34 Talk:Feather

2010-05-09T17:39:13Z

Doub: A page about feathers?

==Feather page?==
Should there be a page about feathers? It is obtained by butchering certain uninvited guests and has a weight up to 495Γ(!). --[[User:Doub|Doub]] 17:39, 9 May 2010 (UTC)

v0.31:Weapon

2010-05-09T17:03:50Z

Doub: Added some links

{{av}}
{{Quality|Exceptional}}

Weapons are used by military dwarves and certain other humanoids in {{l|combat}}.

{{l|hunter|Hunters}}, {{l|wood cutter|Woodcutters}} and {{l|miner|Miners}} also use weapons for their {{l|labor|work}} and if need be will also {{l|combat|fight}} using them. Hunters seem to be limited to {{l|crossbow|crossbows}} while miners and woodcutters use {{l|pick|picks}} and {{l|battle axe|axes}} respectively.

If you find your dwarves wearing more than one weapon - or any unwanted {{l|armor}}, for that matter - one way to get rid of them is to dump the weapon from their {{k|v}}-{{k|i}} screen. This does not work always, they may re-equip. Another option is to remove any weapons and shields listed on their military equip screen. This too does not work always. At least "left-handedness" seems to not pose a problem.

Using weapons is much more effective than unarmed combat- an untrained swordsdwarf with an {{l|iron}} weapon can defeat a grand master {{l|wrestler}}, provided he wears no armor.

There are many different types of weapons;

{| class="wikitable"
|-
! Type
! Size
! Attack Type*
|-
| 2H Sword
| 900
| Edge
|-
| Battle Axe
| 800
| Edge
|-
| Blowgun
| 150
| Blunt**
|-
| Bow
| 300
| Blunt**
|-
| Crossbow
| 400
| Blunt**
|-
| Flail
| 500
| Blunt
|-
| Great Axe
| 1300
| Edge
|-
| Halberd
| 1200
| Edge
|-
| Large Dagger
| 200
| Edge
|-
| Long Sword
| 700
| Edge
|-
| Mace
| 400
| Blunt
|-
| Maul
| 1300
| Blunt
|-
| Morningstar
| 500
| Edge
|-
| Pick
| 500
| Edge
|-
| Pike
| 800
| Edge
|-
| Scimitar
| 300
| Edge
|-
| Scourge
| 300
| Edge
|-
| Short Sword
| 300
| Edge
|-
| Spear
| 400
| Edge
|-
| War Hammer
| 400
| Blunt
|-
| Whip
| 100
| Blunt
|}
:<nowiki>*</nowiki>Most edge weapons (and others) have a secondary, albeit less common attack, such as with a sword striking with the pommel (bash).
:<nowiki>**</nowiki> Weapons melee attack only. Ammunition uses edge.
There are also three training weapons, a wooden sword, axe, and spear. Each is designed for use in {{l|sparring}}.

v0.31:Beak

2010-05-08T17:20:18Z

Doub: minor typo repair

{{av}} {{Quality|Fine}}
A '''beak''' is a {{l|body part}} that can be generated from killing an animal, but not from {{l|butcher|butchering}}. Also, beaks, unlike {{l|tail|tails}} or {{l|head|heads}}, can not be butchered or used in any way, but will be stored on {{l|refuse stockpile|refuse stockpiles}}.

v0.31:Dimple cup

2010-05-08T08:51:02Z

Doub: Adden some links

{{Crop|color=1:0:1|seed_color=5:0:1|character=♥|name=Dimple cup|seed=Dimple cup spawn
|spring=1|summer=1|autumn=1|winter=1
|habitat=Subterranean
|uses=
* {{L|Dye}}
|other_products=
* {{L|Dimple dye}} (Mill)}}
{{av}}{{Quality|Fine}}

A year round subterranean [[crop]] which can be [[milled]] into {{l|dye|blue dimple dye}}. There is no other known use for this plant, so grow it only if you have plenty of [[booze]] and food to go around.

{{gamedata}}
{{Plants}}

v0.31:Building

2010-05-07T13:19:31Z

Doub: inserted these fine key-templates

{{av}}{{Quality|Fine}}
Buildings can be constructed by your dwarves. Buildings have all sorts of uses.
The construction of a building requires resources that you can select when building.

A building is a structure that can be placed from the build menu and then interacted with by the Set Building Tasks/Prefs command {{k|q}} , and the View Items in Buildings command {{k|t}}. Included in this are workshops, doors, trade depots, furniture, bridges, traps -- most of the interesting stuff your dwarves will build!

Most buildings are made from raw materials or blocks, although some workshops require some additional finished items as well.

Some buildings are placed furniture; a cage or throne sitting in a stockpile is just furniture and can be moved by haulers, washed away by flooding, etc., but when built they become a building that can be interacted with. (Or, what seems more accurate to say, a new building is created and the original furniture becomes part of that building's permanent inventory.) Some buildings can be used to define rooms.

Buildings should be considered distinct from constructions. While both are built via the b build menu, constructions are inert to q and t, are removed by designation, and are generally more similar to terrain features. Furthermore, dwarves can place buildings on constructed floors, but buildings cannot overlap other buildings, nor can constructions overlap other constructions. Also constructions provide support while buildings do not.

==List of buildings==
 {{Buildings}} {{Category|Buildings}}

All information taken from the 40d section as it was still accurate. Only the table of building was added too.

v0.31:Gremlin

2010-05-03T17:08:32Z

Doub: Improved the typo. Not perfect yet, but better.

{{av}}

:''A small humanoid creature with a mischievous, toothy grin.''

Gremlins are invisible till spotted, and cause various kinds of {{L|Fun}} in your fortress by stepping on pressure plates, pulling levers, and opening cages.

When a gremlin is discovered, the game pauses and centers on it, with the message: "A gremlin! Drive it away!".

{{gamedata|[CREATURE:GREMLIN]
[DESCRIPTION:A small humanoid creature with a mischievous, toothy grin.]
[NAME:gremlin:gremlins:gremlin]
[CASTE_NAME:gremlin:gremlins:gremlin]
[CREATURE_TILE:'g'][COLOR:2:0:1]
[LARGE_ROAMING][BIOME:SUBTERRANEAN_CHASM]
[UNDERGROUND_DEPTH:1:3]
[POPULATION_NUMBER:1:1]
[CAN_LEARN][CAN_SPEAK]
[PET_EXOTIC]
[LOCKPICKER][TRAPAVOID][MISCHIEVIOUS]
[CANOPENDOORS]
[BONECARN]
[PREFSTRING:mischief]
[PERSONALITY:EXCITEMENT_SEEKING:50:75:100]
[PERSONALITY:ADVENTUROUSNESS:50:75:100]
[PERSONALITY:LIBERALISM:50:75:100]
[PERSONALITY:ORDERLINESS:0:25:50]
[PERSONALITY:DUTIFULNESS:0:25:50]
[BODY:HUMANOID:2EYES:2EARS:NOSE:2LUNGS:HEART:GUTS:ORGANS:HUMANOID_JOINTS:THROAT:NECK:SPINE:BRAIN:SKULL:5FINGERS:5TOES:MOUTH:FACIAL_FEATURES:TEETH:RIBCAGE]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:STANDARD_MATERIALS]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:STANDARD_TISSUES]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:VERTEBRATE_TISSUE_LAYERS:SKIN:FAT:MUSCLE:BONE:CARTILAGE]
[USE_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:NAIL:NAIL_TEMPLATE]
[USE_TISSUE_TEMPLATE:NAIL:NAIL_TEMPLATE]
[TISSUE_LAYER:BY_CATEGORY:FINGER:NAIL:FRONT]
[TISSUE_LAYER:BY_CATEGORY:TOE:NAIL:FRONT]
[SELECT_TISSUE_LAYER:HEART:BY_CATEGORY:HEART]
[PLUS_TISSUE_LAYER:SKIN:BY_CATEGORY:THROAT]
[TL_MAJOR_ARTERIES]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:STANDARD_HEAD_POSITIONS]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:HUMANOID_HEAD_POSITIONS]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:HUMANOID_RIBCAGE_POSITIONS]
[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:HUMANOID_RELSIZES]
[USE_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:SINEW:SINEW_TEMPLATE]
[TENDONS:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:SINEW:200]
[LIGAMENTS:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:SINEW:200]
[HAS_NERVES]
[USE_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:BLOOD:BLOOD_TEMPLATE]
[BLOOD:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:BLOOD:LIQUID]
[CREATURE_CLASS:GENERAL_POISON]
[GETS_WOUND_INFECTIONS]
[GETS_INFECTIONS_FROM_ROT]
[USE_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:PUS:PUS_TEMPLATE]
[PUS:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:PUS:LIQUID]
[BODY_SIZE:0:0:500]
[BODY_SIZE:1:168:2500]
[BODY_SIZE:12:0:10000]
[BODY_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:HEIGHT:75:95:98:100:102:105:125]
[APP_MOD_IMPORTANCE:500]
[BODY_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:BROADNESS:75:95:98:100:102:105:125]
[APP_MOD_IMPORTANCE:500]
[SET_BP_GROUP:BY_CATEGORY:EYE]
[BP_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:CLOSE_SET:0:70:90:100:110:130:200]
[APP_MOD_NOUN:eyes:PLURAL]
[BP_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:DEEP_SET:0:70:90:100:110:130:200]
[APP_MOD_NOUN:eyes:PLURAL]
[BP_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:ROUND_VS_NARROW:0:70:90:100:110:130:200]
[APP_MOD_NOUN:eyes:PLURAL]
[SET_BP_GROUP:BY_CATEGORY:LIP]
[BP_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:THICKNESS:50:70:90:100:110:130:200]
[APP_MOD_NOUN:lips:PLURAL]
[SET_BP_GROUP:BY_CATEGORY:NOSE]
[BP_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:BROADNESS:25:70:90:100:110:130:200]
[BP_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:LENGTH:25:70:90:100:110:130:200]
[BP_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:UPTURNED:0:70:90:100:110:130:200]
[BP_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:CONVEX:0:70:90:100:110:130:200]
[APP_MOD_NOUN:nose bridge:SINGULAR]
[SET_BP_GROUP:BY_CATEGORY:EAR]
[BP_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:SPLAYED_OUT:0:70:90:100:110:130:200]
[APP_MOD_NOUN:ears:PLURAL]
[BP_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:HANGING_LOBES:0:70:90:100:110:130:200]
[APP_MOD_NOUN:ears:PLURAL]
[BP_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:BROADNESS:90:95:98:100:102:105:110]
[APP_MOD_IMPORTANCE:700]
[APP_MOD_NOUN:ears:PLURAL]
[BP_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:HEIGHT:90:95:98:100:102:105:110]
[APP_MOD_IMPORTANCE:700]
[APP_MOD_NOUN:ears:PLURAL]
[SET_BP_GROUP:BY_CATEGORY:TOOTH]
[BP_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:GAPS:0:70:90:100:110:130:200]
[APP_MOD_NOUN:teeth:PLURAL]
[SET_BP_GROUP:BY_CATEGORY:SKULL]
[BP_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:HIGH_CHEEKBONES:0:70:90:100:110:130:200]
[BP_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:BROAD_CHIN:0:70:90:100:110:130:200]
[BP_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:JUTTING_CHIN:0:70:90:100:110:130:200]
[BP_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:SQUARE_CHIN:0:70:90:100:110:130:200]
[SET_BP_GROUP:BY_CATEGORY:NECK]
[BP_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:DEEP_VOICE:0:70:90:100:110:130:200]
[BP_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:RASPY_VOICE:0:70:90:100:110:130:200]
[SET_BP_GROUP:BY_CATEGORY:HEAD]
[BP_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:BROADNESS:90:95:98:100:102:105:110]
[APP_MOD_IMPORTANCE:700]
[BP_APPEARANCE_MODIFIER:HEIGHT:90:95:98:100:102:105:110]
[APP_MOD_IMPORTANCE:700]
[MAXAGE:800:1000]
[ATTACK:PUNCH:BODYPART:BY_TYPE:GRASP]
[ATTACK_SKILL:GRASP_STRIKE]
[ATTACK_VERB:punch:punches]
[ATTACK_CONTACT_PERC:100]
[ATTACK_FLAG_WITH]
[ATTACK_PRIORITY:MAIN]
[ATTACK:KICK:BODYPART:BY_TYPE:STANCE]
[ATTACK_SKILL:STANCE_STRIKE]
[ATTACK_VERB:kick:kicks]
[ATTACK_CONTACT_PERC:100]
[ATTACK_FLAG_WITH]
[ATTACK_PRIORITY:SECOND]
[ATTACK:SCRATCH:CHILD_TISSUE_LAYER_GROUP:BY_TYPE:GRASP:BY_CATEGORY:FINGER:NAIL]
[ATTACK_SKILL:GRASP_STRIKE]
[ATTACK_VERB:scratch:scratches]
[ATTACK_CONTACT_PERC:100]
[ATTACK_PENETRATION_PERC:100]
[ATTACK_FLAG_EDGE]
[ATTACK_PRIORITY:SECOND]
[ATTACK:BITE:CHILD_BODYPART_GROUP:BY_CATEGORY:HEAD:BY_CATEGORY:TOOTH]
[ATTACK_SKILL:BITE]
[ATTACK_VERB:bite:bites]
[ATTACK_CONTACT_PERC:100]
[ATTACK_PENETRATION_PERC:100]
[ATTACK_FLAG_EDGE]
[ATTACK_PRIORITY:SECOND]
[ATTACK_FLAG_CANLATCH]
[BABY:1]
[CHILD:12]
[EQUIPS]
[ALL_ACTIVE]
[HOMEOTHERM:10067]
[SWIMS_LEARNED][SWIM_SPEED:2500]
[CASTE:FEMALE]
[FEMALE]
[MULTIPLE_LITTER_RARE]
[CASTE:MALE]
[MALE]
[SELECT_CASTE:ALL]
[SET_TL_GROUP:BY_CATEGORY:ALL:SKIN]
[TL_COLOR_MODIFIER:GREEN:1]
[TLCM_NOUN:skin:SINGULAR]
[SET_TL_GROUP:BY_CATEGORY:EYE:EYE]
[TL_COLOR_MODIFIER:PUPIL_EYE_YELLOW:1]
[TLCM_NOUN:eyes:PLURAL]}}

v0.31 Talk:Kennel

2010-05-03T14:23:25Z

Doub:

I have been having trouble taming creatures, but other than that it seems like kennels haven't particularly changed.

==2010 War Dogs==

Is it just me, or are war dogs barely worth the investment? Mine do virtually no damage to anything and just get themselves killed (I've just had one killed by a troglodyte, of all things).--[[User:Nimblewright|Nimblewright]] 12:29, 23 April 2010 (UTC)

* Individually they don't do a lot of damage, but it's pretty easy to get a swarm of them - and a war dog swarm is a force to be reckoned with.

==2010 [TRAINABLE] animals==

Since apparently [[Elephant|Elephants]] are now trainable, someone needs to compile a list of animals that can be trained into war animals and added to this page for easy listing [[Special:Contributions/68.161.167.37|68.161.167.37]] 13:35, 15 April 2010 (UTC)

Here you go, this is everything with the tags in the raws. Note there are none with [TRAINABLE_WAR] --[[User:StrongAxe|StrongAxe]] 13:48, 15 April 2010 (UTC)
*[TRAINABLE]
**[CREATURE:DOG]
**[CREATURE:BIRD_EAGLE_GIANT]
**[CREATURE:BEAR_GRIZZLY]
**[CREATURE:ELEPHANT]
**[CREATURE:LION]
**[CREATURE:LEOPARD]
**[CREATURE:JAGUAR]
**[CREATURE:TIGER]
**[CREATURE:CHEETAH]
**[CREATURE:MANDRILL]
**[CREATURE:GORILLA]
**[CREATURE:BEAR_POLAR]
**[CREATURE:LION_GIANT]
**[CREATURE:LEOPARD_GIANT]
**[CREATURE:JAGUAR_GIANT]
**[CREATURE:TIGER_GIANT]
**[CREATURE:CHEETAH_GIANT]
**[CREATURE:DRAGON]
*[TRAINABLE_HUNTING]
**[CREATURE:BAT_GIANT]
**[CREATURE:BIRD_SWALLOW_CAVE_GIANT]

Does anyone know the difference between [TRAINABLE] and [TRAINABLE_WAR]? If there's no difference can we assume Toady has an idea he has yet to implement... [[User:Numeral|Numeral]] 17:58, 19 April 2010 (UTC)
:Given that [TRAINABLE_HUNTING] only allows the creature to be trained for hunting and not for war, it's rather likely that [TRAINABLE_WAR] only allows the creature to be trained for war and not for hunting. --[[User:Quietust|Quietust]] 18:05, 19 April 2010 (UTC)
::My bad, I was under the assumption that [TRAINABLE] was only for war animals and that to have an animal be hunter trainable and war trainable it needed both [TRAINABLE] and [TRAINABLE_HUNTING] [[User:Numeral|Numeral]] 18:11, 19 April 2010 (UTC)

Animals appear to have to be uncaged prior to being trained; a lack of uncaged trainable animals throws up a 'no trainable creatures available' error. Fortunately, dwarves still recognized caged wild animals if ordered to tame them.

== Kennel as Workshop ==

Should it be noted that the kennel isn't built from the workshop menu, but is actually directly under the {{K|b}}uild menu [[Special:Contributions/98.117.151.147|98.117.151.147]] 03:52, 3 May 2010 (UTC)

== Additional Detail? ==
Perhaps it should be added in the article that the creature to be trained has to be roaming the fortress freely and may ''not'' be assigned to a cage or restraint? --[[User:Doub|Doub]] 14:23, 3 May 2010 (UTC)

v0.31 Talk:Trading

2010-05-02T17:47:36Z

Doub: Re: Vermin in caravans

Question regarding the coloring of the items being traded, It says that items in white are are created by a source other then your fortress, while brown is fortress created goods. In my first trade with the dwarven caravan two goods I know I created, a barrel holding donkey cheese and a barrel with cow's milk were colored in white. I mean, it's not exactly an issue, but is this because they an animal derived source or what? --[[User:AdmiralDread|AdmiralDread]] 05:15, 12 April 2010 (UTC)
:I believe for liquids in barrels it looks at whether you made the barrel, not the contents. Perhaps for all barrel items, I'm not sure. I personally don't trade food or drinks --[[User:Todestool|Todestool]] 14:49, 12 April 2010 (UTC)

It seems to be possible in DF2010 to have no trade from the dwarves. If their civilization is too small to have any leaders of note, then there will be no caravans.

==Vermin in caravans?==
I wanted to release the bought warthogs out of their cages, tame bats and fluffy wabblers were in my list. I haven´t catched any vermins yet, so I put them in that cage, too. When I looked at the (elven) caravan they "stole" the vermins from them. Anyone has seen this, too?
:I can confirm that elven caravans offer cages containing vermin. This vermin isn't shown in thr trade screen list, unless you view these cages separately. This vermin is ''not'' shown in your animal list of the status screen (hit {{k|z}} and then {{k|return}} to get there). It ''is'', however, shown in the list of creatures assignable to a cage. (hit {{k|q}}, select a cage, hit {{k|a}}, and there they are.) --[[User:Doub|Doub]] 17:47, 2 May 2010 (UTC)

==No Wagons with Caravans==
I never had wagons with DF2010. Is it just me or is there something needed except a 3wide path to one edge? Its always there and there is never a caravan with wagons, only with traders!--[[User:Niggy|Niggy]] 20:32, 12 April 2010 (UTC)
: I've not had wagons in this current fort either. Think it may be because I'm in a mountain biome...--[[User:Nimblewright|Nimblewright]] 10:11, 14 April 2010 (UTC)

::Yes, Wagons are out for now. This is most likely a bug as the access check screen is still in. Hm..or not? --[[User:Birthright|Birthright]] 20:00, 14 April 2010 (UTC)
:::They're still in the raws - see creature_equipment.txt. --[[User:Quietust|Quietust]] 21:11, 14 April 2010 (UTC)
::::It still checks if a wagon could make it to the dapot, but for me a caravan (Without wagons obviously) went through a two-wide tunnel[[User:GiantTiger11|GiantTiger11]] 08:01, 24 April 2010 (UTC)

== late caravan ==

The caravan used to arrive for me at exactly mid-autumn. I got my caravan in the new version at just a few days before autumn ended. Is this the case with everyone? [[User:Greep|Greep]] 03:56, 17 April 2010 (UTC)
:can confirm, caravans now always come late. --[[User:Confused|Confused]] 14:08, 17 April 2010 (UTC)
::maybe this is intentional as a "delay" from where they travel from? --[[User:Eroing|Eroing]] 17:41, 17 April 2010 (CET)

== Merchants going underground. ==

I just had a dwarven caravan leave the fortress through an underground edge of the map. Spawned from the top though.--[[User:Droid|Droid]] 04:07, 21 April 2010 (UTC)
: In my fortress even an elven caravan took the way through the caverns! --[[User:Doub|Doub]] 07:57, 24 April 2010 (UTC)

v0.31 Talk:Crutch-walker

2010-05-01T14:37:37Z

Doub:

I havn't even come close to having a dwarf use this, but wouldn't it be cool, if it gave lots of experience, and a dwarf got more powerful after his injury than before? [[User:GiantTiger11|GiantTiger11]] 11:11, 23 April 2010 (UTC)

:I don't think so.--[[User:Doub|Doub]] 14:37, 1 May 2010 (UTC)

-Urist McHouse? [[Special:Contributions/62.20.190.151|62.20.190.151]] 12:57, 23 April 2010 (UTC)

v0.31 Talk:Thought

2010-05-01T08:14:07Z

Doub: Where do dwarves have baths?

== Effects of Thoughts==
As of [[DF2010]], some negative thoughts make the dwarf work much more slowly. The dwarf will
continue to work for a time, presumably until the negative thought becomes unbearable, and
then will go attempt to resolve the thought by eating, sleeping, drinking, or some other action.
Um... no. The thoughts do not cause the dwarf to slow down - the thoughts are a result of the pre-existing [[40d:Status icons|status]], which is what both slows them down and causes the thought. That is, they get hungry or tired or whatever, and then they both slow down and have the bad thought about the cause. This is like saying that if a dwarf has a bad thought about losing their foot to magma, the bad thought is what burned their foot off.--[[User:Albedo|Albedo]] 20:22, 6 April 2010 (UTC)
:Hmm. I was just going by observation... I hadn't even seen this string dump business. I saw there was no new article, and sought to get one started. Also, why not fix the mistake instead of making nice big comments detailing the error on the talk pages for both me and the article? [[User:Garanis|Garanis]] 21:07, 6 April 2010 (UTC)
:Also, there are some ''very strange'' unhappy thoughts in that string dump. Gems such as: "has been attacked by a dead and still annoying acquaintance lately" and "had a terrifying nightmare about an army of the dead." I've never seen these, even in some terrifying fortresses. I don't think theres an reason to include everything in the string dump in these lists.[[User:Garanis|Garanis]] 21:20, 6 April 2010 (UTC)
::"By observation" is not a recommended nor perfectly reliable approach, especially not without independent confirmation. Adding "something" to a blank page is, actually, ''not'' better than if it's flawed and misleading, not for the newbie who's relying on it for their information. And I did fix it - I deleted it. And just now I fixed what you put in its place. As for unusual thoughts, the wiki doesn't care so much what one individual has or hasn't seen, it only cares about what is useful to the community - and that's up to the users. I was just tossing it out as a suggestion. (And how many "terrifying fortresses" have you had so far in the new version? nm - rhetorical question - but one that leads us back to "independent confirmation", or the lack of it.) --[[User:Albedo|Albedo]] 21:35, 6 April 2010 (UTC)

:::Regardless of the semantic issues, the way dwarves handle thirst, hunger, and fatigue has changed. Unlike 40d, dwarves now wait to fulfill their needs. This fact should be represented somewhere. Maybe [[Thought]] isn't the best place for it. Should I wait for someone to independently verify that dwarves need food before I go start that article? Where is the best place to ask for independent verification?[[User:Garanis|Garanis]] 21:54, 6 April 2010 (UTC)

Well I do remember something in the dev plans about bringing back the old zombie attacks from the 2D version, I think that will be part of whatever he has planned, and that first thought was hilarious [[Special:Contributions/24.255.86.193|24.255.86.193]]

One of the Happy Thoughts is "took someone to bed recently"? Surely this is a reference to carrying out healthcare duties and not truly as scandalous the article currently suggests. Should we amend?

==Personal Hygiene==
I've also noticed the positive thought "had a nice bath recently", but I'm not sure where the dwarf could have possibly had it. Perhaps at my pond? Definitively not ''in'' the pond, there is no ramp or stairs in it.--[[User:Doub|Doub]] 08:14, 1 May 2010 (UTC)

v0.31 Talk:Giant cave spider

2010-04-27T14:46:29Z

Doub: Verified a means of giant cave spider production

==Cave Wide Web==
Does anyone know where giant cave spiders create their web? I've captured one in a cagetrap and released it in a room (in a layer of clay, if that matters). I hoped it to fill it with webs, cagetrap it again and gather the precious giant cave spider webs safely. But it doesn't make a single one web. I wonder why? --[[User:Doub|Doub]] 17:05, 24 April 2010 (UTC)
:If it's like the previous version, a better way to get them to web is to provoke them with animals or dwarves that they'll shoot at (for example, you could have your spider be an engine that turns kittens into high-quality clothing!). --[[User:Vaniver|Vaniver]] 05:05, 25 April 2010 (UTC)
::Yep, that does the trick, thanks. Well, dogs do, the most of them at least, for most of them attack the spider, which then fights back with web, leaving about 6-7 webs per dog. --[[User:Doub|Doub]] 14:46, 27 April 2010 (UTC)

Category talk:V0.31:Animals

2010-04-24T17:06:32Z

Doub: removed entry - wrong place

v0.31 Talk:Giant cave spider

2010-04-24T17:05:06Z

Doub: Where do gaint cave spiders create their web?

v0.31 Talk:Trading

2010-04-24T07:57:15Z

Doub: elven caravan going underground

Question regarding the coloring of the items being traded, It says that items in white are are created by a source other then your fortress, while brown is fortress created goods. In my first trade with the dwarven caravan two goods I know I created, a barrel holding donkey cheese and a barrel with cow's milk were colored in white. I mean, it's not exactly an issue, but is this because they an animal derived source or what? --[[User:AdmiralDread|AdmiralDread]] 05:15, 12 April 2010 (UTC)
:I believe for liquids in barrels it looks at whether you made the barrel, not the contents. Perhaps for all barrel items, I'm not sure. I personally don't trade food or drinks --[[User:Todestool|Todestool]] 14:49, 12 April 2010 (UTC)

It seems to be possible in DF2010 to have no trade from the dwarves. If their civilization is too small to have any leaders of note, then there will be no caravans.

==No Wagons with Caravans==
I never had wagons with DF2010. Is it just me or is there something needed except a 3wide path to one edge? Its always there and there is never a caravan with wagons, only with traders!--[[User:Niggy|Niggy]] 20:32, 12 April 2010 (UTC)
: I've not had wagons in this current fort either. Think it may be because I'm in a mountain biome...--[[User:Nimblewright|Nimblewright]] 10:11, 14 April 2010 (UTC)

::Yes, Wagons are out for now. This is most likely a bug as the access check screen is still in. Hm..or not? --[[User:Birthright|Birthright]] 20:00, 14 April 2010 (UTC)
:::They're still in the raws - see creature_equipment.txt. --[[User:Quietust|Quietust]] 21:11, 14 April 2010 (UTC)

== late caravan ==

The caravan used to arrive for me at exactly mid-autumn. I got my caravan in the new version at just a few days before autumn ended. Is this the case with everyone? [[User:Greep|Greep]] 03:56, 17 April 2010 (UTC)
:can confirm, caravans now always come late. --[[User:Confused|Confused]] 14:08, 17 April 2010 (UTC)
::maybe this is intentional as a "delay" from where they travel from? --[[User:Eroing|Eroing]] 17:41, 17 April 2010 (CET)

== Merchants going underground. ==

I just had a dwarven caravan leave the fortress through an underground edge of the map. Spawned from the top though.--[[User:Droid|Droid]] 04:07, 21 April 2010 (UTC)
: In my fortress even an elven caravan took the way through the caverns! --[[User:Doub|Doub]] 07:57, 24 April 2010 (UTC)

v0.31 Talk:Trap

2010-04-18T21:48:28Z

Doub:

I have had goats, goblins and alligators happily walk right through a stone trap bomb carpet of 3-5 layers (per person) and walk away wounded, but still walking. This certainly seems new.

Experiences with this? --[[User:Birthright|Birthright]] 19:42, 14 April 2010 (UTC)

:Maybe that´s because they deal only blunt damage (I think), which has been severely nerfed (because it seldom deals critical wounds and bleeding). I had the same experience with a goblin siege in year 2, which then also doomed my entire fortress (because I only got mildly trained soldiers with leather armor and copper weapons and marksdwarfs are bugged). I think they will regain their usefulness, when damage types get balanced again. On the other hand, they really were quite overpowered before, considering the needed setup-time and material. ~ [[User:Felcis|Felcis]] 20:34, 14 April 2010 (UTC)

::Makes sense. I'm not even complaining - I like a challenge. The wooden spears, bows and arrows in my weapon traps btw may be a bit overpowered now.

== Stonefall ==

It's my recollection that stonefall traps outright destroy the stone when they are triggered, so they always need to be reloaded with a fresh rock from somewhere else. --[[User:Quietust|Quietust]] 20:56, 14 April 2010 (UTC)

:Well, try it out? Certainly not the case here, and never was IIRC. --[[User:Birthright|Birthright]] 21:20, 14 April 2010 (UTC)

::I second that. I always have the stone of the trap lying on it after it was triggered, so it was not destroyed. I´m not even sure if the dwarfes always need a different one, but I never payed close attention to that. ~ [[User:Felcis|Felcis]] 21:26, 14 April 2010 (UTC)
:::I think the wisdom of the old ages on that was that the reloader picks the closest stone at the time he is tasked with the job. So if one guy reloads 6 traps he might well pick some of the stones right there - never checked really. --[[Special:Contributions/92.202.32.216|92.202.32.216]] 02:02, 15 April 2010 (UTC)

== Weapon ==

Hi guys, been playing DF for a long while but the improvements in the latest versions have inspired me to try to contribute a bit to the wiki for the first time. If you think any information is incorrect then feel free to shout out about it. [[User:Akkie|Akkie]] 18:23, 15 April 2010 (UTC)

== Cage Traps? ==

are they still as effective as in 40d? the current article doesn't have anything on them .-Slothen--[[Special:Contributions/99.96.100.228|99.96.100.228]] 21:29, 18 April 2010 (UTC)
: Yes they are: Dragons as well as colossi are no threat as long as you have cage traps at your entrance - wooden cages are still sufficient to contain them savely. --[[User:Doub|Doub]] 21:47, 18 April 2010 (UTC)

v0.31 Talk:Trap

2010-04-18T21:47:02Z

Doub: re: cage traps

I have had goats, goblins and alligators happily walk right through a stone trap bomb carpet of 3-5 layers (per person) and walk away wounded, but still walking. This certainly seems new.

Experiences with this? --[[User:Birthright|Birthright]] 19:42, 14 April 2010 (UTC)

:Maybe that´s because they deal only blunt damage (I think), which has been severely nerfed (because it seldom deals critical wounds and bleeding). I had the same experience with a goblin siege in year 2, which then also doomed my entire fortress (because I only got mildly trained soldiers with leather armor and copper weapons and marksdwarfs are bugged). I think they will regain their usefulness, when damage types get balanced again. On the other hand, they really were quite overpowered before, considering the needed setup-time and material. ~ [[User:Felcis|Felcis]] 20:34, 14 April 2010 (UTC)

::Makes sense. I'm not even complaining - I like a challenge. The wooden spears, bows and arrows in my weapon traps btw may be a bit overpowered now.

== Stonefall ==

It's my recollection that stonefall traps outright destroy the stone when they are triggered, so they always need to be reloaded with a fresh rock from somewhere else. --[[User:Quietust|Quietust]] 20:56, 14 April 2010 (UTC)

:Well, try it out? Certainly not the case here, and never was IIRC. --[[User:Birthright|Birthright]] 21:20, 14 April 2010 (UTC)

::I second that. I always have the stone of the trap lying on it after it was triggered, so it was not destroyed. I´m not even sure if the dwarfes always need a different one, but I never payed close attention to that. ~ [[User:Felcis|Felcis]] 21:26, 14 April 2010 (UTC)
:::I think the wisdom of the old ages on that was that the reloader picks the closest stone at the time he is tasked with the job. So if one guy reloads 6 traps he might well pick some of the stones right there - never checked really. --[[Special:Contributions/92.202.32.216|92.202.32.216]] 02:02, 15 April 2010 (UTC)

== Weapon ==

Hi guys, been playing DF for a long while but the improvements in the latest versions have inspired me to try to contribute a bit to the wiki for the first time. If you think any information is incorrect then feel free to shout out about it. [[User:Akkie|Akkie]] 18:23, 15 April 2010 (UTC)

== Cage Traps? ==

are they still as effective as in 40d? the current article doesn't have anything on them .-Slothen--[[Special:Contributions/99.96.100.228|99.96.100.228]] 21:29, 18 April 2010 (UTC)
: Yes they are: Dragons as well as colossi are no threat as long as you have cage traps at your entrance - wooden cages are still able to contain them savely. --[[User:Doub|Doub]] 21:47, 18 April 2010 (UTC)

Category talk:V0.31:Animals

2010-04-18T08:32:46Z

Doub: animals behaving strangely...

==Aggressive animals?!==
Why do camels and deer interrupt my dwarves doing stuff and why do they try to enter my fortress, only to get caught in my traps? --[[User:Doub|Doub]] 08:32, 18 April 2010 (UTC)

v0.31 Talk:Food

2010-04-08T10:36:18Z

Doub: No meals out of alcohol alone anymore

==Changes==
Ok, I'm wondering what has changed about food in 31.01? I know that there are some relevant bugs, but is there anything new? [[User:Garanis|Garanis]] 03:31, 8 April 2010 (UTC)
:Aside from the bugs, the main difference is that when you butcher an animal, you can now eat all of the organs instead of just the meat.--[[User:Morlark|Morlark]]
::It seems to me that the main difference is that you cannot prepare a meal out of alcohol alone. --[[User:Doub|Doub]] 10:36, 8 April 2010 (UTC)

v0.31 Talk:Caravan

2010-04-07T17:37:45Z

Doub: Caravans take a VERY long time to leave. -> bug?

I've encountered a problem with the caravans: Especially the elven caravan needs an enormous amount of time for leaving. This leads to the curious situation that there are all three caravans at one time at my trade depot. Is this a bug? (If I deconstruct it, the merchants actually do leave, but the room is all littered with wooden toys and cages.) --[[User:Doub|Doub]] 17:37, 7 April 2010 (UTC)

v0.31:Known bugs and issues

2010-04-06T12:24:24Z

Doub:

{{AV}}
'''PLEASE SUBMIT BUGS TO THE OFFICIAL BUG TRACKER - THEY WON'T GET FIXED IF THEY ARE ONLY LISTED HERE.''' 
'''[http://bay12games.com/dwarves/mantisbt/ Dwarf Fortress Bug Tracker]'''

As the version is new, and we're still discovering what bugs are, obviously a lot of unverifiable information is going to get added to this thread. Recommend that new entries be added with "'''(confirmation needed)'''", and that people can document each bug on the discussion page. Once we have 2+ instances of a bug with some specific description of what's occurring, we can remove the parenthetical, or alternately, we can discuss removing unconfirmed bugs if there are issues in recreating them. People can also link relevant posts and threads from the forums here to help document the bugs. --[[User:Squirrelloid|Squirrelloid]] 08:58, 3 April 2010 (UTC)
:Please also read the 'Not Actually Bugs' section before adding bug reports! --[[User:Squirrelloid|Squirrelloid]] 09:00, 3 April 2010 (UTC)

==Not Actually Bugs==
*As megabeasts no longer die during world creation, the standard world creation will run until 1050 (Dwarf-Rapture) unless stopped. -- Andrei901, 2 April 2010, someone else check this please
::Not a bug. World creation is *supposed* to run until 1050... --[[User:Squirrelloid|Squirrelloid]] 08:50, 3 April 2010 (UTC)
*Tilesets in png format don't work? Just a black display.
::Tilesets must be in .bmp format, as they always have had to be. The .png format only works for the d# series. --[[User:Squirrelloid|Squirrelloid]] 08:50, 3 April 2010 (UTC)
:::A d## merge is in progress, .png will be supported soon.--[[User:Ar-Pharazon|Ar-Pharazon]] 01:32, 4 April 2010 (UTC)
*When choosing material for a squad item(cloak in this case) there are hundreds of "forgotten beast leather" to choose from.
::That's because there are lots of different forgotten beasts. Somewhat annoying? Yes. Working exactly like every other source creature for leather? Yes. --[[User:Squirrelloid|Squirrelloid]] 08:50, 3 April 2010 (UTC)
*Making a adamantine cloak -sometimes- results in "Urist McArmorer, Armorer cancels Forge adamantine cloak: Needs 10000 adamantine cloth." Also needed 15000 strands to make wafers. Update: this happens if you don't have enough cloths, I had 4 adamantine cloths in this case. If you have enough it works nicely. (The actual required number is much less than 15,000. It's closer to something like 10 adamantine strands. This is probably due to the fact that cloth can be consumed "in pieces" now for medical purposes).
*"Clothier canceled construct silk bag: needs 1000 cloth": http://www.bay12games.com/forum/index.php?topic=51953.msg1123552#msg1123552
::This is working as intended. Cloth is now measured in smaller units than individual pieces. If anything, the bug is that the game isn't telling you how much cloth each cloth item represents. --[[User:Squirrelloid|Squirrelloid]] 08:52, 3 April 2010 (UTC)
*Cats and Dogs - Including kittens, puppies, and War/Hunting variants - are similarly listed twice.
::They're listed twice because they separately list males and females. WAD. --[[User:Squirrelloid|Squirrelloid]] 09:05, 3 April 2010 (UTC)
*Weird red C in top left corner - "''' C '''" means new combat report, "''' H '''" means new hunting message, "''' S '''" means new sparring message. Feature, not bug: http://www.bay12games.com/forum/index.php?topic=52514.0
*No option for magma in the finder, this is because [[magma]] is guaranteed everywhere now.
*Corpses sitting in refuse piles turn into skeletons rather than piles of bones, in fact in the 2+ years I started my fort I haven't seen a single bone or shell in my refuse stockpile and yes, we've been eating fish too. I think bones are gone or something. Haven't tried butchering animals yet, though, so confirmation please...
::Arena Mode allows skeletons to be butchered into bones and a skull. Fortress Mode should be the same
::Dwarves automatically take skeletons, partial skeletons and limbs from the refuse stockpile and butcher them to produce only bones and skulls.

== Embarking ==

*You can embark with some rather unrealistic prepared foods (such as the aforementioned fly brains, which in real life go at about 900 thousand brains to the pound). This may be related to further issues involving vermin's organs.
*All fish are mentioned 2x. See http://www.bay12games.com/forum/index.php?topic=51953.msg1123220#msg1123220
*I find that I am unable to add items or skill points to my dwarves on the embarking screen. I'm using Mayday's graphics pack. I'm not sure what the cause of this is or if I'm just missing something obvious. (Explanation/Confirmation needed) ((signing your posts helps, and it just means you need to free up expedition points (cancel an item)))[[User:Kenji 03|Kenji 03]] 11:32, 5 April 2010 (UTC).
::I thought it might be that I needed to free up points too, but the counter shows that I have points-a-plenty. I'm also unable to subtract items from my embarkation list.--[[Special:Contributions/67.166.145.39|67.166.145.39]] 02:51, 6 April 2010 (UTC)
::I can confirm this. It happens in vanilla too apparently. Hit "esc" and go to you custom binds and rest your + and - keys. Do the same for the */ keys.
*After embarking with items that was listed two times in list game crashes.

== Sites ==

*Magma pipes in volcanoes extend to the top of the map, past the mountain itself.
*Magma tubes remain the same shape and size the whole way down and may be square. See http://www.bay12games.com/forum/index.php?topic=52412.0 (for the above as well)

== Buildings and Zones ==

*Can't farm on dry soil. See http://www.bay12games.com/forum/index.php?topic=51951.msg1123336#msg1123336
*Construction and/or deconstruction can occasionally force some dwarves to idle. See: http://www.bay12games.com/forum/index.php?topic=51953.msg1123250#msg1123250
*Dwarves raid elf (all?) caravans for cloth (maybe thread as well) for the hospital zone. (confirmed. Won't happen if your hospital zone has no room in it's containers for the items, though).
*Emptied murky ponds refill much faster than they used to. A decent sized pond that's been mined into can now flood your fortress if it starts raining (confirmation required)
*There are currently no (or occasionally very few) fish. This includes brooks, rivers, oceans, ponds, lakes (underground and otherwise). You may get a few turtles sometimes. No known workaround: http://www.bay12games.com/forum/index.php?topic=52217.0

== Combat ==

*Some combat maneuvers have no effect. See: http://www.bay12games.com/forum/index.php?topic=51953.msg1123104#msg1123104
**Attempting to grab a bodypart with a weapon leads to "you grab *** by *** with your *weapon* but nothing is grabbed
**Attempting to "pinch" various body parts shows "you adjust you grip on***" and nothing else.
*Alligators can wear armor (same post as above)
*Non-alive creatures (like bronze colossi, zombies and blizzard men) cannot be destroyed (possibly because they can't bleed to death nor have their brain destroyed). However arena testing has revealed that [[dragonfire]] can melt bronze colossi. See http://www.bay12games.com/forum/index.php?topic=51953.msg1123220#msg1123220
:: I had the same problem with skeletal animals. Even a skeletal groundhog fought on without nearly every limb or organ. But they can be killed: A 16 z-level drop does do the trick. --[[User:Doub|Doub]] 11:13, 6 April 2010 (UTC)
*Shield-bashing has no effect with a wooden shield: http://www.bay12games.com/forum/index.php?topic=51953.msg1123499#msg1123499
*The default settings are such that your military dwarfs will train, train, train, and possibly starve in the process. See [[DF2010:Military/Guide]], "Getting your squad to do something", for details.
*Dwarves will continue to train in barracks even after being removed from a squad. (Because they are completing the task they started before they will move on to something else, changing your alert helps here as well).
*{{L|Wrestling}} will take much longer than combat using any kind of Weapon (unlike in 40d), this is due to the fact that a wrestler will have a very hard time making an opponent either bleed to death or have their brain destroyed. A single wrestler, completely untrained, can take on a pack of 5 Crawls in about 20 minute (at 50fps) if Urist McWrestler goes into a martial state. But a Dwarf with an Adamantine battle axe, even if completely untrained, can cut through 5 Crawls in about 5 minutes (at 50fps).
*[[Thirsty]] and [[Hungry]] tags are guaranteed to appear for any soldier (as they are when a dwarf does anything else in this release) because Dwarves will now try to complete a task before they eat/drink. (While I have yet to have a wrestler pass out due to not eating/drinking, they will be wrestling in combat until they kill their target)[[User:Kenji 03|Kenji 03]] 11:44, 5 April 2010 (UTC).

== Labors ==

*Hunting Issues. See: http://www.bay12games.com/forum/index.php?topic=51953.msg1123228#msg1123228
*Miners now cancel mining designations when they can't reach them: http://www.bay12games.com/forum/index.php?topic=51953.msg1123272#msg1123272
*Metal goblets are always iron, regardless of input: http://www.bay12games.com/forum/index.php?topic=51953.msg1123533#msg1123533 (Not true; I've made tons of copper goblets using copper bars)
*Manager screen doesn't show you materials for traction benches: http://www.bay12games.com/forum/index.php?topic=51953.msg1123533#msg1123533
*Workers are too dedicated, dehydrate themselves: http://www.bay12games.com/forum/index.php?topic=51953.msg1123599#msg1123599
*Cooking with alcohol is buggy: http://www.bay12games.com/forum/index.php?topic=51953.msg1123702#msg1123702
*When crafting shell crafts, craftsdwarves never actually produce a shell craft, but instead sit forever with the same shell, with their skills increasing. (confirmation required)
*Dwarves take orders to prepare meals with liquid ingredients like dwarven syrup, wine, and rum, but almost never do it and instead dump the liquid inside the kitchen where it sits cluttering it up and can't be moved... Because it's liquid.
::Using dwarven syrup works just fine for me, but my cook always grabs at least one solid ingredient. Ie, 3 stacks of syrup + one stack of cheese -> finished and edible meal. --[[User:Squirrelloid|Squirrelloid]] 17:54, 5 April 2010 (UTC)
*Making Rock Short Sword results in a wooden short sword. Especially annoying when making an adamantine sword! (multiple reports)
::Is this before or after setting the rock to be allowed for non-economic use in the 'z' screen?
*Wood cutter. Tried to upgrade his axe to a steel one, never cut another tree in his life after being forced to dump his copper battle axe. It's like wood cutting had a seperate profile and he was the only one excluded; Sure enough, turned one of my jewelers into wood cutter and it worked fine for him.
*Immigrants arrive with only peasant labors enabled, even if they are legendary jewelers or whatever. They may sometimes have weird labors enabled. (Stonecrafting master lye makers) No known workaround, manually check each immigrants labors.
*In the {{k|o}}rders menu, there are options for auto {{k|b}}utcher, auto {{k|k}}itchen and auto {{k|f}}ishery. All three of these respond to {{k|b}} only, {{k|k}} and {{k|f}} do nothing.
*Parties never end, sometimes eating up half the labor force.
::You ever waited for parties to actually end in .40d? Just undesignate the statue garden or whatever and the party ends =)
::That's the workaround I took, except I had to get rid of the dining room. In any case, it's still a bug.
* Soap-making seems to be broken big time. You can build a soap-maker's shop, but you can't assign tasks to it. Issuing work order through the manager does work, but the soap is never taken to any stockpiles or hospitals and stays forever in the workshop.
* Making waterskin in leather works results in a weird item called "flask" (simply that, no mention of leather or whatever) that is never used and stays forever in the workshop. Those don't seem to cause clutter in the workshop either. (A metal variant (Ex. Iron) is now capable of being created at a metal smith, probably causing this bug. Soldiers will carry an Metal Flask).
Miners will sometimes dig into underground seas with no "Damp Stone" notification prior to that.

== Moods ==

*Fey moods can request body parts (!!!): http://www.bay12games.com/forum/index.php?topic=51953.msg1123573#msg1123573
**Animal bones satisfies the body parts request.
*Fey moods can request "rock bars." Upon further review, this means "metal bars"

== Creature Data ==

*Alligators have hair. (see http://www.bay12games.com/forum/index.php?topic=51953.msg1123104#msg1123104)
*Descriptions sometimes take strange objects ('She likes to consume she'): http://www.bay12games.com/forum/index.php?topic=51953.msg1123533#msg1123533
*When iron men and maybe Bronze Colossi die, the statues that make up their corpses adopt images of creatures (I.e: Statue of a dwarf 1) and events. - feature; the molten metal falling from them will make statues out of any corpses below where they died (tested and confirmed)
*Giants and giantesses are mapped to the wrong gender.
*Unicorns give birth to elk fawns.
*Mountain goat fawns are called "Stray Horse foal", although having all the features of a mountain goat.
** Confirmed, this is due to what is assumed to be a copy/paste error in the raws - The raws list "Mountain goat kid" as well as "Horse foal" as possible child names, so it randomly picks one.
*in BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:STANDARD_HEAD_POSITIONS both eye lids are around the right eye and clean the left eye

== Stockpiles ==
*Problems with categorization. See http://www.bay12games.com/forum/index.php?topic=51953.msg1123178#msg1123178
*Custom stockpile options don't seem to always work: http://www.bay12games.com/forum/index.php?topic=51953.msg1123474#msg1123474
*Dead vermin never seem to rot: http://www.bay12games.com/forum/index.php?topic=51953.msg1123731#msg1123731
*"Take from stockpile" is broken: http://www.bay12games.com/forum/index.php?topic=52126.0

== Arena ==
*Graphics mode does not work with arena.

== Military ==
*Copying an empty order causes an immediate crash. See http://www.bay12games.com/dwarves/mantisbt/view.php?id=83
*Going to the schedule grid of the inactive group causes an immediate crash. See http://www.bay12games.com/dwarves/mantisbt/view.php?id=156
*Dwarves who are assigned to squads seem to be permanently affixed to the soldier life - changing schedules, training options, switching out dwarves, disbanding the squad: nothing works. All they do is eat, drink, sleep, Individual Combat Drill and take Kill orders. (multiple reports, bug incidence somewhat inconsistent, deconstructing assigned barracks sometimes helps)
*Similarly to the issue above, squads can also get into a "permanent civilian life" and will never go into "recruit mode" unless ordered to "station" or "Kill a target", upon canceling this order they will go back to civilian mode. (Although they will perform individual combat drills, but in civilian garbs unless you replaced their equipment)((Confirmation needed))[[User:Kenji 03|Kenji 03]] 11:54, 5 April 2010 (UTC).
*Bolts assign to a squad that is then disbanded do not free up for use by other squads automatically.

== Injuries ==
*Dwarf with compound fracture and mangling on his toe's nail and skin never recovered, surgeons performed "surgery" on said dwarf for years but nothing ever healed. (confirmation required)
**Confirmed. Red-coloured third finger of the left hand was operated on several times, up to about a month. After that, the surgeon wandered off to see to his needs, or the patient was given sustenance, thus breaking the operation.
*Surgeon provided constant "suturing," each time using up thread. May be related to above problem.

== Items ==

*Eating a masterwork meal will cause the cook to suffer art defacement.

*Butchered animals allow bones to made (confirmed by making bone bolts).

*Quarry bush leaves do not appear in the kitchen menu and the Dwarves will not cook them, rendering them useless except for trading.

*Obsidian does not appear in the accounting stone menu

==Nobles==
*My dwarves had a bit too much [[fun]], dying down to the last 4 dwarves, my nobles were killed and so on. This resulted in the Nobles-list to be emptied of noble-slots except for military nobles.. only happened once, but I had to abandon the fortress since the list stayed empty after the population growing to 30+ without a possibilty to appoint brokers or managers.

::Confirmed. With my starting party, the expedition leader became stark raving mad, from this point the leaders noble positions disappeared from the noble screen (bookkeeping, manager, leader, etc), only military and health-related stuff remained. After he died from starvation/dehydratation, nothing changed. [[User:Jj|Jj]] 16:47, 4 April 2010 (UTC)

::Second that. Mayor/broker died, and the positions became unavailable along with still vacant sheriff slot. Manager, bookkeeper and medical/military positions remained as they were, though. --[[User:Ashmore|Ashmore]] 02:26, 5 April 2010 (UTC)

== Graphics ==
*Arena does not work for graphics mode.
*After generating a world and embarking, you may notice missing tiles. Restart DF to fix.

-------
Currently updated through post 77 of the .31.01 bug thread, except for Arena bugs

== Saves ==
*Renaming a save (ex. "Region2-spr-1050" to "Region2") will invalidate the save, even if you give the save it's original name back. If you must back-up a save manually, putting it into a zip/rar file seems to preserve it's ability to be reloaded. ((Confirmation needed))[[User:Kenji 03|Kenji 03]] 11:56, 5 April 2010 (UTC)

v0.31 Talk:Brewer

2010-04-06T11:20:45Z

Doub:

==Brewing Numbers==
My Adequate Brewer made a stack of 5 Dwarven wine out of a "stack" of 1 plump helmet. The old version had brewers producing this amount all the time, but I want some verification that it doesn't change in this version. What's everyone else getting? Also, two seeds were produced.--[[User:Eagle0600|Eagle0600]] 09:10, 6 April 2010 (UTC)
: My Great Brewer made a stack of 10 Dwarven Ale out of a stack of 2 pig tails, with 4 pig tail seeds remaining. --[[User:Doub|Doub]] 11:20, 6 April 2010 (UTC)

v0.31:Known bugs and issues

2010-04-06T11:13:06Z

Doub:

{{AV}}
'''PLEASE SUBMIT BUGS TO THE OFFICIAL BUG TRACKER - THEY WON'T GET FIXED IF THEY ARE ONLY LISTED HERE.''' 
'''[http://bay12games.com/dwarves/mantisbt/ Dwarf Fortress Bug Tracker]'''

As the version is new, and we're still discovering what bugs are, obviously a lot of unverifiable information is going to get added to this thread. Recommend that new entries be added with "'''(confirmation needed)'''", and that people can document each bug on the discussion page. Once we have 2+ instances of a bug with some specific description of what's occurring, we can remove the parenthetical, or alternately, we can discuss removing unconfirmed bugs if there are issues in recreating them. People can also link relevant posts and threads from the forums here to help document the bugs. --[[User:Squirrelloid|Squirrelloid]] 08:58, 3 April 2010 (UTC)
:Please also read the 'Not Actually Bugs' section before adding bug reports! --[[User:Squirrelloid|Squirrelloid]] 09:00, 3 April 2010 (UTC)

==Not Actually Bugs==
*As megabeasts no longer die during world creation, the standard world creation will run until 1050 (Dwarf-Rapture) unless stopped. -- Andrei901, 2 April 2010, someone else check this please
::Not a bug. World creation is *supposed* to run until 1050... --[[User:Squirrelloid|Squirrelloid]] 08:50, 3 April 2010 (UTC)
*Tilesets in png format don't work? Just a black display.
::Tilesets must be in .bmp format, as they always have had to be. The .png format only works for the d# series. --[[User:Squirrelloid|Squirrelloid]] 08:50, 3 April 2010 (UTC)
:::A d## merge is in progress, .png will be supported soon.--[[User:Ar-Pharazon|Ar-Pharazon]] 01:32, 4 April 2010 (UTC)
*When choosing material for a squad item(cloak in this case) there are hundreds of "forgotten beast leather" to choose from.
::That's because there are lots of different forgotten beasts. Somewhat annoying? Yes. Working exactly like every other source creature for leather? Yes. --[[User:Squirrelloid|Squirrelloid]] 08:50, 3 April 2010 (UTC)
*Making a adamantine cloak -sometimes- results in "Urist McArmorer, Armorer cancels Forge adamantine cloak: Needs 10000 adamantine cloth." Also needed 15000 strands to make wafers. Update: this happens if you don't have enough cloths, I had 4 adamantine cloths in this case. If you have enough it works nicely. (The actual required number is much less than 15,000. It's closer to something like 10 adamantine strands. This is probably due to the fact that cloth can be consumed "in pieces" now for medical purposes).
*"Clothier canceled construct silk bag: needs 1000 cloth": http://www.bay12games.com/forum/index.php?topic=51953.msg1123552#msg1123552
::This is working as intended. Cloth is now measured in smaller units than individual pieces. If anything, the bug is that the game isn't telling you how much cloth each cloth item represents. --[[User:Squirrelloid|Squirrelloid]] 08:52, 3 April 2010 (UTC)
*Cats and Dogs - Including kittens, puppies, and War/Hunting variants - are similarly listed twice.
::They're listed twice because they separately list males and females. WAD. --[[User:Squirrelloid|Squirrelloid]] 09:05, 3 April 2010 (UTC)
*Weird red C in top left corner - "''' C '''" means new combat report, "''' H '''" means new hunting message, "''' S '''" means new sparring message. Feature, not bug: http://www.bay12games.com/forum/index.php?topic=52514.0
*No option for magma in the finder, this is because [[magma]] is guaranteed everywhere now.
*Corpses sitting in refuse piles turn into skeletons rather than piles of bones, in fact in the 2+ years I started my fort I haven't seen a single bone or shell in my refuse stockpile and yes, we've been eating fish too. I think bones are gone or something. Haven't tried butchering animals yet, though, so confirmation please...
::Arena Mode allows skeletons to be butchered into bones and a skull. Fortress Mode should be the same
::Dwarves automatically take skeletons, partial skeletons and limbs from the refuse stockpile and butcher them to produce only bones and skulls.

== Embarking ==

*You can embark with some rather unrealistic prepared foods (such as the aforementioned fly brains, which in real life go at about 900 thousand brains to the pound). This may be related to further issues involving vermin's organs.
*All fish are mentioned 2x. See http://www.bay12games.com/forum/index.php?topic=51953.msg1123220#msg1123220
*I find that I am unable to add items or skill points to my dwarves on the embarking screen. I'm using Mayday's graphics pack. I'm not sure what the cause of this is or if I'm just missing something obvious. (Explanation/Confirmation needed) ((signing your posts helps, and it just means you need to free up expedition points (cancel an item)))[[User:Kenji 03|Kenji 03]] 11:32, 5 April 2010 (UTC).
::I thought it might be that I needed to free up points too, but the counter shows that I have points-a-plenty. I'm also unable to subtract items from my embarkation list.--[[Special:Contributions/67.166.145.39|67.166.145.39]] 02:51, 6 April 2010 (UTC)
::I can confirm this. It happens in vanilla too apparently. Hit "esc" and go to you custom binds and rest your + and - keys. Do the same for the */ keys.
*After embarking with items that was listed two times in list game crashes.

== Sites ==

*Magma pipes in volcanoes extend to the top of the map, past the mountain itself.
*Magma tubes remain the same shape and size the whole way down and may be square. See http://www.bay12games.com/forum/index.php?topic=52412.0 (for the above as well)

== Buildings and Zones ==

*Can't farm on dry soil. See http://www.bay12games.com/forum/index.php?topic=51951.msg1123336#msg1123336
*Construction and/or deconstruction can occasionally force some dwarves to idle. See: http://www.bay12games.com/forum/index.php?topic=51953.msg1123250#msg1123250
*Dwarves raid elf (all?) caravans for cloth (maybe thread as well) for the hospital zone. (confirmed. Won't happen if your hospital zone has no room in it's containers for the items, though).
*Emptied murky ponds refill much faster than they used to. A decent sized pond that's been mined into can now flood your fortress if it starts raining (confirmation required)
*There are currently no (or occasionally very few) fish. This includes brooks, rivers, oceans, ponds, lakes (underground and otherwise). You may get a few turtles sometimes. No known workaround: http://www.bay12games.com/forum/index.php?topic=52217.0

== Combat ==

*Some combat maneuvers have no effect. See: http://www.bay12games.com/forum/index.php?topic=51953.msg1123104#msg1123104
**Attempting to grab a bodypart with a weapon leads to "you grab *** by *** with your *weapon* but nothing is grabbed
**Attempting to "pinch" various body parts shows "you adjust you grip on***" and nothing else.
*Alligators can wear armor (same post as above)
*Non-alive creatures (like bronze colossi, zombies and blizzard men) cannot be destroyed (possibly because they can't bleed to death nor have their brain destroyed). However arena testing has revealed that [[dragonfire]] can melt bronze colossi. See http://www.bay12games.com/forum/index.php?topic=51953.msg1123220#msg1123220
** I had the same problem with skeletal animals. Even a skeletal groundhog fought on without nearly every limb or organ. But they can be killed: A 16 z-level drop does do the trick. --[[User:Doub|Doub]] 11:13, 6 April 2010 (UTC)
*Shield-bashing has no effect with a wooden shield: http://www.bay12games.com/forum/index.php?topic=51953.msg1123499#msg1123499
*The default settings are such that your military dwarfs will train, train, train, and possibly starve in the process. See [[DF2010:Military/Guide]], "Getting your squad to do something", for details.
*Dwarves will continue to train in barracks even after being removed from a squad. (Because they are completing the task they started before they will move on to something else, changing your alert helps here as well).
*{{L|Wrestling}} will take much longer than combat using any kind of Weapon (unlike in 40d), this is due to the fact that a wrestler will have a very hard time making an opponent either bleed to death or have their brain destroyed. A single wrestler, completely untrained, can take on a pack of 5 Crawls in about 20 minute (at 50fps) if Urist McWrestler goes into a martial state. But a Dwarf with an Adamantine battle axe, even if completely untrained, can cut through 5 Crawls in about 5 minutes (at 50fps).
*[[Thirsty]] and [[Hungry]] tags are guaranteed to appear for any soldier (as they are when a dwarf does anything else in this release) because Dwarves will now try to complete a task before they eat/drink. (While I have yet to have a wrestler pass out due to not eating/drinking, they will be wrestling in combat until they kill their target)[[User:Kenji 03|Kenji 03]] 11:44, 5 April 2010 (UTC).

== Labors ==

*Hunting Issues. See: http://www.bay12games.com/forum/index.php?topic=51953.msg1123228#msg1123228
*Miners now cancel mining designations when they can't reach them: http://www.bay12games.com/forum/index.php?topic=51953.msg1123272#msg1123272
*Metal goblets are always iron, regardless of input: http://www.bay12games.com/forum/index.php?topic=51953.msg1123533#msg1123533 (Not true; I've made tons of copper goblets using copper bars)
*Manager screen doesn't show you materials for traction benches: http://www.bay12games.com/forum/index.php?topic=51953.msg1123533#msg1123533
*Workers are too dedicated, dehydrate themselves: http://www.bay12games.com/forum/index.php?topic=51953.msg1123599#msg1123599
*Cooking with alcohol is buggy: http://www.bay12games.com/forum/index.php?topic=51953.msg1123702#msg1123702
*When crafting shell crafts, craftsdwarves never actually produce a shell craft, but instead sit forever with the same shell, with their skills increasing. (confirmation required)
*Dwarves take orders to prepare meals with liquid ingredients like dwarven syrup, wine, and rum, but almost never do it and instead dump the liquid inside the kitchen where it sits cluttering it up and can't be moved... Because it's liquid.
::Using dwarven syrup works just fine for me, but my cook always grabs at least one solid ingredient. Ie, 3 stacks of syrup + one stack of cheese -> finished and edible meal. --[[User:Squirrelloid|Squirrelloid]] 17:54, 5 April 2010 (UTC)
*Making Rock Short Sword results in a wooden short sword. Especially annoying when making an adamantine sword! (multiple reports)
::Is this before or after setting the rock to be allowed for non-economic use in the 'z' screen?
*Wood cutter. Tried to upgrade his axe to a steel one, never cut another tree in his life after being forced to dump his copper battle axe. It's like wood cutting had a seperate profile and he was the only one excluded; Sure enough, turned one of my jewelers into wood cutter and it worked fine for him.
*Immigrants arrive with only peasant labors enabled, even if they are legendary jewelers or whatever. They may sometimes have weird labors enabled. (Stonecrafting master lye makers) No known workaround, manually check each immigrants labors.
*In the {{k|o}}rders menu, there are options for auto {{k|b}}utcher, auto {{k|k}}itchen and auto {{k|f}}ishery. All three of these respond to {{k|b}} only, {{k|k}} and {{k|f}} do nothing.
*Parties never end, sometimes eating up half the labor force.
::You ever waited for parties to actually end in .40d? Just undesignate the statue garden or whatever and the party ends =)
::That's the workaround I took, except I had to get rid of the dining room. In any case, it's still a bug.
* Soap-making seems to be broken big time. You can build a soap-maker's shop, but you can't assign tasks to it. Issuing work order through the manager does work, but the soap is never taken to any stockpiles or hospitals and stays forever in the workshop.
* Making waterskin in leather works results in a weird item called "flask" (simply that, no mention of leather or whatever) that is never used and stays forever in the workshop. Those don't seem to cause clutter in the workshop either. (A metal variant (Ex. Iron) is now capable of being created at a metal smith, probably causing this bug. Soldiers will carry an Metal Flask).
Miners will sometimes dig into underground seas with no "Damp Stone" notification prior to that.

== Moods ==

*Fey moods can request body parts (!!!): http://www.bay12games.com/forum/index.php?topic=51953.msg1123573#msg1123573
**Animal bones satisfies the body parts request.
*Fey moods can request "rock bars." Upon further review, this means "metal bars"

== Creature Data ==

*Alligators have hair. (see http://www.bay12games.com/forum/index.php?topic=51953.msg1123104#msg1123104)
*Descriptions sometimes take strange objects ('She likes to consume she'): http://www.bay12games.com/forum/index.php?topic=51953.msg1123533#msg1123533
*When iron men and maybe Bronze Colossi die, the statues that make up their corpses adopt images of creatures (I.e: Statue of a dwarf 1) and events. - feature; the molten metal falling from them will make statues out of any corpses below where they died (tested and confirmed)
*Giants and giantesses are mapped to the wrong gender.
*Unicorns give birth to elk fawns.
*Mountain goat fawns are called "Stray Horse foal", although having all the features of a mountain goat.
** Confirmed, this is due to what is assumed to be a copy/paste error in the raws - The raws list "Mountain goat kid" as well as "Horse foal" as possible child names, so it randomly picks one.
*in BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:STANDARD_HEAD_POSITIONS both eye lids are around the right eye and clean the left eye

== Stockpiles ==
*Problems with categorization. See http://www.bay12games.com/forum/index.php?topic=51953.msg1123178#msg1123178
*Custom stockpile options don't seem to always work: http://www.bay12games.com/forum/index.php?topic=51953.msg1123474#msg1123474
*Dead vermin never seem to rot: http://www.bay12games.com/forum/index.php?topic=51953.msg1123731#msg1123731
*"Take from stockpile" is broken: http://www.bay12games.com/forum/index.php?topic=52126.0

== Arena ==
*Graphics mode does not work with arena.

== Military ==
*Copying an empty order causes an immediate crash. See http://www.bay12games.com/dwarves/mantisbt/view.php?id=83
*Going to the schedule grid of the inactive group causes an immediate crash. See http://www.bay12games.com/dwarves/mantisbt/view.php?id=156
*Dwarves who are assigned to squads seem to be permanently affixed to the soldier life - changing schedules, training options, switching out dwarves, disbanding the squad: nothing works. All they do is eat, drink, sleep, Individual Combat Drill and take Kill orders. (multiple reports, bug incidence somewhat inconsistent, deconstructing assigned barracks sometimes helps)
*Similarly to the issue above, squads can also get into a "permanent civilian life" and will never go into "recruit mode" unless ordered to "station" or "Kill a target", upon canceling this order they will go back to civilian mode. (Although they will perform individual combat drills, but in civilian garbs unless you replaced their equipment)((Confirmation needed))[[User:Kenji 03|Kenji 03]] 11:54, 5 April 2010 (UTC).
*Bolts assign to a squad that is then disbanded do not free up for use by other squads automatically.

== Injuries ==
*Dwarf with compound fracture and mangling on his toe's nail and skin never recovered, surgeons performed "surgery" on said dwarf for years but nothing ever healed. (confirmation required)
**Confirmed. Red-coloured third finger of the left hand was operated on several times, up to about a month. After that, the surgeon wandered off to see to his needs, or the patient was given sustenance, thus breaking the operation.
*Surgeon provided constant "suturing," each time using up thread. May be related to above problem.

== Items ==

*Eating a masterwork meal will cause the cook to suffer art defacement.

*Butchered animals allow bones to made (confirmed by making bone bolts).

*Quarry bush leaves do not appear in the kitchen menu and the Dwarves will not cook them, rendering them useless except for trading.

*Obsidian does not appear in the accounting stone menu

==Nobles==
*My dwarves had a bit too much [[fun]], dying down to the last 4 dwarves, my nobles were killed and so on. This resulted in the Nobles-list to be emptied of noble-slots except for military nobles.. only happened once, but I had to abandon the fortress since the list stayed empty after the population growing to 30+ without a possibilty to appoint brokers or managers.

::Confirmed. With my starting party, the expedition leader became stark raving mad, from this point the leaders noble positions disappeared from the noble screen (bookkeeping, manager, leader, etc), only military and health-related stuff remained. After he died from starvation/dehydratation, nothing changed. [[User:Jj|Jj]] 16:47, 4 April 2010 (UTC)

::Second that. Mayor/broker died, and the positions became unavailable along with still vacant sheriff slot. Manager, bookkeeper and medical/military positions remained as they were, though. --[[User:Ashmore|Ashmore]] 02:26, 5 April 2010 (UTC)

== Graphics ==
*Arena does not work for graphics mode.
*After generating a world and embarking, you may notice missing tiles. Restart DF to fix.

-------
Currently updated through post 77 of the .31.01 bug thread, except for Arena bugs

== Saves ==
*Renaming a save (ex. "Region2-spr-1050" to "Region2") will invalidate the save, even if you give the save it's original name back. If you must back-up a save manually, putting it into a zip/rar file seems to preserve it's ability to be reloaded. ((Confirmation needed))[[User:Kenji 03|Kenji 03]] 11:56, 5 April 2010 (UTC)

40d Talk:Cleaning

2008-10-11T08:30:45Z

Doub: verified cleaning of blood'n'bolts in 40d

I see no indication that any of this is true in 40c. No blood, vomit, water, bolts, or ammunition (even not-forbidden) has been cleaned up in my fortress, and every dwarf has had Cleaning toggled on by default from the beginning. Is this old data? --[[User:Sev|Sev]] 14:05, 2 September 2008 (EDT)
:At least the cleaning of blood and used bolts I can verify for 40d. So probably its still true for vomit and water, too. --[[User:Doub|Doub]] 04:30, 11 October 2008 (EDT)

40d Talk:Water wheel

2008-09-25T08:59:48Z

Doub:

==Perpetual motion machine==
I've not used waterwheels yet, so I'm unsure if this is the case, but couldn't you, theoretically, set up a perpetual motion machine using a waterwheel and a screw pump?

The article contradicts itself, it says on the first line "in" a flow, but the next line refers to a flow underneath, which is correct? [[User:Matryx|Matryx]] 17:34, 31 October 2007 (EDT)

A perpetual motion device is easy enough to setup once you have an understanding of screwpumps and power. I currently have a water wheel placed between two underground resevoirs that runs a mill and pumps water from the lower tank to the higher one. Its very energy efficient aswell. Three axles, a gear, the mill and the pump only draw 40 power leaving me 60 for other devices.

I'll try get up screenshots of it or maybe a tidier one later --[[User:Lucid|Lucid]] 19:58, 31 October 2007 (EDT)
==edit comments==

Someone removed my edit, but the water wheel actually only requires one square of water underneath it, not three. - Sludge Man

We could really use better pictures. The tileset in these screenshots is terrible, (lets use the default one) and they are very unclear. I do not understand how to build a working waterwheel after looking at this page.
==Perpetual motion again==
I removed the unclear example of a perpetual motion machine with a forum link to much clearer designs. We still need clear pictures and elaboration of the method of construction. I'll get around to it once I understand it myself, if no one beats me to it. --[[User:Turgid Bolk|Turgid Bolk]] 15:48, 5 November 2007 (EST)

: Sorry about the tilesets but I didn't think anyone would mind my custom one considering the only noticibly difference is the pump which looks like 2 barrels.
Although my screenshots were specifically for a perpetual motion machine which is why they lacked indepth wheel and pump construction.
I was hoping to create a video or some sort of tutorial to add in the construction section which dealt with creating waterwheels for someone who has absolutely no idea of any of the mechanics.

Also how reliable are the new designs?
I checked out that link and I previously toyed with designs similar to those and found them to be excellent power generators but not true perpetual motion machines, they all lost power intermittedly for varying lengths of time. --[[User:Lucid|Lucid]] 18:30, 5 November 2007 (EST)

== Perpendicular to water flow ==

Strange as it may sound, water wheels do 'not' need to be parallel to the water flow direction to work. [[User:VengefulDonut|VengefulDonut]] 16:31, 23 November 2007 (EST)
:This is as in real life - you can build a less efficient water wheel by putting the "buckets" at an angle - and indeed might put the "buckets" on a 360 degree pivot for some purposes.[[User:GarrieIrons|GarrieIrons]] 07:21, 8 January 2008 (EST)
===Water Flow Needed?===
::Actually there is no need for water flow at all. A water wheel seems to generate power even if it is built to a water body with no current (no "entry" or "exit" points). So basically the water wheel just needs to touch water and that's it. This is what I've noticed when confining a canal with floodgates at both ends. --[[User:Flaa|Flaa]] 07:47, 22 April 2008 (EDT)
:::This seems to have changed in a recent version. In previous versions you just had to connect a canal to a brook and the whole canal would count as 'flowing' even when nothing was moving. In my latest game this hasn't worked. So it's either changed, or the fact that I tried a 4-tile wide canal has stopped it working. --[[User:Juckto|Juckto]] 18:22, 10 May 2008 (EDT)

== Powering a Water Wheel ==

It seems that you can connect a Water Wheel to a Windmill, or other power source and cause it to spin - is there a purpose to doing this? can you move water along channels this way? What are the benefits? --[[User:SeiferTim|SeiferTim]] 12:47, 12 March 2008 (EDT)

::I think that it's because water wheels use power to run. Hence, they produce 100 power by themselves, but end up using 10 to spin, making the net power output only 90. Therefore, most likely the windmills provide that 10 power to the waterwheel. I don't think it does anything, but it does look cool.
--[[User:Umiman|Umiman]] 05:34, 27 May 2008 (EDT)

==Verify Carpenter==
Does the water wheel require carpentry to build?--[[User:Richards|Richards]] 04:11, 21 April 2008 (EDT)
:Yep--[[User:Dorten|Dorten]] 04:15, 21 April 2008 (EDT)
::Thanks Dorten.--[[User:Richards|Richards]] 04:26, 21 April 2008 (EDT)

==Minimum water level==
What is the minimum water level and flow required to power a waterwheel? --[[User:Sphexx|Sphexx]] 16:48, 27 May 2008 (EDT)

:1/7 water Hight. [[User:Hoborobo|Hoborobo]] 04:59, 8 June 2008 (EDT)-
::That doesn't sound correct to me... [[User:Juckto|Juckto]] 20:33, 14 June 2008 (EDT)

== Definition of "flow"? ==

The article states that waterwheels need flow under them, but how exactly does the game calculate this?

I was thinking that it means any water changing depth below it, but that would rule out building on a river/ocean full of 7/7 tiles. Will a waterwheel work on top of water full to the brim but supposedly "flowing" (i.e. ocean, full river)? [[User:G-Flex|G-Flex]] 8 June 2008 (EDT)

:I believe that right now a waterwheel will provide power as long as there is at least 4/7 water depth below it, or at least that is what has been the case in my experience, as I don't think a dead end channel would really provide any water flow yet a waterwheel will still provide power if place over one. --[[User:Elvang|Elvang]] 04:15, 8 June 2008 (EDT)

::Are you sure, though? Juckto (above) seems to believe the state of affairs is a bit more complicated. I guess I can just test it out for myself at some point. [[User:G-Flex|G-Flex]] 04:28, 8 June 2008 (EDT)

:::I'm sure about the minimum being 4/7, never had a waterwheel that would work below that level. Maybe it counts the water as flowing if the water depth changes during x ticks? If thats the case then a closed system would work unless you manage to get all the tiles at the same depth. I doubt the game uses a system much more complicated than that, as it would cause incredible lag checking each tile for depth, direction of flow, speed of flow, and path of least resistance. Not to mention factoring in water pressure and evaporation. Additionally, waterwheels seem to work no matter what their orientation is to the water. --[[User:Elvang|Elvang]] 04:37, 8 June 2008 (EDT)

::::Hrm, yeah, it seems like you need change of depth for it to count as "flow". Putting in the ocean just don't work.[[User:G-Flex|G-Flex]] 04:23, 16 June 2008 (EDT)

:::::Change of depth not needed. Putting it in a full river works. --[[User:Savok|Savok]] 22:47, 20 July 2008 (EDT)

::::::I believe to have found the key to it: I placed three waterwheels in the bed of a drained underground river; the first one with its outer tiles on the riverbed, the second one hanging in a channel of three tiles, the third one with its outer tiles on top of two constructed walls, which I constructed in a channel in the riverbed, i.e. on rough stone-block floor.
<pre>
So I built them on top of this:

1. 2. 3. ( 4. )
rrr rrr rrr ( fff )
rrr r_r rfr ( f_f ) r=river-tile
r_r r_r r_r ( f_f ) f=rough floor (top of constructed wall)
rrr r_r rfr ( f_f ) _=open space (channeled underneath)
rrr rrr rrr ( fff )
</pre>
::::::When I let the water in again, only the second one was powered, even when I interrupted the flow again. (As I the water flew out, it still turned at water level 1. That seems to be the minimum level indeed.){{verify}} So the generation of power seemed to depend on the underground you build them in, not on anything like flow. Then, to verify my theory that you need river-tiles around waterwheels to make them work, I built a fourth one upstream, which was surrounded by floor-tiles. This one, however, streched all across the river, and so divided it into a lower part (with the three waterwheels in it) and an upper part. In the lower part, no waterwheel worked anymore, as I built one of the second type in the upper part of the river, it worked again!
::::::Therefore, I suppose waterwheels must be surrounded (at least partially?){{verify}} by river-tiles, which additionally must not be disconnected from the source of the river. --[[User:Doub|Doub]] 12:25, 4 September 2008 (EDT)

== Construction Key? ==

The construction area needs a key. I can't figure out what the O is supposed to be, and I only use the ASCII version of DF.--[[User:RustyMcloon|Rusty Mcloon]] 11:19, 18 July 2008 (EDT)

:It is a vertical axle. You should know, since you play the pseudo-ASCII version. --[[User:Savok|Savok]] 22:47, 20 July 2008 (EDT)

== Two Quick Questions... ==

would water wheels be powered by water falling down a Z axis onto a waterwheel?

can a waterwheel be used in magma or would it burn?

--[[User:Althalus|Althalus]] 10:05, 9 August 2008 (EDT)

::Water wheels need to be placed in a channel with water to be powered. AFAIK the channel doesn't have to be any longer than the water wheel, doesn't need water coming in nor going out. The game isn't clever enough yet... (shhh!)
::I think the water has to be depth:3.
::Water wheels have to be made of wood. Any machine that has magma flow through it, if it isn't made of magma-safe material, will burn/melt. You might get a bit of power for a short time but the water wheel would burn (assuming temperature is turned on which it is by default).
::To sign your name properly use the signature button on the toolbar or type "~" four times: <nowiki>~~~~</nowiki> [[User:GarrieIrons|GarrieIrons]] 21:26, 8 August 2008 (EDT)

:::Waterwheels may not be magma-safe, but the actual structure of the wheel is built one z-level above the magma, rather than in it. Thus it is entirely plausible that a waterwheel could survive being used with magma. Whether it does actually survive such circumstances, and if so whether it starts turning, could do with being tested. --[[User:Raumkraut|Raumkraut]] 23:09, 8 August 2008 (EDT)

:Well i guess i will have to do my own experiments on magma wheels, i will report my findings. --[[User:Althalus|Althalus]] 10:05, 9 August 2008 (EDT)

== Waterwheel on rivers ==
Yesterday I build a waterwheel above a river, it did not work. I build a second wheel in a moat channeled from the river it did work. Either I made some stupid error, or there is a bug at the current ver. that makes wheel not working on rivers themselves... --[[User:Catpaw|Catpaw]] 06:37, 29 August 2008 (EDT)
:A brook or a river? [[User:HeWhoIsPale|HeWhoIsPale]] 09:24, 29 August 2008 (EDT)
:: Oh it was a brook, since my dwarfes always waded through it. okay I understand it now... Is kinda quirky in the simulation... you turn a brook into a river by digging its surface... uh. common logic anyone? :-) --[[User:Catpaw|Catpaw]] 09:50, 29 August 2008 (EDT)
::: Brooks have a special layer of floor on top of them that allows fishing and similar activities, but discounts it being considered as running water, channeling can remove this layer. Apparently this has been the best fit way of allowing a brook to be traversable while still being a body of water. [[User:HeWhoIsPale|HeWhoIsPale]] 10:51, 2 September 2008 (EDT)

40d Talk:Trading

2008-09-11T13:43:59Z

Doub:

== Consolidation of Trading, Trade Depot, Caravans, and Wagon ==

This needs wikification with some amounts of rewriting. I will give it a go. --[[User:Maska|Maska]] 06:51, 27 January 2008 (EST)

Yea thanks, this is my first try at a wiki-page. sorry if it was crappy... --[[User:CombatWombat|CombatWombat]] 06:42, 28 January 2008 (EST)

Nah, there's no such thing as a crappy wiki edit, when its got content in it. Just remember to be bold, otherwise there would be nothing here. --[[User:Maska|Maska]] 07:29, 28 January 2008 (EST)

Well this thread's a little old, but I re-wrote and consolidated some more information on this page. There was also some discussion of this on [[Talk:Caravan#Merge_this_into_Trading]]. If you don't approve, please don't just revert it, I organized and cleaned up a lot of the scattered info, so at the very least it should be split from where it is now on the Trading page to where it should ultimately go. --[[User:Marble Dice|Marble Dice]] 02:48, 2 May 2008 (EDT)

== Extraction from different articles ==

All the information on trading seems quite scattered now (Trade depot, Caravan, Dwarf, Elf, Human etc), and as most stuff is well written I think we should merge the trade sections to this one page and leave behind only refecences. --[[User:Maska|Maska]] 08:29, 27 January 2008 (EST)
:Looking good, is there a 'your first caravan'-type tutorial anywhere we could link to? Something with advice on the sort of goods to prepare and what to buy for the first winter, with new players in mind. I'll try and find one somewhere. --[[User:TangoThree|TangoThree]] 09:07, 27 January 2008 (EST)

: Done, linked to the trade section in the new player guide. --[[User:TangoThree|TangoThree]] 09:11, 27 January 2008 (EST)
::Done++ Someone else finish merging the information from Caravans into the page. Make sure to get that awesome Elf trader image. --[[User:Ikkonoishi|Ikkonoishi]] 12:10, 28 January 2008 (EST)

== Haulers? ==
In my experience the "bring item to depot" tasks were performed by any dwarf, even without any hauling labors enabled. Can also be my imagination. I cannot check it for now, so, anyone, please verify.--[[User:Dorten|Dorten]] 23:49, 27 January 2008 (EST)
:That's correct, as many times my pure crafters will stop crafting to haul goods to the depot, despite having only one or two production labors enabled. --[[User:N9103|Edward]] 03:41, 28 January 2008 (EST)
::Is this similar to plant gathering where even non-working nobles and children will do it, or is it limted to any regular dwarf regardless of labour? --[[User:TangoThree|TangoThree]] 19:04, 31 January 2008 (EST)
:::Yes, nobles and children will haul stuff to the depot. --[[User:Janus|Janus]] 00:19, 1 February 2008 (EST)

== Moving goods on afterwards ==

To get things ''out'' of the depot.... do I have to order them removed while the caravan is still around?
I have starving dwarves... and food going rotten in the depot![[User:GarrieIrons|GarrieIrons]] 06:36, 5 February 2008 (EST)
:AFAIK, no. in my experience, anything bought is treated as like it's just lying there, not being traded.
Well, yes and no. Once trading is finished dwarves will start bringing the bought goods in while the caravan still is there. But you cant 'order' them to per se ;) Your own stuff that wasnt sold however will remain in depot till the caravan leaves. --[[User:Koltom|Koltom]] 18:45, 13 February 2008 (EST)
::Unless you go back into the {{k|g}}oods menu at the Depot and unmark them for trading. --[[User:N9103|Edward]] 04:25, 14 February 2008 (EST)
I've a question in the same vein: I just traded for a truckload of goods, but the traders didn't even leave them in the depot! They just carried my goods out with them. Were my dwarves supposed to carry all of the goods back earlier? --[[User:Gh3yz0r|Gh3yz0r]] 14:08, 16 February 2008 (EST)

==Duplicate Page?==
The page "Caravan" has very similar information, though this "trading" page seems more complete.[Samyotix]

== culling on mandates ==

what's that? in the trade screen? me no be native speaker...--[[User:Koltom|Koltom]] 21:56, 20 February 2008 (EST)
:I think it means that it will hide things that are not allowed to be traded: "Mayor has put bans on certain exports". But I don't know if it hides an entire bin if one item in it is banned. [[User:Hex Decimal|Hex Decimal]] 14:29, 27 February 2008 (EST)

== "everything is ruined now" ==
I just accidentally tried to trade the elves a wooden bin full of stone goods. Now ALL my stone goods, including ones not actually in that bin, are unacceptable. I ended up just seizing the rope I needed, but I'd like to know if this is a glitch, or if I just made them too angry to trade. —Preceding [[template:unsigned|unsigned]] comment added by [[User:Shadow archmagi|Shadow archmagi]] ([[User talk:Shadow archmagi|talk]]•[[Special:Contributions/Shadow archmagi|contribs]]) {{{2|}}}
:It's not a glitch. Elves refuse to trade at all after you give them even a single wood or animal product. After you do that the trade option is locked until they come back to trade next year. [[User:Hex Decimal|Hex Decimal]] 14:52, 27 February 2008 (EST)
:The wooden bin told the elves you hate trees. Elves don't trade with people who hate trees. Elves don't trade with people who hate animals. Don't trade dead trees or dead animal parts to elves. [[User:Rkyeun|Rkyeun]] 13:18, 22 March 2008 (EDT)

==Depot Access==
Not a single square on my map is accessible by the caravan. What should i do? --[[User:Noctune9|Noctune9]] 11:16, 19 March 2008 (EDT)

EDIT: My bad. It seems that it shows every square as inaccessible if the depot is not fully constructed--[[User:Noctune9|Noctune9]] 11:16, 19 March 2008 (EDT)

== Trading Margins ==
In regards to this submission:
"If you have a somewhat experienced broker or you already raised the traiders mood to pleased or above you can usually trade with marginal profit for them and you can also safely ignore their counteroffers, offering the same trade a second time, successfully."

You do realize that when they make a counteroffer they automatically add those counteroffer goods to the pot, right? Just making sure. Are you saying you go back through and remove each item their counteroffer added to your side of the deal? Seems much simpler to just stick to the ~50% rule of thumb, especially at the beginning with low skills and again once you reach the point of having so many trade goods that you can easily buy everything you need from each caravan with plenty of goods left over. --[[User:Janus|Janus]] 14:55, 22 March 2008 (EDT)
: Yes, exactly. Whenever i get a counteroffer I remove all items from the list they added until their profit is back to what i deem fit, sometimes leaving a low value item, say, 50☼, they chose, if I wanted to trade it anyway. Since this is not a beginners guide page, I think it's wrong to advise people to a 50% profit margin that is much higher than necessary. Once the traders are happy, they will even agree to trading an anvil for an anvil. I tested this extensively because usually i want them to leave early and thus try to make them angry. Almost impossible. We could however add smth about the (suspected) advantages of having high export totals like bigger caravans, more immigrants, arrival of king. --[[User:Koltom|Koltom]] 06:39, 23 March 2008 (EDT)
::The 50% rule of thumb is a good starting point either way. "Advanced" page or not, before I posted that, there was no guidance on what profit margin the visiting traders would generally accept, so that people were left to find out the hard way.
::Going back through a long list of your trade goods to hunt down and remove the items which the visiting trader added to the offer seems like a bit of a waste of time to me, unless you just have very few trade goods or a really tight budget at your fortress.
::As for being able to get away with lower margins once the trader is happy, that is definitely useful knowledge and could be expanded upon. --[[User:Janus|Janus]] 12:52, 23 March 2008 (EDT)

There is no way to refuse a counter-offer, is there? The only option is to hit {{k|Enter}}, and the "goods are added to the pot" as you say ... correct? --[[User:Juckto|Juckto]] 09:07, 6 May 2008 (EDT)

:Correct, however, you're free to simply remove the additionally requested items and re-offer. In the case of a new trader in his first few trade sessions, this will likely work, as he gained experience (probably a LOT) just by offering. Even if it doesn't, as long as you don't repeat it many times (4+ I'd say) then there's no real risk of driving them off. --[[User:N9103|Edward]] 13:16, 6 May 2008 (EDT)

::I find it easiest to commence one dwarf with novice valuer that way you already know prices... within the first trading I can usually get some items at straight trade (0% profit) maybe it depends on civilisation demands.[[User:GarrieIrons|GarrieIrons]] 01:14, 13 July 2008 (EDT)

:::If you want a trade to succeed just make sure the trader gets 100-1000* profit. Almost every trade I made with this method was accepted. --[[User:AlexFili|AlexFili]] 06:09, 15 July 2008 (EDT)

== Goblins butchering my caravans. ==

Every time I trade with the caravans, a goblin ambush comes and the merchants are all killed. Ive taken new measures to prevent this, but will merchants come back to trade? and what effect does their death have? —Preceding [[template:unsigned|unsigned]] comment added by [[User:Wafl|Wafl]] ([[User talk:Wafl|talk]]•[[Special:Contributions/Wafl|contribs]]) {{{2|}}}

My caravans get shot up by goblins all the time. Then you get to loot their stuff. The caravans always seem to come back next year. [[User:Ripheus|Ripheus]] 22:49, 24 March 2008 (EDT)

== Trading flowchart ==

Given a number of questions on the forums, it may be a good idea to put together a flowchart of the steps involved in trading. I will draft something up here (at least partially so I can safely screw up my first attempt on this wiki)

Tasks are sequential top-to-bottom, but can be done in parallel left-to-right
{|cellpadding="2" border="1"
|-
| colspan=2 rowspan=2| Make or obtain goods to trade || Build Depot ({{K|b}} - {{K|D}})
|-
| Ensure Depot is accessible ({{K|D}})
Check green area reaches edge of map
|-
| colspan=3 | Wait until a caravan arrives on the map
"A--- caravan from --- has arrived."
|-
| Set goods to be traded ({{K|q}} - {{K|g}}) || Request a trader ({{K|q}} - {{K|r}}) || Wait for caravan to reach the depot
"Merchants have arrived and are unloading their goods"
|-
| Wait for goods to be hauled || Wait for the trader to finish their other tasks and go to the depot || Wait for the rest of the caravan to reach the depot and be unloaded
|-
| colspan=3 | Begin actual trading ({{K|q}} - {{K|t}})
|}

Hmm. Is there a better way to show this? It may not help much as is... [[User:Kaypy|Kaypy]]

:Ask and ye shall receive
{|cellspacing=0 align=center
|-
|width=50|
|width=1|
|width=50|
|width=50|
|width=1|
|width=50|
|width=50|
|width=1|
|width=50|
|-
|colspan=3|
|colspan=3 style="border: 1px solid #aaa;" align=center|Arrive at fortress location
|-
|colspan=4 height=20 width=3|
|style="border: 1px solid #aaa;"|
|-
|
|colspan=7 style="border: 1px solid #aaa;"|
|-
|
|style="border: 1px solid #aaa;" height=20|
|colspan=5|
|style="border: 1px solid #aaa;" height=20|
|-
|colspan=3 rowspan=5 style="border: 1px solid #aaa;" align=center|Create Goods
|colspan=3|
|colspan=3 style="border: 1px solid #aaa;" align=center|Build Depot
|-
|colspan=4|
|style="border: 1px solid #aaa;" height=20|
|-
|colspan=3|
|colspan=3 style="border: 1px solid #aaa;" align=center|Check Depot is accessible
|-
|colspan=4|
|style="border: 1px solid #aaa;" height=20|
|-
|colspan=3|
|colspan=3 style="border: 1px solid #aaa;" align=center|Wait for caravan
|-
|
|style="border: 1px solid #aaa;" height=20|
|colspan=5|
|style="border: 1px solid #aaa;" height=20|
|-
|
|style="border: 1px solid #aaa;"|
|colspan=2|
|colspan=4 style="border: 1px solid #aaa;"|
|-
|
|style="border: 1px solid #aaa;" height=20|
|colspan=2|
|style="border: 1px solid #aaa;"|
|colspan=2|
|style="border: 1px solid #aaa;"|
|-
|
|colspan=4 style="border: 1px solid #aaa;"|
|colspan=2|
|style="border: 1px solid #aaa;"|
|-
|
|style="border: 1px solid #aaa;" height=20|
|colspan=5|
|style="border: 1px solid #aaa;" height=20|
|-
|colspan=3 style="border: 1px solid #aaa;" align=center|Set goods to be traded
|colspan=3|
|colspan=3 rowspan=5 style="border: 1px solid #aaa;" align=center|Wait for caravan to arrive at depot and merchants to finish unloading
|-
|
|style="border: 1px solid #aaa;" height=20|
|-
|colspan=3 style="border: 1px solid #aaa;" align=center|Wait for goods to be hauled
|-
|
|style="border: 1px solid #aaa;" height=20|
|-
|colspan=3 style="border: 1px solid #aaa;" align=center|Request the trader at the depot and turn off his other labours
|-
|
|style="border: 1px solid #aaa;" height=20|
|colspan=5|
|style="border: 1px solid #aaa;" height=20|
|-
|
|colspan=7 style="border: 1px solid #aaa;"|
|-
|colspan=4 height=20 width=3|
|style="border: 1px solid #aaa;"|
|-
|colspan=3|
|colspan=3 style="border: 1px solid #aaa;" align=center|Trade
|}
You'll note I shifted the location of requesting trader --[[User:Juckto|Juckto]] 08:46, 6 May 2008 (EDT)
:The above was the first draft. You can access the current version at [[Trading/Flowchart]]. Anyway, what I wanted to say was '''Re: Adeptable's changes'''
:I don't think the third branch is neccesary. For one, it makes it seem too wide, and secondary it implies that turning off the trader's labours ''all the time'' means that trading will happen faster - almost as if it will make merchants arrive more often. --[[User:Juckto|Juckto]] 23:36, 2 August 2008 (EDT)

== Offerings ==

Can anyone expound on the function of {{K|o}}ffering goods as gifts to traders? I tried giving the elves about 1000 worth of tchotchkes, and the next year they showed up with more goods than I've ever seen -- lots of caged animals, whereas I usually get very few, and so on. However, other times I gave them more and it seemed nothing changed. [[User:Anydwarf|Anydwarf]] 12:01, 7 May 2008 (EDT)

Gifts to the traders (and large trading profits) should increase the number of traders / wagons you get the following year, so they'll bring more stuff to trade. AFAIK no-one knows about the numbers for sure though. [[User:Samyotix|Samyotix]] 14:51, 9 June 2008 (EDT)

== Add hint: "Buy everything ... in case you get a strange mood"? ==

Personally I've found it very useful to do this:

When traders arrive,
a) optionally check stocks.
b) Buy everything you can't make or harvest in your own fort.
c) In the diplomat meeting, order everything you can't make or harvest.

To be specific: Thread, Silk, cloth, metal bars (anything else?).

The reason:
a) Dwarves sometimes demand items out of some metal or alloy they like.
b) Dwarves who are possessed or get a strange mood will sometimes demand silk or cloth.

Players who proactively (harr!) seek to stock materials for possible moods will IMO have much less of a problem with dwarves going insane from moods. However I couldn't figure out where (or if) I should insert that, so I'll just add this idea (adding a hint: buy everything you don't have) to the discussion.

Also, as far as I know, possessed/moody dwarves in the current version (27.176.38c) do not demand specific items. Rather, they want a) any metal bar b) any metal ore c) Silk d) Cloth e) wood f) raw gem g) any stone ... that was it, right?. So probably such a hint could read something like:

"NOTE: If your fortress cannot harvest silk, it would be useful to order some from the caravans. If you do not have a cloth industry yet, maybe order some cloth as well. Having a small stock of materials which you are not actively using in your economy - e.g. GCS silk - will increase the likelihood of your fortress gaining an artifact from any mood or possession."
[[User:Samyotix|Samyotix]] 14:49, 9 June 2008 (EDT)

== Clear the perimeter? ==

Is clearing the entire perimeter of the map really necessary? While my depot has been accessible at all, the caravan has '''always''' appeared at a point with access to the depot. --[[User:Raumkraut|Raumkraut]] 13:13, 12 July 2008 (EDT)
:What the article says is:
:#Caravans enter the map from a random direction which does not coincide with the relative direction of the originating civilization,
:#they may appear from different directions or z-levels each year
:#they cannot use stairs
:#they may leave without trading if it takes too long to reach the trade depot
:With the above points in mind:
:#In order to guarantee perfect, permanent wagon accessibility, a three tile path must be cleared around the entire perimeter of the map, with at least one joining path from the border to the trade depot. Any parts of this path system which have grass must be paved with floor tiles, bridges, or roads to prevent trees from growing. Ramps must be used to adjust z-level elevation.

I have certainly had a depot accessible to the southern border, then had the human merchants only turn up with mules because they were approaching from a different direction.

The recommendations are how to ensure the human wagons turn up every summer (it also helps to remember to have your drawbridge down as soon as summer commences!) If you are not so concerned about human merchants then ignore the advice. If you don't have enough dwarf-power then ignore the advice. Some of it only needs to be done once (ie: adjusting slopes), and some of it just gives you more territory to consider for defending from invaders (being open to merchants also opens you to invaders).[[User:GarrieIrons|GarrieIrons]] 00:33, 13 July 2008 (EDT)

==Seizing goods==
"It is worth noting that in the Mac port (untested for other ports), you can simply remove the depot that the merchants are camped out on to recieve all their goods."

I can confirm that this also works in the PC version.[[User:Moonman|Moonman]] 14:07, 13 July 2008 (EDT)

== Empty caravans ==

human, elf, and dwarf caravans bringing me nothing.
is it possible to have a depot too full? --[[User:Eerr|Eerr]] 07:30, 28 July 2008 (EDT)

:In recent versions of the game I've noticed that traders, after their initial visit, will only bring what was mentioned in your previous trade agreement with them. In earlier versions they'd bring all sorts of tat along too. Did you perhaps not request any goods for import? I don't imagine this could affect the Elves as well though. --[[User:Raumkraut|Raumkraut]] 08:02, 28 July 2008 (EDT)

::Prior to the latest group of releases, I'd been getting empty caravans for a LONG time, Elves and Humans alike, and occasionally even the Dwarves. Hasn't happened to me in the e release yet though (hadn't spent too much time on the other releases). --[[User:N9103|Edward]] 13:13, 28 July 2008 (EDT)

== starvation ==

it must be because they brought food to my starving settlement
(dwarves will run out and get food straight from the caravan)

== Added a small bit. ==

I quickly changed the section about the possible exploit of deleting a trade depot from Mac-only-bug to an across the board phenomenon.

== Caravan at Inaccessible Depot ==

I assume it is related to the 3 wide path only showing as 1 green square, but the caravan has stopped at a trade depot that is listed as inaccessible. Does this mean that some trade depots will show bad with SHIFT-D but are actually okay? --[[User:Aristoi|Aristoi]] 21:15, 8 August 2008 (EDT)

:The three-wide path showing only one green square is, to my knowledge, correct. That green is the center of the path, along which the center of the wagon must align with to fit within the three-wide path. --[[User:Mattmoss|Mattmoss]] 23:14, 8 August 2008 (EDT)

::Thanks. It'd be nice then if the Shift-D showed that as a caravan accessible depot then. --[[User:Aristoi|Aristoi]] 01:21, 9 August 2008 (EDT)

:::Correction: It does, there was a boulder in the way that I did not see. --[[User:Aristoi|Aristoi]] 22:10, 10 August 2008 (EDT)

== 50% profit rule ==

This really, REALLY needs to be made clearer in the game. There's nothing wrong with the trader telling us how much profit he'd expect from our goods! I've got tens of thousands worth of goods that I haven't sold for two years straight because the bloody traders wouldn't tell me how much they want, and I didn't find the 50% rule buried in this article until just now! --[[User:Theory|Theory]] 09:36, 13 August 2008 (EDT)

:It's hardly 'buried' in the article, it's certainly not a rule, and it is made pretty clear in the game. I'm not just trying to be contrary; let me explain: A skilled broker can routinely trade with only a thirty or twenty percent profit, even down to ten percent if the merchant is in a good mood. If the merchant wants more profit, he will either put forth a counter-offer or say "With your trade goods such as they are, I can't possibly imagine you getting all of those items." This seems like a pretty clear indication that he wants a bigger margin. As to its place in the article: a full half of the section titled "Trading" details the fifty percent suggestion. If you think it deserves increased prominence, I encourage you to edit it yourself. Them's my six cents. --[[User:Zombiejustice|Zombiejustice]] 17:16, 13 August 2008 (EDT)

:: afaik, traders will accept ''any'' profit, as long as they're not annoyed and also as long as you're not trying to buy 'high-tech' items like steel anvils or bars, with 'low-tech' items such as poorly crafted pieces of stone, bone etc [[User:Twiggie|Twiggie]] 17:58, 21 August 2008 (EDT)

==Elves and dead stuff==

it seems elves will make counter-offers for dead stuff, like totems, bone and shell crafts... needs to be fixed imo [[User:Twiggie|Twiggie]] 18:00, 21 August 2008 (EDT)

==Adamantium in trade window==

I've just noticed that Adamantine strands appear in my trade window in purple text despite them not being present at the depot and marked for trade. I'm fairly sure that this is something to do with mandates from the nobles (my broker has forbade the export of adamantine) but I can't find any mention of this on the Wiki, any thoughts? [[User:Extar|Extar]] 21:55, 5 September 2008 (EDT)
I did a bit more testing and the purple text is clearly to do with export bans, I'll add it to the mandate page. [[User:Extar|Extar]] 22:02, 5 September 2008 (EDT)

==They are selling dead animals?!==

I don't know if this is because my fortress is in the freezing tundra, but all caravans offer me cages with dead, butcherable corpses inside. I don't complain about this: There's no additional charge for them, and so I get free meat, fat, skins and bones. Does this happen in other biomes, too? --[[User:Doub|Doub]] 09:43, 11 September 2008 (EDT)

40d Talk:Trading

2008-09-11T13:43:21Z

Doub: caravans offer me cages with dead, butcherable corpses inside!?

40d Talk:Vermin

2008-09-09T20:02:13Z

Doub: even a self-made pool of water is sufficient for pool-vermin to make them spawn.

Can someone put a list of all the vermin, and their uses if caught? And a picture? --[[User:DDouble|DDouble]] 21:55, 11 November 2007 (EST)
:What would be the use of the picture? --[[User:Eagle of Fire|Eagle of Fire]] 00:24, 12 November 2007 (EST)
::Just to clarify in case the first poster didn't know, vermin all use the same image. --[[User:Shades|Shades]] 09:13, 12 November 2007 (EST)

:::Not quite. Lungfish vermin, for instance, use a fish-like symbol, worms use a tilde, etc. However, most do use the simple "large dot" graphic. --[[User:JT|JT]] 16:30, 18 November 2007 (EST)

:I just listed them all, with most pertinent information. Hope you like. Now someone should go list all the extracts. --[[User:Turgid Bolk|Turgid Bolk]] 02:08, 26 November 2007 (EST)

== un tameable vermin ==

Fire snakes when caught in an animal trap had a value of 1. I was unable to tame them and the announcement "needs tameable small creature item" appeared. --[[User:Kingzilla|Kingzilla]] 14:18, 23 January 2008 (EST)

== Creating vermin habitat ==

I know you can make vermin show up to your base (try a tundra biome with an aquifer - if the stuff belowground stays liquid you can have toads hopping around in the snow :S. Also, I dug out some open cliffside dwellings in a random jungle map, and 5 min later about 50 or so bats turn up singing Meatloaf, and causing miasma hell for my dwarves after they were (mostly) dispatched by my two cats :(. Can anyone else replicate these (or other) situations to confirm my hypothesis? --[[User:Frostedfire|Frostedfire]] 04:21, 19 February 2008 (EST)

:Apparently vermin (and everything else?) spawn by biome. So, if you dig into a cave biome, you'll get bats. I dug next to a chasm and suddenly cave spiders spawn in my tunnel. [[User:Anydwarf|Anydwarf]] 22:37, 6 May 2008 (EDT)

:I started a fortress in the freezing tundra, no life there except my dwarves, wild musk-oxen, wild elk and the inhabitants of the magma-pipe. But as soon as I pumped some water into a cave one level beneath the surface, turtles started to spawn near the self-made underground pool. So apparently even a self-made pool of water is sufficient for pool-vermin ([[toad|toads]] and [[turtle|turtles]]) to make them spawn. --[[User:Doub|Doub]] 16:02, 9 September 2008 (EDT)

== Tameable? ==

There should be a list of -- or mark on -- tameable vermin.

At the very least, there should be a mention that only some can be tamed.

Currently, I know rats can be tamed, while fire snakes and two-legged rhino lizards cannot.

I have a tame fire snake. I'm pretty sure all non-fish vermin creatures are tameable. [[User:Bouchart|Bouchart]] 19:36, 5 March 2008 (EST)

:fire snakes and rhino lizards can be tamed, they are just [PET_EXOTIC]. not all non-fish vermin can be tamed(flies cant for example), and some fish vermin can be(turtles). -[[User:Chariot|Chariot]] 20:22, 5 March 2008 (EST)

Is there a way to get my dwarves to stop eating the fluffy wamblers before I can tame them? Apparently they taste like meat and saltwater taffy had a baby. Or something. (Maybe I just have to be pretty quick on handing my DM the task) [[User:Anydwarf|Anydwarf]] 22:37, 6 May 2008 (EDT)

:Not without a lot of micro-management. Even being quick to assign the task isn't enough, the dwarves will just snatch it right out of his hand. However, if you follow your trapper around as he's searching, and immediately forbid the vermin when he catches it (note: the vermin, not the trap), that'll prevent your dwarves from eating it. This works because eating requires the vermin itself to be unforbidden, but taming only requires that the animal trap is available. --[[User:Morlark|Morlark]] 19:31, 21 June 2008 (EDT)

== Corpse patrol ==

alright I guess this is just a winge...

is there any order to set (or anything else I can do) to get my dwarves to clean up vermin corpses without me manually marking them for dumping?

I guess I'm looking for an order: Autodump vermin corpses or something.
I know if I {{k|k}}{{k|d}} each corpse then it gets dumped pretty quick, but especially once my population goes up I'd like to not worry so much about miasma in the dining room.[[User:GarrieIrons|GarrieIrons]] 08:23, 21 June 2008 (EDT)

: AFAIK dead vermin will be automatically placed in a refuse stockpile, so long as 'Dwarves gather refuse' is selected in the refuse options menu ({{k|o}}{{k|r}}) --[[User:Raumkraut|Raumkraut]] 19:15, 21 June 2008 (EDT)
:: This seems to be what is happening now that I actually have some peasants wandering around on cleaning/food hauling/refuse hauling only... so it sounds like vermin corpses are a lesser priority for picking up for refuse haulers then items marked for dumping are.[[User:GarrieIrons|GarrieIrons]] 07:27, 22 June 2008 (EDT)

== repopulation ==

The [[turtle]] article states:
:Like most fish, they can be harvested too aggressively, and become depleted until the next '''repopulating of vermin'''
I added the bold bit... when does repopulating of vermin occur? Randomly? At spring (on a date) or during thaw (if there is one?) or differently by biome?[[User:GarrieIrons|GarrieIrons]] 01:06, 9 July 2008 (EDT)

Vermin respawn on season changes, along with refuse erasure and limb-mending, if I remember correctly. May be wrong, though. [[User:Iituem|Iituem]] 21:37, 5 Aug 2008 (GMT)

== Flies... ==

Is there anyway to kill flies?

I second this question! :) Is there anyway to kill these things? [[User:Ehertlein|Ehertlein]] 16:34, 5 August 2008 (EDT)

40d Talk:Lever

2008-09-06T14:17:56Z

Doub: Use notes to organize your levers

== floodgates vs. doors misinformation? ==
"''Therefore, it is more logical to use doors, at least until doors aren't usable for holding back water.''"

I'm fairly certain that doors can't be closed while flooded. They work as described for opening via lever, but cannot close when blocked by water or creatures.
Granted, the last time i've levered doors was back in 2d. Please verify or change the wording? --[[User:Vaevictus|Vaevictus]] 15:49, 2 June 2008 (EDT)

:In the current version{{version|0.27.176.38c}} doors can close if water currently occupies the same square. I believe elsewhere the wiki states this destroys the water, but I have not verified if the water is destroyed. --[[User:Quartic|quartic]] 16:18, 2 June 2008 (EDT)
::Does it matter how much water? -- [[User:Vaevictus|Vaevictus]] 13:35, 3 June 2008 (EDT)
:::I have verified this with water of depth 1 and 7, but not values in between.--[[User:Quartic|quartic]] 13:38, 3 June 2008 (EDT)

Todo: Check whether two levers connected to the same door operate it in the same way the older versions did - that is, pulling each lever once would open the door, then do nothing as the second lever is pulled. -- [[User:Zaratustra|Zaratustra]] 19:23, 7 November 2007 (EST)

I'm using vertical bars as portcullis for my keep, and they attach to levers. Perhaps a comment that bars and grates operate identically in this version, specifically with respect to levers? -Gotthard

== controlling at a distance ==

Does the lever need to be adjacent to the item it is controlling?

I want to put a floodgate at the end of a channel... [[User:GarrieIrons|GarrieIrons]] 02:52, 23 January 2008 (EST)
:No, it can be anywhere.--[[User:Dorten|Dorten]] 02:57, 23 January 2008 (EST)

so, analog to the support-cave-in-trap how about building a nice water basin, say 4x4 for a start and covering it with grates, all connected to a lever - do grates have to be attached to a wall or floor on one side? I will try *broad grin* --[[User:Koltom|Koltom]] 21:45, 22 February 2008 (EST)

:Grates must be attached to a wall on one side, although you can put grates next to only grates and the dwarves will build them. Followed by their collapse. Like walls off bridges.--[[User:Draco18s|Draco18s]] 18:31, 2 March 2008 (EST)

:Try building supports under them. SL's hand of armok uses supports under hatches in a similar way. [[User:VengefulDonut|VengefulDonut]] 23:37, 2 March 2008 (EST)

::Yeah, its not working like i wanted it too. The support thing will probably work. Or I will just leave a few walls in the basin..will try that later, busy right now. *watches goblin fly away in high arc* --[[User:Koltom|Koltom]] 19:52, 3 March 2008 (EST)

Regarding remote activation/control: I just spent 10 minutes berating my dwarves for completely ignoring two Pull Lever commands while vile forces of darkness approached, only to find that once I removed the Dwarves Stay Indoors restriction, they happily stepped up to the, uh, lever. The bridges are outside, the levers are on the level below. Has anyone else experienced this? [[User:Holyfool|Holyfool]] 17:49, 22 March 2008 (EST)

:Was the lever and/or any part of the path to the lever marked as "outside"? Use {{k|k}} to check. --[[User:Savok|Savok]] 10:25, 23 March 2008 (EDT)

::I checked and one of the levers was indeed marked "outside". In fact, there are several squares on my first underground level that are marked "outside". Is that because they are in the general area of the stairway leading outside? Thank you for the info. --[[User:Holyfool|Holyfool]] 18:42, 29 March 2008 (EDT)

:::When I quit reading all new forum messages and stayed at the wiki, I thought this would stop. [[Outside|Read The Wiki]]. Really. Read it. No, really, click on that link. --[[User:Savok|Savok]] 19:57, 29 March 2008 (EDT)

== Megabeasts ==

I have noticed that a bridge that a hydra is standing on cannot be retracted {{version|0.27.176.38c}}. Has anyone else had similar experiences? [[User:VengefulDonut|VengefulDonut]] 00:15, 13 March 2008 (EDT)

:Titans cause the same problem. I conjecture that bridged can't be retracted while megabeasts are standing on them. [[User:VengefulDonut|VengefulDonut]] 02:08, 13 March 2008 (EDT)

:Also elephants, it seems. Possibly creature size. [[User:VengefulDonut|VengefulDonut]] 13:18, 13 March 2008 (EDT)

:Dragons cause the same problem. Are megabeasts supposed to all show up at once like this? [[User:VengefulDonut|VengefulDonut]] 21:43, 13 March 2008 (EDT)

== Proposed addition: Mechanism sequence ==

Given the problems that arise when using non magma-safe materials for mechanisms on floodgates, it is quite handy to know which mechanisms go where at the link selection (When for example you're really low on bauxite). 
From my experimentation with floodgate-lever, the first mechanism selected goes at the gate and the second one at the lever. I still haven't activated the contraption, but I'm assuming it's going to be ok. 
I'm also assuming the same is usefull for grates and bars. --[[User:Nonickch]], unsigned

:There is some lower-down text that tells you which mechanism goes in where. --[[User:Savok|Savok]] 08:30, 15 June 2008 (EDT)

== Finding Links ==

Is it possible to determine what a lever is linked to without pulling it and checking to see what happens? -[[User:Fuzzy|Fuzzy]] 00:43, 6 September 2008 (EDT)
:AFAIK the only way is to attempt to link the lever to a built object and notice which one if any is not available.
:eg if you have two bridges but only one is available to be linked to, it is because you are already linked to the other one.
:This would be a really good feature if it was implemented.
:[[User:GarrieIrons|GarrieIrons]] 09:55, 6 September 2008 (EDT)

:I guess this is one good use for the new note-feature: Just use the same note for lever and target. --[[User:Doub|Doub]] 10:17, 6 September 2008 (EDT)

40d:Water wheel

2008-09-04T16:35:25Z

Doub: It seems that building at/on river tiles and a chammel of three tiles are prerequisites for working waterwheels in 40c. See my entry in the talk. (Feel free to correct me if I'm wrong.)

{{Machine_component|name=Water wheel|key=w
|construction=
* 3 [[Wood]]
|construction_job=
# [[Architecture]]
# [[Carpenter]]
|power=Needs 10 power. Generates 100 power. Net gain of 90 power.
}}

A '''water wheel''' is a [[machine component]] that provides [[power]] via [[water]] flow. To build a water wheel, select {{key|b}}uild menu and choose {{key|M}}achine components. It requires 3 [[wood]] and generates 100 power, which can be used for operating a [[pump]] or [[mill]]. Use [[axle]]s and [[Gear assembly|gear]]s to access the power produced by a water wheel.

== Construction ==

Water wheels must be built on <strike> water or</strike>{{verify}} [[river]] tiles. They can also be powered if placed over [[brook]] tiles, but '''only if''' you first dig through the surface of the brook. Build a [[channel]] three tiles{{verify}} long, right on the brook. The water wheel will sit above this channel, but you cannot place it yet -- it has no support. Build an [[axle]] or [[gear assembly]] next to the tile where the center of the water wheel will be. Now you can place the waterwheel.

Power will be generated once a channel tile under the water wheel is filled with water at a depth of four or greater. You can transport the power wherever it is needed via horizontal and vertical axles and gear assemblies. It is possible to support a waterwheel by building its center next to a preexisting waterwheel's center.

In order for the water wheel to generate power, there needs to be a water flow in one of the three tiles beneath it.

{|style="border: 1px solid #0b0; background: #dfd"
|+'''Basic watermill design'''
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|}
{|style="border: 1px solid #0b0; background: #dfd"
|+'''Dual watermill design'''
|- style="font-family: monospace; font-weight: bold; font-size: 135%"
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== Perpetual motion ==

Due to the low power draw of a [[screw pump]], a self-powering assembly can be made with a water wheel that still leaves plenty of excess power for other uses. This is an [[exploit]], and possibly a bug.

A simple design is available at [http://www.bay12games.com/cgi-local/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic&f=11&t=000946 this forum post].
 
'''*REMEMBER TO BUILD THE HORIZONTAL AXLE OR GEAR ASSEMBLY BEFORE THE WATER WHEEL*'''
{|style="border: 1px solid #333; background: #000"
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{|style="border: 1px solid #333; background: #000"
|+'''Perpetual Motion Design #1 - Bottom Floor'''
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{|style="border: 1px solid #333; background: #000"
|+'''Perpetual Motion Design #2'''
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'''Key'''
 
'''Wall: ║ ═ ╠ ╝ ╚ ╔ ╗ ╣ ╩'''
 
'''Floor: +'''
 
'''Water Wheel: W'''
 
'''Gear Assembly: *'''
 
'''Axle E/W: ═'''
 
'''Axle N/S: ║'''
 
'''Pump from west: XX'''
 
'''Pump from south: XX'''
 
'''Channel: _ or if background color is white'''
 
'''Closed water source opening: X'''
 

[[Category:Machine components]]

40d Talk:Water wheel

2008-09-04T16:25:16Z

Doub: I think that I've found the prerequisites to make a waterwheel work in 40c!

==Perpetual motion machine==
I've not used waterwheels yet, so I'm unsure if this is the case, but couldn't you, theoretically, set up a perpetual motion machine using a waterwheel and a screw pump?

The article contradicts itself, it says on the first line "in" a flow, but the next line refers to a flow underneath, which is correct? [[User:Matryx|Matryx]] 17:34, 31 October 2007 (EDT)

A perpetual motion device is easy enough to setup once you have an understanding of screwpumps and power. I currently have a water wheel placed between two underground resevoirs that runs a mill and pumps water from the lower tank to the higher one. Its very energy efficient aswell. Three axles, a gear, the mill and the pump only draw 40 power leaving me 60 for other devices.

I'll try get up screenshots of it or maybe a tidier one later --[[User:Lucid|Lucid]] 19:58, 31 October 2007 (EDT)
==edit comments==

Someone removed my edit, but the water wheel actually only requires one square of water underneath it, not three. - Sludge Man

We could really use better pictures. The tileset in these screenshots is terrible, (lets use the default one) and they are very unclear. I do not understand how to build a working waterwheel after looking at this page.
==Perpetual motion again==
I removed the unclear example of a perpetual motion machine with a forum link to much clearer designs. We still need clear pictures and elaboration of the method of construction. I'll get around to it once I understand it myself, if no one beats me to it. --[[User:Turgid Bolk|Turgid Bolk]] 15:48, 5 November 2007 (EST)

: Sorry about the tilesets but I didn't think anyone would mind my custom one considering the only noticibly difference is the pump which looks like 2 barrels.
Although my screenshots were specifically for a perpetual motion machine which is why they lacked indepth wheel and pump construction.
I was hoping to create a video or some sort of tutorial to add in the construction section which dealt with creating waterwheels for someone who has absolutely no idea of any of the mechanics.

Also how reliable are the new designs?
I checked out that link and I previously toyed with designs similar to those and found them to be excellent power generators but not true perpetual motion machines, they all lost power intermittedly for varying lengths of time. --[[User:Lucid|Lucid]] 18:30, 5 November 2007 (EST)

== Perpendicular to water flow ==

Strange as it may sound, water wheels do 'not' need to be parallel to the water flow direction to work. [[User:VengefulDonut|VengefulDonut]] 16:31, 23 November 2007 (EST)
:This is as in real life - you can build a less efficient water wheel by putting the "buckets" at an angle - and indeed might put the "buckets" on a 360 degree pivot for some purposes.[[User:GarrieIrons|GarrieIrons]] 07:21, 8 January 2008 (EST)
===Water Flow Needed?===
::Actually there is no need for water flow at all. A water wheel seems to generate power even if it is built to a water body with no current (no "entry" or "exit" points). So basically the water wheel just needs to touch water and that's it. This is what I've noticed when confining a canal with floodgates at both ends. --[[User:Flaa|Flaa]] 07:47, 22 April 2008 (EDT)
:::This seems to have changed in a recent version. In previous versions you just had to connect a canal to a brook and the whole canal would count as 'flowing' even when nothing was moving. In my latest game this hasn't worked. So it's either changed, or the fact that I tried a 4-tile wide canal has stopped it working. --[[User:Juckto|Juckto]] 18:22, 10 May 2008 (EDT)

== Powering a Water Wheel ==

It seems that you can connect a Water Wheel to a Windmill, or other power source and cause it to spin - is there a purpose to doing this? can you move water along channels this way? What are the benefits? --[[User:SeiferTim|SeiferTim]] 12:47, 12 March 2008 (EDT)

::I think that it's because water wheels use power to run. Hence, they produce 100 power by themselves, but end up using 10 to spin, making the net power output only 90. Therefore, most likely the windmills provide that 10 power to the waterwheel. I don't think it does anything, but it does look cool.
--[[User:Umiman|Umiman]] 05:34, 27 May 2008 (EDT)

==Verify Carpenter==
Does the water wheel require carpentry to build?--[[User:Richards|Richards]] 04:11, 21 April 2008 (EDT)
:Yep--[[User:Dorten|Dorten]] 04:15, 21 April 2008 (EDT)
::Thanks Dorten.--[[User:Richards|Richards]] 04:26, 21 April 2008 (EDT)

==Minimum water level==
What is the minimum water level and flow required to power a waterwheel? --[[User:Sphexx|Sphexx]] 16:48, 27 May 2008 (EDT)

:1/7 water Hight. [[User:Hoborobo|Hoborobo]] 04:59, 8 June 2008 (EDT)-
::That doesn't sound correct to me... [[User:Juckto|Juckto]] 20:33, 14 June 2008 (EDT)

== Definition of "flow"? ==

The article states that waterwheels need flow under them, but how exactly does the game calculate this?

I was thinking that it means any water changing depth below it, but that would rule out building on a river/ocean full of 7/7 tiles. Will a waterwheel work on top of water full to the brim but supposedly "flowing" (i.e. ocean, full river)? [[User:G-Flex|G-Flex]] 8 June 2008 (EDT)

:I believe that right now a waterwheel will provide power as long as there is at least 4/7 water depth below it, or at least that is what has been the case in my experience, as I don't think a dead end channel would really provide any water flow yet a waterwheel will still provide power if place over one. --[[User:Elvang|Elvang]] 04:15, 8 June 2008 (EDT)

::Are you sure, though? Juckto (above) seems to believe the state of affairs is a bit more complicated. I guess I can just test it out for myself at some point. [[User:G-Flex|G-Flex]] 04:28, 8 June 2008 (EDT)

:::I'm sure about the minimum being 4/7, never had a waterwheel that would work below that level. Maybe it counts the water as flowing if the water depth changes during x ticks? If thats the case then a closed system would work unless you manage to get all the tiles at the same depth. I doubt the game uses a system much more complicated than that, as it would cause incredible lag checking each tile for depth, direction of flow, speed of flow, and path of least resistance. Not to mention factoring in water pressure and evaporation. Additionally, waterwheels seem to work no matter what their orientation is to the water. --[[User:Elvang|Elvang]] 04:37, 8 June 2008 (EDT)

::::Hrm, yeah, it seems like you need change of depth for it to count as "flow". Putting in the ocean just don't work.[[User:G-Flex|G-Flex]] 04:23, 16 June 2008 (EDT)

:::::Change of depth not needed. Putting it in a full river works. --[[User:Savok|Savok]] 22:47, 20 July 2008 (EDT)

::::::I believe to have found the key to it: I placed three waterwheels in the bed of a drained underground river; the first one with its outer tiles on the riverbed, the second one hanging in a channel of three tiles, the third one with its outer tiles on top of two constructed walls, which I constructed in a channel in the riverbed, i.e. on rough stone-block floor.
<pre>
So I built them on top of this:

1. 2. 3. ( 4. )
rrr rrr rrr ( fff )
rrr r_r rfr ( f_f ) r=river-tile
r_r r_r r_r ( f_f ) f=rough floor (top of constructed wall)
rrr r_r rfr ( f_f ) _=open space (channeled underneath)
rrr rrr rrr ( fff )
</pre>
::::::When I let the water in again, only the second one was powered, even when I interrupted the flow again. (As I the water flew out, it still turned at water level 1. That seems to be the minimum level indeed.){{verify}} So the generation of power seemed to depend on the underground you build them in, not on anything like flow. Then, to verify my theory that you need river-tiles around waterwheels to make them work, I built a fourth one upstream, which was surrounded by floor-tiles. This one, however, streched all across the river, and so divided it into a lower part (with the three waterwheels in it) and an upper part. In the lower part, no waterwheel worked anymore, as I built one of the second type in the upper part of the river, it worked again!
Therefore, I suppose waterwheels must be surrounded (at least partially?){{verify}} by river-tiles, which additionally must not be disconnected from the source of the river. --[[User:Doub|Doub]] 12:25, 4 September 2008 (EDT)

== Construction Key? ==

The construction area needs a key. I can't figure out what the O is supposed to be, and I only use the ASCII version of DF.--[[User:RustyMcloon|Rusty Mcloon]] 11:19, 18 July 2008 (EDT)

:It is a vertical axle. You should know, since you play the pseudo-ASCII version. --[[User:Savok|Savok]] 22:47, 20 July 2008 (EDT)

== Two Quick Questions... ==

would water wheels be powered by water falling down a Z axis onto a waterwheel?

can a waterwheel be used in magma or would it burn?

--[[User:Althalus|Althalus]] 10:05, 9 August 2008 (EDT)

::Water wheels need to be placed in a channel with water to be powered. AFAIK the channel doesn't have to be any longer than the water wheel, doesn't need water coming in nor going out. The game isn't clever enough yet... (shhh!)
::I think the water has to be depth:3.
::Water wheels have to be made of wood. Any machine that has magma flow through it, if it isn't made of magma-safe material, will burn/melt. You might get a bit of power for a short time but the water wheel would burn (assuming temperature is turned on which it is by default).
::To sign your name properly use the signature button on the toolbar or type "~" four times: <nowiki>~~~~</nowiki> [[User:GarrieIrons|GarrieIrons]] 21:26, 8 August 2008 (EDT)

:::Waterwheels may not be magma-safe, but the actual structure of the wheel is built one z-level above the magma, rather than in it. Thus it is entirely plausible that a waterwheel could survive being used with magma. Whether it does actually survive such circumstances, and if so whether it starts turning, could do with being tested. --[[User:Raumkraut|Raumkraut]] 23:09, 8 August 2008 (EDT)

:Well i guess i will have to do my own experiments on magma wheels, i will report my findings. --[[User:Althalus|Althalus]] 10:05, 9 August 2008 (EDT)

== Waterwheel on rivers ==
Yesterday I build a waterwheel above a river, it did not work. I build a second wheel in a moat channeled from the river it did work. Either I made some stupid error, or there is a bug at the current ver. that makes wheel not working on rivers themselves... --[[User:Catpaw|Catpaw]] 06:37, 29 August 2008 (EDT)
:A brook or a river? [[User:HeWhoIsPale|HeWhoIsPale]] 09:24, 29 August 2008 (EDT)
:: Oh it was a brook, since my dwarfes always waded through it. okay I understand it now... Is kinda quirky in the simulation... you turn a brook into a river by digging its surface... uh. common logic anyone? :-) --[[User:Catpaw|Catpaw]] 09:50, 29 August 2008 (EDT)
::: Brooks have a special layer of floor on top of them that allows fishing and similar activities, but discounts it being considered as running water, channeling can remove this layer. Apparently this has been the best fit way of allowing a brook to be traversable while still being a body of water. [[User:HeWhoIsPale|HeWhoIsPale]] 10:51, 2 September 2008 (EDT)

40d Talk:Ramp

2008-09-04T14:44:22Z

Doub:

redirect slope to this place?
took a while for me to find this.
helps in making traps and controlling movements.
thank god things can't fly...i think.
oh right and i don't know how to do whatever. redirect.--[[User:Seaneat|Seaneat]] 17:22, 30 June 2008 (EDT)

:Yeah, things can totally fly. Angrystalk the Giant Bat, I know you're out there, come join your brothers in my cages! ---[[User:Zombiejustice|Zombiejustice]] 20:02, 30 June 2008 (EDT)

====Downward Ramp====
I am in my digging designation menu and I don't see an option to dig a ramp down? If I want to do that do I need to use stairs to get down, then construct ramps up? Then replace the stairs with ramps? --[[User:Ehertlein|Ehertlein]] 12:21, 29 August 2008 (EDT)

:One thing you can do is to dig one tile further than the ramp shall be, and dig a channel there.
:Then, your miners are able to dig from there an upward ramp on the level below:
:(side view)
<pre>
XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX
cXXXXXXXXX Level Z c (c)hannel here at first
XXXXXXXXXXXXXX>______XXXX Level Z-1 > then place an upward ramp here
</pre>
:If anyone is able to explain this better, fell free to edit.--[[User:Doub|Doub]]
::I am going to load up a different game and try this out. :) I don't have anything built at Z-1 yet so I hope I can dig the ramp from higher up.
::Ok so this was simpler then I thought I simply changed the Z level one lower and designated ups. No channels, no stairs, just go one lower and designate the up. --[[User:Ehertlein|Ehertlein]] 13:57, 29 August 2008 (EDT)
:::Forget that complicated process - to dig a downward ramp, simply move the screen down one z-level and designate an upward ramp. --[[User:Juckto|Juckto]] 20:56, 3 September 2008 (EDT)
::::Indeed, you are right. How simple! Thx. --[[User:Doub|Doub]] 10:44, 4 September 2008 (EDT)

40d Talk:Iron

2008-09-04T14:03:03Z

Doub:

I wonder why there are Goblins mentioned in the Ore-section on the right? Because they are an abundant source of iron, too? --[[User:Doub|Doub]] 09:58, 4 September 2008 (EDT)

40d Talk:Iron

2008-09-04T13:58:50Z

Doub: New page: I wonder why there are Golins mentioned in the Ore-section on the right? Because they are an abundant source of iron, too? --~~~~

I wonder why there are Golins mentioned in the Ore-section on the right? Because they are an abundant source of iron, too? --[[User:Doub|Doub]] 09:58, 4 September 2008 (EDT)