Dwarf Fortress Wiki - User contributions [en]

40d:Liaison

2008-03-11T19:13:05Z

Duo:

'''Liaisons''' are emissaries from different civilizations that will sometimes accompany traders to your fortress. They can have different names ([[Humans]] will send a '''guild representative''', dwarves will send an '''outpost liaison'''), but their functions are the same. They will ask your [[expedition leader]] or [[mayor]] ''only'' for which goods you would like sent with their next caravan (for a higher price), and inform you of the goods they would like you to sell to them the next time, which they too will pay extra to purchase.

If your leader is dead, then you must assign a new one using the {{k|n}} screen before the liaison arrives or he/she will leave without a [[meeting]].

Make sure to turn off all labor for the dwarf who needs to meet with the liaison, even the 'harvest all order', because your leader tends to walk away from the meeting and liaisons will eventually get [[insanity|depressed]] or go [[berserk]] if they do not get their meeting. This also causes a message saying "A trader went away unhappy" although it's unknown if this has any current in-game effect.

If you are desperate to complete a meeting, consider locking the [[door]] on the meeting room untill the meeting is complete. A sleeping dwarf leader can be woken up by deconstructing his [[bed]], althoug this will often generate an unhapy thought.

The meeting can take place before, after and even "during", that is, between, trading sessions.

The meeting usually consists of 8 screens with breaks, the breaks giving your leader a welcome opportunity to walk away from the meeting. Don't think you are done until the liaison confirms it and says farewell!

Conducting a meeting in a public place usualy generates an unhappy [[thought]]. Conducting a meeting in the leader's private office can generate a happy thought based on the quality of the room.

Oddly enough, liaisons don't need to eat, drink or sleep. There is a statement from one of our mayors on this:

Ironblood: "This damn human thingy keeps following me around, suckling on me when I pause for too long. I think it's a foreign custom, but I dare not emulate. He's all disgusting and clean. Though his clothes are almost completely rotted off..."

[[Category:Trade]]

40d:Liaison

2008-03-11T19:09:34Z

Duo:

'''Liaisons''' are emissaries from different civilizations that will sometimes accompany traders to your fortress. They can have different names ([[Humans]] will send a '''guild representative''', dwarves will send an '''outpost liaison'''), but their functions are the same. They will ask your [[expedition leader]] or [[mayor]] ''only'' for which goods you would like sent with their next caravan (for a higher price), and inform you of the goods they would like you to sell to them the next time, which they too will pay extra to purchase.

If your leader is dead, then you must assign a new one using the {{k|n}} screen before the liaison arrives or he/she will leave without a [[meeting]].

Make sure to turn off all labor for the dwarf who needs to meet with the liaison, even the 'harvest all order', because your leader tends to walk away from the meeting and liaisons will eventually get [[insanity|depressed]] or go [[berserk]] if they do not get their meeting. This also causes a message saying "A trader went away unhappy" although it's unknown if this has any current in-game effect.

If you are desperate to complete a meeting, consider locking the door on the meeting room untill the meeting is complete. A sleeping dwarf leader can be woken up by deconstructing his bed, althoug this will often generate an unhapy thought.

The meeting can take place before, after and even "during", that is, between, trading sessions.

The meeting usually consists of 8 screens with breaks, the breaks giving your leader a welcome opportunity to walk away from the meeting. Don't think you are done until the liaison confirms it and says farewell!

Conducting a meeting in a public place usualy generates an unhappy thought. Conducting a meeting in the leader's private office can generate a happy thought based on the quality of the room.

Oddly enough, liaisons don't need to eat, drink or sleep. There is a statement from one of our mayors on this:

Ironblood: "This damn human thingy keeps following me around, suckling on me when I pause for too long. I think it's a foreign custom, but I dare not emulate. He's all disgusting and clean. Though his clothes are almost completely rotted off..."

[[Category:Trade]]

40d Talk:Broker skills

2008-03-11T18:59:17Z

Duo: /* Skill gain from idle chatter */

:I combined these skills since all the entries are the same. [[User:Jikor|Jikor]] 08:02, 8 November 2007 (EST)

It is gained by:
* Proposing an unsuccessful trade at the depot.

:This seem to controdict the earlier statement that this is a way that the skills are '''not''' gained. Is this skill an exception or what? I think we should make this article clearer. --[[User:Mizipzor|Mizipzor]] 09:25, 8 November 2007 (EST)

::In my first fort I tried to buy out the dwarven caravan with not enough goods, after enough attempts (removing one item each time), the caravan took offence and left. My broker gained the comedian skill after that. So unsuccessful trades do gain skills (not sure if its a random skill or depends how you offended the caravan), anyway the assertion in this article appears to be wrong. [[User:Coelocanth|Coelocanth]]

:::I just copied the text from the previous articles on the subject I haven't really tested these yet. [[User:Jikor|Jikor]] 06:09, 9 November 2007 (EST)

::::I am sure that the 'appraiser' skill is trained before the actual trade. My broker went to sleep at the unlucky moment and I allowed anyone to trade with 6-wagon human caravan. The dwarf that came to trade wasn't even dabbling at appraising and when I pressed 'trade' at the depot - he saw all the items' prices. So I actually cancelled trade that time and looked at the dwarf again - he was now competent appraiser. I guess that some experience in appraising skill (maybe 1?) is gained when a dwarf determines the price of each single merchant item for the first time. Later I bought out that whole caravan and the dwarf became dabbling in a handful of other skills. I guess that each successfull and each rejected trade attempt gives some amount(10?, 20?, 50?) in their corresponding 2 partially overlapping sets of social skills. Some experiments can be conducted to determine the exact amounts of skill gains.--[[User:Another|Another]] 07:55, 9 November 2007 (EST)

:::::I can confirm this. Appraiser goes up just from opening the trading menu, before you've even started putting together an offer. As a result it goes up much faster than any of the other skills, especially once the big caravans start rolling in.

Judge of Intent seems to go up on just about every attempted trade, even failed attempts. It seems to go up slightly faster than most of the other skills, which seem to be applied somewhat randomly, based off your broker's personality and possibly other factors (personalities of the foreign merchants?) For instance, my broker has been gaining Persuader, Negotiator, and Intimidator, with ocassional smaller gains in Comedian. [[User:Rpb|Rpb]] 20:21, 10 November 2007 (EST)

Do any of the broker skills actually do anything past novice? I had thought appraiser (or maybe another one) gave a bonus to the value of your goods but I'm not seeing it anymore - probably I had been trading something they asked for without realizing it. Unless you order something heavy (like stone blocks or metal bars) caravans almost always seem to bring enough to enable novice appraiser so you can see the prices, and seeing as the mood thing doesn't really matter much there does not seem to be a lot of point in using a dedicated broker at all. --[[User:BurnedToast|BurnedToast]] 23:51, 11 November 2007 (EST)
:I don't know if appraiser or judge of intent do anything once past novice. Getting the other skills up a couple ranks does make it a lot easier to get full value on your trades (the traders are much less likely to reject deals or make counter-offers asking for more stuff), so if you're stingy about what you trade away you might as well have a dedicated broker. Even then there seems to be a definite point of diminishing returns, though, as my broker only has 2-4 ranks in four skills and he almost always gets the traders to accept on profit margins of 1-5% or less. Which is probably a good considering their slow rate of advancement, since he started with 5 ranks in negotiation skills and has taken 6 years of dedicated brokering to get the other ranks.[[User:Rpb|Rpb]] 23:59, 11 November 2007 (EST)
::I noticed that, with a low skill, the trader would often ask for more of what you are presenting him before he agrees to trade. Which is probably because I always try to give them the same kind of stone stuff, mainly stone crafts, and the trader look for profit ''and'' diversity. At a time, in a map in which I had no wood and was bent on trying to purchase bins and barrels only to have them in my inventory 'cause I wasn't able to start my metal industry yet, the merchant was also bent in asking for the bins of my trade goods also, along with a few other items I would have rather prefered keeping in stock but didn't mind that much. I had to raise his profit for him to be willing to oversee those demands. In my current fortress, the highest starting skill I gave to my leader was judge of intent. I'll see later on if it make a difference in the haggling process. I am guessing that, with a high enough skill level, my leader will be the one asking for more stuff instead of the inverse. Or maybe it's also related to another talk skill... --[[User:Eagle of Fire|Eagle of Fire]] 13:14, 12 November 2007 (EST)
:::Judge of Intent most probably determines a change in the mood of the trader, so far i was very persistent in not giving human traders the goods they asked for and their status "merchants seems to be willing to trade" changed to "merchant is impatient"(or something like that), I believe Judge of Intent is what detects these changes of mood. Basically it shows you where the safe bargaining zone is over. --[[User:Digger|Digger]] 02:51, 5 March 2008 (EST)

Does it make sense for the "Liar' skill to redirect to the broker skills page? From what I can tell the liar skill isn't trained by trading, or any current noble function.
:I'm pretty sure that it is, but your broker's skill usage is determined by their personality. i.e. if you put someone who is dishonest towards others in charge of trading, then they'll use the Liar skill.[[User:Rpb|Rpb]] 11:38, 16 November 2007 (EST)

== Effect of skills ==

This article says how dwarves learn, but not what the skills *do*. Problem is, I was looking it up because I didn't know, so I can't fill in that info. [[User:Bhudson|Bhudson]] 21:18, 2 February 2008 (EST)

== Skill gain from idle chatter ==

It appears that dwarves also gain most of the broker skills (albeit slowly) from time spent in idle conversation with each other. Leave a few dwarfs sitting around the dining room with no job for a bit, and you'll see that they've gained Dabbling in most of these. While it's not enough to really be useful for trade, the extra few XP often are enough to give a new dwarf a stat gain. Has anyone tested this to see how the XP gain is accrued? Part of the problem is that without some dissection of the code as it's running, it's hard to tell how long a single "conversation" lasts. [[User:RedKing|RedKing]] 23:47, 4 March 2008 (EST)

-- It seems that some of these skills also alow the dwarves to comfort each other, generating happy thoughts. I belive Conversationalist, Comedian and Flatterer are used for this, based on the thought text but I have no specific evidence of that.

[[User:Duo|Duo]] 11 March 2008

40d Talk:Broker skills

2008-03-11T18:58:30Z

Duo: /* Skill gain from idle chatter */

40d Talk:Well

2008-03-11T18:38:41Z

Duo:

Where can these be constructed? only near an aquifer?--[[User:Alc|Alc]] 14:16, 30 October 2007 (EDT)

Open space probably refers to just that - a dug-out space below it that leads to water. Will have to test, though. --[[User:Tracker|Tracker]] 15:54, 30 October 2007 (EDT)

Does it need to be a channel all the way down, on all levels below the well, or can you have normal floor below it all the way down to water? Can you put one well directly above another well, and have them both work (if there's water below)? --[[User:Sowelu|Sowelu]] 15:56, 30 October 2007 (EDT)
: yes.no.no.--[[User:Koltom|Koltom]] 12:27, 1 March 2008 (EST)

Has it been verified that you need water down there? --[[User:Mitchy|Mitchy]] 11:22, 8 November 2007 (EST)
:yes.--[[User:Koltom|Koltom]] 12:27, 1 March 2008 (EST)

Does anyone know if it is okay to have a well like this?<br />
(side view)
<pre>
_W_
| | <-- Empty space between water and well
|~| <-- Water down here
---
</pre>
--[[User:Delton|Delton]] 16:07, 14 November 2007 (EST)

Confirmed that the above is a functional well.
--[[User:Delton|Delton]] 07:52, 19 November 2007 (EST)

==Potential Problem==
As of v0.27.176.38a, when using an artificaly created well (by designating a 'Pond' zone and having dwarves fill it), it is posible that dwarves will take water from the well in order to fill the pond which feeds the well, acomplishing nothing. To correct this, examine the items contained in the well by pressing 't', then forbid the bucket and rope contained in the well. This will stop dwarves from taking water from the well and allow you to fill it. You can then reclaim the bucket and rope to make the well usable again.

Should this be in the article?

[[User:Duo|Duo]] March 11th 2008

== Flooding? ==

Gah! Why do my wells keep flooding? How can I prevent this? [[User:Runspotrun|Runspotrun]] 06:08, 26 November 2007 (EST)

-- Well ... if you did it like I did [http://www.vaevictus.net/images/bucket_full.png (lol)], you lost to backpressure. i filled from a reservoir that was taller than my well floor. (and it was attached to a brook. :) I'm working on using a floodgate and pressure plate to regulate water levels. [[User:Vaevictus|Vaevictus]] 11:30, 20 December 2007 (EST)

== Fair Warning ==

Whatever you do, don't let a barracks area overlap any of your wells. Military dwarves can and will fall in if they're sparring next to it. Ah well, I didn't want that full set of bismuth bronze armor anyway. -- [[User:Vanst|Vanst]] 08:39, 26 December 2007 (EST)

== Grates and Buckets ==

Buckets don't pass through grates, in the well construct. That means a well with a grate halfway will become dry. I had 2/7 water above the grate (and 5 levels of 7/7 water under it), but it was not enough. [[User:Wlievens|Wlievens]] 07:24, 23 January 2008 (EST)

== flood? ==

I have a <s>lake</s> murky pool outside(reaching down one more z level). On the same level i want to construct a well inside. can i just build a channel, thus tap the lake on the lower z level and then build a well on top of the end of the channel? or do i need one more level free space? If i can, will the water flood my outpost or will it stop on floor level? would it help if i tapped the lake one more level down? --[[User:Koltom|Koltom]] 17:12, 8 February 2008 (EST)
:So long as the well is at or above the level of the pond you will have no problem. --[[User:Ikkonoishi|Ikkonoishi]] 23:11, 11 February 2008 (EST)
:: It worked fine. Now however the murky pool is dry, so i built a new one tapping the river. ;) --[[User:Koltom|Koltom]] 13:53, 22 February 2008 (EST)

== Using Buckets? ==
I'm having a hard time getting my dwarfs to use their new well. I...
* Dug a Channel with water beneath it.
* Designated a drinking zone beside it.
** The dwarfs now drink from the channel.
** Loo{{k|k}}ing at the space they're drinking from says Open Space
* Created Blocks, Bucket, Rope
* {{k|b}}uild we{{k|l}}l over the water beside the drinking designation.

Now what happened was I got a massive flood of messages saying something like "XXX Cancelled Drinking: No Bucket at well"

So I went and built another Bucket, and now I have 2 buckets sitting in my finished goods stockpile, and nobody who's willing to drink from the well. How do I instruct the lazy dwarves to go and get the bucket and use it with the well?

[[User:Zeidrich|Zeidrich]] 15:15, 29 February 2008 (EST)

: Why do you need them to use the well? As far as I know, the only time having a well is useful is when the injured need water. Even then, I strongly suspect that people can just drink from the river. --[[User:Shadow archmagi|Shadow archmagi]] 16:02, 29 February 2008 (EST)

:: Well, I want them to use a well because I built it! It looks prettier than drinking out of the stream. I'm pretty sure they get bad thoughts when they drink directly out of the stream. In this particular circumstance I was short on brewable supplies and I had a bunch of thirsty dwarves. Regardless of whether or not I should necessarily be using a well, I would like know ''how'' to use it.-- [[User:Zeidrich|Zeidrich]] 18:37, 29 February 2008 (EST)
:::Well, I believe that the well is *'''built'''* with a bucket, since you require one for construction. If it's really not there for whatever reason, then you may want to rebuild the well(and make sure that furniture hauling orders are ON), and if that doesn't fix it, then i think this is a bug and should be reported to the Toady One, along with the save. --[[User:Digger|Digger]] 05:22, 1 March 2008 (EST)
::::Yes, the bucket for 'normal' drinking is built into the well. U only need extra buckets to fill a pond or give water to a resting dwarf. Check with the q-menu if the well is even finished.--[[User:Koltom|Koltom]] 12:27, 1 March 2008 (EST)
:::::Nope, not a bug. I figured out what it was. Apparantly my architect was far too busy tilling soil and hauling rocks to go and gather the rope and the bucket and connect them to the well. So while I had all of the materials, and the well looked complete, it was actually waiting for construction. I think I was just confused by the message as my dwarves were trying to drink from it before it was ready. [[User:Zeidrich|Zeidrich]] 11:54, 3 March 2008 (EST)