Dwarf Fortress Wiki - User contributions [en]

40d Talk:Lever

2009-06-18T14:22:50Z

Grek: /* Inverting a Lever */

== floodgates vs. doors misinformation? ==
"''Therefore, it is more logical to use doors, at least until doors aren't usable for holding back water.''"

I'm fairly certain that doors can't be closed while flooded. They work as described for opening via lever, but cannot close when blocked by water or creatures.
Granted, the last time i've levered doors was back in 2d. Please verify or change the wording? --[[User:Vaevictus|Vaevictus]] 15:49, 2 June 2008 (EDT)

:In the current version{{version|0.27.176.38c}} doors can close if water currently occupies the same square. I believe elsewhere the wiki states this destroys the water, but I have not verified if the water is destroyed. --[[User:Quartic|quartic]] 16:18, 2 June 2008 (EDT)
::Does it matter how much water? -- [[User:Vaevictus|Vaevictus]] 13:35, 3 June 2008 (EDT)
:::I have verified this with water of depth 1 and 7, but not values in between.--[[User:Quartic|quartic]] 13:38, 3 June 2008 (EDT)

Todo: Check whether two levers connected to the same door operate it in the same way the older versions did - that is, pulling each lever once would open the door, then do nothing as the second lever is pulled. -- [[User:Zaratustra|Zaratustra]] 19:23, 7 November 2007 (EST)

I'm using vertical bars as portcullis for my keep, and they attach to levers. Perhaps a comment that bars and grates operate identically in this version, specifically with respect to levers? -Gotthard

Doesn't the delay come from the floodgate grinding to close the water/magma channel/tunnel compared to a door slamming shut right away? --[[User:Karpatius|Karp]] 08:51, 31 October 2008 (EDT)
:That is what it is meant to simulate. Like people mentioned above, though, Toady's said that doors shouldn't work as well as floodgates, so in some later version your doors will probably leak. --[[User:ThunderClaw|ThunderClaw]] 10:09, 31 October 2008 (EDT)

== controlling at a distance ==

Does the lever need to be adjacent to the item it is controlling?

I want to put a floodgate at the end of a channel... [[User:GarrieIrons|GarrieIrons]] 02:52, 23 January 2008 (EST)
:No, it can be anywhere.--[[User:Dorten|Dorten]] 02:57, 23 January 2008 (EST)

so, analog to the support-cave-in-trap how about building a nice water basin, say 4x4 for a start and covering it with grates, all connected to a lever - do grates have to be attached to a wall or floor on one side? I will try *broad grin* --[[User:Koltom|Koltom]] 21:45, 22 February 2008 (EST)

:Grates must be attached to a wall on one side, although you can put grates next to only grates and the dwarves will build them. Followed by their collapse. Like walls off bridges.--[[User:Draco18s|Draco18s]] 18:31, 2 March 2008 (EST)

:Try building supports under them. SL's hand of armok uses supports under hatches in a similar way. [[User:VengefulDonut|VengefulDonut]] 23:37, 2 March 2008 (EST)

::Yeah, its not working like i wanted it too. The support thing will probably work. Or I will just leave a few walls in the basin..will try that later, busy right now. *watches goblin fly away in high arc* --[[User:Koltom|Koltom]] 19:52, 3 March 2008 (EST)

Regarding remote activation/control: I just spent 10 minutes berating my dwarves for completely ignoring two Pull Lever commands while vile forces of darkness approached, only to find that once I removed the Dwarves Stay Indoors restriction, they happily stepped up to the, uh, lever. The bridges are outside, the levers are on the level below. Has anyone else experienced this? [[User:Holyfool|Holyfool]] 17:49, 22 March 2008 (EST)

:Was the lever and/or any part of the path to the lever marked as "outside"? Use {{k|k}} to check. --[[User:Savok|Savok]] 10:25, 23 March 2008 (EDT)

::I checked and one of the levers was indeed marked "outside". In fact, there are several squares on my first underground level that are marked "outside". Is that because they are in the general area of the stairway leading outside? Thank you for the info. --[[User:Holyfool|Holyfool]] 18:42, 29 March 2008 (EDT)

:::When I quit reading all new forum messages and stayed at the wiki, I thought this would stop. [[Outside|Read The Wiki]]. Really. Read it. No, really, click on that link. --[[User:Savok|Savok]] 19:57, 29 March 2008 (EDT)

== Megabeasts ==

I have noticed that a bridge that a hydra is standing on cannot be retracted {{version|0.27.176.38c}}. Has anyone else had similar experiences? [[User:VengefulDonut|VengefulDonut]] 00:15, 13 March 2008 (EDT)

:Titans cause the same problem. I conjecture that bridged can't be retracted while megabeasts are standing on them. [[User:VengefulDonut|VengefulDonut]] 02:08, 13 March 2008 (EDT)

:Also elephants, it seems. Possibly creature size. [[User:VengefulDonut|VengefulDonut]] 13:18, 13 March 2008 (EDT)

:Dragons cause the same problem. Are megabeasts supposed to all show up at once like this? [[User:VengefulDonut|VengefulDonut]] 21:43, 13 March 2008 (EDT)

:: "All at once like this," you say? Was their a [[fun|party]] on your bridgeworks?
:: And, yeah, megabeasts kill bridge operation, even "benign" acts like retracting with them on it. It must have something to do with their BUILDINGDESTROYER tag. --[[User:FJH|FJH]] 02:58, 6 April 2009 (UTC)

== Proposed addition: Mechanism sequence ==

Given the problems that arise when using non magma-safe materials for mechanisms on floodgates, it is quite handy to know which mechanisms go where at the link selection (When for example you're really low on bauxite).<br>
From my experimentation with floodgate-lever, the first mechanism selected goes at the gate and the second one at the lever. I still haven't activated the contraption, but I'm assuming it's going to be ok.<br>
I'm also assuming the same is usefull for grates and bars. --[[User:Nonickch]], unsigned

:There is some lower-down text that tells you which mechanism goes in where. --[[User:Savok|Savok]] 08:30, 15 June 2008 (EDT)

== Finding Links ==

Is it possible to determine what a lever is linked to without pulling it and checking to see what happens? -[[User:Fuzzy|Fuzzy]] 00:43, 6 September 2008 (EDT)
:AFAIK the only way is to attempt to link the lever to a built object and notice which one if any is not available.
:eg if you have two bridges but only one is available to be linked to, it is because you are already linked to the other one.
:This would be a really good feature if it was implemented.
:[[User:GarrieIrons|GarrieIrons]] 09:55, 6 September 2008 (EDT)

:I guess this is one good use for the new note-feature: Just use the same note for lever and target. --[[User:Doub|Doub]] 10:17, 6 September 2008 (EDT)

:Right now your best way to remember what lever does what is to build a reference behind the lever as a reminder: a one-tile bridge behind the<br />"front door/bridge" lever, a support behind the "collapse the mountain" lever and so forth... or write down what does what on paper.<br />Even naming levers would be useful but for now you need the "references." -[[User:Karpatius|Karp]] 06:10, 19 December 2008 (EST)

== Max number of links? ==

''Is there a limit to the amount of objects that can be linked to a lever?''--[[User:Thendash|Thendash]] 22:56, 19 September 2008 (EDT)

== Speeding the job of linking ==

Is it just me or does it not only take forever to finish the job of linking the lever to something, but also the dwarves treat it as extremely low priority? I've sometimes had to had an entire year for one of them to deign to hook it up. Incidentally, it is the Mechanics job that they use for that, right? -[[User:Fuzzy|Fuzzy]] 15:48, 27 September 2008 (EDT)

: I haven't noticed anything about the priority of the job, but yes, it take hella long to finish it. Some big linking job (eg. linking a large bridge to a remote lever) are virtually impossible to complete without an experienced mecanic... dwarves don't manage to end the job before feeling the urge to eat or drink or something, and all their work is lost when they return, ending in an infinite loop. [[User:Timst|Timst]] 19:47, 27 September 2008 (EDT)

: Unless it's changed in the year since I've played, the mechanic must move the mechanisms to the lever and the "something", then spend time working on both the lever and the "something", all without being interrupted. Consider a 1-square stockpile next to both the lever and the something and choosing those unique mechanisms when you assign the linkage job. -- [[User:Qwip|Qwip]] 16:42, 15 October 2008 (EDT)

:: The catch, so far, is figuring out the "unique" mechanisms in the list. Short of making sure that that stockpile is the only one that carries Schist Mechanisms or something similar... Unlike the other "pick an item" lists, you can't specify a sort and there's nothing zooming you to the item that you will use. On a mildly unrelated note, I realized that part of the reason for my delay was that I was building large amounts of stone traps, so the nearest mechanism that was not already tied up in a trap building job was quote some distance away. I had this problem with the nearby stockpile as well, as it was also fairly close to the traps. It would be nice to even get a distance count on the mechanisms. -[[User:Fuzzy|Fuzzy]] 11:48, 16 October 2008 (EDT)

:::When you choose the mechanism for the lever or trap, it does tell you its distance.--[[User:Maximus|Maximus]] 12:33, 16 October 2008 (EDT)

:::: Addendum to Maximus's comment: When selecting the material to be used, you can e{{k|x}}pand the list of materials, and then select a particular item. Therefore, you can build a single-tile stockpile, then customize it (using {{k|q}} then {{k|s}}settings) to only allow a certain quality mechanism. Link the lever after these stockpiles have been filled. [[User:RomeoFalling|RomeoFalling]] 16:21, 16 October 2008 (EDT)

== Inverting a Lever ==

I think I found a way to automatically invert the signal of a lever, say if you wanted one lever to open one door and close another. It involves a bridge and water, so it would not be instant. I haven't tested it yet. Anyone know if it would work?
<pre>Side view: (Sorry, I realize this isn't the standard tileset, but my text editor doesn't have them all.)
#####
#_~@W
##D##

W - Water source (Under at least 7/7 pressure)
D - Water drain
_ - Pressure plate, set to activate under water of depth 4-7
@ - Hinge of a raisable bridge, connected to the main lever (offscreen)
~ - Bridge over channel
# - Solid rock</pre>
When the main lever is OFF, the bridge is down. It allows water to flow past its hinge, and it covers the drain. Water fills the room, triggering the plate, which sends an ON signal.<br>
When the main lever is ON, the bridge raises. The hinge blocks water from flowing in, and the uncovered drain empties the room. The plate detriggers, sending OFF.<br>
WARNING: The drain must not fill! If it does, you wont be able to get into the room to connect more mechanisms to the plate.
Option: If your water source is infinite, make your drain a hallway, at least 3 long, with a raising bridge that comes down from the far end. When the main lever is activated, the hallway floods. Shortly afterwards, the plate detriggers. After a short delay, the bridge slams down, destroying the water. <br>
--17:52, 1 October 2008 (EDT)

: Isn't it simpler to build two levers? Especially considering the pressure plate takes as many mechanisms? I don't really understand what you are trying to accomplish here.
:--[[User:MagicGuigz|MagicGuigz]] 17:34, 15 October 2008 (EDT)

::If you want a single action to do some "on" actions and some "off" actions - e.g. if from a stylistic point of view you want to have a single "activate outer defenses" lever that raises bridges over moats and puts down bridges blocking catapults.
::--[[User:Random832|Random832]] 19:35, 15 October 2008 (EDT)

::: It's more than stylistic. My designs are complex systems, created on the assumption that only certain combinations of states are possible - that when ''this'' bridge is down, ''that'' bridge is always up, and that when ''this'' floodgate is open, ''that'' door is always closed. If I allow things to enter a condition I hadn't planned for - either because I forgot to throw both leavers, or the dwarf died between them, or whatever - there is literally no telling what would happen. It could drop civilians into a line of fire, or flood the fortress, or expose the marksdwarves to the enemy without also releasing their infantry guards.
:::--[[User:Macdjord|Macdjord]] 16:08, 16 October 2008 (EDT)

:I'd say you should consult the [[Computing]] and [[Mechanical Logic]] pages then. Should find all the components you need there.
:--[[User:Bilkinson|Bilkinson]] 16:13, 16 October 2008 (EDT)

::Doesn't help. That's all about power transfer - gears, axels, waterwheels... It only uses levers for input, not output - I could connect my controll leaver to a not-gate like [[Mechanical_Logic#NOT_or_BUFFER|this one]], but how do i connect ''that'' to a bridge?
::--[[User:Macdjord|Macdjord]] 17:17, 16 October 2008 (EDT)

:::Connect that power to a screw pump, that pours water onto a pressure plate. There's an example of such a device on the mechanics page. Take a look as Water/Fluid logic as well (Linked to on the mechanical page) for some other pump-based devices.
:::--[[User:Bilkinson|Bilkinson]] 06:56, 17 October 2008 (EDT)

:::It's... ''workable'', I suppose. It's much more complex than the bridge system. It might be faster responding, depending on the speed at which a pump works, since there is no 100 step delay like a bridge. It would take a lot more room and mechanisms, not to mention a seperate power source for each one. Remember, each leaver you invert need its own, independent setup.
::::--[[User:Macdjord|Macdjord]] 13:09, 17 October 2008 (EDT)

:::: Check out this page, it might help.. www.dwarffortresswiki.net/index.php/User:SL/Logic_Gates.
::::[[User:Martinuzz|Martinuzz]] 8:54, 28 October 2008 (EDT)

: So the goal here is to have water on a pressure plate when a lever is set to ON. Don't hatch covers respond quicker than bridges?

: Gee, this sucks. I thought things just toggled whenever you flipped the lever. That's how it should be IMHO. [[User:Gairabad|Gairabad]] 20:31, 13 November 2008 (EST)

<pre>
Side view:

####
#^HW
##D#

^ = Pressure Plate
W - Water Inlet
D - Drain
H - Hatch Cover
# - Solid rock
</pre>
:Main lever linked to Hatch Cover (H). When the lever is OFF, the hatch is closed and the Pressure Plate (^) chamber fills. When the lever is ON, the Hatch Cover (H) disappears and water drains away before reaching the pressure plate ledge.
:[[User:Wangcommander|Wangcommander]] 01:27, 12 November 2008 (EST)

:: But since you're not actually blocking off the water, you are dependent on the fickleness of the water pressure simulation. Sure, the room would never fill with an open hatch between the water source and the hatch, but after the first use it ''starts off'' filled. Are you certain it will drain? If the water comes in from the source as fast as it goes out the drain, will it not stay full? That's the advantage of using the bridge - it is the only piece of equipment that blocks water in the ON position.
:: A hybrid design might be useful, using a bridge to block the input bu a hatch to control the output. When you switch it, the hatch instantly starts draining the water, then the bridge seals the inlet 100 ticks later to guarantee a complete drain.
:: --[[User:Macdjord|Macdjord]] 16:04, 12 November 2008 (EST)

I might be misunderstanding the goal of this (and, for the record, I do think it's really cool), but wouldn't hooking up the lever to the thing you want non-inverted, then flipping the switch, and then hooking it up to the inverted thing accomplish the same thing? That way you have two things hooked up to the lever that are in opposite states of each other..... [[User:Zardus|Zardus]] 05:09, 26 February 2009 (EST)
:A 'Pull the lever' task is not a logical toggle. It toggles the lever, and then activates the lever to signal its current state to its linkages... That is, if the lever is in the 'open' position, pulling it flips it to 'closed' and then sends 'closed' to all its linked buildings. Anything which is, for whatever reason, currently in the 'closed' state will simply remain closed. The case you describe is such a situation. It can also arise where a lever is pulled twice in less time than it takes for the first signal to produce its effect. That is: A dwarf pulls a lever linked to a bridge. The dwarf takes 2 steps away, pauses to decide what to do, and notices that there's a pull the lever task on a lever 2 steps away. The dwarf returns to pull the lever again. The bridge has not yet raised when the second signal is sent... A little bit later, the bridge will raise, but unless the lever is pulled again, to get it into the 'raise' state, and then a fourth time to get it to the 'lower' state, the bridge will not lower.--[[User:Wattj|wattj]] 11:03, 26 February 2009 (EST)
Something like this? [[http://dwarf.lendemaindeveille.com/images/4/48/LeverInvert.gif]] --[[Grek]]

== how to disconnect levers? ==

Is there a way to disconnect a lever from an object without destroying the lever and rebuilding it? --[[User:Shaver|Shaver]] 12:53, 2 January 2009 (EST)
:You can't, to my knowledge. Mechanisms in a lever and the connections stay in place until the lever is deconstructed. I use a lever for cage traps in an arena, and after every 'round' I need to rebuild it to get back the mechanisms I used. --[[User:Eddie|Eddie]] 14:17, 2 January 2009 (EST)

== See what's connected to a lever? ==

Is there a way to see what's connected to a lever? I've lost track of which lever does what, and I'd prefer to not randomly set off my traps trying each one out. --[[User:Katt|Katt]] 00:15, 3 March 2009 (EST)

No. This is why its a good idea to keep levers proximal to objects they connect to. I also try to color code levers to the object and gears used for the connection. --[[User:Squirrelloid|Squirrelloid]] 01:36, 3 March 2009 (EST)

You can also use the Notes thing to label them. --[[User:LegacyCWAL|LegacyCWAL]] 17:15, 3 March 2009 (EST)

Mystery levers have historically been a great source of [[fun]]. Especially in bloodline games. --[[User:Jellyfishgreen|Jellyfishgreen]] 10:16, 4 June 2009 (UTC)

40d Talk:Lever

2009-06-18T14:21:35Z

Grek: /* Inverting a Lever */

== floodgates vs. doors misinformation? ==
"''Therefore, it is more logical to use doors, at least until doors aren't usable for holding back water.''"

I'm fairly certain that doors can't be closed while flooded. They work as described for opening via lever, but cannot close when blocked by water or creatures.
Granted, the last time i've levered doors was back in 2d. Please verify or change the wording? --[[User:Vaevictus|Vaevictus]] 15:49, 2 June 2008 (EDT)

:In the current version{{version|0.27.176.38c}} doors can close if water currently occupies the same square. I believe elsewhere the wiki states this destroys the water, but I have not verified if the water is destroyed. --[[User:Quartic|quartic]] 16:18, 2 June 2008 (EDT)
::Does it matter how much water? -- [[User:Vaevictus|Vaevictus]] 13:35, 3 June 2008 (EDT)
:::I have verified this with water of depth 1 and 7, but not values in between.--[[User:Quartic|quartic]] 13:38, 3 June 2008 (EDT)

Todo: Check whether two levers connected to the same door operate it in the same way the older versions did - that is, pulling each lever once would open the door, then do nothing as the second lever is pulled. -- [[User:Zaratustra|Zaratustra]] 19:23, 7 November 2007 (EST)

I'm using vertical bars as portcullis for my keep, and they attach to levers. Perhaps a comment that bars and grates operate identically in this version, specifically with respect to levers? -Gotthard

Doesn't the delay come from the floodgate grinding to close the water/magma channel/tunnel compared to a door slamming shut right away? --[[User:Karpatius|Karp]] 08:51, 31 October 2008 (EDT)
:That is what it is meant to simulate. Like people mentioned above, though, Toady's said that doors shouldn't work as well as floodgates, so in some later version your doors will probably leak. --[[User:ThunderClaw|ThunderClaw]] 10:09, 31 October 2008 (EDT)

== controlling at a distance ==

Does the lever need to be adjacent to the item it is controlling?

I want to put a floodgate at the end of a channel... [[User:GarrieIrons|GarrieIrons]] 02:52, 23 January 2008 (EST)
:No, it can be anywhere.--[[User:Dorten|Dorten]] 02:57, 23 January 2008 (EST)

so, analog to the support-cave-in-trap how about building a nice water basin, say 4x4 for a start and covering it with grates, all connected to a lever - do grates have to be attached to a wall or floor on one side? I will try *broad grin* --[[User:Koltom|Koltom]] 21:45, 22 February 2008 (EST)

:Grates must be attached to a wall on one side, although you can put grates next to only grates and the dwarves will build them. Followed by their collapse. Like walls off bridges.--[[User:Draco18s|Draco18s]] 18:31, 2 March 2008 (EST)

:Try building supports under them. SL's hand of armok uses supports under hatches in a similar way. [[User:VengefulDonut|VengefulDonut]] 23:37, 2 March 2008 (EST)

::Yeah, its not working like i wanted it too. The support thing will probably work. Or I will just leave a few walls in the basin..will try that later, busy right now. *watches goblin fly away in high arc* --[[User:Koltom|Koltom]] 19:52, 3 March 2008 (EST)

Regarding remote activation/control: I just spent 10 minutes berating my dwarves for completely ignoring two Pull Lever commands while vile forces of darkness approached, only to find that once I removed the Dwarves Stay Indoors restriction, they happily stepped up to the, uh, lever. The bridges are outside, the levers are on the level below. Has anyone else experienced this? [[User:Holyfool|Holyfool]] 17:49, 22 March 2008 (EST)

:Was the lever and/or any part of the path to the lever marked as "outside"? Use {{k|k}} to check. --[[User:Savok|Savok]] 10:25, 23 March 2008 (EDT)

::I checked and one of the levers was indeed marked "outside". In fact, there are several squares on my first underground level that are marked "outside". Is that because they are in the general area of the stairway leading outside? Thank you for the info. --[[User:Holyfool|Holyfool]] 18:42, 29 March 2008 (EDT)

:::When I quit reading all new forum messages and stayed at the wiki, I thought this would stop. [[Outside|Read The Wiki]]. Really. Read it. No, really, click on that link. --[[User:Savok|Savok]] 19:57, 29 March 2008 (EDT)

== Megabeasts ==

I have noticed that a bridge that a hydra is standing on cannot be retracted {{version|0.27.176.38c}}. Has anyone else had similar experiences? [[User:VengefulDonut|VengefulDonut]] 00:15, 13 March 2008 (EDT)

:Titans cause the same problem. I conjecture that bridged can't be retracted while megabeasts are standing on them. [[User:VengefulDonut|VengefulDonut]] 02:08, 13 March 2008 (EDT)

:Also elephants, it seems. Possibly creature size. [[User:VengefulDonut|VengefulDonut]] 13:18, 13 March 2008 (EDT)

:Dragons cause the same problem. Are megabeasts supposed to all show up at once like this? [[User:VengefulDonut|VengefulDonut]] 21:43, 13 March 2008 (EDT)

:: "All at once like this," you say? Was their a [[fun|party]] on your bridgeworks?
:: And, yeah, megabeasts kill bridge operation, even "benign" acts like retracting with them on it. It must have something to do with their BUILDINGDESTROYER tag. --[[User:FJH|FJH]] 02:58, 6 April 2009 (UTC)

== Proposed addition: Mechanism sequence ==

Given the problems that arise when using non magma-safe materials for mechanisms on floodgates, it is quite handy to know which mechanisms go where at the link selection (When for example you're really low on bauxite).<br>
From my experimentation with floodgate-lever, the first mechanism selected goes at the gate and the second one at the lever. I still haven't activated the contraption, but I'm assuming it's going to be ok.<br>
I'm also assuming the same is usefull for grates and bars. --[[User:Nonickch]], unsigned

:There is some lower-down text that tells you which mechanism goes in where. --[[User:Savok|Savok]] 08:30, 15 June 2008 (EDT)

== Finding Links ==

Is it possible to determine what a lever is linked to without pulling it and checking to see what happens? -[[User:Fuzzy|Fuzzy]] 00:43, 6 September 2008 (EDT)
:AFAIK the only way is to attempt to link the lever to a built object and notice which one if any is not available.
:eg if you have two bridges but only one is available to be linked to, it is because you are already linked to the other one.
:This would be a really good feature if it was implemented.
:[[User:GarrieIrons|GarrieIrons]] 09:55, 6 September 2008 (EDT)

:I guess this is one good use for the new note-feature: Just use the same note for lever and target. --[[User:Doub|Doub]] 10:17, 6 September 2008 (EDT)

:Right now your best way to remember what lever does what is to build a reference behind the lever as a reminder: a one-tile bridge behind the<br />"front door/bridge" lever, a support behind the "collapse the mountain" lever and so forth... or write down what does what on paper.<br />Even naming levers would be useful but for now you need the "references." -[[User:Karpatius|Karp]] 06:10, 19 December 2008 (EST)

== Max number of links? ==

''Is there a limit to the amount of objects that can be linked to a lever?''--[[User:Thendash|Thendash]] 22:56, 19 September 2008 (EDT)

== Speeding the job of linking ==

Is it just me or does it not only take forever to finish the job of linking the lever to something, but also the dwarves treat it as extremely low priority? I've sometimes had to had an entire year for one of them to deign to hook it up. Incidentally, it is the Mechanics job that they use for that, right? -[[User:Fuzzy|Fuzzy]] 15:48, 27 September 2008 (EDT)

: I haven't noticed anything about the priority of the job, but yes, it take hella long to finish it. Some big linking job (eg. linking a large bridge to a remote lever) are virtually impossible to complete without an experienced mecanic... dwarves don't manage to end the job before feeling the urge to eat or drink or something, and all their work is lost when they return, ending in an infinite loop. [[User:Timst|Timst]] 19:47, 27 September 2008 (EDT)

: Unless it's changed in the year since I've played, the mechanic must move the mechanisms to the lever and the "something", then spend time working on both the lever and the "something", all without being interrupted. Consider a 1-square stockpile next to both the lever and the something and choosing those unique mechanisms when you assign the linkage job. -- [[User:Qwip|Qwip]] 16:42, 15 October 2008 (EDT)

:: The catch, so far, is figuring out the "unique" mechanisms in the list. Short of making sure that that stockpile is the only one that carries Schist Mechanisms or something similar... Unlike the other "pick an item" lists, you can't specify a sort and there's nothing zooming you to the item that you will use. On a mildly unrelated note, I realized that part of the reason for my delay was that I was building large amounts of stone traps, so the nearest mechanism that was not already tied up in a trap building job was quote some distance away. I had this problem with the nearby stockpile as well, as it was also fairly close to the traps. It would be nice to even get a distance count on the mechanisms. -[[User:Fuzzy|Fuzzy]] 11:48, 16 October 2008 (EDT)

:::When you choose the mechanism for the lever or trap, it does tell you its distance.--[[User:Maximus|Maximus]] 12:33, 16 October 2008 (EDT)

:::: Addendum to Maximus's comment: When selecting the material to be used, you can e{{k|x}}pand the list of materials, and then select a particular item. Therefore, you can build a single-tile stockpile, then customize it (using {{k|q}} then {{k|s}}settings) to only allow a certain quality mechanism. Link the lever after these stockpiles have been filled. [[User:RomeoFalling|RomeoFalling]] 16:21, 16 October 2008 (EDT)

== Inverting a Lever ==

I think I found a way to automatically invert the signal of a lever, say if you wanted one lever to open one door and close another. It involves a bridge and water, so it would not be instant. I haven't tested it yet. Anyone know if it would work?
<pre>Side view: (Sorry, I realize this isn't the standard tileset, but my text editor doesn't have them all.)
#####
#_~@W
##D##

W - Water source (Under at least 7/7 pressure)
D - Water drain
_ - Pressure plate, set to activate under water of depth 4-7
@ - Hinge of a raisable bridge, connected to the main lever (offscreen)
~ - Bridge over channel
# - Solid rock</pre>
When the main lever is OFF, the bridge is down. It allows water to flow past its hinge, and it covers the drain. Water fills the room, triggering the plate, which sends an ON signal.<br>
When the main lever is ON, the bridge raises. The hinge blocks water from flowing in, and the uncovered drain empties the room. The plate detriggers, sending OFF.<br>
WARNING: The drain must not fill! If it does, you wont be able to get into the room to connect more mechanisms to the plate.
Option: If your water source is infinite, make your drain a hallway, at least 3 long, with a raising bridge that comes down from the far end. When the main lever is activated, the hallway floods. Shortly afterwards, the plate detriggers. After a short delay, the bridge slams down, destroying the water. <br>
--17:52, 1 October 2008 (EDT)

: Isn't it simpler to build two levers? Especially considering the pressure plate takes as many mechanisms? I don't really understand what you are trying to accomplish here.
:--[[User:MagicGuigz|MagicGuigz]] 17:34, 15 October 2008 (EDT)

::If you want a single action to do some "on" actions and some "off" actions - e.g. if from a stylistic point of view you want to have a single "activate outer defenses" lever that raises bridges over moats and puts down bridges blocking catapults.
::--[[User:Random832|Random832]] 19:35, 15 October 2008 (EDT)

::: It's more than stylistic. My designs are complex systems, created on the assumption that only certain combinations of states are possible - that when ''this'' bridge is down, ''that'' bridge is always up, and that when ''this'' floodgate is open, ''that'' door is always closed. If I allow things to enter a condition I hadn't planned for - either because I forgot to throw both leavers, or the dwarf died between them, or whatever - there is literally no telling what would happen. It could drop civilians into a line of fire, or flood the fortress, or expose the marksdwarves to the enemy without also releasing their infantry guards.
:::--[[User:Macdjord|Macdjord]] 16:08, 16 October 2008 (EDT)

:I'd say you should consult the [[Computing]] and [[Mechanical Logic]] pages then. Should find all the components you need there.
:--[[User:Bilkinson|Bilkinson]] 16:13, 16 October 2008 (EDT)

::Doesn't help. That's all about power transfer - gears, axels, waterwheels... It only uses levers for input, not output - I could connect my controll leaver to a not-gate like [[Mechanical_Logic#NOT_or_BUFFER|this one]], but how do i connect ''that'' to a bridge?
::--[[User:Macdjord|Macdjord]] 17:17, 16 October 2008 (EDT)

:::Connect that power to a screw pump, that pours water onto a pressure plate. There's an example of such a device on the mechanics page. Take a look as Water/Fluid logic as well (Linked to on the mechanical page) for some other pump-based devices.
:::--[[User:Bilkinson|Bilkinson]] 06:56, 17 October 2008 (EDT)

:::It's... ''workable'', I suppose. It's much more complex than the bridge system. It might be faster responding, depending on the speed at which a pump works, since there is no 100 step delay like a bridge. It would take a lot more room and mechanisms, not to mention a seperate power source for each one. Remember, each leaver you invert need its own, independent setup.
::::--[[User:Macdjord|Macdjord]] 13:09, 17 October 2008 (EDT)

:::: Check out this page, it might help.. www.dwarffortresswiki.net/index.php/User:SL/Logic_Gates.
::::[[User:Martinuzz|Martinuzz]] 8:54, 28 October 2008 (EDT)

: So the goal here is to have water on a pressure plate when a lever is set to ON. Don't hatch covers respond quicker than bridges?

: Gee, this sucks. I thought things just toggled whenever you flipped the lever. That's how it should be IMHO. [[User:Gairabad|Gairabad]] 20:31, 13 November 2008 (EST)

<pre>
Side view:

####
#^HW
##D#

^ = Pressure Plate
W - Water Inlet
D - Drain
H - Hatch Cover
# - Solid rock
</pre>
:Main lever linked to Hatch Cover (H). When the lever is OFF, the hatch is closed and the Pressure Plate (^) chamber fills. When the lever is ON, the Hatch Cover (H) disappears and water drains away before reaching the pressure plate ledge.
:[[User:Wangcommander|Wangcommander]] 01:27, 12 November 2008 (EST)

:: But since you're not actually blocking off the water, you are dependent on the fickleness of the water pressure simulation. Sure, the room would never fill with an open hatch between the water source and the hatch, but after the first use it ''starts off'' filled. Are you certain it will drain? If the water comes in from the source as fast as it goes out the drain, will it not stay full? That's the advantage of using the bridge - it is the only piece of equipment that blocks water in the ON position.
:: A hybrid design might be useful, using a bridge to block the input bu a hatch to control the output. When you switch it, the hatch instantly starts draining the water, then the bridge seals the inlet 100 ticks later to guarantee a complete drain.
:: --[[User:Macdjord|Macdjord]] 16:04, 12 November 2008 (EST)

I might be misunderstanding the goal of this (and, for the record, I do think it's really cool), but wouldn't hooking up the lever to the thing you want non-inverted, then flipping the switch, and then hooking it up to the inverted thing accomplish the same thing? That way you have two things hooked up to the lever that are in opposite states of each other..... [[User:Zardus|Zardus]] 05:09, 26 February 2009 (EST)
:A 'Pull the lever' task is not a logical toggle. It toggles the lever, and then activates the lever to signal its current state to its linkages... That is, if the lever is in the 'open' position, pulling it flips it to 'closed' and then sends 'closed' to all its linked buildings. Anything which is, for whatever reason, currently in the 'closed' state will simply remain closed. The case you describe is such a situation. It can also arise where a lever is pulled twice in less time than it takes for the first signal to produce its effect. That is: A dwarf pulls a lever linked to a bridge. The dwarf takes 2 steps away, pauses to decide what to do, and notices that there's a pull the lever task on a lever 2 steps away. The dwarf returns to pull the lever again. The bridge has not yet raised when the second signal is sent... A little bit later, the bridge will raise, but unless the lever is pulled again, to get it into the 'raise' state, and then a fourth time to get it to the 'lower' state, the bridge will not lower.--[[User:Wattj|wattj]] 11:03, 26 February 2009 (EST)
Something like this? [[File:http://dwarf.lendemaindeveille.com/images/4/48/LeverInvert.gif]] --[[Grek]]

== how to disconnect levers? ==

Is there a way to disconnect a lever from an object without destroying the lever and rebuilding it? --[[User:Shaver|Shaver]] 12:53, 2 January 2009 (EST)
:You can't, to my knowledge. Mechanisms in a lever and the connections stay in place until the lever is deconstructed. I use a lever for cage traps in an arena, and after every 'round' I need to rebuild it to get back the mechanisms I used. --[[User:Eddie|Eddie]] 14:17, 2 January 2009 (EST)

== See what's connected to a lever? ==

Is there a way to see what's connected to a lever? I've lost track of which lever does what, and I'd prefer to not randomly set off my traps trying each one out. --[[User:Katt|Katt]] 00:15, 3 March 2009 (EST)

No. This is why its a good idea to keep levers proximal to objects they connect to. I also try to color code levers to the object and gears used for the connection. --[[User:Squirrelloid|Squirrelloid]] 01:36, 3 March 2009 (EST)

You can also use the Notes thing to label them. --[[User:LegacyCWAL|LegacyCWAL]] 17:15, 3 March 2009 (EST)

Mystery levers have historically been a great source of [[fun]]. Especially in bloodline games. --[[User:Jellyfishgreen|Jellyfishgreen]] 10:16, 4 June 2009 (UTC)

File:LeverInvert.gif

2009-06-18T14:19:54Z

Grek: Example picture for a possible lever inverter design.

Example picture for a possible lever inverter design.

Main Page

2008-05-10T20:59:27Z

Grek: Improced Losing=Fun joke, added stone to the links for easy access.

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40d:Crafts

2008-02-29T06:14:23Z

Grek:

'''Crafts''' are a group of items made specifically by a [[craftsdwarf]]. These include rings, amulets, bracelets, scepters, and crowns.
<br>Crafts can be made from [[stone]], [[wood]], [[leather]], [[cloth]], [[bone]], [[shell]]s, and [[gem]]s. However, gem crafts cannot be made normally, instead they are an uncommon product of cutting [[gem]]s.

You cannot specify what a craftsdwarf will make, but one resource can often produce two or three different items. The chance of multiple crafts being produced from one resource is increased with the craftsdwarve's skill. One stone will always produce 3 mugs however.

[[Stonecrafting]] is an easy but timeconsuming way to make [[export]] goods early, as your [[stone crafter]] will have access to tons of [[stone]] in a typical fortress. [[Stone]] crafts are worth very little, but many of these can be made and will not be denied by traders. Making [[mechanisms]] instead is more useful and they are worth more too.

40d Talk:Crafts

2008-02-29T06:13:47Z

Grek:

Added "The chance of multiple crafts being produced from one resource is increased with the craftsdwarve's skill." after noticing my legendary dwarves would almost always produce 3 while my prefix-less crafters usually produce 1. [[User:Moonman|Moonman]] 13:14, 25 December 2007 (EST)

:Mugs, goblets, flasks, and waterskins are always produced in threes. I don't know offhand of any crafts that are produced in twos (except for right/left gloves, etc.) What did your legendary crafters produce three of?--[[User:Maximus|Maximus]] 17:09, 25 December 2007 (EST)

== tone down ==

i would like to tone down the statement to the value of early crafts - cooked food is far more valuable (easily into the hundreds ☼ in 1st year with a skilled cook), and [[mechanisms]] are too (min.30☼,90☼+ with an competent mechanic). So, why make smth from stone that is defined as export just because its useless instead of making smth useful that can be traded just as fine. --[[User:Koltom|Koltom]] 04:05, 14 February 2008 (EST)

ThreeToe

2007-11-12T10:06:26Z

Grek: Made a page.

'''Three toe''' is the nickname used by Zach Adams, co-designer of Dwarf Fortress. He can be reached at [http://www.bay12games.com/about.html About Bay 12 Games] or the [http://www.bay12games.com/cgi-local/ultimatebb.cgi Bay 12 Games Forum].

The other designer is Tarn Adams ([[Toady One]]), his younger brother.

Main Page

2007-11-04T07:50:01Z

Grek: Agriculture redirects to farming, made the main page reflect this.

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40d:Soil

2007-10-30T02:22:22Z

Grek: New page: Soil is the name for the various kinds of ground that can be planted on without irrigation. Someone should add a list of them here.

Soil is the name for the various kinds of ground that can be planted on without [[irrigation]]. Someone should add a list of them here.

40d:Farming

2007-10-30T02:19:06Z

Grek: You can plant in winter this version. May be bug.

'''Farming''' is the most universal source of [[food]] in Dwarf Fortress. On maps with lots of [[shrubs]], [[animals]] or rivers, [[hunting]], [[plant gathering]] and [[fishing]] can also produce a lot of food. Farming is a highly efficient, reliable, and renewable source of food. [[Plants]] grown on farms are also excellent for [[brewing]] [[alcohol]].

For underground farms, you also need to set up an [[irrigation]] scheme or find some soft airable [[soil]]. Additionally, the starting [[seed]]s your dwarves get can only be planted underground. In the outdoors, only seeds from outdoor shrubs can be planted.

== Building the farm room(s) ==

You cannot plant seeds on a bare rock floor, only on mud, soil or sand. You can get mud by using an irrigation system, but dirt and sand are available in great quantity outside the fortress.

== Defining the farm plot ==

Once you have a suitable location for farming you can have your farmer(s) prepare a [[farm plot]]. That's the actual bit of soil to be tilled.

Enter the {{K|b}}uild menu and place farm {{K|p}}lots ({{K|p}}). Use {{K|u}} and {{K|k}} to increase the size of the plot, and {{K|m}} and {{K|h}} to decrease it. When the plot is the right size in the right position, pressing {{K|Enter}} will place it. Your grower(s) will now rush in and prepare the field, clearing out rubble and other impediments when necessary.

How much farm space do you need? Surprisingly little. A 5x5 plot will provide enough food to bring you through your first winter. If there's still rubble in the room, leave a little extra space, otherwise the farmers tend to stack the boulders under your farm room doors and cause them to get stuck ajar, which can lead to flooding if you're not careful. You can also avoid putting doors right next to the farm.

Digging out larger farm rooms than you need can be useful in other ways as well: muddied areas can spontaneously produce [[tower-cap]]s (a source of wood), spider webs (a source of [[silk]]), and [[shrubs]] of the same type as your [[crops]].

== Planting ==

Once a farmer builds the plots, it's time to plant. Go into the plot's {{K|q}} menu and select the type of seed to plant. Your famers will then take care of the rest. Note that your farmers will not work the plot the whole year without being told to do so, you have to designate a crop for ''each'' season. You can designate each season ahead of time by using {{K|a}}, {{K|b}}, {{K|c}} from the plot selection screen. You do not have to plant the same thing each season, and some plants are only available during certain seasons.

Early on, you should focus your production on edible shrubs. [[Plump helmet]]s, [[quarry bush]]es, [[cave wheat]] and [[sweet pod]]s can only be planted underground, and [[pig tail]]s and [[dimple cup]]s produce cloth and dye respectively, not food.

Should you wish to plant nothing, you may select {{K|z}} "fallow" from the farm plot menu. If you possess [[potash]], you may fertilize the field to speed up the growth rate of your plants.

Depending on the [[Grower]] [[skill]] of the farmer who planted it and whether the plot was fertilized, a crop may bear more or less fruit, or (as is sometimes the case with unskilled growers) it may even bear no fruit at all, thus wasting the seed. A higher yield will have many benefits along the whole assembly line of further food processing: workers will always work one one "stack" at a time – if (for example) a brewer has "sweet pod [5]" to work with, he will produce "dwarven rum [25]" and somehow squeeze it all into a single barrel.

== Harvesting ==

A few weeks after planting a seed, a crop will sprout on that spot. Crops must be harvested within another few weeks or they will wither. By default, all dwarves will harvest, including [[children]] and even [[nobles]]. This may or may not be desirable: on the one hand, it makes sure that no crops will wither; on the other, it may lead to far away dwarves interrupting their work and running a long way in order to harvest a single plant.

Harvesting plants earns dwarves [[experience]] in the "growing" [[skill]], so do not be surprised if all your dwarves soon become "dabbling" (or better) growers. Because of that, peasants with no other occupation become farmers almost automatically. Do not be afraid that they might trample your fields: the skill is of no importance during harvest, and no matter how much skill they earned they will still only plant crops if you allow them to in their individual "labor" menu.

If you chose to turn off "All dwarves harvest" in your {{K|o}}rders menu, only dwarves with the "Farming (Fields)" labor enabled will harvest. However, they will often choose to plant new seeds instead of reaping the existing crop, so you risk that some amount may wither. After harvesting a plant (plucking it out of the ground), dwarves will carry it to the nearest [[stockpile]] unless you have "Dwarves ignore food" set in your {{K|o}}rders menu, in which case they will leave the plant blinking on the field. If not moved to a stockpile within a few weeks, it will wither.

Any plant still awaiting harvesting when [[winter]] sets in will disappear along with your farm plots.

== Caveats (warnings) ==

=== Food hauling ===

If you manage to get large-scale farming up and running, you will need to employ many food haulers in order for the food produced on your farms to be edible, even if it has already been harvested. This is because in the current version of the game, items tagged for pending tasks (including Move to Stockpile and Store in Barrel) are unavailable for any other use -- such as eating. An entire fortress of dwarves can starve while they wait for somebody to ''move the food''.

One way to deal with this problem (at least during the heavy farming/harvesting seasons) is to disable hauling of both stone and wood in the top-level {{K|o}}rders menu. This way, most of those jobs will clear out of the job queue, and you will be left mostly with "Store in Barrel" type jobs. You can also increase the number of dedicated food haulers.

== See also ==

* [[Crops]]
* [[Irrigation]]
* [[Skills#Growing|Farmers]]

[[Category:Agriculture]]
[[Category:Jobs]]
[[Category:Food]]

40d:Agriculture

2007-10-30T02:16:44Z

Grek: Made a page.

Argiculture is mostly about [[Farming]], [[Fishing]], [[Plant Gathering]] and [[Livestock]].