Dwarf Fortress Wiki - User contributions [en]

40d Talk:Cage

2009-08-24T20:51:59Z

Talonj256: /* Dungeon master handles gobos */

==Assigning animals / building cages==
How do you put more than one animal in a cage? [[User:Runspotrun|Runspotrun]] 11:41, 9 November 2007 (EST)

:Once you hit (A)ssign, you should have a list of all tame animals in your fort. From here you can toggle whether or not a given animal is assigned to that cage by hitting Enter. You can do this for a number of creatures at once. Creatures already assigned to a cage or chain will have [A] out to the right of their listing. IIRC, there is a limit on the number of critters in a cage, but it's pretty high. One nice benefit is that if you put a male and female of the same species in a cage together, they can still breed.--[[User:RedKing|RedKing]] 12:25, 9 November 2007 (EST)

::Um...
::(A)ssign? Uh, I don't see that. (a) is announcements, and (A) does nothing. I can see a list of animals with both (u) and (z)->Animals, but they only let me assign to owners, slaughter, etc. Do I need a specific noble? [[User:Runspotrun|Runspotrun]] 12:41, 9 November 2007 (EST)
::Ah, hold on. I appear to have only caught untamable creatures (yay... I guess). Does (A)ssign only work if I have caged, tame creatures? [[User:Runspotrun|Runspotrun]] 12:45, 9 November 2007 (EST)

:::Cage options menu, I think {{k|q}} or {{k|t}}. --[[User:Savok|Savok]] 12:48, 9 November 2007 (EST)
::::Wow, I'm being really awkward here. Sorry. {{k|q}} and {{k|t}} both give me options about the animal stockpile the cages are sitting on, or the ground below that. [[User:Runspotrun|Runspotrun]] 12:55, 9 November 2007 (EST)
:::::Ahh, now I see the problem. You have to {{k|b}}uild the cage first, which moves it from the stockpile to whatever location you specify, then you can assign animals to it. Animal stockpiles just serve as collection points for your trappers to dump off their catch, or for new animals bought from caravans.--[[User:RedKing|RedKing]] 13:19, 9 November 2007 (EST)
::::::AHA! I see it now. Thanks for your help! [[User:Runspotrun|Runspotrun]] 13:37, 9 November 2007 (EST)

== Possible addition ==

Maybe worth adding to the article : How do you empty cages of bones and seeds? What's the best way to get rid an untameable creature in a cage? [[User:Runspotrun|Runspotrun]] 21:15, 13 November 2007 (EST)
Answer to both questions is lava. [[User:Rkyeun|Rkyeun]] 17:21, 23 December 2007 (EST)
:Alternatively, if you're just trying to get them out, melting the cage will work as well. (assuming metal of course)
::bones and seeds in a cage can be dumped, the cage will remain where it is. Lava and melting will destroy the cage too, so thats not exactly helpful.--[[User:Koltom|Koltom]] 13:59, 2 March 2008 (EST)

You can build the cage and use {{k|d}}-{{k|b}}-{{k|d}} over the builded cage to dump all items in it. This includes the items of the caged creature but not the creature itself. --[[User:TCPR|TCPR]] 15:55, 1 November 2008 (EDT)

== Captured thieves ==
So, if you manage to catch a thief or a snatcher in a cage trap '''after''' he has already managed to steal something/one, is there any way to get it off him, without releasing and killing him in process?--[[User:Dorten|Dorten]] 23:35, 13 January 2008 (EST)

:There might conceivably be some way to make him go [[melancholy]], at which point he might ditch all his items. I wouldn't know how to induce it, though.--[[User:Maximus|Maximus]] 04:43, 14 January 2008 (EST)

Found this at forum: You can find the items, carried by caged goblins/kobolds/whatever in the stocks menu and designate them for dumping, then dwarves will strip the prisoner. Cant check now. Anyone, confirm?--[[User:Dorten|Dorten]] 07:06, 15 January 2008 (EST)

Yep, this works. Got a human macelord in cage, found (*steel morningstar*) at stock menu, {{K|z}}oomed to it - it pointed on macelord's cage so, it's his morningstar, {{K|d}}umped it, and voila: a dwarf comes to cage and gets morningstar out. The only thing unclear - how do you free a child from a bag?--[[User:Dorten|Dorten]] 02:39, 16 January 2008 (EST)
:Magma works well I hear. [[User:Jikor|Jikor]]

:Alright, so this works with dumping. If I designate an item to be melted, will the furnace operator come take it off the captured goblin? How about if I have a standing order to improve clothing? Will my clothier come and take the (narrow cave spider silk trousers) and sew his cloth image on them? Or is actual dumping the only way? --[[User:Zombiejustice|Zombiejustice]] 09:12, 16 June 2008 (EDT)

== Dissapearing metal cages ==

I keep trying to make metal cages for a prison, but each time it gets completed the smith stands around a while and then it just dissapears. He doesn't even put it on a stockpile. Can anyone tell me what's happening?
<small>—Preceding [[template:unsigned|unsigned]] comment added by [[User:Patarak|Patarak]] ([[User talk:Patarak|talk]]•[[Special:Contributions/Patarak|contribs]]) {{{2|}}}</small>
:Have you tried tracking the cage in the stocks menu? Are you sure it disappeared? [[User:VengefulDonut|VengefulDonut]] 20:44, 25 January 2008 (EST)
:check with {{key|t}} if the cage is still in the workshop - also, u need an animal stockpile (not a furniture one)--[[User:Koltom|Koltom]] 22:42, 7 March 2008 (EST)

== '''Stopping''' certain dwarves from un/caging ==

All right, I know how to {{key|q}}{{key|a}}sign animals to a cage. But even with [[animal hauling]] turned off, my dwarves still love putting furries into cages - how do I make it so that only my animal carers and animal trainers do this job? My miner drags herself from one end of the mine to the other to do this job![[User:GarrieIrons|GarrieIrons]] 05:44, 13 February 2008 (EST)

:Did you try with both hauling and care off? --[[User:N9103|Edward]] 08:17, 13 February 2008 (EST)
::All of my trades-dwarves (carpenters, miners, woodcutters etc) have '''only''' the following enabled: their trade, Health Care ('cause I don't want anyone to die for no real reason), Burial ('cause if they do die I wanna get rid of the evidence), and Cleaning (cause from what I hear, dwarves clean less than I do even with that one turned on). So yeah, I've got both Animal Hauling AND Animal Care turned off AFAIK.[[User:GarrieIrons|GarrieIrons]] 03:25, 14 February 2008 (EST)
:::yep, seems anyone will cage/uncage. no way to stop it. --[[User:Koltom|Koltom]] 22:43, 7 March 2008 (EST)

== Confirming having children in cages ==

I noticed that the page says it's unsure whether or not animals can bear children when while in cages. To my experience they do, I recently had some donkey foals born when everything but my wardogs were caged up. They were also standing around right next to the cages. Anyone care to confirm this so we can add it to the page? --[[User:Eurytus|Eurytus]] 3:14, 28 March 2008 (EST)
:It says 'It is unsure if animals in a cage will mate, but animals can bear children when caged.' You just approved second part. What are you going to change?--[[User:Dorten|Dorten]] 05:01, 28 March 2008 (EDT)
: I get what you're saying, I think. I'll spade it a little more to see if the couple continues to bear children even though they're both in the cage at all time before I consider changing anything.--[[User:Eurytus|Eurytus]] 5:34, 28 March 2008 (EST)
:: I'm still on it too. I'm waiting for the last offspring to be adults to make sure this isn't blocking new ones, plus 3 years to be sure, but it looks like the donkeys and groundhogs have really stopped breeding and the rest too. The requirements for getting pregnant seem to be rather low; having a free male and female ''somewhere'' on the map for a short time seems to be enough. --[[User:Koltom|Koltom]] 22:58, 28 March 2008 (EDT)
: I've confirmed that caged animals do not, in fact, mate. I did a controlled study with animals in cages, specifically with dogs. I brought along two dogs on a new fortress. As soon as they had puppies, I slaughtered the parents and caged the puppies. As immigrants came along, all newborn puppies were immediately caged, and I paid specific attention to which animals were giving birth. Over a 5 year period, 12 puppies matured into dogs (2 are still puppies), none of which gave birth. The only source of puppies were the pets. --[[User:JeebusSez|JeebusSez]] 22:10, 20 May 2008 (EDT)
:: animals reproduce asexually anyway, for some reason - i had a walled up puppy that grew up and had a puppy of its own, as well as a single (tame) mountain goat in my fortress, which had two sets of kids - i butchered the first lot so no, they didnt impregnate their mother... [[User:Twiggie|Twiggie]] 16:45, 12 July 2008 (EDT)
:::Every fortress I've ever played contradicts what is reported here. I've never seen a tame animal in a cage *not* breed. I've been caging and breeding tame animals (captured and imported) since 2D. I suppose I'll have to do some more testing. Not so sure why the user was able to produce these results. I'm also confused as to why they would slaughter the parents and what sort of effect that is supposed to have on the data. It could be that this somehow prevents the puppies from ever learning how to breed, or some other strange effect. See the picture at [http://dwarf.lendemaindeveille.com/index.php/Talk:Meat_industry#Contact_for_breeding|the discussion for the meat industry.][[User:Schm0|Schm0]] 16:57, 20 April 2009 (UTC)

::::I store all my puppies in cages aside from a chained male/female/female. Never have had a matured dog in a cage give birth. Isn't this something that has been tested/confirmed before? The standard advice on the forums is to cage cats to prevent breeding, and it seems to solve the problems. Slaughtering the parents wouldn't cause some strange effect as children don't learn anything from parents currently. How did you do your testing? If they were matured when you stuck them in the cage then chances are they were already pregnant thanks to the spores effect. --[[User:Elvang|Elvang]] 17:45, 20 April 2009 (UTC)

== Cages and Fluids ==
Do creatures need to breath in a cage? If you have an unconstructed/constructed cage underwater does the inhabitant drown? If you have a unconstructed/constructed magma-proof cage under magma does the inhabitant burn up? [[User:Yvain|Yvain]] 08:29, 6 April 2008 (EDT)
:Here is the experiment I conducted:
:* built a large deep empty pool
:* put a goblin cage and a cage stockpile at the bottom of it
:* waiting for a dwarf to put some goblin cages in the stockpile
:* turned on the pumps to flood the room
:* had a dwarf throw (pit/pond) another goblin into the pool
:* waiting until the thrown (pit/ponded) goblin drowned and then emptied the pool
:Results: Neither the goblins in the constructed cage or the goblins in the unconstructed cage in the stockpile died. So in conclusion it appears that caged creatures do not need air. [[User:Yvain|Yvain]] 23:25, 9 April 2008 (EDT)

::Does this also hold for fish? [[User:VengefulDonut|VengefulDonut]] 02:11, 10 April 2008 (EDT)
:::Knowing the questionable physics of DF, it wouldn't surprise me to find out that both land animals and fish in the same cage need neither air nor water, simultaneously. A kind of quantum stasis or cryogenics. --[[User:DDouble|DDouble]] 18:16, 31 July 2008 (EDT)
::::I actually did it! I managed to trap carp in wooden cages in a drainable chamber! I then added the [PET] tag to their raw file, and I actually was able to tame them! --[[User:Arkenstone|Arkenstone]] 12:57 17 August 2009 (EST)
:::::They can never be truly tame... [[User:Shardok|Shardok]] 20:11, 17 August 2009 (UTC)

== Building materials ==
It appears that it takes four bars of metal to make a cage. How many logs of wood? How many bags of sand? These are things it would be nice to have in the article. --[[User:zombiejustice|zombiejustice]] 00:51, 03 June 2008 (CDT)

== Trading caged animals ==

Okay, so I just tried ordering my caged [[Fire Imp]] (wooden cage, go figure ^_^) to the trade depot so that the humans could take it away. A dwarf instead opened the cage and let the thing go, and the now empty cage was taken to the depot. Fortunately the humans smote it before it could set anything alight, but it would've been nice to sell the thing to them, so they could've smitten it on their own time. Does this always happen with caged wild animals? --[[User:Raumkraut|Raumkraut]] 14:28, 12 July 2008 (EDT)
:Like anything else being taken to the [[trade depot]] - order the [[container]] (in this case the cage) to be taken to the depot not the contents. You ordered just the contents, so they took just the contents out of the container.[[User:GarrieIrons|GarrieIrons]] 00:18, 13 July 2008 (EDT)
::Not so. I've just tried with a "dog cage (Acacia)". The relevant cage shows up under both "pets" and "cages" sections of the "bring to depot" list. ''Neither'' of these options caused the dog to be released from the cage. And if I'd selected the fire imp rather than the cage, then why would the (then empty) cage be taken to the depot? --[[User:Raumkraut|Raumkraut]] 13:18, 13 July 2008 (EDT)
:To answer my own question, this is [http://www.bay12games.com/dwarves/dev_bugs.html#Bug41 known bug #000041] (means it's been around a while, I guess!). As mentioned in [http://www.bay12games.com/cgi-local/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic&f=7&t=000444 this forum thread]. --[[User:Raumkraut|Raumkraut]] 13:34, 13 July 2008 (EDT)
:On the other hand, if you don't feel like spending time setting up mechanisms and pulling levers, and you happen to be trading, this is a decent way to free up cage traps while letting your military practice. Station your military by the cage traps, mark them for trade, and watch the sparks fly. The civilians always run away right quick while the military fills the trapped goblins/animals with bloody holes. -[[User:Fuzzy|Fuzzy]] 15:33, 19 September 2008 (EDT)

== Training Vermin in Cages ==

How can you train them? I want some rats, dragonflies, and some lizards as pets.--[[User:Seaneat|Seaneat]] 03:12, 4 August 2008 (EDT)
: You train animals in a kennel ({{key|b}}->{{key|k}}), by a Dwarf with the Animal Trainer skill activated. Depending on the animal, you either use the command to train a small animal or a large animal. I'm not sure right now of the condition of the cage or trap in which the animal is stored but I am sure it has to be stock{{key|p}}iled, at least. --[[User:FJH|FJH]] 18:56, 24 February 2009 (EST)

== Cage Trading Caveats-Elves ==

I'm not sure it's directly relevant to pretty much anything, but I found the section about elves trading wounded animals to be very interesting. Has anyone here read [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lords_and_Ladies_(novel) "Lords and Ladies"], from Terry Pratchett's Discworld series? In it, elves are described as being particularly cruel, and are said to be good at keeping creatures alive- sometimes for months(with the suggestion being that they torture them ''very slowly'' to death).

Could DF elves perhaps be similar? Apparently Discworld elves are based off [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elves_(Discworld) pre-Tolkien British and European folklore,] but I don't know enough about that to be able to draw a reasonable conclusion.
Anyway, just wanted to throw that out there. Perhaps it's not actually a bug? ;) --[[User:Gnavin|Gnavin]]

==Animal Stockpile doesn't move caged animals==
I built a cage and assigned creatures to it. I assumed they would take that cage to the animal stockpile. It makes sense. So far all they've taken there is my empty cage. I'm guessing that I'm doing it wrong, that building cages is not the way to move them (maybe once they're built, they're forever immobile until you unbuild them?). But how do you capture animals in a cage without building the cage?

:You have some of it right, but you're confusing about 3 different actions, all of which are explained on their own wiki pages.

:You {{key|b}}uild a [[cage]] if you want to un/assign creatures to that cage ''(or designate it as a [[jail]] - but chains are deemed better)'' - the cage then becomes a structure, the same as a door or bridge, until deconstructed. Once deconstructed, it then again becomes a portable item, with any and all creatures still inside.*

::''(* FYI - a cage with many animals is HEAVY. A dwarf could take a long time to move something like that. Still might be faster than the alternatives, but be aware.)''

:You can designate an animal [[stockpile|stock{{key|p}}ile]] and cages and/or animals in cages will be moved there for storage - but you can't interact much with them at that point, until the cage is built somewhere. There is an option ({{key|u}}, iirc?) that allows you to toggle whether empty cages are allowed. {{key|f}}orbiding all animals but allowing empty cages gets you a stockpile full of... empty cages.

:To capture a large creature, you must use a [[mechanism]] and {{key|c}}onstruct a cage [[trap|{{key|T}}rap]] ({{key|c}}, {{key|T}}, {{key|c}}). To capture vermin, you must {{key|q}}uery a kennel or butcher's shop and have a [[trapper]] try to catch them.--[[User:Albedo|Albedo]] 03:40, 10 May 2009 (UTC)

::Ah, thanks so much. I'm dumb. It makes sense. I didn't realize that you could deconstruct a cage and keep the creatures inside, I should've tried that or just read the article more carefully. Many thanks.

== Cages and Unwanted Dwarven Inhabitants ==

I think that it would be useful to have a section on removing unwanted inhabitants.
Not only for wiki-readers, but also for me. :)
I have searched high and low, but I cannot find any workable answers for my dilemma.
Problem: Unconscious dwarves trigger cage traps, which lead to them being irretrievable.
Thanks in advance!
Apparently it's a fairly common problem, so I think it would be good to have.
:I also had this problem. I fixed it by setting the cage to be melted ({{k|k}}->{{k|m}}) and then adding the task to the forge ({{k|q}}->{{k|o}}). The dwarf in the cage was released and the cage was melted...although you can probably un-toggle melting the cage just after the dwarf is released... --[[User:Wizjany|Wizjany]] 21:10, 6 July 2009 (UTC)

== Dungeon master handles gobos ==
For fun I ordered 2 (armed) goblins in cages to be transferred to another cage - the inital result was as expected - havoc and lots of interrupt messages. But then my dungeon master came along and swiftly took both of them to the new cage - awesome! --[[User:Confused|Confused]] 20:18, 7 July 2009 (UTC)
:What version is this? I'm currently re-caging five armed goblins into a single cage without any problems, at all. Which is nice, considering I don't even have a military, and it allows re-use of cage traps. One was built and the others weren't, if that makes a difference. I'm playing the latest version: 28.181.40d [[User:Talonj256|Talonj256]] 20:51, 24 August 2009 (UTC)

== Assigning pets ==
While the game won't allow you to assign somebody's pet to a cage, I've noticed that if you assign a cat to a cage and it adopts ''while being caged'', it will still be placed in the cage (where it will then be unable to contribute to a [[catsplosion]]). --[[User:Quietust|Quietust]] 18:21, 24 July 2009 (UTC)

40d Talk:Ice

2009-08-24T19:13:53Z

Talonj256: /* Obsidian ice? */

Should probably include some information on melting the ice, as this is a common question. [[User:Sinoth|sinoth]] 10:44, 16 November 2007 (EST)

Ice is listed as a fire-safe material, and fire-safe materials are listed as being usable for creation of magma-powered buildings. Does this mean one can make a magma forge out of ice stones? [[User:Rkyeun|Rkyeun]] 14:29, 24 November 2007 (EST)
:Yep, you can make all 4 magma workshops from ice.

I tryed to get water out of ice by dropping it a floor but it did not work. What am I doing wrong? [[User:Diabl0658|Diabl0658]] 23:49, 30 November 2007 (EST)

:It no longer seems to work as of 33d, I'm removing that part from the page [[User:Klada|Klada]] 20:55, 3 December 2007 (EST)

Regarding melting ice, I found that if you melt ice, drain it off to a 2 or 3, and then shunt the magma off somehow (happens often when magma first flows, due to ebb and flow of the magma waves) the 2-depth water will re-freeze, allowing you to re-thaw it into a 7-depth water. ... I found this out the hard way actually, since the magma waves caused successive re-thaws for the water to flood out my then-thought-to-be-way-too-big water pit. --[[User:CrushU|CrushU]] 21:20, 7 January 2008 (EST)[[User:CrushU|CrushU]] 21:20, 07 January 2008 (EST)

One winter, I filled with magma a room beneath a frozen river to melt it, so my injured dwarves could be helped. Next winter, those rooms beneath are still filled with magma, but the river froze and will not melt. This is on version 0.28.181.39d. --[[User:Mattmoss|Mattmoss]] 17:50, 2 August 2008 (EDT)

==Value of ICE==
What's the material value of ice? 1? [[User:Noctis|Noctis]] 07:51, 31 December 2007 (EST)

:Whatever ice boulders are worth I would assume. Probably 2. [[User:Lightning4|Lightning4]] 08:31, 31 December 2007 (EST)
::0 Water is free so is ice. It doesn't even have a material entry it is hard coded in the game I think. --[[User:Ikkonoishi|Ikkonoishi]] 10:56, 31 December 2007 (EST)

:::Yet on a map with water and magma sources one can produce an infinite amount of obsidian, which has value. Not that I'm suggesting obsidian should be valueless, but a fortress making a business out of selling ice sculptures would be fun. :) [[User:Bryan Derksen|Bryan Derksen]] 21:46, 18 June 2008 (EDT)

::::Considering pets can now die in route with merchants due to weather/temp, I bet they don't get far with your masterwork Ice Sculpture. :P --[[User:Kyace|Kyace]] 23:17, 18 June 2008 (EDT)

:::Not entirely true. I just noticed in a glacier game that I can sell ice "stones" to traders at a value of 3 each (with a weight of about 250 or so). Same price as wood, and roughly the same weight, depending on species of tree. Makes for a handy low-value trade with elves. [[User:RedKing|RedKing]] 04:56, 23 March 2009 (UTC)

== Melting without magma ==

If there is any way to melt ice without magma this would be good to know.
Are there any drinks that are "just water"? ie can I put water into a barrel and have something to drink through the winter, or do I have to get plants and brew beer / wine / rum to not die of dehydration/thirst?[[User:GarrieIrons|GarrieIrons]] 07:15, 10 January 2008 (EST)
:Nope, you have to brew something to store a drink in a barrel. Besides, even if you could store water, you wouldn't want to. Dwarves need alcohol, or they work much slower. -[[User:FunnyMan|FunnyMan]] 08:44, 5 February 2008 (EST)

::Well they may work slow for a bit but at least they don't die![[User:GarrieIrons|GarrieIrons]] 06:50, 6 February 2008 (EST)

:::Well, if your map does not freeze all year long, build a [[well]]. --[[User:Stinhad Limarezum|Stinhad Limarezum]] 07:03, 23 February 2009 (EST)

::::Keep in mind that injured Dwarf Soliders need water, along with recently unconscious Dwarves. As such, water is indeed necessary. Speaking of that, the article on the main page is quite unclear. I am not quite sure if I just have to drop the ice one floor for it to melt, Crush the ice to turn it into water, or what...[[User:Kenji 03|Kenji 03]] 15:07, 18 July 2009 (UTC)

==Attempts at melting ICE W/0 Magma==
I tried to colapse a section of ice from the top down one floor. That did not cause the ice to melt. I tried building a floor over the hole to make the ice go indoors. That too did not work. I am currently lost at how to melt ice without Magma. [[User:Kenji 03|Kenji 03]] 15:30, 18 July 2009 (UTC)

== Water pit vs lake / pond ==

Does a water pit have to be a certain number of tiles, depth below ground, or overall "internal depth" (ie go a certain number of z-levels) to not freeze? ie how much of a pit do I need to not only dig, but fill, to have water in my fortress no matter what the weather is like?[[User:GarrieIrons|GarrieIrons]] 08:21, 5 February 2008 (EST)
:Height doesn't seem to be important. It needs to be either Inside or Below Ground to not freeze, I'm not sure which. -[[User:FunnyMan|FunnyMan]] 08:41, 5 February 2008 (EST) Update: It's Below Ground. -[[User:FunnyMan|FunnyMan]] 18:56, 21 February 2008 (EST)

Well my current thought is to build a wall out of ice to see it melt and irrigate my field... also, I'm building an up/down stair down a few z-levels. Once done I will work out how to drop my ice down it... yes more to do it than anything else.[[User:GarrieIrons|GarrieIrons]] 06:49, 6 February 2008 (EST)

== Engraving ice ==

Ice Walls can be engraved. I can prove it if you like. I made the change to the article, change the wording if you want.--[[User:Niaba|Niaba]] 06:06, 6 April 2008 (EDT)
:This seems a reasonably viable way to train engravers without wasting valuable wall space in a glacial sort of map.--[[User:Dadamh|Dadamh]] 15:28, 29 May 2008 (EDT)

If a masterfully engraved ice wall melts, does it cause a tantrum? --[[User:Raumkraut|Raumkraut]] 16:06, 18 June 2008 (EDT)
:It causes unhappy thought, like all masterworks. It's not instant-tantrum in new versions. --[[User:Someone-else|Someone-else]] 23:58, 3 August 2008 (EDT)

== Outside/Above Ground ==

I made a deep channel by actually digging a tunnel (so dwarves wouldn't get stuck by channelling stupidly), so it was all inside. BUT I dug an opening through the floor on one of the corners for some reason (thought it was required for flood gate lever). Anyway, so the water in this corner was inside, but above ground. And in late autumn it froze over, just when I was thinking I would need a well there! All the other water is still intact in the channel, but with a corner of damp ice wall blocking flow. Anyway, if someone else can confirm it doesn't have to be outside to freeze! --[[User:KernelJ|KernelJ]] 10:38, 28 May 2008 (EDT)

:I don't think I follow your situation. If you mined out an L-shaped path underground for water, then dug a channel on top of the corner, that corner tile should be outside/light/above ground, unless you put some kind of construction over it. It's possible that the tile became outside, and then froze to ice, which might cause the game to claim the tile was inside/light/above ground (the game seems to report most outside impassable tiles as inside). However, even if you've got an ice wall in the corner, water should still be able to flow around it diagonally, shouldn't it? --[[User:Marble Dice|Marble Dice]] 12:21, 28 May 2008 (EDT)

:I just ran into this problem myself while trying to build a tower of ice to carve out. I had Inside, Above Ground tiles in my pump tower, and water froze solid the instant it was pumped into them. Water does not have to be Outside to freeze, it only needs to be Above Ground. --[[User:Tomatofruit|Tomatofruit]] 11:01, 29 December 2008 (EST)

:Same thing here, z-level doesn`t matter. A cistern was made by dropping down a large portion (2 Z-levels high natural walls) of ice that formed a natural cap of ice and stone above water _after_ falling, so there is a subterranian area under it. Removing this cap makes the cistern freeze.. --[[User:Delduvat|Delduvat]] 07:11, 26 March 2009 (UTC)

== Moving Ice Stone ==

Ice stone or "water" can't be put into a stockpile right?
So it'll stay where it's mined until I decide to make something out of them?
:Yes, it's not listed under stockpile options, which is probably good, because you wouldn't want your dwarves bringing it inside so it melts or firing it out of catapults. --[[User:Tachyon|Tachyon]] 11:56, 1 August 2008 (EDT)
:: However, you could [[dump]] your ice anywhere you like.--[[User:Aykavil|Aykavil]] 14:52, 1 April 2009 (UTC)
:::If I dump the ice inside, like in a room I eventually want to farm, will it melt and give me a muddy floor? That would be really nice...--[[User:Jpwrunyan|Jpwrunyan]] 07:15, 9 April 2009 (UTC)
:::I tested this. Ice stone (as opposed to ice wall/frozen terrain) melts into a puddle of water which gets cleaned the same as spent bolts. There's no way to change solid ice wall into terrain water on a frozen map unless you collapse it with a cave in. This also seems like a bug as weird things can result from this. For example, any stone that might be on top of the section of ice wall you are collapsing remains suspended in mid-air after the floor(s) disappear under it. Ramps also stayed suspended in mid-air with nothing connecting them. It was very unsettling. The ramps and "stone" in question were all "water" (ie ice)--[[User:Jpwrunyan|Jpwrunyan]] 18:21, 25 April 2009 (UTC)

== building with ice ==

I know it's possible to make constructions out of ice, but can you make things that use the masonry skill, like tables? I've tried making a mason's workshop near the ice and ordering a table made, but he got rock from a different area. maybe if ice was the only thing available they would make it into furniture? It would be cool, because I made an ice tower and a need a door to go with it. :P --[[User:Tachyon|Tachyon]] 10:42, 5 August 2008 (EDT)

: No. They count it as an "economic stone" for some reason, and there's no way to disable this that I could find. It's kind of a shame, because an ice palace WOULD be awesome. --Count Dorku

== Magma Melted Ice Pressure ==

Is it just me, or does the water that comes from melted ice have strange pressure characteristics? I tried to get it to U-Bend but it wouldn't come back up to the original source and it seems to flow very slowly for water.

==Ice Constructions melting==

I built a Trade Depot ENTIRELY out of ice (water stone), and it stayed properly frozen throughout winter. However, when the ice melted in spring, the depot melted too!!! I had also built some walls out of ice but they did not melt. Does anyone know why this happened? --[[User:Stinhad Limarezum|Stinhad Limarezum]] 07:10, 23 February 2009 (EST)

:I've not tested this, so I don't know for certain, but I'm pretty sure that it's because constructions and buildings are not the same thing. Constructions are only the things that you can build under the {{K|b}} - {{K|C}} menu (i.e. walls, floors, fortifications etc). These are indestructible to everything. Everything else in the {{K|b}} menu - from armour stands to trade depots - is a building and can thus melt if made of ice. [[User:Aosher|Aosher]] 08:39, 26 March 2009 (UTC)

:: This is very much the case. I once had a craftsdwarf's workshop spontaneously disappear out from under my stonecrafter because I built it from ice without being on ice. --Count Dorku

== Temperature Off? ==

I noticed a lot of people pointing out that water wasn't thawing out for them, and I know it may seem obvious, but could it be because they turned off temperature? That could be half of why some people have stuff that melts, while other people have stuff that doesn't melt. Probably the cause for much confusion on this subject, maybe something should be stated (though obvious) in the article that the effects of Ice thawing/freezing only work if temperature is turned on? [[User:Shardok|Shardok]] 03:08, 7 August 2009 (UTC)

== Brook? ==
Digging out my brook does not produce ice blocks. It just produces "water" that is cleaned up by my dwarves. Normal? Mention in article? --[[User:Confused|Confused]] 00:05, 8 August 2009 (UTC)

== Obsidian ice? ==
I recently tried to magma warm a murky pool. The pool itself melted, but the ice floor above remained, so I just channeled that out. It was a 3x3 area of ice, and it kept refreezing, so I decided to ignore the middle square to prevent the accidental drowning of stupid dwarves... I caused a cave-in, which resulted in an OBSIDIAN square in the center, an ice block on top of it, and a dwarf somehow freezing himself to death inside of it. Which is kind of expected, as I had forgotten about cave-ins, but the obsidian was... unexpected. [[User:Talonj256|Talonj256]] 17:48, 24 August 2009 (UTC)
*If you channeled magma underneath the pool to melt the ice, then a cave-in would have smashed through the floor of the pool ''into the magma channel'', and some of that magma would have then splashed upward into the water and turned into obsidian. --[[User:Quietust|Quietust]] 17:51, 24 August 2009 (UTC)
:: I had forgotten about that... And while that does explain the obsidian, it still leaves the question of the ice block remaining on top. [[User:Talonj256|Talonj256]] 19:13, 24 August 2009 (UTC)

== "Damaged" floors? ==

In the section about using ice cave-ins to generate water, it is suggested that "the floor will also be almost completely destroyed" and that farms cannot be designated in that area. Unless there's something inherently special about ice cave-ins versus regular cave-ins, this sounds like total hogwash, since a 1 Z-level ice cave-in should simply deposit 1/7 water on the floor of the room, leaving it perfectly suitable for a farm. An independent test would be welcome, as I don't have a world handy with a glacier. --[[User:Quietust|Quietust]] 17:59, 24 August 2009 (UTC)
*A closer test seems to reveal what happened - it actually melted the floor itself, leaving water floating on top of "Open Space" and revealing the stone on the Z-level below. I also managed to get the game to completely glitch out, generating an infinite series of cave-ins until I channeled out the roof and allowed the outside air to freeze the lot of it. --[[User:Quietust|Quietust]] 18:40, 24 August 2009 (UTC)

40d Talk:Ice

2009-08-24T17:48:35Z

Talonj256: