v0.31 Talk:Butcher's shop

Article Quality

I'm sorry, but this page doesn't come close to Human quality. It's highly incomplete, lacking several conclusive bits of information. It also has broken links and is terribly organized. I do not see how we can possible pass this on as Human; it needs to be prioritized back to Elven and given much more attention.The Architect 06:34, 22 April 2010 (UTC)

Parts Yielded

It seems that creatures now do not give the same thing when butchered. For example I butchered some Hydras in arena mode and none of the Hydras gave the same yield of parts. There seems to be a range in what you get from butchering, or is this just a side effect of now having fatness and size? In one case I got more livers from one Hydra than from a different one, how would this either of these effect major organs?

I was using a drowning tank just to see what these animals would yield. There are some things that stayed the same, like the Hydras always had 7 skulls and 14 eyes.

If the above is the case then the creature pages might need to show a range of values one could expect when butchering a certain animal. --Flying Dwarves Hurt 15:56, 7 April 2010 (UTC)

I have also noticed this while butchering kittens. Is it possible that the yield is related to butchering skill? --Soronhen 16:03, 7 April 2010 (UTC)

Maybe related to both considering that in arena mode you have either no skill or max skill. --Flying Dwarves Hurt 17:09, 7 April 2010 (UTC)

One thing I've noticed, after having my Swordsdwarf hunt down a Leopard and him killing it by severing its lower body, was that both the mutilated corpse and the lower body were butcherable, and it might be that some, if not all, parts are duplicated then, as I received two skins from the butchering in total. Unless Leopards generally yield two skins (or can). Correct me if I'm wrong... --Ramperkash 17:36, 7 April 2010 (UTC)

Not all the parts are duplicated, when destroying Hydras with a Swordsdwarf it put body parts every where, and most of them were butcher-able and gave respective cut up things, further testing would have to be done to see if the lower and upper-body give duplicates if separated. I'd say if that happens again compare the body parts and see if the total is similar to one you drown (which should have everything normal).--Flying Dwarves Hurt 18:42, 7 April 2010 (UTC)

Fat, intestines, meat

I seem to remember a forum post saying that the amount of fat you get depends on the fat descriptor (with a creature that's incredibly skinny giving less than one that's behung with rolls of lard), the amount of meat depending on the muscle descriptor (very strong vs. incredibly weak) and the amount of intestines depending on the size descriptor. I'll test that to verify it once I get my fort running, butchery is usually a later-game side project for me. --Syndic 16:24, 13 April 2010 (UTC)

Parts with Unknown Uses

Wouldn't tusks be used for crafts as well? I see there are Decorate with Ivory/Tooth and Make Ivory/Tooth Crafts commands at the craftsdwarf workshop, and I'd guess that tusks would be considered Ivory, if not Teeth. We'd have to check whether they actually do use tusks for those though.

Revamping Templates

The (apparently hardcoded) templates on creature pages (which previously listed butchery products) need to be made more flexible. For that purpose, we need to list possible parts here. Afaik, there is no such thing as a "chunk" anymore. That was only a placeholder, after all. Here is the beginning of a list; please expand on it and move/reformat it to the main page when you feel it is complete.

• Inedible
  • Skulls
  • Bones
  • Teeth
  • Tusks
  • Hooves
  • Skins
  • Scales
  • Nervous Tissue
• Edible
  • Meat
    • Prepared Organs
    • Tripe, Sweetbread
  • Fat

Prepared Organs need their own page, rather than just Intestines. Various preparations (such as Tripe) and organs (Intestines, Brains) belong on such a page. I'll be working on that right now, of course... --The Architect 05:38, 8 April 2010 (UTC)

None of these seem to show up in the kitchen menu?

Not even meat - anyone else have this too? --Confused 21:06, 8 April 2010 (UTC)

I might be misinterpriting the situation, but I believe this is because you no longer have the option not to cook meat. I mean, why would you not? --Zombiejustice 03:22, 9 April 2010 (UTC)

Nope. Is Fixed in 31.02 - back to normal --Confused 14:16, 9 April 2010 (UTC)

Feathers and scales

Ok, so I KNOW I saw a cave crocodile scale. Is this the reptilian version of skin? Also, the article says something about feathers. Can we get verification on either of these? --Zombiejustice 17:03, 13 April 2010 (UTC)

Ask User:Soronhen who added feathers (?); i can vouch for alligator and cave croc giving scale but not skin. A look at the raws:

donkey:

[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:VERTEBRATE_TISSUE_LAYERS:SKIN:FAT:MUSCLE:BONE:CARTILAGE]

cave croc:

[BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:STANDARD_MATERIALS] [REMOVE_MATERIAL:SKIN] [REMOVE_MATERIAL:LEATHER] [REMOVE_MATERIAL:HAIR] [USE_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:SCALE:SCALE_TEMPLATE] [BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:STANDARD_TISSUES] [REMOVE_TISSUE:SKIN] [REMOVE_TISSUE:HAIR] [USE_TISSUE_TEMPLATE:SCALE:SCALE_TEMPLATE] [BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:VERTEBRATE_TISSUE_LAYERS:SCALE:FAT:MUSCLE:BONE:CARTILAGE]

giant eagle is less obvious though:

[REMOVE_MATERIAL:HAIR] [USE_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:FEATHER:FEATHER_TEMPLATE] [BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:STANDARD_TISSUES] [REMOVE_TISSUE:HAIR] [USE_TISSUE_TEMPLATE:FEATHER:FEATHER_TEMPLATE] [BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:VERTEBRATE_TISSUE_LAYERS:SKIN:FAT:MUSCLE:BONE:CARTILAGE] [BODY_DETAIL_PLAN:BODY_HAIR_TISSUE_LAYERS:FEATHER]

I would read that as giving leather and feather, but I'm surely not trying to check in game ;) --Confused 17:48, 13 April 2010 (UTC)

I've tried to stay away from the raws for fear of misinterpreting them. Others who are more confident in their abilities are of course welcome to verify things in this way. I'll edit the article to reflect the scale/skin swap. --Zombiejustice 18:45, 13 April 2010 (UTC)

I can confirm feathers empirically. Both Giant Eagles and Elk Birds yield feathers, which are currently cluttering up my butchers' shops. --Nimblewright 16:50, 22 April 2010 (UTC)

beak

A buzzard was killed by a trap and now i have 'corpse' and 'beak'. I would expect a beak is also the result of butchering birds, then. --Old Ancient 16:18, 16 April 2010 (UTC)

But it is not. Butchering does not produce beaks. --Old Ancient 00:04, 17 April 2010 (UTC)

I deleted it from the talk page because no one could confirm, but I wrote a while back about getting a beak as well. I had both buzzards and vultures on the map. Perhaps this warrants further looking into, rather than outright dismissal. --Zombiejustice 22:59, 17 April 2010 (UTC)

Especially when you consider the variability of butchery products. A reasonable correlation needs to be established between the RAWs and the possible products, and that needs to be our test for information included on this page and creature pages. The Architect 02:34, 19 April 2010 (UTC)

Well its quite simple. you can have noses(!) as you can have beaks, from killing creatures, but you can't from butchering. There is no variability of butchery products, except by animal. I have tested butchering a lot (hundreds of animals), and since it is easy to test, just go ahead instead of speculating! --Koltom 13:38, 22 April 2010 (UTC)