Editing 40d Talk:Moat

Yea, it needed more info in it, such as the fact that moats do not have to only have water in them. i have fixed that... to some extent. --[[User:CombatWombat|CombatWombat]] 07:22, 28 January 2008 (EST)
: I'm pretty sure that an empty channel is just as impassable as a water-filled one. --[[User:Mitchy|Mitchy]] 10:13, 28 January 2008 (EST)
though an empty channel is not called a moat, it is a channel. --[[User:CombatWombat|CombatWombat]] 02:04, 29 January 2008 (EST)

:Unless there's an in-game reference calling anything a moat, then I wouldn't say an empty moat isn't a moat. I would say the distinction between moat and channel is largely on it's primary function. If it's intended to be a defensive emplacement, then it's certainly a moat. If it's intended to move a fluid on the otherhand, then it's probably a channel. Obviously, something can be both at once, though I'd always place the defensive value above the convenience value. --[[User:N9103|Edward]] 07:17, 29 January 2008 (EST)

Made some edits. I have no problem with fun-style writing and a little fantasy, but the content should be accurate and not misleading. --[[User:Koltom|Koltom]] 20:49, 19 February 2008 (EST)

For the record, Real Life moats were often simply large trenches with steep sides. Water, pikes, etc were all nice-to-have extras, but the primary function came from the earthwork obstacle. [[User:Zaranthan|Zaranthan]] 21:16, 19 February 2008 (EST)

== good semi not deadly moat defense ==

I had built a defense for one of my fortresses and i think it's a good idea

     +++++++++++++++++
     +^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^+
     +^0===========0^+
     +^|~.........~|^+
     +^|~+++++++++~|^+
     +^|~++0===0++~|^+
     +^|~++|+++|++~|^+
     +^|~++|+X+|++~~.~
     +^|~++|+++|++~|^+
     +^|~++0=-=0++~|^+
     +^|~+++++o+++~|^+
     +^|~....#....~|^+
     +^0=====#=====0^+
     +^^^^^^^+^^^^^^^+
     +++++++++++++++++

      ^=trap
      =, |, 0=wall
      +=floor
      ~, .=water/moat
      #=bridge
      o=lever
      X=up-down stairs
      -=door

--[[User:0todd0|0todd0]] 19:36, 3 June 2008 (EDT)
@@ Line 9: / Line 9: @@
 For the record, Real Life moats were often simply large trenches with steep sides. Water, pikes, etc were all nice-to-have extras, but the primary function came from the earthwork obstacle. [[User:Zaranthan|Zaranthan]] 21:16, 19 February 2008 (EST)
-== A good semi-not-deadly moat defense ==
+== good semi not deadly moat defense ==
 I had built a defense for one of my fortresses and i think it's a good idea
-<div style="font-family: monospace; white-space: pre; line-height: 126.5%"><nowiki>
+     +++++++++++++++++
-.................
+     +^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^+
-.^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^.
+     +^0===========0^+
-.^▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒^.
+     +^|~.........~|^+
-.^▒≈≈≈≈≈≈≈≈≈≈≈▒^.
+     +^|~+++++++++~|^+
-.^▒≈.........≈▒^.  All symbols are as
+     +^|~++0===0++~|^+
-.^▒≈..▒▒▒▒▒..≈▒^.  they are ingame.
+     +^|~++|+++|++~|^+
-.^▒≈..▒...▒..≈▒^.
+     +^|~++|+X+|++~~.~
-.^▒≈..▒.X.▒..≈≈≈≈  Three potentially
+     +^|~++|+++|++~|^+
-.^▒≈..▒...▒..≈▒^.  confusing symbols:
+     +^|~++0=-=0++~|^+
-.^▒≈..▒▒╪▒▒..≈▒^.  ╪ = door
+     +^|~+++++o+++~|^+
-.^▒≈.....ò...≈▒^.  X = up/down stairway
+     +^|~....#....~|^+
-.^▒≈≈≈≈≈╥≈≈≈≈≈▒^.  ▒ = wall
+     +^0=====#=====0^+
-.^▒▒▒▒▒▒╨▒▒▒▒▒▒^.
+     +^^^^^^^+^^^^^^^+
-.^^^^^^^.^^^^^^^.
+     +++++++++++++++++
-.................
-</nowiki></div>
+      ^=trap
+      =, |, 0=wall
+      +=floor
+      ~, .=water/moat
+      #=bridge
+      o=lever
+      X=up-down stairs
+      -=door
 --[[User:0todd0|0todd0]] 19:36, 3 June 2008 (EDT)
-:I took the liberty to redo your formatting. For things like this, you should always use [http://archive.dwarffortresswiki.net/index.php/Dwarf_Fortress_Wiki:Community_Portal#Unified_map_key UMkey]. Note that that link is to an imperfect project on the old wiki. I really should get around to fixing it up and importing it sometime.
-:On topic, I'm not really sure how that's supposed to work. --[[User:Savok|Savok]] 20:52, 3 June 2008 (EDT)
-== Article for Deletion? ==
-To me, it sounds like moat design belongs on a fortress design, defense design, etc. article, not on its own page. A moat... is just a trench that might have dangerous stuff in it. There! I've summed up in one sentence just about everything we can really say about a moat. We might as well create [[staircase layout]], [[wall design]], and [[livestock choice]]!<br>
-Sure, we do have information in there not in my sentence. There isn't much, though, and it is all stuff that anyone smart enough to play DF can think of on their own. I know that I like being forced to do that. --[[User:Savok|Savok]] 20:52, 3 June 2008 (EDT)
-:I don't think that we should remove these pages. If people want to create their own designs that's perfectly fine. We aren't forcing people to use our defensive methods. The reason why people leave the ditch empty is because the water can freeze, and some monsters can swim in water. --[[User:AlexFili]], unsigned
-::That's not at all my point. My point is, "what is there to say about it? It's a freaking MOAT! That's everything that CAN be said about it." I don't count examples like "you can dig a trench in the ground and fill it with sharp pointy things" as something to be said about it.
-::I'm not suggesting leaving moats out of the wiki. I'm suggesting not devoting a whole page to moats and instead covering them in articles about the general topic. --[[User:Savok|Savok]] 11:15, 4 June 2008 (EDT)
-:::Well, in future you could link it to part of the "Fortress Defense" page, or whatever it's called. Make it a subsection maybe. --[[User:AlexFili|AlexFili]] 11:17, 4 June 2008 (EDT)
-== does this work? ==
- doesn't it take bridges 100 steps to retract? if so, most of this stuff wouldn't work.
- I'm building my first ever moat, so if someone could verify this and clean up the page,
- that would be helpful. [[User:Destor|Destor]] 11:25, 20 September 2008 (EDT)
-: I assume you're concerned that enemies might finish crossing the bridge before it retracts? This is a risk, but can be dealt with by sizing the bridge appropriately. See [http://mkv25.net/dfma/movie-1093-drowningchamber3 this video] to get an idea of how far goblins can move between activating a pressure plate and the consequent raising of a linked drawbridge. If you make the bridge at least that long, you can be sure it will raise before they finish crossing. --[[User:HebaruSan|HebaruSan]] 02:23, 11 November 2009 (UTC)
-: It'd be useful to have some information on how far from the map edge sieges can spawn so that players can know how to effectively place moats.