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Editing 40d Talk:Water wheel
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[[File:09.08.29.Perpetual.png|200px|thumb|Water circulates counter clockwise in bi-level circuit. A pump lifts the water to the top of the channel, where it then falls back to the bottom, turning a wheel as it circulates. The wheel powers the pump by a shaft in the middle.]] | [[File:09.08.29.Perpetual.png|200px|thumb|Water circulates counter clockwise in bi-level circuit. A pump lifts the water to the top of the channel, where it then falls back to the bottom, turning a wheel as it circulates. The wheel powers the pump by a shaft in the middle.]] | ||
I made a potentially erroneous illustration in an attempt to understand perpetual motion. Is this correct? I did not attach it to the article fearing that I might confuse somebody.<!-- I am also a bit embarrassed by the misaligned polygons. --> --[[User:SnowCat|SnowCat]] 04:16, 30 August 2009 (UTC) | I made a potentially erroneous illustration in an attempt to understand perpetual motion. Is this correct? I did not attach it to the article fearing that I might confuse somebody.<!-- I am also a bit embarrassed by the misaligned polygons. --> --[[User:SnowCat|SnowCat]] 04:16, 30 August 2009 (UTC) | ||
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== Perpendicular to water flow == | == Perpendicular to water flow == | ||
Strange as it may sound, water wheels do 'not' need to be parallel to the water flow direction to work. [[User:VengefulDonut|VengefulDonut]] 16:31, 23 November 2007 (EST) | Strange as it may sound, water wheels do 'not' need to be parallel to the water flow direction to work. [[User:VengefulDonut|VengefulDonut]] 16:31, 23 November 2007 (EST) | ||
− | :This is as in real life - you can build a less efficient water wheel by putting the "buckets" at an angle - and indeed might put the "buckets" on a 360 degree pivot for some purposes[[User:GarrieIrons|GarrieIrons]] 07:21, 8 January 2008 (EST) | + | :This is as in real life - you can build a less efficient water wheel by putting the "buckets" at an angle - and indeed might put the "buckets" on a 360 degree pivot for some purposes.[[User:GarrieIrons|GarrieIrons]] 07:21, 8 January 2008 (EST) |
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===Water Flow Needed?=== | ===Water Flow Needed?=== | ||
::Actually there is no need for water flow at all. A water wheel seems to generate power even if it is built to a water body with no current (no "entry" or "exit" points). So basically the water wheel just needs to touch water and that's it. This is what I've noticed when confining a canal with floodgates at both ends. --[[User:Flaa|Flaa]] 07:47, 22 April 2008 (EDT) | ::Actually there is no need for water flow at all. A water wheel seems to generate power even if it is built to a water body with no current (no "entry" or "exit" points). So basically the water wheel just needs to touch water and that's it. This is what I've noticed when confining a canal with floodgates at both ends. --[[User:Flaa|Flaa]] 07:47, 22 April 2008 (EDT) | ||
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:Not totally sure what you mean, but if the water wheel is totally submerged in "flowing" water, it shouldn't be active because the water is not actually flowing through the tiles, but "teleporting" to where it would end up, according to Toady in an [http://www.gamasutra.com/view/feature/3549/interview_the_making_of_dwarf_.php?page=10 interview]. (See the picture) --[[User:Wizjany|Wizjany]] 19:15, 10 July 2009 (UTC) | :Not totally sure what you mean, but if the water wheel is totally submerged in "flowing" water, it shouldn't be active because the water is not actually flowing through the tiles, but "teleporting" to where it would end up, according to Toady in an [http://www.gamasutra.com/view/feature/3549/interview_the_making_of_dwarf_.php?page=10 interview]. (See the picture) --[[User:Wizjany|Wizjany]] 19:15, 10 July 2009 (UTC) | ||
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== Safe water wheel power == | == Safe water wheel power == | ||
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:Not sure on your whole scenario, but i recently flooded 3 waterwheels and despite what other ppl say they still worked powering just the pumps that flooded the room when being in 7/7 water. This was underground, right at a river, with a ceiling above, if that makes any difference. --[[User:Birthright|Birthright]] 16:58, 12 July 2009 (UTC) | :Not sure on your whole scenario, but i recently flooded 3 waterwheels and despite what other ppl say they still worked powering just the pumps that flooded the room when being in 7/7 water. This was underground, right at a river, with a ceiling above, if that makes any difference. --[[User:Birthright|Birthright]] 16:58, 12 July 2009 (UTC) | ||
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== Adjacent water tiles == | == Adjacent water tiles == | ||
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:If you disable SHOW_FLOW_AMOUNTS in init.txt, you can very easily see whether or not water is flowing, as it will alternate between ~ and ≈. With the setting turned off, I dug a long channel next to a river and then dug out the last wall to fill it in, and the water mostly stopped flowing once the channel filled, but after a minute or so, the entire channel spontaneously started flowing at full force. Presumably, there's a process that happens every so often where the game traces all paths from water sources and marks those tiles as flowing, and they keep flowing forever (and providing water wheel power if they're at least 4/7). Presumably, this check also marks all "isolated" water as non-flowing (such as those formed from ponds being filled via pumps or being expanded via channeling). --[[User:Quietust|Quietust]] 13:59, 8 September 2009 (UTC) | :If you disable SHOW_FLOW_AMOUNTS in init.txt, you can very easily see whether or not water is flowing, as it will alternate between ~ and ≈. With the setting turned off, I dug a long channel next to a river and then dug out the last wall to fill it in, and the water mostly stopped flowing once the channel filled, but after a minute or so, the entire channel spontaneously started flowing at full force. Presumably, there's a process that happens every so often where the game traces all paths from water sources and marks those tiles as flowing, and they keep flowing forever (and providing water wheel power if they're at least 4/7). Presumably, this check also marks all "isolated" water as non-flowing (such as those formed from ponds being filled via pumps or being expanded via channeling). --[[User:Quietust|Quietust]] 13:59, 8 September 2009 (UTC) | ||
− | I've recently came back to dwarf fortress, and I'm still rather obsessed with water flow... I'm firmly of the belief that rivers and brooks have some sort of "magic flow" that behaves differently than any artificial flow you can try to create from stagnant water. I've checked the various perpetual motion generators and am still not really satisfied. If a power source stops, even briefly, it makes a mill worthless, since it will cancel jobs every time it stops. Sooo.... I am back to running tests again, and looking to develop a true perpetual motion device. This reactor is a new one to me, I'll have to check that out, although looking at it I strongly expect it's going to halt periodically as well | + | I've recently came back to dwarf fortress, and I'm still rather obsessed with water flow... I'm firmly of the belief that rivers and brooks have some sort of "magic flow" that behaves differently than any artificial flow you can try to create from stagnant water. I've checked the various perpetual motion generators and am still not really satisfied. If a power source stops, even briefly, it makes a mill worthless, since it will cancel jobs every time it stops. Sooo.... I am back to running tests again, and looking to develop a true perpetual motion device. This reactor is a new one to me, I'll have to check that out, although looking at it I strongly expect it's going to halt periodically as well. [[User:Doctorzuber|Doctorzuber]] 16:59, 17 March 2010 (UTC) |
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== Mobius Wheels == | == Mobius Wheels == | ||
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I honestly have no idea why this works, but it does. The design is simply an enclosed 4 *2 space, two pumps on lvl1, water wheels directly in front of the pumps on lvl2, and a gear assembly linking the wheels to the pumps. One manual pumper switches it on (fill the chamber), and it will never ever stop. It does NOT work with single wheels. --[[User:Salk|Salk]] 16:40, 8 September 2009 (UTC) | I honestly have no idea why this works, but it does. The design is simply an enclosed 4 *2 space, two pumps on lvl1, water wheels directly in front of the pumps on lvl2, and a gear assembly linking the wheels to the pumps. One manual pumper switches it on (fill the chamber), and it will never ever stop. It does NOT work with single wheels. --[[User:Salk|Salk]] 16:40, 8 September 2009 (UTC) | ||
*I've found that water pumped directly out of a river and into an enclosed reservoir appears to flow indefinitely (turn off SHOW_FLOW_AMOUNTS in init.txt and you can see whether water is flowing or not), so your setup might work even without linking the pumps to the water wheels. --[[User:Quietust|Quietust]] 16:45, 8 September 2009 (UTC) | *I've found that water pumped directly out of a river and into an enclosed reservoir appears to flow indefinitely (turn off SHOW_FLOW_AMOUNTS in init.txt and you can see whether water is flowing or not), so your setup might work even without linking the pumps to the water wheels. --[[User:Quietust|Quietust]] 16:45, 8 September 2009 (UTC) | ||
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