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* @ Wiki Editors: ''As a rule, Wiki-ettiquette does not allow "personalizing" an article, or part of it (specific citations and quotes being a notable exception).  Edits made on public pages are exactly that, "public", so no "ownership" is attached to any text. Editors usually do not add their names to a page or subsection - "anonymous" editing is the rule. This page allows for exceptions to that rule, but that does not prevent future editors from making changes to another's "research".''
 
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: ''If you don't want it edited, put it on your Home page and link to it.''
 
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This page on the wiki houses trials run within the game by players, with the intention of arriving at conclusions on how certain combat situations work, or just combat in general.
 
This page on the wiki houses trials run within the game by players, with the intention of arriving at conclusions on how certain combat situations work, or just combat in general.
  
−
If you want to know more about how to do your own testing, go to the [[DF2010:Arena]] wiki article. To learn more about the military and how it works in ''Dwarf Fortress'', go to the [[DF2010:Military]] article.
+
If you want to know more about how to do your own testing go to the [[DF2010:Arena]] wiki article. To learn more about the military and how it works in ''Dwarf Fortress'', go to the [[DF2010:Military]] article.
  
 
The format in which trials are presented here is by no means a strict rule. Feel free to add and change elements but make sure the information is easy to read and understand. Try to provide any information you think is relevant and useful without digressing too much.
 
The format in which trials are presented here is by no means a strict rule. Feel free to add and change elements but make sure the information is easy to read and understand. Try to provide any information you think is relevant and useful without digressing too much.
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<u>'''Tester's conclusion:'''</u>
 
<u>'''Tester's conclusion:'''</u>
−
Like the dragon, the hydra has a very hard time with the dwarves. The fight is long and even though it can kill them all eventually, the damage it takes in the meantime is definitive. A slightly higher number of dwarves might have killed it and even if a whole squad dies, the threat the hydra poses is practically eliminated as it will probably eventually die on its own anyway.
+
Like the dragon, the hydra has a very hard time with the dwarves. The fight is long and even though it can kill them all eventually, the damage it takes in the meantime is definitive. A slightly higher number of dwarves might have killed it and even if a whole squad dies, the threat the hydra poses is practically elimintated as it will probably eventually die on its own anyway.
  
  
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|}
 
|}
  
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This study seems to show that (for legendary dwarves), silver war hammers are about equal with adamantine battleaxes, even with both sides being unarmored. The previous time I ran this test, hammers actually won 6 of the 10 rounds, but this time it was evenly split.
+
This study seems to show that (for legendary dwarfs), silver war hammers are about equal with adamantine battleaxes, even with both sides being unarmored. The previous time I ran this test, hammers actually won 6 of the 10 rounds, but this time it was evenly split.
  
 
:(Is that because a grandmaster dwarf can disable or kill an unarmored dwarf with just one hit with either weapon?  Might be worth examining the combat logs.) [[User:Bognor|Bognor]] 09:08, 3 June 2011 (UTC)
 
:(Is that because a grandmaster dwarf can disable or kill an unarmored dwarf with just one hit with either weapon?  Might be worth examining the combat logs.) [[User:Bognor|Bognor]] 09:08, 3 June 2011 (UTC)
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! Side & Creature !! Number !! Skills !! Items
 
! Side & Creature !! Number !! Skills !! Items
 
|-
 
|-
−
| #1: Dwarves || 6 ||  Proficient Fighter and swordsdwarf, skilled Dodger, Armor and Shield user<br>  || Full iron armor&Shortsword
+
| #1: Dwarfs || 6 ||  Proficient Fighter and swordsdwarf, skilled Dodger, Armor and Shield user<br>  || Full iron armor&Shortsword
 
|-
 
|-
 
| #2: Skeletal horse || 6 || None || none
 
| #2: Skeletal horse || 6 || None || none
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! Side & Creature !! Survived !! Injury level !! Health tags !! Most common cause of death
 
! Side & Creature !! Survived !! Injury level !! Health tags !! Most common cause of death
 
|-
 
|-
−
| #1: Dwarves || 6 || 1 with minor wounds, one with head bruising and some broken parts || 1 unconscious (Dwarf with head bruising) ||
+
| #1: Dwarfs || 6 || 1 with minor wounds, one with head bruising and some broken parts || 1 unconscious (Dwarf with head bruising) ||
 
|-
 
|-
 
| #2: Skeletal horse || 0 ||  ||  ||
 
| #2: Skeletal horse || 0 ||  ||  ||
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<u>'''Notes:'''</u>
 
<u>'''Notes:'''</u>
−
Dwarves began in a line, horses began slightly scattered
+
Dwarfs began in a line, horses began slightly scattered
  
 
<u>'''Tester's conclusion:'''</u>
 
<u>'''Tester's conclusion:'''</u>
−
The test was a test of how a middling military would fare against an equal force of skeletal horses. The dwarves did excellently with only one badly wounded and one other with a minor wound.
+
The test was a test of how a middling military would fare against an equal force of skeletal horses. The dwarfs did excellently with only one badly wounded and one other with a minor wound.
  
 
= DF2012 (0.34.02) tests =
 
= DF2012 (0.34.02) tests =
Line 747: Line 742:
 
| #2: Swordswarf || 5, 0, 0, 0 || Torn muscle, Severed nerve, Opened arteries, Severed limbs, Missing Limbs || Pale, -N/A- || Bled to death
 
| #2: Swordswarf || 5, 0, 0, 0 || Torn muscle, Severed nerve, Opened arteries, Severed limbs, Missing Limbs || Pale, -N/A- || Bled to death
 
|}
 
|}
−
Third time last axedwarf actually fall into martial trance and finished three remaining sworddwarves, last sword guy just bled to death while fighting.
+
Third time last axedwarf actually fall into martial trance and finished three remaining sworddwarfs, last sword guy just bled to death while fighting.
 
It seems that the initiated distance of the engagement is a factor, though I'm not sure and this statement requires more tests.
 
It seems that the initiated distance of the engagement is a factor, though I'm not sure and this statement requires more tests.
  
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=== War Hammer material effectiveness comparison (ongoing) (Tested by: Adonkares) ===
 
=== War Hammer material effectiveness comparison (ongoing) (Tested by: Adonkares) ===
−
<u>'''Test description:'''</u> After editing the object testing arena into 896 4x1 duel rooms and 84 5x5 5v5 brawl rooms the premise of gold war hammer superiority was put to trial using a variety of different hammer materials. A program was written to populate the arena more quickly as well as equip the dwarves. (If anyone has any tips on counting the results quickly or via a program, please let me know.)
+
<u>'''Test description:'''</u> After editing the object testing arena into 896 4x1 duel rooms and 84 5x5 5v5 brawl rooms the premise of gold war hammer superiority was put to trial using a variety of different hammer materials. A program was written to populate the arena more quickly as well as equip the dwarfs. (If anyone has any tips on counting the results quickly or via a program, please let me know.)
  
 
<u>'''Acronym explanation:'''</u> Each test was assigned a number from 1-3. Each row in a table is named after Duel or Group results and is followed by a -s -g -c suffix to denote the material of the weapon equipped. And so 1solo-g means a group of 1v1 dwarf fighters with steel armor and gold hammers.
 
<u>'''Acronym explanation:'''</u> Each test was assigned a number from 1-3. Each row in a table is named after Duel or Group results and is followed by a -s -g -c suffix to denote the material of the weapon equipped. And so 1solo-g means a group of 1v1 dwarf fighters with steel armor and gold hammers.
Line 1,580: Line 1,575:
 
= DF 2020 (v0.47.04) Tests =
 
= DF 2020 (v0.47.04) Tests =
  
−
== Combat fatigue and the skill 'Armor User' (by NeckRomancer) ==
+
== One vs many, a look at 'Exhaustion' and 'Armor User' (by NeckRomancer) ==
−
 
 
−
Long fights makes dwarves very tired. When a dwarf gets too tired he or she will fall unconscious and become an easy target for the enemy. Can the skill 'Armor User' help a dwarf to fight for longer?
 
  
−
When someone is unconscious in combat, their foes start to do targetted head attacks with increased force. This can sometimes be seen in the combat log, a copper edged weapon that earlier couldn't damage a copper helm can now both damage and break that helmet. It's pretty rare but dwarves have also been observed using a "remove helm" action and immediately follow up with a deadly head-hit, this specific head targetting points towards an unconcious target. Strangulation appears to be the most common type of death, but that could be because of the test design and may not be true for real combat.
+
Combat makes dwarves very tired. I believe this is the reason why Uber Dwarf in the tests above looses, it's not because combat skill is unimportant.
  
−
I don't know the attribute values of arena dwarves. My assumption is that they are identical, because dwarves in the arena all seem to tire around the same time. The median Endurance value of a dwarf is 1000, so this might be what Arena dwarves have. Since Fortress dwarves can double their initial attribute by training, one can expect them to do a bit better than an Arena dwarf.
+
I don't know the attribute values of arena dwarves. My assumption is that they are identical, because if they are random the arena results wouldn't be very reliable. The median Endurance value of a dwarf is 1000, so it might be what Arena dwarves have. Fortress dwarves can double their initial attribute by training, so expect them to do a bit better than Arena dwarves.
  
 
<u>'''Times run:'''</u> 100 per set
 
<u>'''Times run:'''</u> 100 per set
Line 1,621: Line 1,614:
  
 
<u>'''Tester's conclusion:'''</u>
 
<u>'''Tester's conclusion:'''</u>
−
Endurance is a big factor in these fights, easily seen by the many flashing X's that appear. The fighters also gets the Tired, Exhausted and Over-exerted statuses. I run 100 matches at the same time, and the 1v7 took almost twice as long as the 1v5 to resolve, which hints at just how tired and useless they are near the end.
+
Endurance is a big factor in these fights, seen by the many flashing X's that appear. The fighters also gets the Tired, Exhausted and Over-exerted statuses. I run 100 matches at the same time, and the 1v7 took almost twice as long as the 1v5 to resolve, which hints at just how tired they were at the end.
  
 
A high Armor User skill does not appear to help against exhaustion, since 0 and 14 skill have the same outcome. The slightly better performance of the Armor User 14's is not large enough to mean anything, it could be random noise. In the test below, no armor is used, and they actually perform better than in this test, very likely because they don't get tired as quickly.
 
A high Armor User skill does not appear to help against exhaustion, since 0 and 14 skill have the same outcome. The slightly better performance of the Armor User 14's is not large enough to mean anything, it could be random noise. In the test below, no armor is used, and they actually perform better than in this test, very likely because they don't get tired as quickly.
  
−
 
+
== One vs many, effects of open and narrow terrain (by NeckRomancer) ==
−
== Fighting outnumbered in open and narrow terrain (by NeckRomancer) ==
 
−
 
 
−
This test looks at the performance of a single very skilled fighter against a group of rookies in two types of terrain, a 7x7 room and a 1-wide tunnel. The win ratios will show us if the terrain has an impact on the outcome.
 
  
 
<u>'''Times run:'''</u> 100 per set in open, 50 per set in narrow
 
<u>'''Times run:'''</u> 100 per set in open, 50 per set in narrow
Line 1,681: Line 1,671:
  
 
<u>'''Tester's conclusion:'''</u>
 
<u>'''Tester's conclusion:'''</u>
−
The narrow tunnel clearly gives the elite solo fighter an advantage. Exactly why is harder to say, probably many factors, below is some speculation.
+
The narrow tunnel gives the solo fighter a clear advantage. Exactly why is hard to say, probably many factors, below is some speculation.
  
 
A successful dodge always seem to move the character. Private tests I have run show that Dodge is more effective in 1v1 matches in open terrain, and less effective in a 1-wide tunnel. This is detrimental to the elite in the tunnel, since the high skill is wasted. On the other hand, one can suspect that a surrounded fighter will also suffer a reduced effect from Dodge since there are less free tiles to move to.
 
A successful dodge always seem to move the character. Private tests I have run show that Dodge is more effective in 1v1 matches in open terrain, and less effective in a 1-wide tunnel. This is detrimental to the elite in the tunnel, since the high skill is wasted. On the other hand, one can suspect that a surrounded fighter will also suffer a reduced effect from Dodge since there are less free tiles to move to.
Line 1,687: Line 1,677:
 
It is known that facing is a thing. Meaning that flanking attacks probably can't be shield blocked. The 1-wide tunnel should then make the shield more important since the solo fighter can only be flanked if the group can pass through him first.
 
It is known that facing is a thing. Meaning that flanking attacks probably can't be shield blocked. The 1-wide tunnel should then make the shield more important since the solo fighter can only be flanked if the group can pass through him first.
  
−
A surrounded target should suffer more attacks in the same time-interval, increasing the odds of getting killed.
+
A surrounded target should suffer more attacks in the same time-interval, increasing the odds of getting hit.
  
 
Endurance might play a role too. If the surrounded solo fighter must perform more defensive actions, she will get exhausted faster.
 
Endurance might play a role too. If the surrounded solo fighter must perform more defensive actions, she will get exhausted faster.
−
 
−
 
−
== Combat skills and win ratios (by NeckRomancer) ==
 
−
 
−
A series of 1 vs 1 fights to see how important 'Weapon skill', 'Fighter', 'Dodger' and 'Shield User' is to the outcome. As well as a test to roughly estimate the importance of each skill at a specific skill level.
 
−
 
−
<u>'''Times run:'''</u> 100 per set (some tests were rerun for better precision, all data is included as separate sets)
 
−
 
−
<u>'''Initial setup:'''</u>
 
−
Only dwarven females (gender should not matter), fighting in a 7x7 room, fighters start at opposite walls
 
−
 
−
{| class="wikitable sortable"
 
−
|-
 
−
! Side & Creature !! Number !! Skills !! Items
 
−
|-
 
−
| #1 and #2: Dwarf || 1 || Fighter<br>Axeman<br>Dodge<br>Shield User || Copper battle axe<br>Fungiwood shield
 
−
|}
 
−
 
−
<u>'''Results:'''</u>
 
−
{| class="wikitable sortable"
 
−
|-
 
−
! Side & Creature !! Victories !! Comment
 
−
|-
 
−
| skills 1 vs skills 0 || 82/98 || (2 stalemates)
 
−
|-
 
−
| skills 1 vs skills 1 || 46/99 || (1 stalemate)
 
−
|-
 
−
| skills 1 vs skills 2 || 16/99 || (1 stalemate)
 
−
|-
 
−
| skills 1 vs skills 3 || 3/99 || (1 stalemate)
 
−
|-
 
−
| skills 1 vs skills 4 || 2/100 ||
 
−
|-
 
−
| skills 5 vs skills 6 || 27/100 ||
 
−
|-
 
−
| skills 5 vs skills 6 || 32/98 || (2 double kills)
 
−
|-
 
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| skills 5 vs skills 7 || 15/99 || (1 stalemate)
 
−
|-
 
−
| skills 5 vs skills 7 || 16/99 || (1 stalemate)
 
−
|-
 
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| skills 5 vs skills 8 || 11/100 ||
 
−
|-
 
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| skills 5 vs skills 9 || 8/100 ||
 
−
|-
 
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| skills 10 vs skills 11 || 37/98 || (2 double kills)
 
−
|-
 
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| skills 10 vs skills 11 || 27/95 || (2 stalemates, 3 double kills)
 
−
|-
 
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| skills 10 vs skills 12 || 21/98 || (2 double kills)
 
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|-
 
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| skills 10 vs skills 12 || 27/98 || (2 double kills)
 
−
|-
 
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| skills 10 vs skills 13 || 19/99 || (1 double kill)
 
−
|-
 
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| skills 10 vs skills 14 || 11/97 || (1 stalemate, 2 double kills)
 
−
|}
 
−
 
−
{| class="wikitable sortable"
 
−
|-
 
−
! Side & Creature !! Victories !! Comment
 
−
|-
 
−
| skills 5 vs skills 5 (but Fighter 0) || 52/97 || (2 stalemates, 1 double kill)
 
−
|-
 
−
| skills 5 vs skills 5 (but Fighter 0) || 60/98 || (2 double kills)
 
−
|-
 
−
| skills 5 vs skills 5 (but Dodger 0) || 58/92 || (2 stalemates, 6 double kills)
 
−
|-
 
−
| skills 5 vs skills 5 (but Dodger 0) || 60/96 || (4 double kills)
 
−
|-
 
−
| skills 5 vs skills 5 (but Shield User 0) || 81/98 || (2 double kills)
 
−
|-
 
−
| skills 5 vs skills 5 (but Shield User 0) || 70/94 || (2 stalemates, 4 double kills)
 
−
|-
 
−
| skills 5 vs skills 5 (but Shield User 0) || 65/96 || (1 stalemate, 3 double kills)
 
−
|-
 
−
| skills 5 vs skills 5 (but Shield User 0) || 72/95 || (5 double kills)
 
−
|-
 
−
| skills 5 vs skills 5 (but Axeman 0) || 87/99 || (1 stalemate)
 
−
|-
 
−
| skills 5 vs skills 5 (but Axeman 0) || 90/99 || (1 double kill)
 
−
|-
 
−
| skills 5 vs skills 5 (but Axeman 0) || 89/98 || (2 stalemates)
 
−
|}
 
−
 
−
<u>'''Tester's conclusion:'''</u>
 
−
 
−
At skill level 5 in a 1 vs 1 match between naked dwarves inside a 7x7 room, the order of importance of the skills investigated were: Weapon > Shield User > Dodger = Fighter.
 
−
 
−
== Armor weight and combat fatigue (by NeckRomancer) ==
 
−
 
−
Does heavier armor weight make a dwarf more tired? The idea behind the test is to make an armored fighter so tired that she looses about half of her fights against unarmed opponents. Then, by changing the weight of her armor, it should be noticeable in the win-ratio if heavier or lighter equipment make her fall unconscious from exhaustion earlier or later.
 
−
 
−
<u>'''Times run:'''</u> 100 per set
 
−
 
−
<u>'''Initial setup:'''</u>
 
−
Only dwarven females (gender should not matter), fighting in a 7x7 room, fighters start at opposite walls
 
−
 
−
{| class="wikitable sortable"
 
−
|-
 
−
! Side & Creature !! Number !! Skills !! Items
 
−
|-
 
−
| #1a: Elite naked dwarf || 1 || Fighter 14<br>Axeman 14<br>Dodge 14<br>Shield User 14 || Copper battle axe<br>Fungiwood shield
 
−
|-
 
−
| #1b: Elite leather dwarf || 1 || Fighter 14<br>Axeman 14<br>Dodge 14<br>Shield User 14<br>Armor User 14 || Copper battle axe<br>Fungiwood shield<br>chicken leather armor<br>chicken leather helm<br>2 chicken leather gloves<br>2 chicken leather high boots
 
−
|-
 
−
| #1c: Elite armored dwarf || 1 || Fighter 14<br>Axeman 14<br>Dodge 14<br>Shield User 14<br>Armor User 14 || Copper battle axe<br>Fungiwood shield<br>mail shirt<br>helm<br>breastplate<br>greaves<br>2 gauntlets<br>2 high boots
 
−
|-
 
−
| #2: 6 dwarven peasants || 6 || none || none
 
−
|}
 
−
 
−
<u>'''Results:'''</u>
 
−
{| class="wikitable sortable"
 
−
|-
 
−
! Side & Creature !! Victories !! Comment
 
−
|-
 
−
| 1a vs 2: (elite naked vs 6 peasants) || 83/98 || (2 stalemates)
 
−
|-
 
−
| 1a vs 2: (elite naked vs 6 peasants) || 80/100 ||
 
−
|-
 
−
| 1b vs 2: (elite leather armor vs 6 peasants) || 60/99 || (1 stalemate)
 
−
|-
 
−
| 1b vs 2: (elite leather armor vs 6 peasants) || 55/98 || (2 stalemates)
 
−
|-
 
−
| 1c vs 2: (elite copper armor vs 6 peasants) || 59/100 ||
 
−
|-
 
−
| 1c vs 2: (elite bronze armor vs 6 peasants) || 60/99 || (1 stalemate)
 
−
|-
 
−
| 1c vs 2: (elite iron armor vs 6 peasants) || 55/98 || (2 stalemates)
 
−
|-
 
−
| 1c vs 2: (elite steel armor vs 6 peasants) || 57/99 || (1 stalemate)
 
−
|-
 
−
| 1c vs 2: (elite adamantium armor vs 6 peasants) || 59/100 ||
 
−
|}
 
−
 
−
<u>'''Bonus tests (not very good ones, but just to test some extra stuff)'''</u><br>
 
−
1) add more weight, replace wood shield with copper shield<br>
 
−
2a) try partial armor: copper helm, 2 copper gauntlets and 2 copper high boots (no chain shirt, no breastplate, no greaves)<br>
 
−
2b) try partial armor: copper shirt, copper breastplate, copper greaves, 2 copper high boots (no helm, no gauntlets)<br>
 
−
3) try a lighter weapon, replace axe with copper short sword<br>
 
−
4) replace armor with woolen clothing: robe, dress, trousers, cap, hood, cloak, 2 socks, 2 mittens, 2 gloves<br>
 
−
5a) added wool clothing to copper armor (the elite dwarves threw copper helmet and gauntlets on the ground at the start)<br>
 
−
5b) added copper armor to wool clothing (the elite dwarves threw away wool mittens at the start)
 
−
{| class="wikitable sortable"
 
−
|-
 
−
! Side & Creature !! Victories !! Comment
 
−
|-
 
−
| 1) elite copper armor + copper shield vs 6 peasants || 63/99 || (1 stalemate)
 
−
|-
 
−
| 2a) elite partial copper armor vs 6 peasants || 51/100 ||
 
−
|-
 
−
| 2b) elite partial copper armor vs 6 peasants || 62/96 || (4 stalemates)
 
−
|-
 
−
| 3) elite copper armor + copper short-sword vs 6 peasants || 54/97 || (3 stalemates)
 
−
|-
 
−
| 4) elite wool clothing vs 6 peasants || 71/99 || (1 stalemate)
 
−
|-
 
−
| 5a) elite copper armor + wool clothing vs 6 peasants || 67/98 || (1 stalemate, 1 all died)
 
−
|-
 
−
| 5b) elite copper armor + wool clothing vs 6 peasants || 54/99 || (1 stalemate)
 
−
|}
 
−
 
−
<u>'''Tester's conclusion:'''</u><br>
 
−
It almost seems like all kinds of armor are equally exhausting to fight in. Which would mean that armor weight only influences the movement speed.
 
−
 
−
 
−
== Mutilated and mangled corpses per weapon type (by NeckRomancer) ==
 
−
 
−
Mangled corpses can't be re-animated.
 
−
 
−
note: ''When the pickaxe was tested, the raws were edited so that it uses the Axe skill instead of Mining, since the Mining skill can't be increased in the Arena. The default file is ...\DF\raw\objects\item_weapon.txt but each save also has its own copy of it.''
 
−
 
−
Mutilated corpse = missing a limb (examples: neck, hand, lower body) (not: teeth, nose, ear, finger)<br> Mangled corpse = head, upper body or lower body destroyed (examples: cloven asunder, explodes into gore, crushed)
 
−
 
−
<u>'''Examples of damage and resulting corpses'''</u>
 
−
{| class="wikitable sortable"
 
−
|-
 
−
! Item(s) on the ground !! Damage Type !! Combat log
 
−
|-
 
−
| Dwarf 26's corpse || Bleeding || Dwarf 26 has bled to death.
 
−
|-
 
−
| Dwarf 151's corpse || Edged || Dwarf 51 hacks Dwarf 151 in the lower body with her copper battle axe, tearing apart the muscle and spilling her guts!
 
−
|-
 
−
| Dwarf 176's neck<br>Dwarf 176's mutilated corpse || Edged || Dwarf 76 hacks Dwarf 176 in the neck with her copper battle axe and the severed part sails off in an arc!
 
−
|-
 
−
| (no lost limb found)<br>Dwarf 114's mutilated corpse || Edged || Dwarf 14 slashes Dwarf 114 in the lower body with her copper short sword and the severed part sails off in an arc!
 
−
|-
 
−
| Dwarf 51's mangled corpse || Edged || Dwarf 151 hacks Dwarf 51 in the head with her copper battle axe and the injured part is cloven asunder!
 
−
|-
 
−
| Dwarf 140's left foot<br>Dwarf 140's mangled mutilated corpse || Edged || Dwarf 40 hacks Dwarf 140 in the left foot with her copper battle axe and the severed part sails off in an arc!<br>Dwarf 40 hacks Dwarf 140 in the upper body with her copper battle axe and the injured part is cloven asunder!
 
−
|-
 
−
| Dwarf 60's corpse || Blunt || Dwarf 160 bashes Dwarf 60 in the head with her copper war hammer, bruising the muscle, jamming the skull through the brain and tearing the brain!
 
−
|-
 
−
| Dwarf 165's mangled corpse || Blunt || Dwarf 65 bashes Dwarf 165 in the head with her copper war hammer and the injured part explodes into gore!
 
−
|-
 
−
| Dwarf 187's mangled corpse || Blunt || Dwarf 87 bashes Dwarf 187 in the head with her copper war hammer and the injured part is crushed!
 
−
|}
 
−
 
−
<u>'''Observed mutilations by weapon type'''</u><br>
 
−
(Found by searching the combatlog.txt for "sails off in an arc!". Upper body decapitation has not been observed in a limited sample between dwarves.)
 
−
{| class="wikitable sortable"
 
−
|-
 
−
! Weapon !! Part cut off
 
−
|-
 
−
| Battle axe || head, neck, upper arm, lower arm, hand, lower body, foot
 
−
|-
 
−
| Short-sword || head, neck, upper arm, lower arm, hand, lower body, foot
 
−
|-
 
−
| Spear || neck, hand, foot
 
−
|-
 
−
| Pickaxe || head, neck, upper arm, lower arm, hand, lower body, guts, upper leg, lower leg, foot
 
−
|}
 
−
 
−
<u>'''Times run:'''</u> 100 per set
 
−
 
−
<u>'''Initial setup:'''</u>
 
−
Only dwarven females and male giants (gender should not matter), fighting in a 7x7 room, fighters start at opposite walls
 
−
 
−
Raws were edited so the Pickaxe uses the Axe skill instead of Mining, since Mining can't be increased in the Arena.
 
−
 
−
{| class="wikitable sortable"
 
−
|-
 
−
! Side & Creature !! Number !! Skills !! Items !! Comment
 
−
|-
 
−
| #1: Dwarf || 1 || Weapon skill 5 || Copper weapon ||
 
−
|-
 
−
| #2: Dwarf dodger || 1 || Weapon skill 5<br>Dodge 14 || Copper weapon || Used against #3, because #1 died too much
 
−
|-
 
−
| #3: Giant || 1 || none || none || Giant has size 9 million, chosen to represent anything large. A forgotten beast has size 10 million.
 
−
|}
 
−
 
−
<u>'''Results for dwarf kills:'''</u><br>Matches were both dies are ignored, because the winner will then be dying from blood loss and that will skew the numbers incorrectly towards regular corpses and mutilated corpses.
 
−
{| class="wikitable sortable"
 
−
|-
 
−
! Side & Creature !! Weapon !! Dead dwarves !! Regular corpses !! Mutilated corpses !! Mangled corpses !! Mangled Mutilated corpses
 
−
|-
 
−
| #1 vs #1: || Battle axe || 90 (10 double kills were ignored) || 8 || 49 || 26 || 7
 
−
|-
 
−
| #1 vs #1: || Short-sword || 86 (14 double kills were ignored) || 2 || 20 || 48 || 16
 
−
|-
 
−
| #1 vs #1: || Spear || 94 (6 double kills were ignored) || 18 || 16 || 51 || 9
 
−
|-
 
−
| #1 vs #1: || War hammer || 95 (5 double kills were ignored) || 63 || 0 || 32 || 0
 
−
|-
 
−
| #1 vs #1: || Mace || 91 (9 double kills were ignored) || 36 || 0 || 55 || 0
 
−
|-
 
−
| #1 vs #1: || Pickaxe || 92 (8 double kills were ignored) || 4 || 45 || 28 || 15
 
−
|}
 
−
 
−
<u>'''Results for giant kills:'''</u>
 
−
{| class="wikitable sortable"
 
−
|-
 
−
! Side & Creature !! Weapon !! Dead giants !! Regular corpses !! Mutilated corpses !! Mangled corpses !! Mangled Mutilated corpses
 
−
|-
 
−
| #2 vs #3: || Battle axe || 95 (1 stalemate and 4 losses were ignored) || 95 || 0 || 0 || 0
 
−
|-
 
−
| #2 vs #3: || Short-sword || 97 (3 losses were ignored) || 94 || 0 || 3 || 0
 
−
|-
 
−
| #2 vs #3: || Spear || 99 (1 stalemate were ignored) || 90 || 0 || 9 || 0
 
−
|-
 
−
| #2 vs #3: || War hammer || 95 (2 stalemate and 3 losses were ignored) || 0 || 0 || 95 || 0
 
−
|-
 
−
| #2 vs #3: || Mace || 85 (2 stalemates and 13 losses ignored) || 0 || 0 || 85 || 0
 
−
|-
 
−
| #2 vs #3: || Pickaxe || 98 (2 losses were ignored) || 20 || 0 || 78 || 0
 
−
|}
 
−
 
−
<u>'''Tester's conclusion:'''</u>
 
−
 
−
Dwarf 28: How fragile we are...  I must not succumb to fear!
 
−
 
−
edit: All weapons used in this test were made out of copper. In a recent fort I played, a dwarf with an Adamantine battle axe were able to mutilate a giant with a hack to the head. Not sure how other materials will perform.
 
−
 
−
== Skilled Miner vs average soldier (by NeckRomancer) ==
 
−
 
−
Mining is very easy to train up. But how good is a miner with an armor piercing pick in a fight? Training soldiers can take a long time. In this test the soldiers only get half the skill of the miner. Please note that soldier training also boosts the attributes more than mining does, the effect of that is unknown.
 
−
 
−
note: ''When the pickaxe was tested, the raws were edited so that it uses the Axe skill instead of Mining, since the Mining skill can't be increased in the Arena. The default file is ...\DF\raw\objects\item_weapon.txt but each save also has its own copy of it.''
 
−
 
−
<u>'''Creatures'''</u>
 
−
{| class="wikitable sortable"
 
−
|-
 
−
! Side & Creature !! Number !! Skills !! Items
 
−
|-
 
−
| #1: Miner || 1 || Pickaxe 14<br>(Mining skill by default) || Steel Pickaxe
 
−
|-
 
−
| #2: Soldier || 1 || Fighter 7<br>Axeman 7<br>Dodger 7<br>Shield User 7<br>Armor user 7 || Iron battle axe<br>Fungiwood shield<br>iron mail shirt<br>iron helm<br>iron breastplate<br>iron greaves<br>2 iron gauntlets<br>2 iron high boots
 
−
|}
 
−
 
−
<u>'''Times run:'''</u> 100 per set
 
−
 
−
<u>'''Initial setup:'''</u>
 
−
Only dwarven females (gender should not matter), fighting in a 7x7 room, fighters start at opposite walls
 
−
 
−
<u>'''1v1 Results'''</u>
 
−
{| class="wikitable sortable"
 
−
|-
 
−
! Side & Creature !! Victories
 
−
|-
 
−
| #1 vs #2 || Miner won 38/91 (1 stalemate, 8 double kills)
 
−
|-
 
−
| #1 vs #2 || Miner won 39/86 (1 stalemate, 13 double kills)
 
−
|}
 
−
 
−
<u>'''10v10 Results'''</u>
 
−
{| class="wikitable sortable"
 
−
|-
 
−
! Side & Creature !! Victories !! Comment
 
−
|-
 
−
| #1 vs #2 || Miners won 18/99 (1 all died) || 74/1000 miners alive, 448/1000 soliders alive
 
−
|}
 
−
 
−
<u>'''Tester's conclusion:'''</u>
 
−
 
−
Skilled unarmored miners can definately put up a fight in 1v1. But they perform poorly as an army.
 
−
 
−
== Hit locations (by NeckRomancer) ==
 
−
 
−
What body parts are hit the most?
 
−
 
−
This test is done with armor to prevent mutilation. It is untested if a lost limb can be hit again, it's just assumed that it can't. The face however can't be protected by armor, so parts like ears and noses can still be lost, and this can have an effect on the outcome.
 
−
 
−
Each test is only run for a few seconds to prevent fighters from falling unconscious (from pain or fatigue). Since an unconscious target always seem to be hit in the head, this would skew the result.
 
−
 
−
A script was used to count the hits and their locations. But the script wasn't perfect. Some face hits damage multiple parts, a tongue hit can/will also do damage to the cheek for example, which will result in double counting in those particular cases. There can also be other errors that are undiscovered. That is why the total number of hits are slightly lower than what is obtained by adding all individual hits together.
 
−
 
−
edit:''a script error was found, hands and fingers as well as feet and toes were counted together, column labels have been adjusted to show this, no data has been changed''
 
−
 
−
<u>'''Creatures'''</u>
 
−
{| class="wikitable sortable"
 
−
|-
 
−
! Side & Creature !! Number !! Skills !! Items
 
−
|-
 
−
| #1: Soldier || 1 || Fighter 5<br>Weapon 5 || Copper weapon<br>Copper mail shirt<br>Copper helm<br>Copper breastplate<br>Copper greaves<br>2 copper gauntlets<br>2 copper high boots
 
−
|}
 
−
 
−
<u>'''Times run:'''</u> 100 fights per set, for just a few seconds to avoid unconsciousness as much as possible
 
−
 
−
<u>'''Initial setup:'''</u>
 
−
Only dwarven males, fighting in a 7x7 room, fighters start at opposite walls
 
−
 
−
<u>'''Results for dwarf vs dwarf'''</u>
 
−
{| class="wikitable sortable"
 
−
|-
 
−
! Weapon used !! Weapon hits !! Head !! Neck/Throat !! Upper body !! Lower body !! Upper arm !! Lower arm !! Hand + Finger !! Upper leg !! Lower leg !! Foot + Toe !! Only fingers !! Only toes !! Face parts (has double-counting)
 
−
|-
 
−
| Battle axes || 1743 || 137 || 45/0 || 99 || 89 || 106/113 || 133/139 || 143/126 || 51/41 || 57/55 || 146/138 || 10 || 6 || 130
 
−
|-
 
−
| Battle axes || 1961 || 157 || 51/2 || 129 || 131 || 168/141 || 133/128 || 162/130 || 52/41 || 69/56 || 152/130 || 10 || 7 || 138
 
−
|-
 
−
| Short-swords || 1543 || 141 || 37/0 || 90 || 101 || 104/115 || 112/98 || 117/125 || 57/38 || 34/32 || 109/134 || 12 || 5 || 105
 
−
|-
 
−
| Short-swords || 1629 || 133 || 38/2 || 99 || 94 || 115/123 || 116/117 || 114/117 || 60/57 || 59/41 || 126/103 || 11 || 5 || 121
 
−
|-
 
−
| Spears || 1915 || 147 || 55/1 || 134 || 135 || 132/137 || 150/135 || 155/144 || 50/58 || 62/46 || 127/124 || 22 || 4 || 131
 
−
|-
 
−
| Spears || 1774 || 141 || 51/1 || 126 || 124 || 123/153 || 119/133 || 134/133 || 54/43 || 51/50 || 119/127 || 10 || 1 || 93
 
−
|-
 
−
| War hammers || 1210 || 97 || 38/1 || 75 || 79 || 100/92 || 101/93 || 101/92 || 40/40 || 30/23 || 81/81 || 11 || 1 || 48
 
−
|-
 
−
| War hammers || 1496 || 159 || 35/4 || 83 || 89 || 108/103 || 114/101 || 131/115 || 35/38 || 45/39 || 105/120 || 9 || 3 || 74
 
−
|-
 
−
| Maces || 1410 || 118 || 48/1 || 95 || 76 || 109/96 || 109/92 || 117/101 || 54/37 || 52/35 || 101/102 || 10 || 1 || 68
 
−
|-
 
−
| Maces || 1372 || 133 || 39/1 || 85 || 89 || 107/96 || 92/118 || 111/94 || 48/41 || 38/33 || 102/97 || 2 || 2 || 49
 
−
|-
 
−
| Pickaxes || 1679 || 159 || 37/3 || 113 || 105 || 118/125 || 132/126 || 130/121 || 39/46 || 49/49 || 111/140 || 9 || 7 || 78
 
−
|-
 
−
| Pickaxes || 1413 || 110 || 37/0 || 100 || 83 || 105/92 || 109/123 || 108/117 || 35/38 || 41/39 || 123/102 || 9 || 0 || 53
 
−
|}
 
−
 
−
<u>'''Averaged results in %'''</u><br>The face hits value is uncertain since it is known to contain double counting. By using the value for total number of hits, the double counting can be adjusted for, and it is found to be 0.8% units too high. When all % values are added they become 99.4%, the missing 0.6% comes from rounding.
 
−
{| class="wikitable sortable"
 
−
|-
 
−
! Comment !! Head !! Neck/Throat !! Upper body !! Lower body !! Upper arm !! Lower arm !! Hand + fingers !! Upper leg !! Lower leg !! Foot + toes !! Only fingers !! Only toes !! Face parts
 
−
|-
 
−
| Left/Right bodypart || 8.6 || 2.7 / 0.1 || 6.4 || 6.2 || 7.3 / 7.2 || 7.4 / 7.3  || 8.0 / 7.4 || 3.0 / 2.7 || 3.1 / 2.6 || 7.3 / 7.3 || 0.6 || 0.2  || 5.6 (adjusted value is 4.8)
 
−
|-
 
−
| Combined || 8.6 || 2.7 / 0.1 || 6.4 || 6.2 || 14.5 || 14.7  || 15.4 || 5.7 || 5.7 || 14.6 || 0.6 || 0.2  || 5.6 (adjusted value is 4.8)
 
−
|}
 
−
 
−
<u>'''Combined averaged results in % with hands/fingers and feet/toes separated'''</u>
 
−
{| class="wikitable sortable"
 
−
|-
 
−
! Comment !! Head !! Neck/Throat !! Upper body !! Lower body !! Upper arms !! Lower arms !! Hands !! Upper legs !! Lower legs !! Feet !! Fingers !! Toes !! Face parts
 
−
|-
 
−
| Combined || 8.6 || 2.7 / 0.1 || 6.4 || 6.2 || 14.5 || 14.7  || 14.8 || 5.7 || 5.7 || 14.4 || 0.6 || 0.2  || 4.8
 
−
|}
 
−
 
−
<u>'''Armor pieces and their % chance of recieving a hit'''</u>
 
−
{| class="wikitable sortable"
 
−
|-
 
−
! Armor piece !! approximate % chance of getting hit
 
−
|-
 
−
| Mail shirt / leather armor || 35.6
 
−
|-
 
−
| Helm || 8.6
 
−
|-
 
−
| Breastplate || 12.6
 
−
|-
 
−
| Greaves / leggings || 17.6
 
−
|-
 
−
| Gauntlets || 30.1
 
−
|-
 
−
| High boots || 20.3
 
−
|-
 
−
| Low boots || 14.6
 
−
|}
 
−
 
−
<u>'''Tester's conclusion:'''</u>
 
−
 
−
It appears that all weapons use the same hit location calculation. There is one minor trend where the left limbs of the body are hit more, which could be explained by the attacker holding the weapon in his right hand. War hammers and Maces have 9.5% and 9.0% head hits respectively, slightly higher than average, I think this can be explained by the fact that blunt weapons can kill through helmets and after that happen that particular fight is over and no longer generate any new hits and this will skew the numbers in favor of the head.
 
−
 
−
A thought on low vs high boots: Even though gauntlets are more likely to break, the boots are also hit fairly often. If there is a concern about them breaking, the low boots would be the better choice, since the legs have a low chance of being hit the greaves / leggings are pretty safe already and the lower body have several overlapping armor pieces. The lower legs have a low chance of getting hit, so having double armor on them is not that important, especially when compared to the risk of loosing the boots entirely if they were to break. An item breaks the 5th time it takes damage, and blunt weapons of any material, especially the war hammer, can damage and break all kinds of armor (not tested on adamantium).
 
−
 
−
As a side note: Leggings have both the [shaped] and [elastic] tags, which seems incorrect since they should be mutually exclusive. It appears as if leggings can stop blunt damage just like greaves do, but they will never get damaged by blunt hits.
 
−
 
−
== Shields vs Bucklers in melee combat (by NeckRomancer) ==
 
−
 
−
Straightforward test, one side has shields and the other bucklers, who wins the most? Trying both a 7x7 room and a 1x15 tunnel.
 
−
 
−
<u>'''Creatures'''</u>
 
−
{| class="wikitable sortable"
 
−
|-
 
−
! Side & Creature !! Number !! Skills !! Items
 
−
|-
 
−
| #1a: Shield soldier || 1 || Fighter 5<br>Axeman 5<br>Shield User 5 || Copper battle axe<br>Fungiwood shield
 
−
|-
 
−
| #1b: Skilled shield soldier || 1 || Fighter 5<br>Axeman 5<br>Shield User 10 || Copper battle axe<br>Fungiwood shield
 
−
|-
 
−
| #2a: Buckler soldier || 1 || Fighter 5<br>Axeman 5<br>Shield User 5 || Copper battle axe<br>Fungiwood buckler
 
−
|-
 
−
| #2b: Skilled buckler soldier || 1 || Fighter 5<br>Axeman 5<br>Shield User 10 || Copper battle axe<br>Fungiwood buckler
 
−
|}
 
−
 
−
<u>'''Times run:'''</u> 100 per set
 
−
 
−
<u>'''Initial setup:'''</u>
 
−
Only dwarven females (gender should not matter), fighting in a 7x7 room / 1x15 tunnel, fighters start at opposite walls
 
−
 
−
<u>'''Results'''</u>
 
−
{| class="wikitable sortable"
 
−
|-
 
−
! Side & Creature !! Victories !! Comment
 
−
|-
 
−
| #1a vs #2a || Bucklers won 40/98 (1 stalemate, 1 double kill) || 7x7 room
 
−
|-
 
−
| #1a vs #2a || Bucklers won 44/97 (3 double kills) || 7x7 room
 
−
|-
 
−
| #1a vs #2a || Bucklers won 44/98 (2 double kills) || 7x7 room
 
−
|-
 
−
| #1b vs #2b (skilled) || Bucklers won 47/100 || 7x7 room
 
−
|-
 
−
| #1b vs #2b (skilled) || Bucklers won 40/97 (1 stalemate, 2 double kills) || 7x7 room
 
−
|-
 
−
| #1b vs #2b (skilled) || Bucklers won 50/98 (2 double kills) || 7x7 room
 
−
|-
 
−
| #1a vs #2a || Bucklers won 23/47 (1 stalemate, 2 double kills) || 1x15 tunnel
 
−
|-
 
−
| #1a vs #2a || Bucklers won 25/50 || 1x15 tunnel
 
−
|-
 
−
| #1a vs #2a || Bucklers won 23/46 (3 stalemates, 1 double kill) || 1x15 tunnel
 
−
|-
 
−
| #1a vs #2a || Bucklers won 19/48 (2 double kills) || 1x15 tunnel
 
−
|-
 
−
| #1a vs #2a || Bucklers won 19/48 (2 double kills) || 1x15 tunnel
 
−
|-
 
−
| #1a vs #2a || Bucklers won 21/47 (2 stalemates, 1 double kill) || 1x15 tunnel
 
−
|}
 
−
 
−
<u>'''Tester's conclusion:'''</u>
 
−
 
−
Shields perform a bit better in melee combat than bucklers.
 
−
 
−
 
−
 
−
= v50 (v50.07) tests =
 
−
 
−
== Heavy Armor vs Medium Armor (tested by: someguy) ==
 
−
 
−
<u>'''Times run:'''</u>
 
−
 
−
100 times each
 
−
 
−
<u>'''Initial setups and Results:'''</u>
 
−
 
−
{| class="wikitable sortable"
 
−
|-
 
−
! Side & Creature !! Skills !! Items !! Victories
 
−
|-
 
−
| #1: 15 Dwarves || -no skills-  || Steel Short Sword, Wood Shield, Full set of steel armor || 43
 
−
|-
 
−
| #2: 15 Dwarves || -no skills-  || Same but without Greaves and Breastplate || 57
 
−
|}
 
−
{| class="wikitable sortable"
 
−
|-
 
−
! Side & Creature !! Skills !! Items !! Victories
 
−
|-
 
−
| #1: 5 Dwarves  || swordsdwarf 7|| Steel Short Sword, Wood Shield, Full set of steel armor || 43
 
−
|-
 
−
| #2: 5 Dwarves  || swordsdwarf 7|| Same but without Greaves and Breastplate || 53
 
−
|}
 
−
{| class="wikitable sortable"
 
−
|-
 
−
! Side & Creature !! Skills !! Items !! Victories
 
−
|-
 
−
| #1: 5 Dwarves || swordsdwarf 14 || Steel Short Sword, Wood Shield, Full set of steel armor || 56
 
−
|-
 
−
| #2: 5 Dwarves || swordsdwarf 14 || Same but without Greaves and Breastplate || 42
 
−
|}
 
−
 
−
<u>'''Methodology:'''</u>
 
−
 
−
All experiments featured 100 fights. When there were no survivors the fight was excluded from the final numbers. For the unskilled test 5 15x15 dwarf combats were generated in a classic arena map and then the map was reloaded 20 times. For the other tests 25 5x5 dwarf combats were generated in  forest arena map inside 7x7 rooms made of tree trunks and the map was reloaded 4 times.
 
−
 
−
Steel Short swords were chosen for their variety of attacks.
 
−
 
−
Tests were done at different skill levels to vary the momentum of successful strikes (1.0x at unskilled, 1.5x at adept, 2.0x at grand master.)
 
−
 
−
<u>'''Notes:'''</u>
 
−
 
−
The objective of the test is to study some claims made in [[Armor#Encumbrance]]. Older testing indicated an unskilled peasant wearing heavy armor may fight at two-thirds the speed of a naked dwarf [[http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=111414.0| link]].
 
−
 
−
"Full Steel Armor" is used to mean breastplate, greaves, helm, gauntlets, high boots, and mail shirt.
 
−
 
−
Steel short swords wielded by typical dwarves will not pierce steel mail shirts. Instead the benefit of shaped armor in this situation was to decrease blunt damage from torso and leg strikes.
 
−
 
−
Weapon skill likely affects parrying chance as well as momentum, so varying skill level ultimately influenced combat length, and therefore the importance of fatigue, in an unknown way. Collapse from over-exertion was common.
 
−
 
−
The 95% confidence intervals for these results are about +-10 combats.
 
−
 
−
<u>'''Tester's conclusions:'''</u>
 
−
 
−
In no sample set of 100 combats was a statistically significant difference from equality of the groups observed. Furthermore at low and medium weapon skill levels the medium-armored dwarves performed somewhat better. These results are consistent with the advice that for military dwarves with low armor skill, the encumbrance of wearing multiple pieces of 15+ weight armor makes the extra protection not worth it. However, the difference does not appear to be backbreaking, metaphorically speaking. For comparison, in Neckromancer's win ratio tests above, a naked but shielded axedwarf with 2 ranks in each relevant skill defeated a similar dwarf with 1 rank in each relevant skill 83 out of 100 times.
 

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