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Editing v0.31 Talk:Strange mood
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− | I just had this same issue. | + | I just had this same issue. DF2010. Guy got fey mood and also happens to be expedition leader. Dabbling grower. Skilled appraiser. Novice Organizer. Talented Record Keeper. He's set as expedition leader, manager, bookkeeper, and broker. Did what 0x517A5D said above, no dice. Hope this helps --[[User:W-dueck|w-dueck]] 04:24, 13 August 2010 (UTC) |
:Did you have a craftsdwarfs workshop, which is what dwarfs with no moodable skills take?--[[User:Kwieland|Kwieland]] 06:01, 13 August 2010 (UTC) | :Did you have a craftsdwarfs workshop, which is what dwarfs with no moodable skills take?--[[User:Kwieland|Kwieland]] 06:01, 13 August 2010 (UTC) | ||
I have this issue as well. high master armormsith, novice metal crafter, and adept pump operator. Obviously, he could take a metalsmith's forge, but he refuses to take either the conventional, or the magma versions. Just stands around at my well. [[User:Psychobones|Psychobones]] 00:05, 29 August 2010 (UTC) | I have this issue as well. high master armormsith, novice metal crafter, and adept pump operator. Obviously, he could take a metalsmith's forge, but he refuses to take either the conventional, or the magma versions. Just stands around at my well. [[User:Psychobones|Psychobones]] 00:05, 29 August 2010 (UTC) | ||
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== Body Parts? == | == Body Parts? == | ||
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== Obsidian Farming SCIENCE == | == Obsidian Farming SCIENCE == | ||
Someone needs to figure out definitely whether obsidian farming allows more moods. | Someone needs to figure out definitely whether obsidian farming allows more moods. | ||
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== 'Nother Possible Bug == | == 'Nother Possible Bug == | ||
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I think it requires some clarification. Does the moody dwarf attack their victim, drag them to workshop and insta-kill them or insta-kill them on the place and then drag the corpse? --[[User:Someone-else|Someone-else]] 20:22, 23 May 2010 (UTC) | I think it requires some clarification. Does the moody dwarf attack their victim, drag them to workshop and insta-kill them or insta-kill them on the place and then drag the corpse? --[[User:Someone-else|Someone-else]] 20:22, 23 May 2010 (UTC) | ||
:In 40d, the moody dwarf would insta-kill his victim wherever he/she was standing (without the victim even being able to defend itself, much like slaughtering), then drag the corpse to the workshop. --[[User:Quietust|Quietust]] 20:45, 23 May 2010 (UTC) | :In 40d, the moody dwarf would insta-kill his victim wherever he/she was standing (without the victim even being able to defend itself, much like slaughtering), then drag the corpse to the workshop. --[[User:Quietust|Quietust]] 20:45, 23 May 2010 (UTC) | ||
− | :I also had a fell mood murder in | + | :I also had a fell mood murder in DF2010. It seems like it uses the same game mechanics as slaughtering (instant-kill without combat mechanics). --18:46, 5 July 2010 (UTC) |
::I just had a Fell mood in 31.12. The Dwarf who undertook the mood first claimed a Tanner's shop then stalked the (corpse-strewn, gradually flooding) halls of my fortress for quite a while. Eventually, he grabbed an alread-dead Dwarf's corpse and hauled it back to the Tannery. And now... I have a lovely Dwarf Bone Cage which sadly will be lost soon when my fortress finishes self-destructing in an orgy of tantrums and doomsday-level flooding. [[Special:Contributions/71.232.137.20|71.232.137.20]] 04:59, 30 July 2010 (UTC) | ::I just had a Fell mood in 31.12. The Dwarf who undertook the mood first claimed a Tanner's shop then stalked the (corpse-strewn, gradually flooding) halls of my fortress for quite a while. Eventually, he grabbed an alread-dead Dwarf's corpse and hauled it back to the Tannery. And now... I have a lovely Dwarf Bone Cage which sadly will be lost soon when my fortress finishes self-destructing in an orgy of tantrums and doomsday-level flooding. [[Special:Contributions/71.232.137.20|71.232.137.20]] 04:59, 30 July 2010 (UTC) | ||
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::::I don't want to create an argument, just to clear it up. You ''claim'' that a Peasant can go Fey or Secretive, but is there evidence of it? If even a single dwarf were to enter a Fey or Secretive mood, who ''did not have any moodable skills prior'' (even at dabbling), this would disprove DJ Devil's hypothesis. Present a case where this has happened, and he should be satisfied. I would also like to see this evidence, as the only Possessed dwarves I've had were those without moodable skills - and those with had all (if I remember correctly) Fey or Secretive. --[[User:Drake1500|Drake1500]] 00:48, 20 June 2011 (UTC) | ::::I don't want to create an argument, just to clear it up. You ''claim'' that a Peasant can go Fey or Secretive, but is there evidence of it? If even a single dwarf were to enter a Fey or Secretive mood, who ''did not have any moodable skills prior'' (even at dabbling), this would disprove DJ Devil's hypothesis. Present a case where this has happened, and he should be satisfied. I would also like to see this evidence, as the only Possessed dwarves I've had were those without moodable skills - and those with had all (if I remember correctly) Fey or Secretive. --[[User:Drake1500|Drake1500]] 00:48, 20 June 2011 (UTC) | ||
:::::Humans are really good as spotting patterns. We're so good at it that sometimes we see patterns where none actually exist.<br/>Mix in something as important to the game and as rare as strange moods, well, it's understandable that a player would want to know how to control them.<br/>But the reality is, moods are purely random. There are only two inputs into mood type selection, exactly as I said a year ago in this very section. The <u>only</u> control you have to prevent a possessed mood is to keep your dwarfs unhappy enough that all moods are fell or macabre.<br/>Here's the proof. This is part of the disassembly of the current version{{version|0.31.25}}'s mood selection code. I have shown all of the calculations for "good" moods, but skipped the choice between the two "bad" moods. Also, I have shown only one of the five pieces of code that set the mood type. They all work the same. | :::::Humans are really good as spotting patterns. We're so good at it that sometimes we see patterns where none actually exist.<br/>Mix in something as important to the game and as rare as strange moods, well, it's understandable that a player would want to know how to control them.<br/>But the reality is, moods are purely random. There are only two inputs into mood type selection, exactly as I said a year ago in this very section. The <u>only</u> control you have to prevent a possessed mood is to keep your dwarfs unhappy enough that all moods are fell or macabre.<br/>Here's the proof. This is part of the disassembly of the current version{{version|0.31.25}}'s mood selection code. I have shown all of the calculations for "good" moods, but skipped the choice between the two "bad" moods. Also, I have shown only one of the five pieces of code that set the mood type. They all work the same. | ||
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<pre> | <pre> | ||
; This is the test that determines whether the dwarf will get a fell or | ; This is the test that determines whether the dwarf will get a fell or | ||
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jmp @@end_of_mood_setup | jmp @@end_of_mood_setup | ||
</pre> | </pre> | ||
− | + | :::::The takeaway here is that the branches in the code that choose moods (that's the instructions that start with 'j') depend solely on random numbers. There is <u>nothing</u> to tweak that will change this random outcome.<br/>Training doesn't affect it. Skill rust doesn't affect it. Availability of a workshop doesn't affect it. Whether the dwarf is wearing lucky socks doesn't affect it.<br/>—[[User:0x517A5D|0x517A5D]] 20:20, 23 June 2011 (UTC) | |
− | :::::The takeaway here is that the branches in the code that choose moods (that's the instructions that start with 'j') depend solely on random numbers. There is <u>nothing</u> to tweak that will change this random outcome.<br/>Training doesn't affect it. Skill rust doesn't affect it. Availability of a workshop doesn't affect it. Whether the dwarf is wearing lucky socks doesn't affect it.<br/>—[[User:0x517A5D|0x517A5D]] 20:20, 23 June | ||
== Shells == | == Shells == | ||
Mussel shells count as shells along with turtle shells and cave lobster shells. Should change the page to include them . | Mussel shells count as shells along with turtle shells and cave lobster shells. Should change the page to include them . | ||
− | : Cave lobsters don't produce shells anymore. Only turtle, oyster and mussel do - see [[ | + | : Cave lobsters don't produce shells anymore. Only turtle, oyster and mussel do - see [[DF2010:Shell|shell]] page.[[User:Peregarrett|Peregarrett]] 06:50, 2 July 2010 (UTC) |
== Materials in hospitals == | == Materials in hospitals == | ||
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Oh, sorry, DF 31.10, [[Special:Contributions/78.140.48.35|78.140.48.35]] 08:12, 18 August 2010 (UTC) | Oh, sorry, DF 31.10, [[Special:Contributions/78.140.48.35|78.140.48.35]] 08:12, 18 August 2010 (UTC) | ||
:It happens fairly often (and even back in 40d) that a moody metalsmith will insist on a very specific metal. In most cases, that metal would be the dwarf's favorite metal, but I always observed that once I had struck raw adamantine, all moody metalsmiths would insist on using adamantine wafers. --[[User:Quietust|Quietust]] 12:53, 18 August 2010 (UTC) | :It happens fairly often (and even back in 40d) that a moody metalsmith will insist on a very specific metal. In most cases, that metal would be the dwarf's favorite metal, but I always observed that once I had struck raw adamantine, all moody metalsmiths would insist on using adamantine wafers. --[[User:Quietust|Quietust]] 12:53, 18 August 2010 (UTC) | ||
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== Strange problem with moods == | == Strange problem with moods == | ||
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I had a Dwarf who got the Fey mood and didnt want to claim a Workshop. I built any possible Workshop, except a Forge, since I had a Magma Forge. The Dwarf didnt accept the Magma Forge but when i disassemled it and built a Normal Metlsmiths Forge he claimed it immediately. So it seems for moody dwarfs thats not the same. -- Blue Crake 30.10.10 | I had a Dwarf who got the Fey mood and didnt want to claim a Workshop. I built any possible Workshop, except a Forge, since I had a Magma Forge. The Dwarf didnt accept the Magma Forge but when i disassemled it and built a Normal Metlsmiths Forge he claimed it immediately. So it seems for moody dwarfs thats not the same. -- Blue Crake 30.10.10 | ||
:Yes, this sometimes happens. Reported above, item #9. Also reported several times on the 40d Talk Strange Mood page. I'm glad you figured out the workaround.<br/>—[[User:0x517A5D|0x517A5D]] 22:40, 30 September 2010 (UTC) | :Yes, this sometimes happens. Reported above, item #9. Also reported several times on the 40d Talk Strange Mood page. I'm glad you figured out the workaround.<br/>—[[User:0x517A5D|0x517A5D]] 22:40, 30 September 2010 (UTC) | ||
− | I wrote that to tell, that this is the case for the forge too, not only the glassmaker. I can`t find anything about this in the mainpage of | + | I wrote that to tell, that this is the case for the forge too, not only the glassmaker. I can`t find anything about this in the mainpage of DF2010 Moods. Shouldn`t it be here as well, as long as this bug (is it a bug or rather a caveat?) exists? Needing a normal forge is kinda counterintuitive, as moody dwarfs dont use fuel anyway. Also do moody dwarfs always take nonmagma-buildings or just sometimes? --[[User:Blue Crake|Blue Crake]] 10:42, 1 October 2010 (UTC) |
This seems like a bug to me, why does normal vs. magma matter? It really shouldn't. Just want to make sure this is noted as bug. <small>– [[template:unsigned|unsigned]] comment by [[User:Pathaugen|Pathaugen]]</small> | This seems like a bug to me, why does normal vs. magma matter? It really shouldn't. Just want to make sure this is noted as bug. <small>– [[template:unsigned|unsigned]] comment by [[User:Pathaugen|Pathaugen]]</small> | ||
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==cloth... thread...== | ==cloth... thread...== | ||
i think i can confirm this also means 'cloth(yarn)' for possessed dwarves, based on having both silk and plant fibre cloth AND thread available, in stockpiles nearby, but my possessed dwarf not going for either. there were also a number of other items on his list, but he'd found them all, and had them 'TSK'ed in the workshop. unfortunately, i'd left him to it too long (thinking he had all the items at his disposal, and would get going with it unsupervised) before i'd recognised he wasnt interested in the cloth available, and wanted some of the new yarn. he'd gone insane before i could sheer any animals, and weave it into cloth.--[[User:DJ Devil|DJ Devil]] 16:50, 8 May 2011 (UTC) | i think i can confirm this also means 'cloth(yarn)' for possessed dwarves, based on having both silk and plant fibre cloth AND thread available, in stockpiles nearby, but my possessed dwarf not going for either. there were also a number of other items on his list, but he'd found them all, and had them 'TSK'ed in the workshop. unfortunately, i'd left him to it too long (thinking he had all the items at his disposal, and would get going with it unsupervised) before i'd recognised he wasnt interested in the cloth available, and wanted some of the new yarn. he'd gone insane before i could sheer any animals, and weave it into cloth.--[[User:DJ Devil|DJ Devil]] 16:50, 8 May 2011 (UTC) | ||
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==Infinite logs loop?== | ==Infinite logs loop?== | ||
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== Profession != Highest skill == | == Profession != Highest skill == | ||
Just thought I should point this out. The article states: "The deciding factor for eligibility is a dwarf's actual profession." however, evidence here suggests that it is the ''highest skill'' of the dwarf that matters. In most cases these are the same thing, but not always. AFAIK a peasant needs to reach novice skill before changing profession, so would a peasant with dabbling weaponsmith skill entering a mood choose to make a weapon, or enter an 'unskilled' mood? --[[Special:Contributions/213.121.247.101|213.121.247.101]] 13:01, 27 June 2011 (UTC) | Just thought I should point this out. The article states: "The deciding factor for eligibility is a dwarf's actual profession." however, evidence here suggests that it is the ''highest skill'' of the dwarf that matters. In most cases these are the same thing, but not always. AFAIK a peasant needs to reach novice skill before changing profession, so would a peasant with dabbling weaponsmith skill entering a mood choose to make a weapon, or enter an 'unskilled' mood? --[[Special:Contributions/213.121.247.101|213.121.247.101]] 13:01, 27 June 2011 (UTC) | ||
− | :The profession check is for '''whether a dwarf can enter a mood at all''' - Soldiers (excluding Recruits) and Babies can '''never''' enter a strange mood (and neither can some special ones that you can't get anyways, such as Merchant or Drunk), but all others are eligible | + | :The profession check is for '''whether a dwarf can enter a mood at all''' - Soldiers (excluding Recruits) and Babies can '''never''' enter a strange mood (and neither can some special ones that you can't get anyways, such as Merchant or Drunk), but all others are eligible. Once the dwarf is chosen to enter a mood, '''then''' it checks for their highest moodable skill - a Peasant with Dabbling skill in Weaponsmithing (and no other moodable skills) will claim a metalsmith's forge and produce an artifact weapon. --[[User:Quietust|Quietust]] 13:10, 27 June 2011 (UTC) |
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