Editing DF2014 Talk:Starting build

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== Optimization ==

According to this page, the following are true:
# Alcohol grants a new barrel after every 5th unit.
# Food (includes raw meats, prepared creature parts, e.g. brains, and fish) grants a new barrel after every 10th unit. Different parts of the same creature are stored in the same barrel.
# Liquids (extracts?) grant a new barrel after every 10th unit.
# Seeds grant a new bag after every 10th unit.
# Powders grant a new bag after every unit.

I was not getting the same results as the Optimization section indicates, so I embarked upon some embark SCIENCE!. I used the DF Starter Pack with DF version 40.04. For all embarks, I first removed all of the default equipment so I would only have a short list to look through once the game started.

First embark: 11 kea meat
Observation: A plum wood barrel containing 11 kea meat.
Conclusion: Claim 2, above, is false.

I checked http://dwarffortresswiki.org/index.php/DF2014:Barrel which states "Barrels can hold up to 30 pieces of meat"

Second embark: 31 pig meat
Observation: A pear wood barrel containing 27 pig meat, and a walnut wood barrel containing 5 pig meat.
Conclusion: Food grants a new barrel after 30 units, but the 31st unit may not be in a barrel by itself.

Embark, the third: 6 dwarven rum
Observation: A walnut wood barrel containing 1 dwarven rum, and a date palm wood barrel containing 5 dwarven rum.
Conclusion: Although a barrel can hold up to 30 units of alcohol, a single barrel will only hold one stack. The default stack size for alcohol appears to be 5. Claim 1 appears to be true.

Embark 4, prepare carefully: 11 gremlin tears, 11 yak blood, 11 yak's milk
Observation: a chestnut barrel containing 11 gremlin tears, a bayberry wood barrel containing 11 yak blood and 11 yak's milk.
Conclusion: Claim 3 is false. Interestingly, extracts from the same creature are stored in the same barrel. Are extracts stored in the same barrel as meat from the same creature? Must do more SCIENCE!

Embark 5, gettin' complicated up in this biat**: 11 plump helmet spawn, 11 pig tail seeds, 15 cave fish (f), 16 cave fish (m), 31 honey bee venom, 10 cow meat, 10 cow's milk, 10 cow blood
Observation: An alpaca wool bag containing 11 plump helmet spawn, a grizzly bear leather bag containing 11 pig tail seeds, a hazel wood barrel containing 10 cave fish (f) and 16 cave fish (m), a plum wood barrel containing 31 honey bee venom, an apricot wood barrel containing 10 cow meat, a cedar barrel containing 10 cow's milk and 10 cow blood, a pomegranate wood barrel containing 5 cave fish (f)
Conclusion: Claim 4 is false. Extracts and meat from the same animal are not stored in the same barrel. Fish seem to follow the same rules as meat and gender, like body part, does not preclude the item from being stored in the same barrel.

Embark 6, honing in on the answers: 101 plump helmet spawn, 101 gremlin tears, 101 cow's milk, 11 prepared badger brain
Observation: A sheep wool bag with 101 plump helmet spawn, an avocado wood barrel with 96 gremlin tears, a willow barrel with 96 cow's milk, an alder barrel with 11 prepared badger brain, an ashen barrel with 5 cow's milk, and an apricot wood barrel with 5 gremlin tears
Conclusion: Extracts grant a new barrel after 100 units. Bags hold more than 100 seeds, which is in direct conflict with the information on the bags page. Prepared creature parts appear to follow the rules for raw meat and fish.

Embark 7, stay on target: 301 plump helmet spawn, 11 plump helmets, 3 black sand, 3 red sand
Observation: A pigtail fiber bag containing 301 plump helmet spawn!!! a plum wood barrel containing 11 plump helmets, a llama wool bag containing a black sand, a capybara leather bag containing a red sand, a pig tail fiber bag containing a red sand, a llama wool bag containing a red sand, a cave spider silk bag containing a black sand, and a giant cave spider silk bag containing a black sand
Conclusion: Claim 5 seems to be true...  WTF, Seeds?!?!

Embark 8: 31 plump helmets, 2 gypsum plaster, 2 lye
Observation: A peach wood barrel containing 31 plump helmets, a pig tail fiber bag containing a gypsum plaster, a larch barrel containing 2 lye, a grizzly bear leather bag containing a gypsum plaster.
Conclusion: Plump helmets do not follow the same behavior as meat/fish. Gypsum plaster behaves as sand.

Embark 9, wrapping it up: 61 plump helmets, 101 lye
Observation: a pear wood barrel with 56 plump helmets, an apricot wood barrel with 96 lye, a fungiwood barrel with 5 lye, and a coconut palm barrel with 5 plump helmets
Conclusion: Lye follows the behavior of extracts. Plump helmets (and probably all plants) grant an additional barrel after 60.


'''Findings:'''
# Alcohol does indeed grant a new barrel after every 5th unit.
# Food (includes raw meats, prepared creature parts, e.g. brains, and fish) grants a new barrel after every 30th unit. Different parts of the same creature are stored in the same barrel.
# Extracts (and lye) grant a new barrel after every 100th unit. Different extracts from the same creature are stored in the same barrel.
# Seeds do not grant a new bag after any reasonable unit count.
# Powders grant a new container after every unit.
# Plants grant a new barrel after every 60th unit.
@@ Line 58: / Line 58: @@
 # Powders grant a new container after every unit.
 # Plants grant a new barrel after every 60th unit.
-<small>&ndash; [[template:unsigned|unsigned]] comment by [[User:Thepaan|Thepaan]]</small>
-:Thanks! I'll update the page when I get a chance. &mdash;[[User:Lethosor|<span style="color:#074">Lethosor</span>]] ([[User talk:Lethosor|<span style="color:#092">talk</span>]]) 21:41, 23 July 2014 (UTC)
-Updated after testing today.  I took out the part about new barrels for everything other than alcohol, since it doesn't happen at any reasonable amount for this trick, and certainly not at 10 units.
-"Garden Vegetables" don't grant a new bag at any reasonable amount either, holding at least 50 when I tested them. --[[Special:Contributions/97.83.67.252|97.83.67.252]] 14:40, 29 August 2020 (UTC)
-== Eggs and fruits/leaves come with free containers ==
-Embarking with one hen egg brought a barrel with it. I have not tested limits for additional barrels, or whether each variety of egg brings a separate barrel or if they get combined in one.
-The plants, fruits and leaves new to this version arrive in bags. Each type gets a separate bag. However if this gets noted in the page, it should also be noted that this behavior is semi-buggy (e.g. the bug preventing bagged, brewable fruit from embarks being unavailable for brewing until unbagged, while local fruit, stored in barrels, brews fine) and so is likely to change in future versions. [[User:Urist McDorf|Urist McDorf]] ([[User talk:Urist McDorf|talk]]) 15:21, 14 October 2015 (UTC)