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Difference between revisions of "User talk:Kydo"

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==Spontaneous Hypothermia==
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Please try to refrain from telling people to "lurk moar" when you disagree with them. It is the same as saying "Shut up." This is a wiki. And this game is not an open book. Given that your name is not "ToadyOne" you are not an expert on the inner workings of this game. You are experimenting and making hypothesis like everyone else. For instance, you seemed surprised to learn there is a "liquids" category in the stock screens, and assumed it would show "billion-gazillions" of units of water. If you had bothered to look, you would know exactly what it shows. I would think someone writing a well guide should know about the "liquids" stock category. Perhaps you need to lurk and experiment moar, missing a simple and important thing like that. (See? Doesn't feel so nice, does it?) [[User:GhostDwemer|GhostDwemer]] 20:33, 29 November 2010 (UTC)
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I've heard stories of this happening to other players, and it seems to result from corrupted raws leading to the creation of clothing made from " leather" (i.e. no creature name) which has a boiling point of 0, causing both migrants and caravans to be instantly frozen in a cloud of '''boiling leather''' the instant they enter the map. --[[User:Quietust|Quietust]] 23:25, 4 October 2009 (UTC)
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: Indeed I do, and I did check after writing that. I also learned a number of other things from that. All of which told me he was still wrong. Also, when I originally wrote it, I DID say "shut up". I changed it because I thought that might be a bit too much. I didn't want him to stop posting completely, I just wanted him to stop spreading that particular (and easily disputed) rumor acrosss all of the water-related pages. I do agree with you though, it was mean of me, and deserves an apology. --Kydo 02:58, 30 November 2010 (UTC)
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:Really? Neat! I just reinstalled the game, copied my save files over, and everything was oky-doky! Well, you know, except for the pile of dead dwarves. --Kydo 23:42, 4 October 2009 (UTC)
 
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:I like to think it was just a really, really cursed island.
 
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:By the way Kydo, I've been working on my own little geology chart (and learning a whole lot about RL geology along the way). Mine is probably in way rougher condition than yours since I've just started looking into this, although I will point out that I have found it's pretty useful to organize gems into rough families of related gems, especially since many of these relationships aren't immediately apparent (eg., aquamarine, goshenite, heliodor and morganite are all beryls, as are emeralds). I also think the wiki could present this topic with more clarity - give me a shout if you'd like to collaborate a bit.[[User:Nemokara|Nemokara]] 06:29, 12 October 2009 (UTC)
 
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== Gelogy chart & etc ==
 
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I like it! It's definitely not something that's at an intro level, but if you don't mind, it should be more public - perhaps a new "advanced" sebsection at the bottom of the [[guide to rock]]?  Or a new parallel article, the "thinking dwarf's guide to rock"? (or something). In several areas, this wiki has been changed to one article with basic info or an overview, and another with absolutely related info, but at a higher level. (See [[armor]] vs [[armor piece]], the former being a technical discussion of the game mechanics, the latter being where [[helm]], [[greaves]] etc redirect.)
 
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I originally felt that the overall presentation of the stones and such to be absolutely wretched...<br />...I've learned why they were arranged that way... the whole thing needs massive cleanup...
 
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What would you suggest? As (I am guessing) you've seen, the entire wiki seems to be laid out more at an intro level, more for searching one narrowly defined topic than for quick comparison or overview. I've been working on that, combining various stub articles, isolated topics and scattered info into unified pages ''(vein (and clusters), mayor/leader/etc, armor/armor piece, defense guide et al, dwarf weapon/other weapon, most recently thread/cloth and pearlash/potash, others)'' -  I, too, found this wiki rather... hrmmm... convoluted in its overall presentation, a bit of a paper chase to actually find a complete answer to any broader question than "What is this one numerical value for this one facet of this specific item?" (and it still fails that regularly).  I still think the generic animals should be grouped into charts of similar animals rather than each their own page - a shark is a shark is a shark, after all - maybe that'll be next.  Thoughts?--[[User:Albedo|Albedo]] 17:32, 6 November 2009 (UTC)
 
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edit - btw, a wagon gets broken down into ''three'' wood logs, not "two".
 
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:I'd like to make it more public- once it's a bit beyond the basic layer stones. At the moment, it's really limited, and there's some... Errors. I think. I need to examine the game information and the wiki a bit more, because I SWEAR I've found gems in some of those layers, even though the wiki didn't list any as appearing in them. Also, the gems page states that some of them WILL appear in those layers. So... Yeah... Cleanup is needed, if the wiki contradicts itself as to whether gems can appear in Igneous Extrusive layers. When i was doing this, none of the Igneous Extrusive stones mentioned ANY gems. But some gems do mention igneous extrusive stone. I think i need to go looking through the stones that appear in igneous extrusive layers first, though, before I jump to conclusions.  
 
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:Also, I've noticed the manner in which most stone types are exactly the same, aside from a few having a couple of tiny special features. Which means the current table could (and should) be VERY heavily simplified for clarity. What I'd really like to get to, is reconciling the connections between stones and gems. If we can clearly see those relationships all together on one page, well, that'd be QUITE useful. At least for me, anyways.
 
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:I definitely agree about the animals, though. How many pages do we really need to dedicate to what is essentially the same freaking monkey? That really bothered me when I went browsing through there. Still, the object data does take up a fair bit of space, and it's more table-breaking than the gems lists are. So, in that sense, it kind of does make sense to give each one it's own page, just because that is a LOT of data.
 
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:And, yeah, slight error on my part.
 
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:--Kydo 02:05, 9 November 2009 (UTC)
 
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::Uh, slight addition, after reading a bit.
 
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::<blockquote>
 
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::"Let's say you hope to find some cinnabar, because you want to make some levers and use its bright red color. So we look up cinnabar, and find that that stone is listed on the "generic" stone page. In that chart we see that cinnabar is found as veins in "All igneous extrusive (layers), shale, (and) quartzite". If you have some stones that are igneous extrusive layer (you'd have to look that up, too), or some shale or quartzite, then you know where to start your exploratory mining. If not, then you'll have to look for another red stone, and hope you get lucky with that." -From [[The Non-Dwarf's Guide to Rock]]
 
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</blockquote>
 
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::All of this, and gems, could be compressed into a single page. It'd take a lot of time, and it's tedious. I know, as I've already started on the way. But it would definitely save time for people who get past the basics and start actively looking for things. --Kydo 02:33, 9 November 2009 (UTC)
 
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== Dead Wagons ==
 
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In your Observations section about dead wagons, you suggest that wagons "seem to completely deconstruct themselves from existence" when they enter the depot and "reappear from the location they originally disappeared on" when they leave, but at least in version 40d, this is not the case - if you look carefully, you will see that all of the wagons are in fact still sitting in the center of the depot, fully visible (though they'll probably be obscured by the other merchants, pack animals, and guards). --[[User:Quietust|Quietust]] 20:36, 4 February 2010 (UTC)
 
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:Yes, I did notice this since writing that. I simply haven't updated it. Also, your obsidian factory thing looks freaking brilliant. --Kydo 21:01, 4 February 2010 (UTC)
 
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== Industry flowchart ==
 
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It may just not be possible, or not in the effective space we have to work with. (Maybe if you had an 72" monitor...)  When I redid the current industries, the toughest challenge I found was the [[glass industry]] - altho' that was with the blocky wiki graphics. (I didn't even want to touch the [[metal industry]], graphics or no.)
 
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I'd suggest that perhaps, rather than having arrows that actually connect perfectly, you have (some?) arrows that terminate at end-product balloons such as "Furniture Industry" - and then another "Furniture Industry" that represents the ''start'' of that production chain, which flows out on its own path. If you color-code it clearly, readers should(?) be able to figure it out. --[[User:Albedo|Albedo]] 23:40, 24 February 2010 (UTC)
 
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:Actually, the way I've been organizing it lately has actually been sort of like an enormous venn diagram, using arrows to show the flow of materials through labors and workshops to their products. This eliminated a LOT of the circular paths and self-referencing my original charts did... It's STILL enormous, though. It takes forever to load the image, and it lags when I scroll. So I'm still looking for ways to, uh, streamline it. I pretty much remake the entire thing every time I open it. --Kydo 00:10, 27 February 2010 (UTC)
 
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==Other Stuff==
 
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[[user talk:vengefulDonut]] (I think you are being silly) [[User:VengefulDonut|VengefulDonut]] 01:17, 6 March 2010 (UTC)
 
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:I just like philosophical discussions, and look for any reason I can to have one.
 
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::The philosophical discussion is not the silly part. It's silly that you are trying to convince me of something that I haven't disagreed with. As far as you know, I could be aligned with or completely indifferent to what you are saying. [[User:VengefulDonut|VengefulDonut]] 16:04, 6 March 2010 (UTC)
 

Latest revision as of 02:58, 30 November 2010

Please try to refrain from telling people to "lurk moar" when you disagree with them. It is the same as saying "Shut up." This is a wiki. And this game is not an open book. Given that your name is not "ToadyOne" you are not an expert on the inner workings of this game. You are experimenting and making hypothesis like everyone else. For instance, you seemed surprised to learn there is a "liquids" category in the stock screens, and assumed it would show "billion-gazillions" of units of water. If you had bothered to look, you would know exactly what it shows. I would think someone writing a well guide should know about the "liquids" stock category. Perhaps you need to lurk and experiment moar, missing a simple and important thing like that. (See? Doesn't feel so nice, does it?) GhostDwemer 20:33, 29 November 2010 (UTC)

Indeed I do, and I did check after writing that. I also learned a number of other things from that. All of which told me he was still wrong. Also, when I originally wrote it, I DID say "shut up". I changed it because I thought that might be a bit too much. I didn't want him to stop posting completely, I just wanted him to stop spreading that particular (and easily disputed) rumor acrosss all of the water-related pages. I do agree with you though, it was mean of me, and deserves an apology. --Kydo 02:58, 30 November 2010 (UTC)
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