v0.34 Talk:Finished goods

Mugs

Mugs are also heavier, so in my experience crafts are much more productive. How should this be reflected in the article? Dree12 02:11, 16 April 2012 (UTC)

Cut Glass/Gems

in v0.31 there was a discussion about glass- and gem-crafts, the footnote to the table still "refers" to it but the link does not work. Should the discussion be moved over to the new namespace, or a small section be written in the article itself?

Crafts can be works of art?

What is "Some subtypes of crafts can be works of art (figurines, for example) on them when first built" supposed to mean?– unsigned comment by 71.190.3.225

Presumably it was intended to indicate that a figurine of your civilization's king is no more valuable than a figurine of some random goblin invader (or cheese). I replaced "works of art" with "references to historical figures" in an attempt to clarify the thought.--Loci (talk) 19:11, 21 August 2013 (UTC)

!!SCIENCE!! in multiples production

I've taken the time to perform some !!SCIENCE!! in regards to determining what crafts actually get the multiplication bonus.

I used DFHack 0.34.11 r3 and this script (to alter the skill level of a dwarf). My procedure was the following:

1. Created a new embark, with one of the dwarfs being a Proficient Bookkeeper (as to actually see the number of items, another being a Miner (as to have somewhere inside to work) and another a Proficient Stonecrafter.

2. Placed (using createitems) a table, a chair and a stone. The material used for all things was obsidian.

3. A Craftsdwarf's Workshop was constructed near the wagon using the stone and a small room was dug, where the bookkeeper's office would reside. After placement of the chair, the bookkeeper was assigned to it.

4. A stack of 100 stones was spawned at the center of the workshop (to minimize delays)(using create-items)

After step 4. the embark was saved. Henceforth, all trials could be made by giving a repeating order to the workshop and force-quitting DF after the trial was done. Two variables were tested, the number of different classes of stone items (Mug, Instrument, Crafts, Toys) produced by a Legendary +5 dwarf and whether the number of multiples was altered according to skill.

For the first test, the following trial results were obtained:

- Mugs: 300
- Instrument: 100
 - flutes   : 21
 - trumpets : 15
 - harps    : 21
 - drums    : 14
 - piccolos : 29
- Crafts     : 209
 - figurines : 23
 - amulets   : 34
 - scepters  : 29
 - crowns    : 24
 - rings     : 31
 - earrings  : 34
 - bracelets : 34
- Toys         : 100
 - puzzleboxes : 18
 - toy boats   : 20
 - toy hammers : 19
 - toy axes    : 22
 - mini-forges : 21

As seen, only Crafts and Mugs are produced in multiples.

I then repeated this trial, only for mugs, for decreasing levels of skill (Legendary, Accomplished, Proficient and Dabbling). Regardless of the increase in levels done by the production of the mugs, they were produced in every trial at a 3:1 ratio. The amount of experience got was also the same (12000xp), which totals 40xp per mug (or 120xp per resource). This slightly contradicts what's stated on the Experience page.

I also tested the case for Crafts and a Dabbling dwarf. The results follow:

- Crafts     : 194
 - figurines : 32
 - amulets   : 23
 - scepters  : 25
 - crowns    : 20
 - rings     : 35
 - earrings  : 25
 - bracelets : 34

Although there is some discrepancy, the results point that Crafts are produced in a 2:1 ratio. The experience given in this case was 8820xp, which does not fit the number of items produced. If going by resources, then producing 2 crafts (using 1 resource) gives around 90xp.

Also, the quality of the items produced was noted. If items are made in multiples, the quality is not. Each item gets it's own quality rating regardless of being produced in multiples, which explains the existence of 8 masterwork items out of 300.

These are my findings on the subject. I haven't tested gems or totems or any other material, but as this shows, the probability of multiples isn't increased by skill, as stated in the main page.

--Doktoro Reichard (talk) 11:30, 30 December 2013 (UTC)

---

I've done some more research to a topic that puzzled me: glass and gem crafts. The page points to the v0.31.25 talk page, which itself I felt it didn't provide a good enough explanation. Using a setup similar to the above (with the addition I also used fastdwarf 2 1 to speed up the process). I've tested all varieties of glass, tested whether skill affects production and also tested gems (in this case, only Ruby and Prase were tested). 1000 items were used in each trial. The results are as follows:

      Item      | Gem | L.Gem |       Crafts       | Total
                |     |       |f |a |s |c |r |e |b |
----------------+-----+-------+--+--+--+--+--+--+--+------
Green Glass     | 658 |  197  |26|23|24|10|24|21|17| 1000
Clear Glass     | 691 |  185  |15|18|23|20|14|17|17| 1000
Crystal Glass   | 690 |  178  |18|17|22|26|27|13|9 | 1000
----------------+-----+-------+--+--+--+--+--+--+--+------
Gr. Glass (Dab.)| 651 |  212  |20|23|22|28|14|15|15| 1000
----------------+-----+-------+--+--+--+--+--+--+--+------
Ruby            | 962 |  37   |0 |1 |0 |0 |0 |0 |0 | 1000
Prase           | 954 |  44   |0 |1 |1 |0 |0 |0 |0 | 1000

Observing the data retrieved from the trials, the following can be concluded:

1. Raw Glass has a 65-70% chance to be cut to a Gem, 20-15% to be cut into a Large Gem and a 10-15% to be cut into a Craft. 2. Experience has no effect on the distribution. 3. Raw Gems has a 95% chance to be cut to a Gem and a 5% chance to be cut into a Large Gem. The results given by the Crafts production are too residual to be considered (i.e. the probability of a craft appearing is less than 1%.--Doktoro Reichard (talk) 14:56, 4 January 2014 (UTC)

It seems Quietust has done some code spelunking and found the correct ratios, although my research is slightly off, which could be explained by the difference in versions. Awkwardly, it is written at the Gems page.--Doktoro Reichard (talk) 15:31, 4 January 2014 (UTC)

I've done some more research and increased the sample size to 10000 items, the results follow:

      Item      | Gem | L.Gem |           Crafts          | Total
                |     |       | f | a | s | c | r | e | b |
----------------+-----+-------+---+---+---+---+---+---+---+------
Green Glass     | 6608|  2027 |188|199|198|188|205|184|203| 10000
Morion          | 9489|  441  |  7| 10| 15| 12| 10|  4| 12| 10000

Treating the results we get roughly the same data that's stated at the Gems page. It strikes me as odd that this page didn't have any relationship whatsoever with the accurate information existing in the wiki... This being said, I'm updating the post with this information and also quoting it here:

Exactly 5% of all rough gems will be cut into a single craft or large gem (with 1 craft for every 8 large gems), and the same occurs with raw glass (but with different ratios - 33% of all jobs, producing 11 crafts for every 16 large gems).

—Quietust, Gems page

--Doktoro Reichard (talk) 21:55, 4 January 2014 (UTC)