Editing DF2014 Talk:Creature

== Creature Playability ==

I recently added playability information to the creatures on this page. Here's a few things I discovered about how the game determines playable races, which seems to have changed in v0.42:
* If an entity has [SITE_CONTROLLABLE], then that entity is playable in Dwarf Fortress mode.
* If an entity has [ALL_MAIN_POPS_CONTROLLABLE], then creatures from that entity are playable in Adventure mode. Your adventurer comes from a civ from that entity, and is a member.
* If a creature has [LOCAL_POPS_CONTROLLABLE], then that creature is playable in Adventure mode. Your adventurer comes from a nearby civ, and is a member. Creatures played this way appear under "Intelligent Wilderness Creature" in the race selection menu.
* If the creature raw has [OUTSIDER_CONTROLLABLE], then that creature is playable in Adventure mode. Your adventurer begins in a random civ with no associations. This is selected after the race, in the civ selection menu.
* As noted, other creatures seem to be playable in Adventurer mode as well. This seems to be due to historical consequences, but I'm not sure what causes it. It may be because those creatures have moved into a civ wiht [ALL_MAIN_POPS_CONTROLLABLE]. More Science required.
* The difference between [ALL_MAIN_POPS_CONTROLLABLE] and [LOCAL_POPS_CONTROLLABLE] mainly seems to be whether the tag is attached to creature or entity. More Science required.
[[User:AntiBlueQuirk|AntiBlueQuirk]] ([[User talk:AntiBlueQuirk|talk]]) 11:06, 24 December 2015 (UTC)

== new creatures ==
Here's a preliminary list. Note that some already exist, but have been reordered in other files (large felines) or have been renamed (giant toad, tigerman). It would be nice to have a script that takes the creature raws and outputs a properly formatted table. I have a vim substitution command for the [[graphic set]] page, but nothing for this table.

amphibians
*TOAD_MAN
*GIANT_TOAD


*annelids
*WORM_MAN


*birds
*BLUEJAY_MAN
*GIANT_BLUEJAY
*CARDINAL_MAN
*GIANT_CARDINAL
*GRACKLE_MAN
*GIANT_GRACKLE
*ORIOLE_MAN
*GIANT_ORIOLE
*RW_BLACKBIRD_MAN
*GIANT_RW_BLACKBIRD


*insects
*FLY_MAN
*GIANT_FLY
*ROACH_MAN
*GIANT_ROACH
*BEETLE_MAN
*GIANT_BEETLE
*BUTTERFLY_MONARCH_MAN
*GIANT_BUTTERFLY_MONARCH
*FIREFLY_MAN
*GIANT_FIREFLY
*DRAGONFLY_MAN
*GIANT_DRAGONFLY


*large mountain
*GOAT_MOUNTAIN_MAN
*GIANT_GOAT_MOUNTAIN
*MARMOT_HOARY_MAN
*GIANT_MARMOT_HOARY


*large ocean
*WALRUS_MAN
*GIANT_WALRUS


*large riverlake
*HIPPO_MAN
*GIANT_HIPPO


*large temperate
*BEAR_GRIZZLY_MAN
*GIANT_BEAR_GRIZZLY
*BEAR_BLACK_MAN
*GIANT_BEAR_BLACK
*DEER_MAN
*GIANT_DEER
*FOX_MAN
*GIANT_FOX
*RACCOON_MAN
*GIANT_RACCOON
*MACAQUE_RHESUS_MAN
*GIANT_MACAQUE_RHESUS
*COUGAR_MAN
*GIANT_COUGAR
*WOLF_MAN
*GIANT_WOLF
*GROUNDHOG_MAN
*GIANT_GROUNDHOG
*ALLIGATOR_MAN
*GIANT_ALLIGATOR
*BUZZARD_MAN
*GIANT_BUZZARD


*large tropical
*ELEPHANT_MAN
*GIANT_ELEPHANT
*WARTHOG_MAN
*GIANT_WARTHOG
*LION_MAN
*GIANT_LION
*LEOPARD_MAN
*GIANT_LEOPARD
*JAGUAR_MAN
*GIANT_JAGUAR
*TIGERMAN -> TIGER_MAN
*GIANT_TIGER
*CHEETAH_MAN
*GIANT_CHEETAH
*GAZELLE_MAN
*GIANT_GAZELLE
*MANDRILL_MAN
*GIANT_MANDRILL
*CAMEL_1_HUMP_MAN
*GIANT_CAMEL_1_HUMP
*CAMEL_2_HUMP_MAN
*GIANT_CAMEL_2_HUMP
*CROCODILE_SALTWATER_MAN
*GIANT_CROCODILE_SALTWATER
*VULTURE_MAN
*GIANT_VULTURE
*RHINOCEROS_MAN
*GIANT_RHINOCEROS
*GIRAFFE_MAN
*GIANT_GIRAFFE
*	HONEY BADGER MAN
*	HONEY BADGER, GIANT
*MUSKOX_MAN
*GIANT_MUSKOX
*ELK_MAN
*GIANT_ELK
*BEAR_POLAR_MAN
*GIANT_BEAR_POLAR


*reptiles
*LIZARD_MAN
*GIANT_LIZARD
*	SKINK -vermin
*SKINK_MAN
*GIANT_SKINK
*	CHAMELEON -vermin
*CHAMELEON_MAN
*GIANT_CHAMELEON
*	ANOLE -vermin
*ANOLE_MAN
*GIANT_ANOLE
*	IGUANA
*IGUANA_MAN
*GIANT_IGUANA


*small mammals
*RAT_MAN
*SQUIRREL_GRAY_MAN
*GIANT_SQUIRREL_GRAY
*SQUIRREL_RED_MAN
*GIANT_SQUIRREL_RED
*CHIPMUNK_MAN
*GIANT_CHIPMUNK


*subterranean
*TOAD_GIANT -> TOAD_GIANT_CAVE

[[User:CLA|CLA]] ([[User talk:CLA|talk]]) 15:08, 20 January 2016 (UTC)

== Aquatic creature section ==

Presently, it includes few creatures (such as Beak Dog or Grimeling) only found in marshes and swamps.

In our world, we link them with water, but in DF they are no more linked to water than forests and shrublands are - though many creatures found in rivers and lakes also appear in marshes or swamps.

I question whether such association is right, though. Does the section serve as a list of creatures one may find in water (which wouldn't have Beak Dog next to Basking Shark) or is it meant for newer players coming into DF from outside looking for specifically things they would expect in wetlands and bodies of water?

[[User:Fleeting Frames|Fleeting Frames]] ([[User talk:Fleeting Frames|talk]]) 06:36, 27 August 2018 (UTC)

== Pet Value ==

Why do some say 'Not Tamable' and others say 'N/A'? What's the difference? If there is a difference, it should be clear. If there isn't, it should be standardized. [[User:Vixen525|Vixen525]] ([[User talk:Vixen525|talk]]) 20:09, 27 August 2018 (UTC)
@@ Line 178: / Line 178: @@
 Why do some say 'Not Tamable' and others say 'N/A'? What's the difference? If there is a difference, it should be clear. If there isn't, it should be standardized. [[User:Vixen525|Vixen525]] ([[User talk:Vixen525|talk]]) 20:09, 27 August 2018 (UTC)
-== Domestic animals are civilized? ==
-Going by our definition of [[Civilization]] should 'domestic animals' be listed as civilized ? --[[User:Jan|Jan]] ([[User talk:Jan|talk]]) 13:24, 23 December 2021 (UTC)
-== spoiler tags ==
-Is there any point to having spoiler tags on this page? The tables contain dry numbers, interesting stuff are contained in the individual creature entries which has their own spoiler tags.  --[[User:Jan|Jan]] ([[User talk:Jan|talk]]) 04:04, 22 February 2022 (UTC)
-Well, no, not really, so...[https://dwarffortresswiki.org/index.php?title=DF2014:Creature&curid=31257&diff=262497&oldid=262496| did that]? [[User:Silverwing235|Silverwing235]] ([[User talk:Silverwing235|talk]]) 16:22, 22 February 2022 (UTC)
-: Thanks. --[[User:Jan|Jan]] ([[User talk:Jan|talk]]) 19:30, 22 February 2022 (UTC)
-:: I disagree, the existance of demons and angels, and especially their living in the underworld/vaults is treated as a spoiler across the rest of the wiki. This should apply to this article as well. —-[[User:Voliol|Voliol]] ([[User talk:Voliol|talk]]) 21:02, 22 February 2022 (UTC)
-::: Their existence is an open secret on the wiki, they are mentioned or referred to on many articles. Nevertheless if you want to know what those things actually mean in DF you still need to go past the spoiler tags on the individual entries.  (btw IMO attempts to hide their existence by using weird terminology only bring further additional attention to the topic, like 'Hidden fun stuff' [https://i.kym-cdn.com/entries/icons/mobile/000/002/019/dnt.jpg Really?!])
-::: There is also a question of how spoilers should be marked. I think that {{tl|spoiler}} works best when placed at the top of the article when its the first thing you see, not so much when placed in the middle, when people use Ctrl+F, or with tables. Maybe we should use something like this here:
-:::{| class="mw-collapsible mw-collapsed wikitable"
-! colspan=2 | spoiler stuff
-|-
-| This  content || is hidden
-|-
-| at first || load time
-|} --[[User:Jan|Jan]] ([[User talk:Jan|talk]]) 22:09, 22 February 2022 (UTC)
-::::I agree with Voliol on that demons and angels should be treated as a spoiler. Jan's idea of a collapsed table is excellent: in comparison to current spoiler tags, it is both better at preserving the spoiler and less hindering for those who don't care about spoilers. [[User:Tanamoril|Tanamoril]] ([[User talk:Tanamoril|talk]]) 14:29, 26 February 2022 (UTC)
-== Splitting list of creatures? ==
-Could be nice if for the new version this page can be split in two
-* Creatures - which gives an overview of what you might expect in game ([https://www.reddit.com/r/dwarffortress/comments/zh542o/a_newbies_bestiary_or_a_comprehensive_guide_to/ for example])
-* List of creatures - which contains the exhaustive list of creatures and their prominent stats.
---[[User:Jan|Jan]] ([[User talk:Jan|talk]]) 09:57, 10 December 2022 (UTC)