DF2014 Talk:Mass pitting

Re: 40.x

Hey guys I did some experimentation and it appears that normal enemies (non-flying non-thief) can be prevented from escaping mass pits by having forbidden hatches over the top of the pits. Not sure of the behavior with thieves/flyers as I've yet to catch one.

~ Lasserith

Hatches must be forbidden before pitting, else they can get a finger in and slip out (even though they are below the hatch)Mesmerism (talk) 04:39, 28 October 2014 (UTC)

Attempted !SCIENCE!

Having had Goblins escape in 0.40.24, my dwarves have been conducting experiments with a new batch of mostly Troll prisoners. However, so far all have been successfully pitted. The setup is almost exactly as in the article: animal stockpile with hatches to ensure every cage is next to a hatch. Hatches forbidden. Floor smoothed, though I have still had escapees with a smoothed floor so I don't know if that changes anything. I tried with multiple pit zones (pitting only enemies next to the zone each time) and with a single pit zone (pitting all at once). Pitting was no problem even when there were trolls running around under the hatches. Orthogonal and diagonal pitting worked equally well. We are therefore perplexed. Possible differences compared to failed attempts (for further enquiry):

- The lower level (z-1) was completely smooth this time

- This pitting was done shortly (about 10-15 days) after an attack failed miserably. Could time spent in cages be a factor? Could fear and stress from seeing decimated comrades be a factor?

- Most of my dwarves have minor discipline experience. However I'm fairly sure the goblin was pitted by a 0 EXP dwarf, and goblins have previously escaped much more readily than trolls.

So it is still unknown what is causing the problem. However it is clear that the recommended layout still works, as long as the unknown factor allowing escapes doesn't come into play. 90.44.54.59 13:27, 8 April 2015 (UTC)

Points to clarify

Greetings. Maybe we can tackle this problem by sorting out and eliminating various possibilities which could be the reason for this new behaviour.

Can someone:

- Confirm when the break out of the caged prisoner happens? For example, does it only happen when they are pitted, but not when they are lead somewhere else? If so, the release from the cage should not be the reason, but the pitting instead.

- Confirm if or if not the sight of previously released prisoners on the lower floor might be the reason for the dwarf in question to panic, and therefore release the prisoner which is currently to be pitted? I read on the forum, that Jacko13 supposed this could be the case (last post in this topic: http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=141361.30). So the dwarf opens the hatch to drop the current prisoner in, spots a previously released (free) target on the level below, panics and releases his captive instead of pitting it. If this is the case, it should not happen when the pit below is empty, or deep enough.

- Check in some way, if the escape occurs because the pitted enemies grab the floor of the z-level from which they are pitted when they are thrown into the pit through the hatch? If that is the case, enemies which cannot climb should always be pitted successfully, while enemies with high climbing skills should almost always escape.

~ Beryll (talk) 09:08, 22 April 2015 (UTC)