Editing Talk:Trading

== Elves ==
I'm working on rewriting this page to take into account all of the changes to diplomacy and the civilizations screen since it was last updated. There's a lot of work to do.

One of the biggest changes was how elven ethics changed to reject IMPLIES_ANIMAL_KILL items. I updated it with everything I was reasonably sure about, but some things I'm only partially sure about and some things are just completely untested. I intend to check these myself, but if anyone wants to do the work in the meantime, I wouldn't mind.

These items I haven't tested and I'm completely unsure about:
* <s>[[Milk]] and [[cheese]]. These don't have [[Material definition token#IMPLIES_ANIMAL_KILL|IMPLIES_ANIMAL_KILL]] but they are obviously animal products</s>
** ''Tested cheese, didn't have any milk in an elf-safe container but that shouldn't be hard to arrange [[User:Desistance|Desistance]] ([[User talk:Desistance|talk]]) 16:12, 13 January 2023 (UTC)''
** ''Milk is okay too, huh [[User:Desistance|Desistance]] ([[User talk:Desistance|talk]]) 16:59, 13 January 2023 (UTC)''
* [[Extract]]s - Likewise. Both plant and animal extracts would need to be tested separately
* [[Venom]] - Also likewise, although this will be hard to test
* <s>Gem windows and large gems made of crystal or clear glass</s>
**''Gem windows are buildings, not discrete objects, duh. [[User:Desistance|Desistance]] ([[User talk:Desistance|talk]]) 17:53, 13 January 2023 (UTC)''
**''I tested large gems made of horn and they got bounced. I need to test large clear glass gems but I think it does check mats on large gems. [[User:Desistance|Desistance]] ([[User talk:Desistance|talk]]) 17:53, 13 January 2023 (UTC)''
**''Large clear and crystal glass gems are indeed unacceptable'' [[User:Desistance|Desistance]] ([[User talk:Desistance|talk]]) 09:53, 17 January 2023 (UTC)
* <s>[[Remains]] (can these even be hauled to the depot? I forget)</s>
**''they can't [[User:Desistance|Desistance]] ([[User talk:Desistance|talk]]) 15:43, 13 January 2023 (UTC))''
* [[Codex|Codices]] <s>and [[traction bench]]es</s>. These items can involve [[parchment]] [[sheet]]s or [[wool]] [[rope]]s in their creation. Due to a bug<!--{{bug|9409}}-->, they can lose the material definition from these components as part of assembling a [[quire]] into a codex or a [[table]], rope, and [[mechanism]] into a traction bench. Note that a codex made with a [[wood]]en [[Book binding|binding]] or a traction bench made with a wooden table would not be acceptable in any case.
** ''Both of the parts of a traction bench that can be non-elf-safe are still present on the final product, so this isn't accurate for them. Still need to test with books [[User:Desistance|Desistance]] ([[User talk:Desistance|talk]]) 02:03, 14 January 2023 (UTC)
* [[Instrument]]s are just a giant question mark
* [[Scroll]]s made with [[scroll roller]]s made from [[wood]] or clear or crystal [[glass]], or [[Codex|codices]] bound with [[hair]] or [[wool]]en [[thread]].

There are a few things I was sure enough about to put/keep in the article itself, but I do want to double-check:
* <s>Soap made from oil. The bug report is still open but the soap material template seems to be IMPLIES_ANIMAL_KILL regardless of the source lipid, unless I'm misreading it.</s>
** ''Whatever it is, plant soap is okay and tallow soap is not. [[User:Desistance|Desistance]] ([[User talk:Desistance|talk]]) 17:53, 13 January 2023 (UTC)''
* Bee stuff. No IMPLIES_ANIMAL_KILL but I haven't tried to trade them in particular
* Blood. IMPLIES_ANIMAL_KILL and would be very hard to test, mainly on there because I'm pretty sure about it and it's funny
* The glass stuff.
** ''The raw glass/cut glass bug is still there. [[User:Desistance|Desistance]] ([[User talk:Desistance|talk]]) 17:53, 13 January 2023 (UTC)''
* <s>Eggs. IMPLIES_ANIMAL_KILL but I haven't tested it</s>
** ''Eggs get bounced [[User:Desistance|Desistance]] ([[User talk:Desistance|talk]]) 01:14, 17 January 2023 (UTC)''
* <s>Is charcoal actually offensive? I've never really tried to sell my precious, precious fuel</s>
** ''Yes, as is ash lol [[User:Desistance|Desistance]] ([[User talk:Desistance|talk]]) 16:59, 13 January 2023 (UTC)''

Stuff that might be questionable but I've tested myself:
* Ash glaze bug is still there.

Ideally a [[Template:Mod]] section with a full rundown of what makes an item offensive to elves would be also helpful, but it's a bit beyond my depth. I assume items with IMPLIES_ANIMAL_KILL are not okay, and any item tagged as grown is always okay even if it would otherwise be unacceptable, but I don't know how the tree taboo works, or how grown items are flagged. This would be cool to have but I don't know enough about the internal workings to write it. [[User:Desistance|Desistance]] ([[User talk:Desistance|talk]]) 04:20, 10 January 2023 (UTC)