Editing 40d Talk:Engraving

==Smoothing/engraving vs re-walling==

I started a general page on engraving, mostly to point out that it appears possible to smooth tiles containing ore, since they have been placed in the category of stone now.  Haven't tried it on gems, but I'm quite giddy about being able to make an aesthetically pleasing fortress in the middle of an ore vein finally.

:Yes, ore is now exactly the same as regular stone, so it can be smoothed just fine. Make for MUCH nicer fort designs then before. I am not 100% sure but I think gems work the same way too. --[[User:BurnedToast|BurnedToast]] 03:49, 30 October 2007 (EDT)
::(For more recent readers, yes, confirmed, they do.)--[[User:Albedo|Albedo]] 08:32, 3 September 2009 (UTC)

Note also that rewalling allows for even more aesthetic possibility. And you can extract the ore or gem from a wall and then rebuild it with less useful material.
:Except you can't engrave rewalls. --[[User:Squirrelloid|Squirrelloid]] 17:10, 24 April 2008 (EDT)

::Actually, you can - I did it accidentally when I was smoothing out a plateau for one of my round towers (the fort was called that, might as well put some round towers in :P).  Also added in a channel and they did their job before the lazy engraver could haul his arse to do his.  In time, I put up a rewall and came back later to find the top of my rewall engraved with blazing suns, dwarves etc.  Kinda confused me when I first saw it tho --[[User:Frostedfire|Frostedfire]] 09:57, 25 April 2008 (EDT)
:::Did you construct these rewalls on top of an engraved floor? That gives the walls the appearance of engraving, but I don't know if it counts as an engraved wall for room value purposes. --[[User:zombiejustice|zombiejustice]] 00:41 2 June 2008 (CDT)

I hit {{K|k}} and everything, looked at my wall, and all it said was "Detailed Obsidian Wall." It doesn't work when I make the walls look like regular walls with lines on them or when I make them have the funky little symbols. My fortress is quite young, but I heard that the engraver can just use his imagination and stuff. What's wrong? --[[User:Penguinofhonor|Penguinofhonor]] 19:55, 14 November 2007 (EST)
:Hit {{K|k}} and then hit {{K|Enter}}.

:::as of the latest build you cannot engrave a built wall --[[User:Loganis|Loganis]] 22:31, 27 October 2009 (UTC)

==stone types & happiness?==
Does the type of stone affect Dwarf happiness? Are they happier if their room contains a golden engraved wall? Or even a granite one? And what about the floor? I've just cleaned out a gold vein and I'm thinking about rewalling it into a dinning hall to take advantage of the gold floor. --[[User:Malenfant|Malenfant]] 11:34, 26 November 2007 (EST)
:[http://www.bay12games.com/cgi-local/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic&f=2&t=000691 Draxxalon's study] suggests that the stone does have an effect. --[[User:Kingzilla|Kingzilla]] 22:24, 12 December 2007 (EST)

==room value?==
I'm doing a little studying on the architecture value of smoothing/engraving for the current tournament.  As far as I can tell, a smoothed wall is worth 8 monies, a smoothed floor is worth 6 monies, and the base value of an engraving is 10 (so an *engraving* is worth 40).  The value *DOES NOT* depend on the type of stone, you get the same bonuses even if you smooth/engrave ore.  And of course while engravings do have quality, smoothing does not. --[[User:Sowelu|Sowelu]] 17:20, 12 April 2008 (EDT)

:At one point I noticed a tiny room had an astronomical rent value - turns out the walls were native aluminum (that the game never announced for some reason, and i'd smoothed them without noticing).  I mined out the ore and rewalled and the rent dropped substantially.  So I'd say ore value matters quite a bit, at least for walls --[[User:Squirrelloid|Squirrelloid]] 17:10, 24 April 2008 (EDT)

::Had same thing but with gem floor. About 5 tiles of some x10 value gem floor increased rent from ~2300 (minor noble room) to ~8000. --[[User:Someone-else|Someone-else]] 15:10, 25 April 2008 (EDT)

== Quality engravings tell more history ==

When I had my dwarves engrave the history in my story I wrote earlier, they weren't very skilled at engraving. Though my entire fortress had been burnt up by spirits of fire and attacked by goblins a couple years back, only two of thirty engravings depicted a demon and had a story along with it. There were about thirty engravings done, and only three were well-crafted. The three well-crafted included the two about demons, and one that had a fact about my mayor being elected in 1051. The rest, which were normal quality were of pointless designs and creatures never encountered. Quality plays a major role in what is shown in the engraving. I'll add a section about this, does someone know if higher qualities like masterful depict even more?--[[User:Richards|Richards]] 16:51, 24 April 2008 (EDT)
:I have no desire to savescum and abandon, but I do find that generic dwarf enrgavings tend to be less quality. --[[User:GreyMario|GreyMario]] 17:10, 24 April 2008 (EDT)
::I checked it out a few times, there's no difference in the history of masterful engravings then there were in well-crafted ones. The only exception is unskillful engravings, they don't tell anything. So it's confirmed then. --[[User:Richards|Richards]] 08:42, 25 April 2008 (EDT)

== Types of stone ==
I'm pressing {{K|d}} then {{K|e}} and selecting an area, then pressing {{K|Enter}}. But it's not seeming to do anything in most bits of my fortress. (I find this with smoothing as well.) Could this be because they're mudstone? Does engraving only work in certain types of rock? It'd be good to clarify this somewhere. --[[User:AlexChurchill|AlexChurchill]] 08:28, 29 May 2008 (EDT)

alex: you need to smooth the surface first. currently any stone surface can be engraved. first you smooth it from a rough stone surface with {{k|d}} then {{k|s}} first, then designate it for engraving after it is nice and flat. confused me on my very first fort also. --[[User:FruityBix|FruityBix]] 05:45, 20 September 2008 (EDT)

== Engraving Constructed Walls ==

Why can't constructed walls/floors be designated for engraving? Has Toady said anything specific about this, or is it just something we have to deal with? --[[User:Rakankou|Rakankou]] 00:15, 25 July 2008 (EDT)
:Have you tried smoothing them first? I think they have to be smoothed first, they also must be made out of stone. [[User:Magikarcher|Magikarcher]] 02:13, 25 July 2008 (EDT)
::Constructed walls also can't be designated for smoothing. --[[User:Rakankou|Rakankou]] 03:39, 25 July 2008 (EDT)
I have just had dwarves engrave the floor tile made by the tops of some constructed walls.  The engravers were originally ordered to engrave the natural stone walls there, but they were removed before the engravers arrived to make way for a waterfall.  When they came, they engraved the floor tile made by the constructed wall on the z-level below.--[[User:Odul|Odul]] 04:43, 20 August 2009 (UTC)
:Suddenly, I am hugely confused.  The walls beneath the engravings were removed, and now there are engravings on open space.*makes backup*--[[User:Odul|Odul]] 05:10, 20 August 2009 (UTC)

== Toggled engravings differentiation ==

I noticed in a previous fort (in a previous version) that engraved walls, once I'd toggled off their display, were a different shade to the ones that had only been smoothed. I believe it was smoothed basalt (dark grey), and the engravings were lighter - either mid-grey or white. Can anyone confirm? --[[User:Raumkraut|Raumkraut]] 09:15, 16 August 2008 (EDT)
:Yes, I've seen the same thing.  Smoothed and Engraved got the same tile, some foreground, different background.  Smoothed siltstone was dark brown on black, and hidden-engravings on siltstone was dark brown on grey -- the same grey background as the non-hidden engravings got. --[[User:Sev|Sev]] 03:21, 27 August 2008 (EDT)

== About Defacement ==

Will defacing an *engraved wall* or an =engraved wall= annoy the engraver?  I have an enormous legendary dining room that I want to make even more legendary by adding a pair of waterfalls, but I don't want to piss off any of my engravers.--[[User:Gandalf the Dwarf (No, really! Look it up!)|Gandalf the Dwarf (No, really! Look it up!)]] 17:10, 13 November 2008 (EST)

:Only defacing masterpieces (☼) will cause negative thoughts.--[[User:Maximus|Maximus]] 17:38, 13 November 2008 (EST)

:: Somehow I think the values for negative thoughts for defacing engravings is wrong, actually. I defaced, in the course of a season, roughly 30 masterpieces (legendary +5 engravers can get DAMN annoying when it comes to where you can build) and he never dipped below ecstatic. He hadn't created an artifact (or been freed) recently, and I don 't think much else should be able to reconcile a supposed 1500 negative thoughts. [[User:Milskidasith|Milskidasith]] 22:12, 13 November 2008 (EST)

:::From what I've read elsewhere, the defacement penalty is 1000 divided by the total number of masterpieces created by that dwarf.  So if your legendary dwarf has engraved a thousand or more tiles, he'll have made hundreds of masterpieces and the "travesty" over each will only be a few points.--[[User:Maximus|Maximus]] 21:58, 13 November 2008 (EST)

::::I coulda sworn it was 50 per masterpiece... Ah well. Thanks for the tip. [[User:Milskidasith|Milskidasith]] 22:12, 13 November 2008 (EST)
:::::Maximus is right, for what it's worth.  Just a few days ago I inadvertantly told my miners to deface 5 masterpieces of one of my legendary engravers.  He'd been with my fortress for many years (i think 5) and had hit legendary about 3 years prior.  He's definitely engraved over 100 masterpieces; it may be 250 or more, really.  The engraver barely noticed the 5 defacements.  He was still ecstatic when I checked him, just chilling out in the statue garden and chatting with a friend.  --[[User:ThunderClaw|ThunderClaw]] 00:45, 14 November 2008 (EST)

== Goblins can destroy engravings? ==

:''A masterful engraving that is destroyed or defaced (mining, magma, tower caps and goblins do the job nicely...''

News to me.--[[User:Maximus|Maximus]] 13:44, 14 November 2008 (EST)

== Engraving under siege ==

I assume that these battles depicted are actually over, but the whole siege isn't. So it will show, for example, Urist Thunderfist striking down Flowers Treesunshine, the Elf. Which has already happened, but it won't show, for example, Urist Thunderfist striking down Violet Lovefest, the Elf. Which hasn't happened, but is going to happen. So really, engraving under siege doesn't engrave any different than engraving after any other battles. Unless it does actually do the latter. [[User:Shardok|Shardok]] 19:58, 6 August 2009 (UTC)
:That particular bit of information was added a few months ago by Eerr([[User talk:Eerr|Talk]]) and was cut out without any verifying, I thought it was interesting so I added it back in. Feel free to change any wording you think is deceptive to what you know is true.--[[User:Richards|Richards]] 20:08, 6 August 2009 (UTC)

== Snow-covered Open Space ==

I dug a Pillar out of the mountain and detailed it. After it collapsed during a cave-in the place where the floor on the top was before, now was detailed open space. Still showing the same engraving as before but in blueish color.
[[User:Voenix|Voenix]] 13:27, 9 August 2009 (UTC)

==Vandalism==

I've had many miners beat/arrested for "Vandalism" after having had my miners remove engravings that I decided I didn't want there because I wanted to continue building past them. Unless you have a better reason for why these miners were suddenly listed as needing to be beat/arrested for "Vandalism" after they destroyed the walls I think that's pretty well verifiable.[[User:Shardok|Shardok]] 21:43, 10 August 2009 (UTC)
:I agree, but do they get punished for words that are less than masterwork quality?--[[User:Richards|Richards]] 21:49, 10 August 2009 (UTC)
::My miners never get punished, no matter how many masterful engravings they deface. I have Justice in full effect. --[[User:Overspeculated|Overspeculated]] 19:29, 26 October 2009 (UTC)

== How is history made? ==

I don't get what causes dwarves to write what. This one masterwork really irked me. It says...

<blockquote>
Engraved on the wall is an exceptionally designed image of a orc by Kosoth Etagkubuk. The orc is falling.
</blockquote>

This seems pretty standard, but there is a 20-Z pit in my fortress that has collected about 5 army's worth of dismembered-from-impact orcs. Is this where the dwarf got his inspiration? --[[User:Iban|Iban]] 21:54, 18 January 2010 (UTC)
:Yes. If you turn on SHOW_ALL_HISTORY_IN_DWARF_MODE in init.txt, you'll be able to see exactly '''which''' orc is being depicted in the engraving and when it died, though since orcs don't have names, it'll probably come out something like "Engraved on the wall is an exceptionally designed image of the orc by Kosoth Etagkubuk. Is falling. The artwork relates to the collision of the orc with an obstacle in [fortress name] in the [season] of [year]." --[[User:Quietust|Quietust]] 01:34, 19 January 2010 (UTC)
::That's very awesome. Thanks man. --[[User:Iban|Iban]] 02:59, 19 January 2010 (UTC)

== D for Dwarf ==

Hey, it's an anonymous poster, but call me ungulateman. I've added a D for Dwarf section at the bottom of the page, since the image of dwarves using their beards as some sort of steel wool or cloth amuses me.

Thoughts? Remove it? [[Special:Contributions/124.149.75.198|124.149.75.198]] 10:10, 2 February 2010 (UTC)

:Sounds about right to me -- [[User:Melek|Melek]] 06:34, 3 February 2010 (UTC)
@@ Line 27: / Line 27: @@
 ::Had same thing but with gem floor. About 5 tiles of some x10 value gem floor increased rent from ~2300 (minor noble room) to ~8000. --[[User:Someone-else|Someone-else]] 15:10, 25 April 2008 (EDT)
-:I noticed that sometimes engraving does not count material multiplier, notably engravings on limonite do not have x8 to them. Engraving on gold nuggets wall in the same fortress had proper x30 though. Would be great to check if there is a rule about it or is it some random bug? --[[User:Elfy|Elfy]] 01:57, 5 March 2010 (UTC)
 == Quality engravings tell more history ==
@@ Line 66: / Line 64: @@
 ::::I coulda sworn it was 50 per masterpiece... Ah well. Thanks for the tip. [[User:Milskidasith|Milskidasith]] 22:12, 13 November 2008 (EST)
 :::::Maximus is right, for what it's worth.  Just a few days ago I inadvertantly told my miners to deface 5 masterpieces of one of my legendary engravers.  He'd been with my fortress for many years (i think 5) and had hit legendary about 3 years prior.  He's definitely engraved over 100 masterpieces; it may be 250 or more, really.  The engraver barely noticed the 5 defacements.  He was still ecstatic when I checked him, just chilling out in the statue garden and chatting with a friend.  --[[User:ThunderClaw|ThunderClaw]] 00:45, 14 November 2008 (EST)
-I just had my lengendary carpenter go on a tantrum from a single chair being destroyed, I'm unsure on the number of Masterful peices made but 1 chair tipped him over to very unhappy.  He's been tantruming now for two seasons.  --Nordak 29 Oct 2010
 == Goblins can destroy engravings? ==
@@ Line 110: / Line 106: @@
 :Sounds about right to me -- [[User:Melek|Melek]] 06:34, 3 February 2010 (UTC)
-:Okay then, I actually made a solid submission to the wiki! :o [[Special:Contributions/124.149.56.27|124.149.56.27]] 05:33, 4 February 2010 (UTC)
-== water destroying engravings? ==
-Is there any difference between what muddy water will do to an engraving and what clean water will?
-I've noticed that in my current fort, water from a pump leak didn't seem to damage engravings, but water from a brook flood error did. Did I just get lucky with the pump leak, or is pumped water engraving-safe?
-== Two-sided engravings? ==
-If it's true that an engraving only affects the side that it happened from, then it really sucks to have two engraved rooms share a wall, or to dare have any west-open walls be marked for engraving.  Is there any way to tell a dwarf to engrave from a specific direction, or to engrave two sides of a wall? --[[User:Aescula|Aescula]] 08:33, 1 March 2010 (UTC)