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Difference between revisions of "40d Talk:World generation"

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m (my experience with the batch file)
 
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If you guys can think of anything to add to this, let me know. [[User:Schm0|Schm0]] 19:58, 30 October 2007 (EDT)
 
If you guys can think of anything to add to this, let me know. [[User:Schm0|Schm0]] 19:58, 30 October 2007 (EDT)
 +
 +
:I would suggest changing the region numbers to 101-107 etc, as they're unlikely to be already used, and most pregen maps (packs and non-packs) are unlikely to ever use that range either. --[[User:N9103|Edward]] 23:01, 3 January 2008 (EST)
 +
 +
:Simple, I want a description of what the symbols on the map mean. eg, what does "#" stand for?
 +
 +
::At the bottom of the article you'll see a set of links to other Overworld related pages. [[Map_legend]] is the one you're looking for. --[[User:Janus|Janus]] 03:17, 21 November 2008 (EST)
  
 
Oh yeah, and I can't get the last graphic to show, even though it exists. [[User:Schm0|Schm0]] 20:17, 30 October 2007 (EDT)
 
Oh yeah, and I can't get the last graphic to show, even though it exists. [[User:Schm0|Schm0]] 20:17, 30 October 2007 (EDT)
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::I just tried this without the "start /wait" part, and it didn't work for me (Win XP SP1) - it generates only one map, then stops. Leave the code as it is.--[[User:Siliziumleben|Siliziumleben]] 21:32, 2 January 2008 (EST)
 
::I just tried this without the "start /wait" part, and it didn't work for me (Win XP SP1) - it generates only one map, then stops. Leave the code as it is.--[[User:Siliziumleben|Siliziumleben]] 21:32, 2 January 2008 (EST)
 +
 +
::Like it more this way. If you'll have any problems with 'wait's, just add it.--[[User:Dorten|Dorten]] 01:42, 11 January 2008 (EST)
  
 
i dont get seeds.. sure theyre not random... but what do they do? a list of different seeds and what they create? [[User:Twiggie|Twiggie]] 10:16, 5 December 2007 (EST)
 
i dont get seeds.. sure theyre not random... but what do they do? a list of different seeds and what they create? [[User:Twiggie|Twiggie]] 10:16, 5 December 2007 (EST)
Line 22: Line 30:
 
seeds define the world that is generated; unless you want a world that somebody else has generated, then using the 'random seed' option will give you a more-or-less random map, (don't be confused by all the pseudorandom stuff, it's random enough -_-) well, I doubt anybody has a list of pregenerated worlds and their seeds, but I think it'd be better to create your own. There'll be areas with low difficulty and areas with high difficulty, so there's no problem there.
 
seeds define the world that is generated; unless you want a world that somebody else has generated, then using the 'random seed' option will give you a more-or-less random map, (don't be confused by all the pseudorandom stuff, it's random enough -_-) well, I doubt anybody has a list of pregenerated worlds and their seeds, but I think it'd be better to create your own. There'll be areas with low difficulty and areas with high difficulty, so there's no problem there.
 
[[User:Jc100|Jc100]] 06:18, 12 December 2007 (EST)
 
[[User:Jc100|Jc100]] 06:18, 12 December 2007 (EST)
 +
 +
On random seeds... It is very difficult to make a number that is truly random on a computer.  Instead of doing something like hooking up a Geiger counter and a source[http://www.imagesco.com/geiger/geiger-counter-kits.html#rngad] to generate a pseudo random number, you pick a starting point - a seed.  You can run this number through a function[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mersenne_twister] and get another number.  This new number is returned and used in the next iteration.  This is a pseudo random number sequence[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pseudorandom_number_generator].  One of the things that is useful about a pseudo random number sequence is that it is deterministic - if you start with the same seed, you will get the same random numbers.  Thus, when you use the seed someone has provided, you will get the same world generated. --[[User:Shagie|Shagie]] 17:26, 29 February 2008 (EST)
 +
 +
[[Image:Pocket example.png]]<br />
 +
With v0.27.176.38c, in world generation you can now select the size of the world.  For example - a pocket world (above) - thats it, thats the whole thing. --[[User:Shagie|Shagie]] 17:26, 29 February 2008 (EST)
 +
:On the topic of updating this, I've gone through and done so. We might need a new page for all the advanced options, though. [[User:Masterful|Masterful]] 03:26, 15 July 2008 (EST)
 +
:Yeh this page needs some updating for v0.27.176.38c. What seed did you use to generate that Shagie? All pocket worlds I generate have 10,000's of rejects and I give up. [[User:Yvain|Yvain]] 03:07, 21 March 2008 (EDT)
 +
::Hmm seems some options I changed meant I couldn't generate pocket worlds. It worked fine with a fresh copy so I'll have to check what exact changes I had made which prevented it. [[User:Yvain|Yvain]] 03:52, 21 March 2008 (EDT)
 +
 +
== What do they mean ==
 +
 +
What do the options mean specifically? How does percentage of beasts dead before stoppage effect my game world, how does changing the elevation by 1 or 10 or 100 effect the generation process. What do I do to get more rivers or less mountains. Something more detailed than taking a dictionary to a screen would be helpful. Consider that new gamers who know nothing about anything related except Tolkien might be looking at this and trying to figure it out. What versions brought in what features? Etc.
 +
Forgot me tag --[[User:Lowlandlord|Lowlandlord]] 01:37, 31 July 2008 (EDT)
 +
 +
== Who is Toady referencing in the interview? ==
 +
 +
I think there's an ever so slight possibility that he means me. I'm...not sure though, and it's not likely, but it feels nice to know there's a possibility.
 +
 +
At its most complex, running Dwarf Fortress is like having an ant farm. You look in, and these little bearded guys are roaming all around, each with his own agenda. It's fascinating to watch for its own sake.
 +
 +
TA: Somebody modded their dwarves into antmen [laughs]. I even have a few people that went as far as donating, and they don't even play. They just like to check out the stories.
 +
 +
I wonder...
 +
 +
 +
== Disadvantages? ==
 +
Are there disadvantages or even any effects of picking a smaller size world? what does it mean that world history is shorter? --[[User:Confused|Confused]] 02:00, 23 June 2009 (UTC)
 +
: Smaller world means less special spots, less spots to choose on embark. Less civilization, etc. If you play in adventure mode, you will have less place to visit too. For the History... I don't know. --[[User:Karl|Karl]] 02:07, 23 June 2009 (UTC)
 +
::Quick answer :) So.. less civ - that might influence immigrants and invaders? and you might have less dwarf civs to pick from.. --[[User:Confused|Confused]] 02:13, 23 June 2009 (UTC)
 +
 +
== Examples ==
 +
 +
Here's an intresting example of what you can do with by editing files. Not created by me but by Eduren on the Cracked forums.
 +
 +
<pre>
 +
[WORLD_GEN]
 +
[TITLE:VULCN]
 +
[DIM:129:257]
 +
[END_YEAR:1500]
 +
[BEAST_END_YEAR:400:70]
 +
[REVEAL_ALL_HISTORY:1]
 +
[CULL_HISTORICAL_FIGURES:1]
 +
[ELEVATION:1:400:401:800]
 +
[RAINFALL:0:100:200:400]
 +
[TEMPERATURE:25:75:200:400]
 +
[DRAINAGE:0:100:200:400]
 +
[VOLCANISM:35:100:200:400]
 +
[SAVAGERY:0:100:200:400]
 +
[ELEVATION_FREQUENCY:1:1:1:1:1:1]
 +
[RAIN_FREQUENCY:1:1:1:1:1:1]
 +
[DRAINAGE_FREQUENCY:1:1:1:1:1:1]
 +
[TEMPERATURE_FREQUENCY:1:1:1:1:1:1]
 +
[SAVAGERY_FREQUENCY:1:1:1:1:1:1]
 +
[VOLCANISM_FREQUENCY:1:1:1:1:1:1]
 +
[GOOD_SQ_COUNTS:50:501:1003]
 +
[EVIL_SQ_COUNTS:50:501:1003]
 +
[PEAK_NUMBER_MIN:25]
 +
[OCEAN_EDGE_MIN:1]
 +
[VOLCANO_MIN:12]
 +
[REGION_COUNTS:SWAMP:518:3:3]
 +
[REGION_COUNTS:DESERT:518:3:3]
 +
[REGION_COUNTS:FOREST:2072:6:6]
 +
[REGION_COUNTS:MOUNTAINS:4144:4:4]
 +
[REGION_COUNTS:OCEAN:4144:3:3]
 +
[REGION_COUNTS:GLACIER:0:0:0]
 +
[REGION_COUNTS:TUNDRA:0:0:0]
 +
[REGION_COUNTS:GRASSLAND:4144:6:6]
 +
[REGION_COUNTS:HILLS:4144:6:6]
 +
[EROSION_CYCLE_COUNT:250]
 +
[RIVER_MINS:200:200]
 +
[PERIODICALLY_ERODE_EXTREMES:1]
 +
[OROGRAPHIC_PRECIPITATION:1]
 +
[SUBREGION_MAX:2750]
 +
[CAVE_MIN_SIZE:5]
 +
[CAVE_MAX_SIZE:25]
 +
[MOUNTAIN_CAVE_MIN:50]
 +
[NON_MOUNTAIN_CAVE_MIN:115]
 +
[ALL_CAVES_VISIBLE:0]
 +
[SHOW_EMBARK_RIVER:2]
 +
[SHOW_EMBARK_POOL:2]
 +
[SHOW_EMBARK_M_POOL:2]
 +
[SHOW_EMBARK_M_PIPE:2]
 +
[SHOW_EMBARK_CHASM:2]
 +
[SHOW_EMBARK_PIT:2]
 +
[SHOW_EMBARK_OTHER:2]
 +
[SHOW_EMBARK_TUNNEL:2]
 +
[TOTAL_CIV_NUMBER:20]
 +
[TOTAL_CIV_POPULATION:20000]
 +
[PLAYABLE_CIVILIZATION_REQUIRED:1]
 +
[ELEVATION_RANGES:4144:8288:4144]
 +
[RAIN_RANGES:4144:8288:4144]
 +
[DRAINAGE_RANGES:4144:8288:4144]
 +
[SAVAGERY_RANGES:4144:8288:4144]
 +
[VOLCANISM_RANGES:0:0:0]
 +
</pre>
 +
 +
Incase you can tell its a world with more volcaninc activity for all you magma overating whores. Anyways add this to the ened of your data\init\world_gen.txt. Then to create new world with parameters, then go to VULCN and it will rejecft a few 100 worlds before showing and error message. Press ignore this problem even if I end up with a legends only world! Thats all have fun with your magmas :D (Note: Changed VOLCANISM_RANGES to 0:0:0 to avoid rejects.)
 +
 +
 +
Feel free to post anymore examples.
 +
 +
==d40 links==
 +
The template usage <nowiki>{{L|#Title|Title}}</nowiki> doesn't seem to work as intended. [[Special:Contributions/213.100.120.132|213.100.120.132]] 14:49, 13 April 2010 (UTC)
 +
:For links within the page itself, it is sufficient to simply use <nowiki>[[#Title|Title]]</nowiki> - <nowiki>{{L}}</nowiki> should only be used if it's going to a '''different page''' within the same namespace. --[[User:Quietust|Quietust]] 14:53, 13 April 2010 (UTC)
 +
::...and now it shouldn't be used ''at all'', since it's now built into the wiki itself. --[[User:Quietust|Quietust]] 17:43, 8 December 2011 (UTC)

Latest revision as of 17:43, 8 December 2011

If you guys can think of anything to add to this, let me know. Schm0 19:58, 30 October 2007 (EDT)

I would suggest changing the region numbers to 101-107 etc, as they're unlikely to be already used, and most pregen maps (packs and non-packs) are unlikely to ever use that range either. --Edward 23:01, 3 January 2008 (EST)
Simple, I want a description of what the symbols on the map mean. eg, what does "#" stand for?
At the bottom of the article you'll see a set of links to other Overworld related pages. Map_legend is the one you're looking for. --Janus 03:17, 21 November 2008 (EST)

Oh yeah, and I can't get the last graphic to show, even though it exists. Schm0 20:17, 30 October 2007 (EDT)

It took me *way* too long to figure out, but I know why the last picture isnt showing. It has "ad" in the URL, and you are using AdBlock.

Thank you, anonymous. :)

From my own little experiments, it looks like the /wait commands aren't needed. There may be a difference in OS here, but under Windows XP Home SP2, I can create a .bat file with

dwarfort.exe -gen 1

dwarfort.exe -gen 2

right after the other. When one creation ends, the window closes and the next begins. The two [RANDOM]s aren't required, either. If the .bat is in the same folder as your executable, you don't have to go through the whole "C:\df\whatever" tree, either. Mephisto 16:08, 9 November 2007 (EST)

Well, like I said, it's for you to use or modify if necessary. I know that it will be compatible on all copies of XP and beyond... I don't care to bother and check what version of XP I have, but the batch program will not function correctly unless I use the /wait commands. Obviously you wouldn't need to include the directory of the files, unless you ran it from the desktop. Some good observations, nonetheless. Schm0 22:15, 5 December 2007 (EST)
I just tried this without the "start /wait" part, and it didn't work for me (Win XP SP1) - it generates only one map, then stops. Leave the code as it is.--Siliziumleben 21:32, 2 January 2008 (EST)
Like it more this way. If you'll have any problems with 'wait's, just add it.--Dorten 01:42, 11 January 2008 (EST)

i dont get seeds.. sure theyre not random... but what do they do? a list of different seeds and what they create? Twiggie 10:16, 5 December 2007 (EST)

seeds define the world that is generated; unless you want a world that somebody else has generated, then using the 'random seed' option will give you a more-or-less random map, (don't be confused by all the pseudorandom stuff, it's random enough -_-) well, I doubt anybody has a list of pregenerated worlds and their seeds, but I think it'd be better to create your own. There'll be areas with low difficulty and areas with high difficulty, so there's no problem there. Jc100 06:18, 12 December 2007 (EST)

On random seeds... It is very difficult to make a number that is truly random on a computer. Instead of doing something like hooking up a Geiger counter and a source[1] to generate a pseudo random number, you pick a starting point - a seed. You can run this number through a function[2] and get another number. This new number is returned and used in the next iteration. This is a pseudo random number sequence[3]. One of the things that is useful about a pseudo random number sequence is that it is deterministic - if you start with the same seed, you will get the same random numbers. Thus, when you use the seed someone has provided, you will get the same world generated. --Shagie 17:26, 29 February 2008 (EST)

Pocket example.png
With v0.27.176.38c, in world generation you can now select the size of the world. For example - a pocket world (above) - thats it, thats the whole thing. --Shagie 17:26, 29 February 2008 (EST)

On the topic of updating this, I've gone through and done so. We might need a new page for all the advanced options, though. Masterful 03:26, 15 July 2008 (EST)
Yeh this page needs some updating for v0.27.176.38c. What seed did you use to generate that Shagie? All pocket worlds I generate have 10,000's of rejects and I give up. Yvain 03:07, 21 March 2008 (EDT)
Hmm seems some options I changed meant I couldn't generate pocket worlds. It worked fine with a fresh copy so I'll have to check what exact changes I had made which prevented it. Yvain 03:52, 21 March 2008 (EDT)

What do they mean[edit]

What do the options mean specifically? How does percentage of beasts dead before stoppage effect my game world, how does changing the elevation by 1 or 10 or 100 effect the generation process. What do I do to get more rivers or less mountains. Something more detailed than taking a dictionary to a screen would be helpful. Consider that new gamers who know nothing about anything related except Tolkien might be looking at this and trying to figure it out. What versions brought in what features? Etc. Forgot me tag --Lowlandlord 01:37, 31 July 2008 (EDT)

Who is Toady referencing in the interview?[edit]

I think there's an ever so slight possibility that he means me. I'm...not sure though, and it's not likely, but it feels nice to know there's a possibility. 

At its most complex, running Dwarf Fortress is like having an ant farm. You look in, and these little bearded guys are roaming all around, each with his own agenda. It's fascinating to watch for its own sake.

TA: Somebody modded their dwarves into antmen [laughs]. I even have a few people that went as far as donating, and they don't even play. They just like to check out the stories.

I wonder...


Disadvantages?[edit]

Are there disadvantages or even any effects of picking a smaller size world? what does it mean that world history is shorter? --Confused 02:00, 23 June 2009 (UTC)

Smaller world means less special spots, less spots to choose on embark. Less civilization, etc. If you play in adventure mode, you will have less place to visit too. For the History... I don't know. --Karl 02:07, 23 June 2009 (UTC)
Quick answer :) So.. less civ - that might influence immigrants and invaders? and you might have less dwarf civs to pick from.. --Confused 02:13, 23 June 2009 (UTC)

Examples[edit]

Here's an intresting example of what you can do with by editing files. Not created by me but by Eduren on the Cracked forums. 

[WORLD_GEN]
	[TITLE:VULCN]
	[DIM:129:257]
	[END_YEAR:1500]
	[BEAST_END_YEAR:400:70]
	[REVEAL_ALL_HISTORY:1]
	[CULL_HISTORICAL_FIGURES:1]
	[ELEVATION:1:400:401:800]
	[RAINFALL:0:100:200:400]
	[TEMPERATURE:25:75:200:400]
	[DRAINAGE:0:100:200:400]
	[VOLCANISM:35:100:200:400]
	[SAVAGERY:0:100:200:400]
	[ELEVATION_FREQUENCY:1:1:1:1:1:1]
	[RAIN_FREQUENCY:1:1:1:1:1:1]
	[DRAINAGE_FREQUENCY:1:1:1:1:1:1]
	[TEMPERATURE_FREQUENCY:1:1:1:1:1:1]
	[SAVAGERY_FREQUENCY:1:1:1:1:1:1]
	[VOLCANISM_FREQUENCY:1:1:1:1:1:1]
	[GOOD_SQ_COUNTS:50:501:1003]
	[EVIL_SQ_COUNTS:50:501:1003]
	[PEAK_NUMBER_MIN:25]
	[OCEAN_EDGE_MIN:1]
	[VOLCANO_MIN:12]
	[REGION_COUNTS:SWAMP:518:3:3]
	[REGION_COUNTS:DESERT:518:3:3]
	[REGION_COUNTS:FOREST:2072:6:6]
	[REGION_COUNTS:MOUNTAINS:4144:4:4]
	[REGION_COUNTS:OCEAN:4144:3:3]
	[REGION_COUNTS:GLACIER:0:0:0]
	[REGION_COUNTS:TUNDRA:0:0:0]
	[REGION_COUNTS:GRASSLAND:4144:6:6]
	[REGION_COUNTS:HILLS:4144:6:6]
	[EROSION_CYCLE_COUNT:250]
	[RIVER_MINS:200:200]
	[PERIODICALLY_ERODE_EXTREMES:1]
	[OROGRAPHIC_PRECIPITATION:1]
	[SUBREGION_MAX:2750]
	[CAVE_MIN_SIZE:5]
	[CAVE_MAX_SIZE:25]
	[MOUNTAIN_CAVE_MIN:50]
	[NON_MOUNTAIN_CAVE_MIN:115]
	[ALL_CAVES_VISIBLE:0]
	[SHOW_EMBARK_RIVER:2]
	[SHOW_EMBARK_POOL:2]
	[SHOW_EMBARK_M_POOL:2]
	[SHOW_EMBARK_M_PIPE:2]
	[SHOW_EMBARK_CHASM:2]
	[SHOW_EMBARK_PIT:2]
	[SHOW_EMBARK_OTHER:2]
	[SHOW_EMBARK_TUNNEL:2]
	[TOTAL_CIV_NUMBER:20]
	[TOTAL_CIV_POPULATION:20000]
	[PLAYABLE_CIVILIZATION_REQUIRED:1]
	[ELEVATION_RANGES:4144:8288:4144]
	[RAIN_RANGES:4144:8288:4144]
	[DRAINAGE_RANGES:4144:8288:4144]
	[SAVAGERY_RANGES:4144:8288:4144]
	[VOLCANISM_RANGES:0:0:0]

Incase you can tell its a world with more volcaninc activity for all you magma overating whores. Anyways add this to the ened of your data\init\world_gen.txt. Then to create new world with parameters, then go to VULCN and it will rejecft a few 100 worlds before showing and error message. Press ignore this problem even if I end up with a legends only world! Thats all have fun with your magmas :D (Note: Changed VOLCANISM_RANGES to 0:0:0 to avoid rejects.)


Feel free to post anymore examples.

d40 links[edit]

The template usage {{L|#Title|Title}} doesn't seem to work as intended. 213.100.120.132 14:49, 13 April 2010 (UTC)

For links within the page itself, it is sufficient to simply use [[#Title|Title]] - {{L}} should only be used if it's going to a different page within the same namespace. --Quietust 14:53, 13 April 2010 (UTC)
...and now it shouldn't be used at all, since it's now built into the wiki itself. --Quietust 17:43, 8 December 2011 (UTC)
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