Dwarf Fortress Wiki talk:Community Portal

Use this discussion page to talk about any issues or ideas you have about the direction of this wiki. The community portal is a hub for directing our conciousness. Read the rules carefully, take them to heart, post here if you have any questions or you think the rules can be improved.

Account Problems

I can't log in, but it says my username is already in use. --64.22.68.4 14:55, 29 October 2007 (EDT) (Peristarkawan)

Are you sure? The new wiki cleaned out all the old accounts so you have to reregister. --Hamelin 15:02, 29 October 2007 (EDT)

Unfortunately, I was unable to import all the user accounts, please recreate. --Senso 15:22, 29 October 2007 (EDT)

AdBlock

Could you move all the files in the graphics directory with the word "ad" in it? For those using AdBlock or similar add-ons it will block the display of the graphics in those directories. Thanks!!! :) Schm0 10:26, 5 November 2007 (EST)

It doesn't look possible - re-uploading the file keeps putting it in the 'ad' folder and I cannot edit the link in the DB as it is stored inside a BLOB. I suggest you whitelist this site anyways, it's not like you need to block anything here (and blocking /*ad*/ may cause problems elsewhere too). --Senso 10:49, 5 November 2007 (EST)

Rule discussion

A

How do we handle several rules that starts with the same character? I see that titles have been moved to page titles because of timelessness. But what about other scenarios that doesnt have an solution as easy? --Mizipzor 07:51, 5 November 2007 (EST)

We can handle them as they come up. In general, I think it's better practice to avoid reusing letters than to have to rename an existing rule.

If we want to just do away with rule A at this point, that would be fine. It was only meant to be a starting point for brainstorming, and the rules haven't changed much lately. --Peristarkawan 11:21, 5 November 2007 (EST)

I Call for Judgment on this statement, this would remove the backbone rule used to define this alphabetical set of rules. We could put it outside of the rules though, like a description. --Senso 12:24, 5 November 2007 (EST)

Unless we have another rule that must start with A, why not keep it? --Savok 12:28, 5 November 2007 (EST)

I like rule A, it introduces the page, please keep it --Markavian 16:32, 13 November 2007 (EST)

B and E

How are B and E rules? --Savok 11:27, 7 November 2007 (EST)

Rules? I thought the alphabet was the guide for the war against entropy VengefulDonut 11:34, 7 November 2007 (EST)

Well, the Alphabet rule does describe them as rules. But I don't really think that B and E seem out of place. --Peristarkawan 11:37, 7 November 2007 (EST)

They will simply be replaced by "real" rules once someone have made them. --Mizipzor 14:23, 7 November 2007 (EST)

I think of them more as "guidelines" ;) Turgid Bolk 20:22, 7 November 2007 (EST)

I put strikes through B and E and wrote more helpful ones (along the same lines) --Me

Gravitas was a silly word. What do you think of the new rules? --Markavian

Serious Rules

Would it be possible for us to come up with some *real* rules that are more ... serious? --Geofferic 08:59, 10 December 2007 (EST)

The alphabet rules concept is senseless. Maybe remove the fluff? --Jackard 11:09, 10 December 2007 (EST)

Hey now, with a couple of exceptions, the rules are serious. The point of the alphabet framework wasn't random silliness; it was to inspire creativity and make rule-writing fun. It's hard to come up with good rules out of thin air. It's easier to think up a topic of concern that starts with a particular letter and then write a rule about it.

Of course, the rules have been pretty stable for a while now, so rule A hasn't been too useful lately. There was a brief discussion a while back about dropping rule A under DwarfFortressWiki:Community Portal#Rule discussion, and everybody seemed to want to keep it at the time. If you want to reopen that discussion, then I'm okay with either keeping it or dropping it (besides which, I haven't been too active around here lately anyway). --Peristarkawan 11:54, 10 December 2007 (EST)

I support the Alphabet ruleset, I don't see why it should change. It's clean and clear. --Senso 16:56, 10 December 2007 (EST)

It's childish, incomplete, unprofessional and silly. The rules are not grouped logically and there is no table of contents. There's not room for clarification or expounding and little opportunity to expand. It should be scrapped for something that makes sense. --Geofferic 03:25, 12 December 2007 (EST)

It would be trivial to change it from an unordered list to use section headings, which would allow a table of contents and plenty of room for clarification. I don't think "little opportunity to expand" is valid; there's no reason we can't have multiple rules for the same letter, or rules that fall outside the alphabet rubric entirely.

If you want to improve the organization, then just go for it. Let me suggest that you create the new version on a subpage at first, so that others can view two presentations side by side when discussing it. --Peristarkawan 12:06, 12 December 2007 (EST)

While I agree with some of your points, I'd like to say that this is not a "professional" wiki and silliness in general is a good thing. This is a wiki (Internet!) about a game (Haha!) that is pretty silly itself. If you want to create a Whole Complex and Indexed Body of Rules About Everything, go for it and as Peristarkawan said, editors should be able to choose between the two. I just don't see the need. --Senso 14:47, 12 December 2007 (EST)

What's the current system for banning people? Like this jackass here. --Jackard 12:46, 12 December 2007 (EST)

Enforcing consistency in screenshots?

Can I strongly suggest that all screenshots be taken with the default interface and tileset, for consistency's sake? It seems to me like that would be a good way of keeping the wiki aesthetics constant. EighenIndemnis 11:33, 5 November 2007 (EST)

We can make it a rule, but we shouldn't remove any screenshots for non-conformance (except to replace them with conforming screenshots). --Peristarkawan 11:46, 5 November 2007 (EST)

Yeah, for some tutorials that are written while the user is playing, it would be impossible to anyway. EighenIndemnis 11:47, 5 November 2007 (EST)

I agree that images should use the default tileset for articles, but I disagree for personal pages or bloodline games. --Markavian

The rule as written already exempts bloodline games. The only rule that should apply to personal pages is D. --Peristarkawan 16:05, 5 November 2007 (EST)

Um, I added the rule before noticing the discussion here. Anyway, I added rule I, inspired by the old Water wheel image (Image:PerpetualMotion.JPG), which was incomprehesible to me and unnecessarily large. Like Peristarkawan said, the exemption of user pages is implied, but feel free to make it explicit if you want. --Turgid Bolk 16:13, 5 November 2007 (EST)

How about this?

World creation screenshot.

It's clean, neat and doesn't warp the page. :) The obvious drawback is file size is not monitored. Can't we edit the file upload settings to measure pixels? Nothing over 800x600? Schm0 19:16, 7 November 2007 (EST)

Redirects and article titles

How do you do that thing that makes a certain term redirect to a different page? Like Elephants redirecting to Elephant, for example. --BahamutZERO 15:20, 30 October 2007 (EDT)

If Elephants already exists, you can move the page to Elephant, and it will create the redirect for you. Otherwise, just edit Elephants to read: #REDIRECT [[Elephant]] --Peristarkawan 15:26, 30 October 2007 (EDT)

I see, thanks! --BahamutZERO 15:27, 30 October 2007 (EDT)

Just FYI, if at all possible, do not create pages as plurals. Use the following syntax: [[Elephant]]s: example Elephants. --JT 20:20, 31 October 2007 (EDT)

What about titles that are verbs? Should they be in "base-form"? Or whatever its called (my english on this level isnt the best). Example: should the title be Mine or Mining? --Mizipzor 17:30, 31 October 2007 (EDT)

Based on the Wikipedia style, titles should be nouns. So in your example it should be the gerund Mining, and Mine would be the title for an article about mines. I've updated the rule to reflect this. --Peristarkawan 17:35, 31 October 2007 (EDT)

What about skills and professions? Should we have a Bone carving (labor preference) article and a Bone carver (skill) article, or would this be redundant? I've seen both styles linked to, but tend to think that the -ing form should redirect to the -er form. Opinions? --Mechturk 03:11, 5 November 2007 (EST)

Sounds good to me. --Peristarkawan 11:21, 5 November 2007 (EST)

Btw, shouldnt all these comments be moved into talk? --Mizipzor 17:30, 31 October 2007 (EDT)

Moved the account problem comments to the talk page. The rest are informative. --Turgid Bolk 13:26, 1 November 2007 (EDT)

Tutorials

New players are getting bogged down by the complexity at the start of their fortresses, I think we should get some "getting started" or "surviving your first winter" type tutorials up as soon as possible. --BahamutZERO 16:33, 31 October 2007 (EDT)

Getting started will be just that. --Savok 11:31, 2 November 2007 (EDT)

Deletion

We now have a category:deletion, who has the power to delete pages? When are they deleted? Who make the final call? The same person that deletes them? What rules should we make regarding this? --Mizipzor 11:57, 1 November 2007 (EDT)

Anyone can mark a page for deletion using the {{del}} tag, however it is usually recommended to get a consensus that it's not worth keeping. Exceptions are things like spam or empty pages. The {{del}} tag just lets the admin know to delete it, ultimately it's his call to do so or not. Just ask around on the talk page first, if no one disagrees, add the tag. (Disclaimer: that's how it worked on the old wiki, the policy may change as this new wiki grows.) --Turgid Bolk 13:02, 1 November 2007 (EDT)

Water level style

I think we should have a standard style for talking about water level. We could say it various ways, such as "6/7 water," "water with a depth of 6," "a depth of 6 pool," or "water with a depth of six." It seems using the numeral makes it clear that we mean water depth, without adding the /7. --Turgid Bolk 13:02, 1 November 2007 (EDT)

I'm not sure. The /7 is definately unnessessary and that we should use 6 instead of six, maybe create a template to make the numberal blue/red (water/magma)? If not "Water 6" and "Magma 5" seem short, simple, correct, and understandable.--Draco18s 03:27, 2 November 2007 (EDT)

Like 6 / 6 or 6 / 6? --Matryx 05:38, 5 November 2007 (EST)

Too hard to read against the normal white background I think. But just the coloured number on its own would stand out weirdly. --Shades 06:10, 5 November 2007 (EST)

6 / 6 or not even going so far as to use the tile template? --Matryx 06:16, 5 November 2007 (EST)

I think "depth of 7" works wonders, bold, colored text had a bit high contrast according to my taste. In case there is either magma or water, just state it. And we should also link to a waterdepth article for those that are in need of furher explanation of the concept. Example; "a water wheel needs to be placed in flowing water with a depth of at least 3". --Mizipzor 07:44, 5 November 2007 (EST)

Templates?

Is there a page with a list of all the templates available to us? Are all of the templates migrated from the old wiki? --Felix the Cat 00:51, 3 November 2007 (EDT)

You can find a list at Special:Allpages?namespace=10. --Peristarkawan 01:44, 3 November 2007 (EDT)

Forum references

Where there is a bit saying "Toady said this", what is the best way to link to the forum? Currently in magma, I've got a link to http://www.bay12games.com/cgi-local/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic&f=7&t=001504 which shows up as [1] (not too bad). Is there a better way of doing it akin to Wikipedia with <ref>something</ref>? Maybe something like Template:version for future (but that doesn't cover the "this is how it works now" type thing. --Shagie 02:17, 3 November 2007 (EDT)

IIRC the <ref> system on Wikipedia requires an extension to be installed. --Rick 17:48, 7 November 2007 (EST)

Crops categories

My wiki-fu is weak, but surely there is a better way to present the myriad crops than having a different category for each season and biome? Category:Crops could at least show the seasons grouped seperate from the biomes. Are we going to put each plant in its respective biome and seasons, and in Category:Crops, or is List of crops sufficient? Just seems like there's a lot of potential for a mess here, and we need to standardize the plant pages and various categories.

Personally I like the way the old wiki did it, with some nice templates. Granted there are a lot more plants in this version, but not so much that we need 20 subcategories cluttering up the crops category. See Crops and Plump Helmets; easy to tell what crops belong in what season. --Turgid Bolk 02:52, 3 November 2007 (EDT)