40d Talk:Strange mood

Does the new version still have the strange mood? It wouldnt be complete without it!

It still exists, I've had it happen several times now, I went to the archive wiki and copy/pasted the old page.

Isnt that why the wiki was nuked? To make sure that no old info lingers? Ill put some "verify" in there, I dont think that the bold text is enough for users to understand that some of this may no longer apply. --Mizipzor 06:03, 6 November 2007 (EST)

I agree. Although moods themselves don't seem to have been changed in this version, the changes to the stones/ores that they use means that some of the information in this article is no longer true. I'll have a go at cleaning it up when I have the proper time for it, but this wiki definitely needs a 'no copypasting from the archives' rule to avoid screwups like this. If people are going to copypaste old stuff, then it is downright irresponsible of them not to verify the accuracy of the information before committing it to the wiki. --Morlark

I know, I was a huge fan of that little strange aspect of the old one.

I need my dwarfs to make more swordfish bone swords, and i still need some glass weapons/armor

The moods seem to have changed. One of my dwarfs went fey, made a nice hematite mug, and is now a legendary... Engraver. Very wierd, he also had no stoneworking or other craftdwarf skills. But he was a competent mason. This was also my fifth dwarf who took the same craftworkshop, so it's a bit strange. --Soyweiser 17:36, 6 November 2007 (EST)

Six fey dwarf, all took the craftdwarfshop, now my bowyer took one. Think it might be a bug. Is the 15 artifacts limit still in? --Soyweiser 14:34, 8 November 2007 (EST)

Whohoo my second legendary engraver made a gold mug. My bowyer became a legendary engraver. --Soyweiser 14:40, 8 November 2007 (EST)

Scratch all that, one of my woodworkers just used a carpenters shop. --Soyweiser 07:45, 9 November 2007 (EST)

Have you marked all statements in the article that risks being falsified with {{verify}}? --Mizipzor 19:41, 6 November 2007 (EST)

Hey, I am getting a dwarf who wants "raw...crystal". Help? -- Bovinepro

Probably wants raw crystal glass. I had a dwarf ask for "raw...green", they wanted raw green glass. Looks like Toady might have moved the glass demands out of the "rough...color" category. Iddq?

About the engravers taking over craftdwarf's shops and becoming legendary engravers afterwards is quite true. I recently got a bunch of immigrants, and the engraver that came with them fell into a strange mood before even crossing the bridge on my river. He took over a craftdwarf's workshop and made a basalt scepter, and now he's legendary level in engraving. So yeah, perfect laboratory conditions, he was 100% engraver when he went into his mood and came out a legendary engraver. --Zhang5 17:07, 12 November 2007 (EST)

It seems that no craft skill is required. I just had a peasant go into a strange mood. His skills were: competent marksdwarf; novice wrestler; novice armor wearer. He grabbed a craftsdwarf's workshop and 10 items (3xFelsite, Schorls, Tigereyes, Red Beryls, Giant cave swallow leather, Grizzly Bear Leather, Rough harlequin opals and Ash logs -- guess he has expensive taste?) and churned out an idol in relatively short order. This is my 9th successful mood in this fortress, and I've seen requests for between 3 and 10 items, personally. Since they seem to be increasing in complexity, I've either hit the item cap, or I'm about to break ten :) Doctorlucky 16:34, 19 November 2007 (EST)

This is consistent with older versions. Moody peasants would become crafters, and 10 items was the cap. The minimum was 1 item -- generally when constructing a "perfect gem".--Maximus 16:55, 19 November 2007 (EST)

I had a miner go into a strange mood, take over a mason's workshop, and make a something that got him up to legendary miner status. In my current fort, I have had 6 artifacts made, 2 of which were actual moods and 5 of which were possessions (I can add, one of them failed and the dwarf became a babbling wreck). My dwarves love to use only one item: an oak door (1 item), an olivine coffin (2 items), a turtle shell mask (1 item and is my cheapest artifiact at 3600), a diorite amulet (3 items), and a perfect jelly opal (1 item). --Penguinofhonor 18:47, 28 November 2007 (EST)

Where to add the info that in my game (.33c) a miner took over a mason's workshop, became legendary miner and then held the artifact in his right hand instead of a pick, which became 'hauled', then droped the pick and then took the pick with his left hand? He can mine after all these. While holding a 667 weight units cabinet in his right hand. --Another 10:07, 1 December 2007 (EST)

I had dwarf Miller, profecienty Grower who had Fey Mood, and he became a Legendary Mason .... Is it normal ? Feydreva

One of my dwarves has become possessed and is demanding cloth, bones and stone, which I have plenty of. But he refuses to go fetch them. Is there something I'm doing wrong?—Preceding unsigned comment added by Patarak (talk•contribs)

They want either silk or fiber cloth. Make sure you have both! Bartavelle 03:40, 21 January 2008 (EST)

Aargh! One of my dwarves went secretive and is demanding a huge list of stuff. He seems to be demanding two types of stone because the "sketches quarry" message stays on twice as long as the others. I have (and he has gathered) flint: is there any way to tell what kind of stone he wants? --Holyfool 011:55, 7 March 2008 (EST)

I had a Glassmaker that sat around when I had a lot of Magma Glass Furnaces, but then decided to get going when I made a regular Glass Furnace. Seems like they will only use a specific kind. Not sure yet if it's random. Might be they won't take the Magma Glass Furnace in version 38a. Can anyone verify? --Afbee 05:07, 21 February 2008 (EST)

My Glassmaker successfully used Magma Glass Furnace in a fey mood. --Digger 07:54, 24 February 2008 (EST)

I just had the same problem. I had a glass maker who wouldn't take over a magma glass furnace. Since I'm creating a glass fortress and had a mess of glass orders piled up, I thought that might have confused the AI and I built 2 more magma glass furnaces. No dice, he didn't want them. After reading this page I decided to create a normal glass furnace. He snapped it up as soon as it was built. --Alkyon 04:07, 9 November 2008 (EST)

Maximum number of artifacts

Well, I just got my umpteenth mood, and it resulted in the 16th successfully created artifact.(33b) So that 15 cap thing is clearly wrong. As it happens, this single artifact is worth 754,800, and is an adamantine spear decorated with, among other things, adamantine. For the record, in case this data is important to someone tabulating number of ingredients, my moods in order created the following objects using the corresponding number of ingredients: (Flute, 4; Mechanism, 4; Spear, 3; Millstone, 6; Ring, 8; Chest, 7; Cape, 7; Ring, 9; Statue, 8; Idol, 10; earring, 8; Buckler, 8; Table, 3; Mechanism, 10; Bracelet, 5; and Spear, 8). Doctorlucky 04:54, 27 November 2007 (EST)

Do fell/macabre moods still exist? I haven't seen any for quite a few versions. It'd be nice to have that verified.—Preceding unsigned comment added by Rabek (talk•contribs)

clarification on "trade" skills

Are trade skills all the skills that produce items with some level of quality? Mainly I want to know if dyer is a trade skill. And how does that work with miner? I didn't think miner was a trade skill. Maybe someone who knows more than me could clarify in the wiki. I just got my first artifact. It's worth 2400. The dwarf took one log and made a scepter. -Radtse

I don't know exactly, we should make a list of the skills we know are not trade skills. I'll start: my brewer/grower once got a strange mood and made a wood item and gained woodcrafting skill. Let's try to only add to the list when we have experienced a moody dwarf with that skill only.--Valdemar 19:36, 27 December 2007 (EST)

I'm adding Weaver and Furnace Operator to this list, since they're on the wiki. I haven't seen them myself, but I'm assuming someone else has. Knowing that Furnace Operator is a "fey-able" skill will be quite helpful.-Radtse 18:28, 29 December 2007 (EST)

Where's cooking fit in? --KittenyKat 20:09, 6 January 2008 (EST)

List of non-trade skills:

Skills that may be used and gained by dwarves with no trade skills:

Skills that use a different skill(See list above), but give correct skill:

For the record, i can confirm both Furnace Operator and Weaver, since no one else has commented to verify them thus far. (The weaver actually surprised me when it happened). --Squirrelloid 01:43, 29 April 2008 (EDT)

I can confirm that a Miner will claim a Mason's shop, and produce a stone item, even with no Mason skill at all. It works just like the wiki says. --Strangething 23:47, 31 May 2008 (EDT)

And I can confirm that Wood Cutter does not contribute -- I had a Novice Glassmaker/No Prefix Wood Cutter take a glass furnace. Slitherrr 13:48, 28 July 2008 (EDT)

mood condition

The 20 dwarves / no crazy stuff has been found while looking at the binary of v0.27.169.33d, might be different now, but i don't think so. Bartavelle 15:08, 2 January 2008 (EST)

Regarding the calulations for required maximum existing artifacts (items/200 and dugout/(48*48)) wouldn't it make more sense to either use the squared symbol, or the actual result of that square (which was the original number actually discovered/revealed I believe)? --Edward 19:17, 28 April 2008 (EDT)

<sup>2</sup> --GreyMario 21:28, 28 April 2008 (EDT)

20 dorf must be still there. I've made low-population fort and I had no mood for ~8 years (from start). I'm sure that I've digged at least 2700 tiles and created at least 300 items. I will test if raising population to 20 will cause moods. I think that 20 dwarf limit should be mentioned even if it's not confirmed. --Someone-else 18:30, 26 May 2008 (EDT)

Random Workshop Seizure

I just had a gem cutter seize a carpenter's workshop and make a perfect gem; upon completion I had a worthless Legendary dwarf and a new jeweler's workshop, so I guess that's still in from the previous version. I've removed the verify in the article. Tacroy 16:51, 9 January 2008 (EST)

nonsense. Should be a bigger chance of making ZOMG high-quality gem crafts now ;) --Frostedfire 07:35, 18 February 2008 (EST)

More to the point, if you don't like the profession your dwarf has Legendary in...draft for the stats! --Alfador 12:16, 18 February 2008 (EST)

forbidden items

Do moody dwarfs use forbidden items? Will they demand forbid items? Diabl0658 02:07, 21 February 2008 (EST)

I don't know whether moody dwarves will use forbidden items (my guess would be they won't). But they don't choose the demands based on what is on the map, they can and do demand things you don't have. So it's safe to assume forbidding doesn't prevent dwarves from demanding the forbidden kind of item. --BahamutZERO 16:31, 13 May 2008 (EDT)

Forbidden items are not used. Similarly, if your mooder slipped in e.g. an iron bar when you wanted him to use a platinum bar, you can forbid AND dump the item to stop him from using it. --GreyMaria 16:35, 13 May 2008 (EDT)

Impossible Requests?

Will dwarves try to use items that you just don't have access to? I had a dwarf asking for silk when I haven't imported any and I'm pretty sure there isn't a giant spider anywhere. Also asking for "rocks" when I have mined at least one of each type of rock that is visible (requiring rocks from unmined areas seem pretty harsh). Also a request for "metal bars" when I have smeltered at least one of each ore I have found and made at least one of each possible alloy. Yvain 23:27, 26 February 2008 (EST)

Yeah, impossible stuff is all my dwarves ever want. :-P Right now mine appears to want stone I don't have, and no traders have come by with any stone.... So my guys are frantically mining in various directions.... Holyfool 13:59, 7 March 2008 (EST)

As far as i can tell they never request anything it is truly impossible for you to get. Available by trade seems to imply possible for the game engine though. Too bad if its the start of winter (which is when all my moods which require things I don't have and can't produce happen, of course). But if there's no sand on your map at all you will not be asked for glass, since you can't trade for sand. (If there's 5 tiles of sand under that underground lake you haven't found yet... sucks to be you - my first fortress lost 3 dwarves to this). So yes, requiring things present on the map that you haven't found yet appears to be possible and routine. --Squirrelloid 01:48, 29 April 2008 (EDT)

Procastinator!

I just had a moody dwarf demand bones, wood, rocks, and cloth.

He got the rocks okay, and then did nothing for ages. Then, as soon as the fire imp corpse rotted away, he ran down and got the bones, then ran over to my wood stockpile and got a piece of wood...

Do they need to get their ingredients in order now?--Shadow archmagi 06:28, 29 February 2008 (EST)

i think so, not that it matters, he wont start unless he has ALL the ingridents.

gems

My moody dwarf asked for 2 kinds of rough gems, but i had cut all rough ones at that point. So i "printed out" all layers and started checking for leftover gems in the walls. Guess what, he picked the first 2 kinds i mined. So either

random/pure luck (don't think so)
they only ask what they "see"
they only ask what is somehow on the map
or they might even adapt somewhat to availability, but i doubt that. --Koltom 15:59, 28 March 2008 (EDT)

I believe, but don't know for sure, that sometimes they want specific items and sometimes they just want anything in a category of items, such as any rough gems in this case. It used to work that way in the 2d version, didn't it? --BahamutZERO 12:23, 14 May 2008 (EDT)

Confirming behaviour that BahamutZERO sees. Dwarves will always grab the closest object that falls under the category unless he is requesting a specific metal, specific silk, or specific plant fiber cloth. --GreyMaria 14:25, 14 May 2008 (EDT)

Just standing around?

I have a dwarf who was possessed, but won't leave the main hall. He's also a novice in everything, but to be safe I've already cleared the shops. It's winter of my first year, but somehow I've already had 2 waves of immigrants. Back to the point, I'm afraid he's going to wait out the mood and go berserk. Help? --Ilmmad 20:00, 6 March 2008 (EST)

Well, make sure u ve got one workshop of every possible kind available - there are however quite a few u dont need to build, its covered in the article. Check for locked doors or otherwise blocked access (bridges, channels, statues..) Dont forget furnaces, glass and magma. Check with 'q' if all workshops are completely build. If it doesnt help consider building workshops not related to his skills, or more "exotic" ones, like Ashery or Alchemist. No one can guarantee that Toady didnt have some new fun ideas ;) --Koltom 22:59, 6 March 2008 (EST)

stark raving suicide

My mechanic wanted silk cloth, which I didn't have, and eventually gone insane ("stark raving mad" to be precise). Seconds after that I had message that he died in heat (I had artificial magma pool nearby). He probably jumped into the pool like in melancholy. Main article states that only melancholic dwarves kill themselves in such way. Could anyone confirm that mad ones do that too, and this wasn't just an accident/bug? Someone-else 16:59, 19 April 2008 (EDT)

Perhaps it was an accident -- I seem to recall that "stark raving mad" ones wander around at random. Perhaps it wandered into the lava. Anydwarf 18:30, 19 April 2008 (EDT)

It was an accident, the stark raving mad ones wander around aimlessly, regardless of Z- levels. --Hoborobo 12:53, 9 November 2008 (EST)

Glassmaker with no glass

I had an immigrant glassworker get a mood, seize a glass workshop, and created an artifact made entirely of gemstones. No glass involved or asked for. (No sand on the map, anyway.) He turned into a Legendary Glassworker, despite having never made a glass anything.

Rewrite

I think I got most of the old information and then some into the new article. Please make any necessary modifications. --Marble Dice 01:22, 10 May 2008 (EDT)

Silk Cloth

I had a dwarf demand silk cloth, but he refused to use my giant cave spider silk cloth. I didn't have any regular cave spider silk cloth. To verify that the silk was the problem, I used Companion to change the silk demand to any stone, and he immediately collected the rest of the materials and constructed the artifact. Can anyone else confirm that giant cave spider silk cloth does not count as silk cloth? --Doniazade 08:55, 13 May 2008 (EDT)

No, I'm pretty sure I can't. I've seen a dwarf grab GCS silk.
Could it be that you had thread and not cloth? --GreyMaria 13:59, 13 May 2008 (EDT)

Nope, giant cave spider cloth [3] sorted under cloth on the stock screen. --Doniazade 16:52, 13 May 2008 (EDT)

Probably they may specifically require GCS silk or specifically require CS silk. —Chaos 14:10, 13 May 2008 (EDT) I figured it out - the silk was outside and I had accidentally left "Dwarves Stay Inside" on after the latest attack. --Doniazade 08:52, 14 May 2008 (EDT)

Engineer taken by secretive mood, and creates...

Evidently engineers who are taken by a secretive mood ("withdraws from society", in case it's later determined that the descriptor has an effect) will have no problems taking over the mechanic's workshop. And there's only one thing mechanic-shops build - that's right, you heard right, ladies and gentlemen, I present Kodor ós: A claystone mechanism. It's even available for use from the appropriate b)uild screens. He decided to make this splendid 86,400o creation while on an eight-mechanism binge in that very same mechanic's workshop. Maybe dwarves choose the workshop they've been in the most often? --BismuthBismuthBismuth 15:31, 13 May 2008 (EDT)

Ah, actually I can confirm I've had a Mechanic create an artifact mechanism as well. Stick some obsidian swords in that baby and you'll be good to go! That should probably go in the main article for skills vs workshops... I would expect siege engineers also have strange moods, but I imagine pump op and siege op fall under the general craftsman catch-all --Marble Dice 15:45, 13 May 2008 (EDT)

I'd like to smack BismuthBismuthBismuth with the facts stated in the article.

     A dwarf will claim a workshop according to their highest applicable skill

In this case it was Engineering and therefore your mechanic went to a Mechanic's Workshop. It's the same with the possessed glassmakers. They hit a glassmaker's shop. --GreyMaria 15:49, 13 May 2008 (EDT)

I'd like to hit GreyMario-Maria, preferably in the upper-body region, with the fact that at the time of my post, the table in the article did not mention mechanics whatsoever. --BismuthBismuthBismuth 22:26, 13 May 2008 (EDT)

Pardon me, but I was not aware that mechanics worked at a mechanic's workshop, where objects are created that have quality mofidiers and can thus become artifacts. --GreyMaria 23:28, 13 May 2008 (EDT)

Pardon me as well, but it seems that the table in this particular revision did not encapsulate this information. GreyMario is throwing a tantrum! --BismuthBismuthBismuth 15:22, 14 May 2008 (EDT)

Mechanics. Work at a mechanic's workshop. Produce items which have visible quality modifiers. Items with visible quality modifiers are eligible to be artifacts. THEREFORE, mechanics claim mechanic's workshops when they go fey. Seriously, logic sometimes, please? --GreyMaria 15:30, 14 May 2008 (EDT)

That would follow if we knew for certain that the proposition "items with visible quality modifiers are eligible to artifacts" is necessarily true. We don't. For instance, siege engine components are not verified as artifact eligible. Since that isn't a given, it's perfectly reasonable for people to not jump to the conclusion that a job type will create artifacts relevant to it until they see it happen. —Chaos 16:26, 14 May 2008 (EDT)

i love the absurd randomness factor with artifacts - you end up with really weird stuff. like grates, and socks. a question pertinent to legendary mechanisms - i got a stupidly valuable one of these as the first legendary item in a new fort and i used it to create a gear assembly in a public dining area in the hopes that it would give dwarves happy thoughts, but after a few years gametime of checking randomly on them nothing particular showed up. any particular use along these lines for legendary mechanisms for something other then simple fortress value? --FruityBix 11:51, 10 September 2008 (EDT)

weapon traps! --Bartavelle 12:03, 10 September 2008 (EDT)

FWIW, that might be a more general answer for artifact items... I had a Weaponsmith dwarf go into a strange mood and create a lead warhammer (Yes, there was plenty of steel and iron around, but this dwarf likes lead, I guess). It can't be equipped as a weapon (lead isn't a valid material type normally for constructing weapons) but I can put it into a weapons trap. Which... is basically the only thing I can do with this 65000* artifact... -Fuzzy 14:37, 10 September 2008 (EDT)

Actually, artifact equipment can be used, it just requires a "hero" level dwarf or higher. However, for the nonstandard material weapons and armor you may do well to forbid them so that they're not used. The actual effectiveness of odd material artifacts is supposedly lower than that of decent iron or steel equipment, and artifact equipment cannot be unequipped once a dwarf decides to use it. --Janus 15:36, 10 September 2008 (EDT)

Tanner fixed

I just had a Tanner claim a leather works, not a tannery. I updated the table. For the record, the dwarf has no skill level in leather working.

I wonder if Tanners even claim Tanner's shops? Tanner's shops just make leather, and leather doesn't have quality modifiers, so you shouldn't be able to produce an artifact from one, aye? That information came from an older version of the page, I wonder if it was inaccurate. Weavers supposed claim Clothier's shops and not Looms, so it would make sense if Tanners were the same way. --Marble Dice 18:08, 2 June 2008 (EDT)

Cooks

I can confirm that cooks do not produce artifacts: my Peasant with Dabbling Cook/Brewer/(various social) and nothing else just took over a Craftsdwarf's Workshop. I'm removing the verify tag for cooks in the article. --Comonad 16:16, 2 August 2008 (EDT)

mmmm. . . . artifact roast. Mirthmanor 19:12, 4 August 2008 (EDT)

Soapers etc.

It stands to reason that soapers, lye makers, and wood burners wouldn't make artifacts. Neither soap, lye, charcoal, nor ash have quality modifiers, and that's all those skills can produce. I'm pretty sure you can't have artifact soap, lye, charcoal, or ash. --Tachyon 20:26, 11 August 2008 (EDT)

My woodburner just got possessed. He wants a shell and wood. I have the shell but I'm not sure what type of wood he wants. --Ehertlein 20:18, 22 August 2008 (EDT)

Not all demands need to be met

I just had a dwarf taken by a secretive mood and collect a huge variety of things: 4 stone, 1 block, 1 gem, 2 rough gems, bones, a shell, 2 leather. He was further sketching for more bones, 2 leather, another stone, a log, another shell, and raw green glass. The only things I didn't have on hand were the shell and the green glass -- dwarves seem to go through their list in order, and get stuck on certain items.

I just hoped someone would eat a turtle (50/1678 chance!) and queued a raw green glass. When the glass was made, he got started, totally ignoring his previous requests for wood, another shell, and the other things. Anyone else have this experience? Mirthmanor 13:28, 13 August 2008 (EDT)

I think they keep sketching images even after they get the items. Your dwarf already had all of the shells, leather, bones, stones, blocks, and gems he needed. Curudan 15:26, 22 August 2008 (EDT)

This is correct. I've had dwarves run out, grab two items, and then sit at the Workshop shouting a need for three items. When the item he was waiting on became available, he ran out, grabbed it, went back in, and started working. So it's pretty evident that they list ALL of the items they want, regardless of how many of them they've already collected. --Nekojin 22:28, 23 August 2008 (EDT)

Possession

I've had 14 moods in my current Fortress, 11 of them have been possessions. Am I really unlucky, or is the type of mood weighted? HeWhoIsPale 09:55, 26 August 2008 (EDT)

As far as I can tell by looking at the game logic, each mood types are as likely to be rolled (except fell of course, which is selected if happiness<rand(128) or something like that). --Bartavelle 07:56, 3 September 2008 (EDT)

I had a feeling I was just getting really unlucky, thanks. HeWhoIsPale 14:34, 3 September 2008 (EDT)

Furnace Operator

Apparently furnace operator is no longer a mood skill as of df 28 181 40d. I just had a expert furnace operator take over a Craftdwarf's Workshop and become a legendary stonecrafter. Otherdwarf 10:26, 1 October 2008 (EDT)

I had one take over a mason's workshop, I would guess that Furnace Operator is treating like Engraver or Miner. I'm kind of disappointed, I was hoping he'd churn out an artifact coke or something.Gandalf the Dwarf (No, really! Look it up!) 13:03, 14 November 2008 (EST)

Back when furnace operator was moodable, they'd turn out metal crafts. But taking over a mason's workshop is surprising. Occasionally they'll take over a random workshop and convert it into the type they want -- what artifact did the dwarf produce? And, just to rule out some obvious things, did the dwarf have dabbling skill in mining, masonry, or engraving?--Maximus 13:51, 14 November 2008 (EST)

He went crazy looking for some kind of rough gem, so we'll never know. It was right after the dwarf trading caravan left, too, so I really had no chance whatsoever. I don't know for sure what skills he had, I don't think he had much other than Furnace Operator, Architect, and the social skills though. I might have enabled mining, but there was plenty of work for him at the smelter so I don't know for sure.--Gandalf the Dwarf (No, really! Look it up!) 15:56, 14 November 2008 (EST)

Chunk Butchery?

Well, even though the selection of items for artifacts is totally random, its a bit wierd if a macabre dwarf goes to a butcher's workshop and starts bringing in tons of dwarf CHUNKS! My dwarf just started doing that, should I expect rotting meat (yes, the chunks are already rotten)? - 09:57, 30 October 2008 Stinhad Limarezum

^_^ "This is a delicious meat pie. All craftsdwarfship is of the highest quality. On the item is an image of a dwarf and dwarves in rotting dwarf chunks. The dwarf is baking the other dwarves into meat pies. The artwork relates to the rise of the dwarf butcher Sweeney Todd as the cook of The Fleet Street in 78" -Fuzzy 11:11, 30 October 2008 (EDT)

Oh, do post the description of the artifact when the dwarf completes it. ("Menaces with spikes of dwarf chunk?" I'd be intimidated for sure.)--Maximus 13:18, 30 October 2008 (EDT)

What Workshop?

Is there any way to discover what workshop a dwarf in a secretive mood requires? I had nearly everything. I built a siege workshop and a bowery before I ran out of ideas and he went beserk. --Corona688 10:55, 3 November 2008 (EST)

You have to look at what skills he has first and rule out the obvious. If he has no mood-able skills then it's going to be a craftsdwarf's workshop. If you have hit magma and he wants a forge or glass furnace, he will insist on the magma version of that workshop. Finally, maybe one of your existing workshops was inaccessible or you accidentally forbid it at some point. If none of that works, I'm out of ideas too.--Maximus 13:01, 3 November 2008 (EST)

I have a functioning magma glass furnace and I had to build a normal glass furnace when my glass maker became secretive. HeWhoIsPale 14:23, 11 November 2008 (EST)

Same here, in fact I had 2 moody glass making dwarves refuse to use anything but a normal glass furnace when there were 5 fully functional magma glass furnaces in the same fort. (sorry, almost forgot to sign) --Alkyon 14:27, 11 November 2008 (EST)

Ah. In older versions, they'd insist on a magma workshop, when possible. Do they now insist on using a regular workshop, or has anyone seen a moody dwarf use a magma workshop in recent versions?--Maximus 14:34, 11 November 2008 (EST)

I believe my metalsmith is waiting for my magma forge to come on line, I have a standard forge built, but that isn't doing anything for him. Does anyone know what effect fluctuating power will have on the strange mood? Edit: If a claimed workshop looses power for even a millisecond, the mood fails. HeWhoIsPale 12:02, 18 November 2008 (EST)

Possessed Child

I have a child that has become possessed and taken over one of my craft workshops (of course). He is muttering the following: rough color, leather skin, bone yes, stone rock, cloth thread, blocks bricks, and a shell. He has already acquired the following: turtle bones, donkey bones [4], microcline blocks, turtle shell, rough pink garnets, dog leather, carp leather, and hematite. I have plenty of all the things that he's already gathered, so I'm assuming that he doesn't need anymore of those items. That leaves the thread. I have turned off my auto-loom a while ago so that I would keep the thread around for artifacts. I currently have plenty of plant thread (4 pig tail and 14 rope reed) and enough spider silk (5). What I don't have is giant spider silk. I have confirmed that the child has access to all these items, including the thread which I have piles next to his workshop. Still he doesn't start construction.

Can any help? Is there a difference for artifact creation between regular cave spider silk and giant cave spider silk? ---Frewfrux

Do you have both silk and plant cloth available? (Not just thread.) And do you see any specific cloth preferences in his thoughts and preferences screen?--Maximus 01:32, 6 November 2008 (EST)

Argh. I bet that's it. No silk cloth, just thread. I have had guys go crazy for lack of thread before, so I never make silk cloth, just kept the thread. Oh well, the child is now melancholy. I can re-load and see what would happen if I make the thread into cloth. Maybe I'll test that out. ---Frewfrux

Wouldn't you be able to solve this problem by only weaving dyed thread? Then you'll always have some thread waiting to be dyed. --RomeoFalling 03:04, 6 November 2008 (EST)

You could also leave high quality, expensive materials lying around Forbidden, and only Claim them when someone's trying to make an artifact. --Navian 15:07, 11 November 2008 (EST)

Getting More Strange Moods

According to the article, the number of artifacts is limited by "The number of items created divided by 200." This indicates that making bolts (5 for each bone or 25 for each log) or brewing (5 units of drink for each unit of plant brewed) are efficient ways to encourage strange moods. Does that sound accurate?

It also states that the number of revealed subterranean tiles is a limit. Does that mean an area like a chasm, where many tiles are revealed to start with, will produce more strange moods?

Also, does anyone know whether the division rounds up or down? Gairabad 22:24, 16 November 2008 (EST)

I'd be willing to bet all stacks count as only one "item" for this kind of calculation. 200 sounds like a paltry number, however. If rocks are counted as items, most fortresses have thousands of them in just a few years. The other number is what is most significant (I wonder where the heck it comes from?) I've had four miners digging non-stop for about 10 years now, and my stocks menu says I have 70,000 stones. Allowing for underground soil tiles (which don't produce stone) and stone/ore consumed by industry, each miner can probably clear about 2,000 tiles a year: one artifact. I have 21 artifacts in my fortress now (and two failed moods early on), so if that rate is indicative, I'd say you want to employ three or more miners non-stop to maximize your chances.--Maximus 00:09, 17 November 2008 (EST)

The guy who wrote this doesn't seem to think that stones count as created items. Also, "revealed tiles" is ambiguous. For example, this method is very good at showing you what's inside of a tile without actually mining it out. Do you suppose that seeing whats inside is enough?

Where do you think these numbers came from anyway? I'm gonna take a look through the edit history and try to track them down. Gairabad 00:15, 17 November 2008 (EST)

They came during this edit. They're so specific I've got to think the author did some poking around with a disassembler. Again, though, 200 is such a paltry number. If underground "open space" counts, then discovering a chasm, bottomless pit, or magma pipe should many thousands thousands of revealed tiles. If underground floor tiles are needed, you'll have to mine most of them out yourself.--Maximus 00:34, 17 November 2008 (EST)

I had a chat with GreyMario over at his talk page, since he edited the page around the time the changes were made. He seemed fairly certain that all you had to do to "reveal" a tile was to have a passable square next to it, so I edited the article to reflect that. He did not, however, know anything about how bolts or stones would affect things. Right now my hopes are on Marble Dice, whom I believe made the actual addition. I'm not sure if he's a very active user though.

By the way, the reason I'm doing all this is that I'm considering optimizing a fortress for strange moods: have lots of dwarves with only "dabbling" in a single strange mood skill to gain maximum benefit from the moods. Any ideas for fortress strategies that will go well with this? Gairabad 02:44, 17 November 2008 (EST)

I saw the conversation -- I keep my eye on Special:Recentchanges. What he says about "reveal" is correct, as far as I know. I still wonder about "open space" tiles. If they count as revealed, all you really need to do is find a chasm/pit/magma pipe and you'll be in moods for years to come.

I've done the dabbling strategy in the past. It's best to emphasize just a few skills you really really want that are otherwise hard to train due to limited materials -- armorsmith, weaponsmith, bone carver, leatherworker, carpenter, etc. It works fine with any fortress strategy.--Maximus 04:30, 17 November 2008 (EST)

Two missing labors

Strand Extractor and Blacksmith don't currently appear in either the Causes Moods category or the Doesn't Cause Moods category. I put Strand Extractor in Doesn't Cause Moods and the Blacksmith in Causes Moods; feel free to correct me if you think I'm wrong. Gairabad 19:59, 18 November 2008 (EST)

I can confirm that blacksmith is moodable, I've got a nice steel chest to show for it. It stands to reason that strand extractor isn't moodable, but we don't know for sure -- I've slapped a verify on it.--Maximus 21:01, 18 November 2008 (EST)

Order of stuff

I'm wondering if dwarves always claim items in a certain order. For example, when a dwarf wants three pieces of wood he always wants them back-to-back, never wood gem wood bone wood. So are types ALWAYS in a certain order? My current moody dwarf wanted two bars of metal, then spider silk cloth, then ash logs, then bones, then a rough gem, then a shell. Knowing the order might help you guess what the dwarf wants next if he doesn't need to wait for anything (and thus tell you what he wants). This might be useful for micromanaging forbidding stuff to make sure your dwarf gets the highest value things available. --Sowelu 23:19, 26 November 2008 (EST)

~~This is actually well-defined in the article, if you'd bothered to look close enough. Dwarves will gather items in the order they scream their demands in.~~ It's unknown. I think there's no real order, just similar things end up grouped together. :V --GreyMaria 23:32, 26 November 2008 (EST)

fail. Uh, I mean, as soon as anyone else sees a strange mood, it can either be disproven, or we can start putting some data together immediately and be done pretty quick. I saw: Metal Bars, Silk Cloth, Wood, Bones, Rough Gem, Shell. If anyone sees bones before wood or something, that means there's no guaranteed order. But no harm done. :) --Sowelu 23:36, 26 November 2008 (EST)

It's simpler than that. Items have a certain number of slots for improvements, and for artifacts the first improvement slot is always filled by the base material of the item. Then the rest are filled in order, with whatever is a valid candidate for that slot (which is probably 'anything that's anything' in every case, though I'm not absolutely sure.) So, there isn't any explicit sorting because it has to be in order.

If you fill an item's slots with ordinary decoration, which is easiest to do by encrusting a wide variety of gems on a piece of furniture or the like, you'll see what I mean. Maybe. --Navian 23:40, 26 November 2008 (EST)

Ah! So you're saying that instead of generating a list of ingredients, it first plans out the artifact itself, saying "This one is a chest, it has hanging rings and an image, first let's get a material for the chest, then a material for the hanging rings, then a material for the image"? That makes a ton of sense, and answers my question. Thanks! --Sowelu 23:47, 26 November 2008 (EST)

Well, I know it doesn't do that, because if you close the game and reopen it, you can get different items... With my elf game, I had one artifact that came out as either a thong, a left mitten, or a rope on five tries. But it's roughly the same idea, even with the details randomized upon creation. --Navian 00:05, 27 November 2008 (EST)

Fell Mood Demands

It looks like when a brooding dwarf sits in the tanner's shop and says he needs "Things..." what he's looking for is vermin remains. Other demands are like in Fey moods. --Sev 22:24, 3 December 2008 (EST)

Confusing macabre mood

My mayor just entered one, while 'quite content', claimed a smelter, waited for a bit, until the parts appeared (the vermin must have died). He then created a roach rock chitin bracelet, and gained the carpenter skill. Am I missing something here? Smelter, rock and carpenter don't seem to mix well... Note: The only skills were proficient cook and fish cleaner, with some dabbling and noice social.--Finbeer 13:03, 6 December 2008 (EST)

Carpenter? Or wood crafter? Claiming a smelter isn't out of the question: they sometimes grab a random workshop and turn it into the one they want (is it still a smelter?). And what is roach rock? Give the actual description of the artifact.--Maximus 19:14, 6 December 2008 (EST)

Carpenter. It's still a smelter, yes. "This is a large roach chitin bracelet. All craftsdwaftship is of the highest quality. It is encircled with bands of large roach chitin and dwarf bone. This object menaces with spikes of rat leather."--Finbeer 15:32, 7 December 2008 (EST)

Hmm. Post that one on the forums, find out if it's an actual bug. Does sound pretty nonstandard.--Maximus 22:50, 7 December 2008 (EST)

:-D Pretty sure that a roach is an actual bug. -Fuzzy 09:00, 8 December 2008 (EST)

D'oh.--Maximus 22:56, 8 December 2008 (EST)

I did have two very close together, but I am certain that neither had any carpenter skill, and the smelter was claimed.